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SarahP
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Date Joined Mar 2005
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   Posted 3/9/2007 8:01 PM (GMT -7)   
Is there any arthritis that causes fluid (small amount) in both knees? Earlier this year, I had a double MRI of my knees and they found the fluid, but passed the cause of all the knee issues as Fibro. I have looked, looked, and looked some more and nowhere can I find anything like this related to my fibro.
 
My symptoms: knee pain that will come on for no apparent reason
                    obvious swelling of knee, and skin discoloration
                    a ton of pressure, like my kneecap is going to blow off
                    they feel very weak, and shake when I bear weight
                    shooting pains that go from knees to feet, mostly one
                    nothing helps but to get OFF my feet
                    this disappears with no apparent treatment
 
Any ideas? I do have osteoarthritis in my lower spine, according to doc, so wouldn't be surprised to see it pop up elsewhere.
 
Thanks!!
Sarah
I'm not procrastinating----I'm still doing yesterday!!!! 
I have no medical training, any medical opinions expressed in my posts are just that....opinions.

Co-Moderator for : Chronic Pain, Fibro


Ducky
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Date Joined Mar 2005
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   Posted 3/9/2007 8:23 PM (GMT -7)   

Hey Sarah!

Is odd that they would say that the fluid on your knee would be attributed to your Fibro.. I have always understood it to mean arthritis.. I found this website and it takes about OA Knee... How long have you had this?  Are you being seen by a rheumy for your Fibro? Or is it just your primary?  I hope you get some relief soon!  Keep us posted on what happens.. talk to you soon

Duck


Moderator of Arthritis/Epilepsy Forums
Confirmed Diagnosis of - Psoriatic Arthritis/Spondylitis/Graves Disease/GERD/Scoliosis/Hiatal Hernia/Graves Disease of the Eyes/Chronic UTIs
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SarahP
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Date Joined Mar 2005
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   Posted 3/10/2007 11:24 AM (GMT -7)   
Well, it's been about a year or so that I've had this annoying symptom of something. The one Rheumy that exists in this town didn't really want to take on my treatment. My doc already had the narcotics, muscle relaxant, anti anxiety, and SSRI thing going on, already sent me to PT, etc... so the rheumy said there was nothing left for him to do..lol.

I didn't believe either of them, the rheumy or my PCP, the minute fibro came out of their mouths. I know fibro, I've researched fibro, and never ever came across fluid as a symptom. I could maybe buy joint pain from tense muscles pulling on it, but not the swelling I have, or the fluid they found.

They said that it wasn't *enough* fluid to warrant going thru draining it off, and apparently it's transitory, because the problem isn't always there. After someone told me about the size of the needle, I wholeheartedly agreed. :)

One thing I forgot to put in my original post is that four times my knee has "gone out". No pain, no loud popping noise, just be upright one second, flat out the next. Usually occurs when I have "overworked" them while having the symptoms. I carry my cane with me if I need to walk when this happens.

I have a theory, but the docs just blew me off. I was told by a doc years and years ago that because I have spinal issues, my knees would go eventually. Because I walk "off". That it puts a lot of extra wear and tear on my knees due to not using a proper "gait" anymore. Quite annoying to present something and be looked at like yeah sure lady...lol.

I'll check that website out Ducky. Thanks for passing it along!
I'm not procrastinating----I'm still doing yesterday!!!! 
I have no medical training, any medical opinions expressed in my posts are just that....opinions.

Co-Moderator for : Chronic Pain, Fibro


Keah
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Date Joined Nov 2003
Total Posts : 7314
   Posted 3/10/2007 3:25 PM (GMT -7)   
Sarah, I have similar problems with my knees. It began in my early teens. In my case, We treated it with rest, braces, crutches, etc. for several years. I was told that after puberty, it would resolve. At 19, they finally did exploratory knee surgery. Back then, there was no MRI. What they found was a slight increase in fluid and a very inflammed synovium. The inflammation was so bad that the tissue was being pinched between my femur and patella every time I bent my knee. The result was that it was being eroded and a large piece was hanging off.

The biopsies confirmed chronic synovitis and the increase in fluid was a result of the inflammation. After all, swelling is the result of fluid. This combined with my chronic tendonitis was the first red flag which should have led to my Dx with Spondylitis, unfortunately, nobody considered that and I suffered for almost another 20 years before anyone found the arthritis in my spine and put all of my joint problems together with the gut problems that was eventually Dx as Crohn's. Five years later, I had similar findings in my shoulder. Go figure! Still nobody put it together.

I asked about whether or not some of my pain was from FMS, but my Docs all agree that I have three documented inflammatory diseases and those could well account for the body/muscle/nerve aches and pains that I suffer with. Since FMS is primarily a Dx after exclusion of other diseases/disorders, that can't be the case for me.

I'd be very interested in whether you could have some form of Spondyloarthritis, because of the spinal arthritis. Of course, this may well be my own biased opinion because it's what I know a lot about, but it could well be a possiblility that has not been considered for you.

Is it possible for you to get to another Rheumy who may be more interested in a complete evaluation for you? I'd want someone to check the tendon and ligament insetion points in my knee(s) as well as the Achilles and both shoulders, since those are the most common to be affected by SpA. Your SI joints should also be looked at and you should consider being tested for HLA-B27, which is a genetic marker that c=is often present in those affected by SpA. That in itself does not mean you have the disease and being negative does not rule it out, but many Docs insist on testing for it.

Take a quick look through the Symptoms and Diagnosis sections at spondylitis.org and see if some of your symptoms match up. THat may help you decide if it's worth following up on.

In any case. I hope you find some answers and relief soon.


Keah a.k.a. Wormy
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SarahP
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2005
Total Posts : 1185
   Posted 3/10/2007 4:02 PM (GMT -7)   
Keah, I looked around the site, but couldn't seem to find a list of symptoms. Of course, i have five kiddos running around my house, lucky I can find my own computer..lol.

This has definately never been considered for me, but then.. nobody has come up with anything else that fits either. The shoulder thing is really interesting. My shoulders are incredibly tight, they are drawn forward and my chest hurts and has a lot of redness/swelling. Everytime I rotate my shoulders I hear this horrid crunchy noise.

So far, whatever this is, is mainly in my *large* joints. My shoulders, my knees, my hips (and my spine and breastbone). My hands/wrists/ankles/elbows don't hurt, beyond normal type over done it pain. The visible swelling is in my knees and upper chest. Can't see if it's on my upper back.. my neck doesn't like to swivel much.

I do believe that I have fibro, many many symptoms fit, and I had all but one of the tender points. But it seems like once that dx was made, EVERYthing I complained of was laid at fibro's door, and I'm just not buying that. Not with all the auto immune type disorders that seem to piggy back with fibro. They've run blood panel after blood panel, and I test negative for everything, tho exactly what they are testing for I have no idea..lol.

My hubby made me come back and edit to add: I don't have this symptom over the winter, not one single time. It didn't start happening again until it started warming up to 60 degrees and above here. He said if it's arthritis, it's the most backwards type he's ever seen..lol. (Gotta love it when you have to be reminded of your symptoms, geesh)


I'm not procrastinating----I'm still doing yesterday!!!! 
I have no medical training, any medical opinions expressed in my posts are just that....opinions.

Co-Moderator for : Chronic Pain, Fibro

Post Edited (SarahP) : 3/10/2007 5:19:45 PM (GMT-7)


Keah
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2003
Total Posts : 7314
   Posted 3/10/2007 9:07 PM (GMT -7)   
Here are some links to the correct symptoms pages.
 
AS symptoms (Ankylosing Spondylitis)
http://www.spondylitis.org/about/as_sym.aspx?PgSrch=symptoms
 
uSpA symptoms (Undifferentiated Spnyloarthropathy)
http://www.spondylitis.org/about/undif_sym.aspx?PgSrch=Undifferentiated+Spnyloarthropathy
 
 
(Sorry, I can't make th elinks work, you'll have to copy and paste into your browser)
 
For right now, I technically have uSpA, but my Rheumy expects that it will develop further into AS. I am HLA-B27 negative, but suffer with constant back pain. I have muscle spasms, costochondritis, chronic tendonitis in my shoulders, knees and achilles and arthritis in all my large joints - shoulders, hips, knees and ankles. There is facet arthropathy and sclerosis in my lumbar spine and I've been treated by Pain Mgmt for the last 3.5 years for SI joint pain. The muscle spasms are killing me and I live on Oxycontin and Zanaflex.
 
In addition, I also hit all of the tender points which are considered in the Dx of FMS and that combined with the muscle pain and spasm is the reason that I inquired whether FMS was a part of my problems.
 
Again, I hope you get answers & relief soon.

Post Edited (Keah) : 3/11/2007 5:37:29 PM (GMT-6)


SarahP
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2005
Total Posts : 1185
   Posted 3/11/2007 10:54 AM (GMT -7)   
Keah... all I can say is I fit those to a T. The only things I don't have are any gastro issues, or eye problems. At least any that are out of the "ordinary". Hard to tell on the eyes since I have pollen allergies, and they are reacting to spring coming!!

I will definately be presenting this to my doc when my hubby's insurance finally, finally, finally kicks in for me. (April 1st) I've been searching for things to take and bring up with him, and most things just make me go..well, I don't really "fit" in these symptoms.. but I certainly do in this one.

I do have GERD so NSAIDs are really not an option for me. The occasional low dose Motrin is tolerated, but not much past two/three doses of it. I need to find some way I can tolerate NSAIDs I guess.
Thank you, Thank you, Thank you!!!!!
I'm not procrastinating----I'm still doing yesterday!!!! 
I have no medical training, any medical opinions expressed in my posts are just that....opinions.

Co-Moderator for : Chronic Pain, Fibro


catlover2
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2007
Total Posts : 483
   Posted 3/11/2007 11:22 AM (GMT -7)   
Sarah, I had the same symptoms but the ortho said I had osteoarthritis of the patella (kneecap). My knee went out one day when I bent over to pick up sime library books. Hurt like heck. You said you have other arthritis- is it osteoarthritis( the degenerative kind that breaks down and gives you osteophytes) or other? They say NSAIDS - motrin, ex. are good for this. I can't take NSAIDS anymore as my stomach hurts too; much. Years of living with chronic pain. Hope I gave you insight. Hugs, Cheryl
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