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jrstrmac
New Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 4
   Posted 10/13/2008 1:30 PM (GMT -7)   
cry  Hello, I'm sorry. I sent this the wrong way. I must have sent it as a reply and I wanted a new post. I'm new to this so I hope you will bear with me. Here is my post. I'm looking for some advice.
 
Hello,
I am a new member. I suffer with chronic pain from a myriad of problems. I'll list some of the important ones, but I clould fill a book with them all. I have a herniated disc, lumbar 5, stenosis, spinal osteoarthritis, cervical fusion, non-malignant tumor located on the left side of lumbar 5 with the nerves growing through and wrapped around the tumor, spondyliosos(sp?), aggressive degenerative disc disease, sciatic nerve left leg, diabetic neuropathy in feet, beginning in hands, permanent nerve damage to right hand and wrist resulting from four carpel tunnel surgeries (doc's say nothing can be done to repair, too damaged), RSD in left foot (thankfully in remission now), severe osteoarthritis in both knees (now getting the Synovasc treatment), severe osteoarthritis in both hips, chronic edema problem, legs and feet swell three times their size, so bad sometimes they weep. I think these are the worst of it...I'm in so much pain sometimes I have even thought of giving up the ghost...I go to a pain clinic and the meds they give me, Avinza 120mg, one every 24 hours and Lortab (10/500) one every 6-8 hours. Well, I'm like tyno...I have to take more Lortab because alot of times I can't bear waiting six hours. So, I'm now in the position she gets in. I have now run out and cannot get my prescription until Thursday the 16th. This is the first time I have ever completely ran out of meds, I always managed to keep a few back just for this type of emergency. As I don't use my meds to get high, those days are gone, all I want is to be at least able to ease 50% of this horror. I was wondering if anyone can tell me what to expect? The last dose of 20mg hydrocodone I had was at 10:30 am, the morning. The pain is already increased greatly, what will happen next? Is there anything I can do to help the withdrawal? I am so frightened...Any advice will really be appreciated.
Thank you,
Jane

mrsm123
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2007
Total Posts : 1228
   Posted 10/14/2008 9:22 AM (GMT -7)   

You will probably go through withdrawal. Diarrehea, muscle spasms and cramps, nausea and lack of ability to sleep will probably be part of it. Along with yawning, and tearing eyes...

Can I ask why you would take an extra dose of pain meds nightly?  I am not trying to be rude, but you had to realize that you were going to be short pain meds by doing this.

Why not discuss with your doctor that you found yourself waking at night and in pain and asking him what he would like you to do about this? It seems to me that if you are consistantly finding yourself in need of more frequent relief than what you are prescribed, rather than altering the dosing by yourself, it would make far more sense to discuss it with your doctor, who may be able to make some adjustments in your dosage, and then not finding yourself in this situation.

Those of us , taking pain meds have some responsibility to take the meds as directed and to let the PM's we see know if something needs tweaking or is not covering our pain, rather than adjust our meds ourselves.

I truly don't mean to be rude, and I do understand what it is like to have to wait those two or three hours until it is time to be able to take another dose , but I wait...I try other means to manage the pain until that time comes. The other problem that comes with adjusting meds on our own is that we train our bodies to expect that extra dose of meds, and it will wake us, and tell us what horrible pain we are having until it gets it.

Anyway, I hope that it is not too bad for you.....I just feel so frustrated when I read posts like this... when it is avoidable by not taking it upon ourselves to adjust meds on our own.

Sandi

 


PLIF/TLIF Fusion w/Instrumentation L4-5 Spondololysthesis L4-5.Laminectomies L4-5, foraminal stenosis L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, herniations L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, central canal stenosis L3-4, L4-5 and L5-S1
POST OP CES 3/30-06
Neurogenic Bladder and Bowel, bilateral numbness legs and feet
Revision for failed Back surgery, pseudoarthrosis L4-5, hemilaminectomies L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, bmp added to revision fusion, replaced two bent screws that were reversing out of vertebrae - August 2, 2007
On going back pain and neuropathic pain, failed back surgery, consult for scs, decided not to do that at this point.
Adhesive Arachnoiditis also......just what I didn't need..9/08- adding bilateral ulnar neuropathy with severe compression to the mix. They want me to see a surgeon for ulnar nerve surgery, but I'm not biting.
I've seen enough surgeons over the last few years.


Tirzah
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2008
Total Posts : 2279
   Posted 10/14/2008 9:42 AM (GMT -7)   
Drink plenty of water (or decaf tea).

Also, depending on your relationship w/ your doctor you could ask for something to help with the withdrawal symptoms. There are prescription meds that can help to lessen symptoms.

If possible, maybe you can fill your script at a 24-hr pharmacy on the 16th and pick it up just after midnight. That way you'll really only have about one day of withdrawal symptoms.

Sandi covered the w/d symptoms pretty well. Another possible symptom that I had was feeling creepy-crawly sensations on my arms. I felt like I had to keep moving & keep rubbing my arms in order to feel okay. You might also feel like you're nervous/anxious or nervous b/c your heart rate & breathing rate may increase. It really just depends on the person -- how fast you metabolize the last dose, how long you've been on your current meds, etc. Sometimes people won't start to get any withdrawal symptoms for more than a day after their last dose. Maybe you'll get lucky like that. Just try to stay calm & remember that you'll be okay.
On occasion people can develop serious complications from even short periods of withdrawal. If your heart rate is really fast or you can't keep down liquids or something else serious like that, you should call your dr or go to the er.

Hope things go okay for you. Take care.

frances

jrstrmac
New Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 4
   Posted 10/14/2008 12:00 PM (GMT -7)   

Thank you both for your advice and observations. I have already started the creepy crawling feeling, it is awful, inability to sleep, tearing and oddly, sneezing, nausea, but no diarrhea yet. So far it's pretty bad. Normally I do follow the program but on occasion the pain is so servere I can't wait the extra hours. I have spoken to the doctor and he suggested he discontinue the Avinza and put me on the Durgesic patch. Those things scare me and I am resisting going on them. I've also asked him to just increase my Lortab to 4 to 6 hours but he won't. He suggested discontinuing the Lortab and putting me on a morphine pill for breakthrough. I've gotta tell you I just don't want to get started on what I feel are very strong narcotics. It just upsets me that he won't consider my ideas that I know would work and not have to switch to the heavy duty narcotics. Well I'll tell you, this will be the last time I take extra Lortabs, I won't go through this again. I'll just have to go through the more intense pain, somehow, when it happens. Well, hopefully it will be over pretty soon. Thank you all again.

Jane


Pamela Neckpain
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 1821
   Posted 10/14/2008 12:47 PM (GMT -7)   
Call your doctor. He may feel some frustration with you. He has offered you
medications that would probably work but you go your own route and now
are feeling the consequences.
I'm sorry this happened to you. But it should be a warning to all of us to never
take extra medication without asking your doctor.
You could get yourself in trouble ... and you could get HIM/HER in trouble. Doctors
who prescribe Opiods are taking chances with patients.
btw ... I took Avinza and it didn't do a thing for me.
MEDICAL CONDITIONS

Osteoarthritis all levels of spine right down to Coccyx,Spondilytis,Myofascial Pain
Fromyalgia,Bulging Discs,Spinal Stenosis,Scoliosis,Osteopenia,Chronic Constipation
Carpel Tunel Syndrome,.Prolapsed Bowel and Bladder, Attention Deficity Disorder,
Depression & Anxiety

Methadone for Pain, Xanax for Anxiety,


jrstrmac
New Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 4
   Posted 10/14/2008 1:39 PM (GMT -7)   
As I stated I don't want to start with the heavy narcotics so I'll just have to, as you say "go may own route" and make do with the way things are now. Maybe someday I'll change my mind but right now I have to go with my gut feelings. I imagine one day the pain will win out and I'll take the Duragesic and Morphine, but not until absolutely neccessary. Also, my taking the extra Lortabs is not an everyday thing, only on very few occasions have I done this. And obviously it won't happen again. Other than the very few times I've done this I follow my doctor's instructions. I just don't understand why he would want to put me on stronger narcotics rather then just increase my Lortab a few hours as the Avinza works fine most of the time. It just doesn't make any sense to me.
Jane

PAlady
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 6795
   Posted 10/14/2008 2:12 PM (GMT -7)   
Jrstrmac,
It may sound strange, but some of the opiods may actually be safer for longer term use, and cause less harm to the body. Your doctor may be trying to help. You say you are sometimes in such pain that you feel like "giving up the ghost" which can be interpreted as suicidal thinking. You've got a lot of physical problems that can not only cause pain, but depression, and I doubt that going your own route is going to help. Are you on anthing to help with depression? Also, seeing a psychologist or other therapist who specializes in pain may help you make decisions about treatment, and what you may have to accept if you want at least some relief.

PaLady

Pamela Neckpain
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 1821
   Posted 10/14/2008 7:30 PM (GMT -7)   
Although I said that Avinza didn't help me that doesn't mean it's not a very strong Opiod. Duragesic and
Morphine didn't help either. Doctors have to really search to find the best medication for you. I'm doing
fair now.

PAl: I felt at ease with your suggestions. You do have a way with words, girl.

Pamela

mrsm123
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2007
Total Posts : 1228
   Posted 10/14/2008 9:03 PM (GMT -7)   
Avinza is a strong narcotic pain med. As are all of the long acting. None of them are "lightweights " are far as pain meds go. One reason that your doctor may not want to increase the frequency of the lortabs is the amount of tylenol in them. Too much tylenol over the long term is not good for your liver. Increasing the frequency could well put you over the recommended amount of tylenol for the day that is recommended.
There are several other short acting meds that he can try you on, or he can change you over to the patch but you are against that? I'm not sure why, since Avinza is right up there with the rest of the long acting meds. The only difference is that Duragesic is a patch with a three day span before needing changing in most cases.
It might offer you better overall coverage than you are getting with Avinza which you say isn't working so well for you, and might also eliminate the waking up in pain that you are having now.
As Pam said to you, your doctor is trying to help, just not the way that you want him to. He is trying to help keep your pain levels down, and the tylenol down as well. Try one of his suggestions, you might find that you get better pain relief than what you think you are getting with the Lortab and Avinza. If it doesn't work , you can always ask to go back to what you were on.
Sandi
PLIF/TLIF Fusion w/Instrumentation L4-5 Spondololysthesis L4-5.Laminectomies L4-5, foraminal stenosis L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, herniations L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, central canal stenosis L3-4, L4-5 and L5-S1
POST OP CES 3/30-06
Neurogenic Bladder and Bowel, bilateral numbness legs and feet
Revision for failed Back surgery, pseudoarthrosis L4-5, hemilaminectomies L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, bmp added to revision fusion, replaced two bent screws that were reversing out of vertebrae - August 2, 2007
On going back pain and neuropathic pain, failed back surgery, consult for scs, decided not to do that at this point.
Adhesive Arachnoiditis also......just what I didn't need..9/08- adding bilateral ulnar neuropathy with severe compression to the mix. They want me to see a surgeon for ulnar nerve surgery, but I'm not biting.
I've seen enough surgeons over the last few years.


PAlady
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 6795
   Posted 10/14/2008 9:09 PM (GMT -7)   
I definitely agree with what Sandi's said. BTW, Sandi, thanks for being able to explain things better than I did.

Having some not so good pain days and brain fog and just plain tired!

PaLady

mrsm123
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2007
Total Posts : 1228
   Posted 10/15/2008 2:02 PM (GMT -7)   

You are so very welcome PA. I truly hope that you feel better soon.

:-) I've had several of those not feeling so well days myself of late, which is why I haven't been around.  sad

I wish things would just level off for many of us. It seems to be that time of year again.

Take care,
Sandi


PLIF/TLIF Fusion w/Instrumentation L4-5 Spondololysthesis L4-5.Laminectomies L4-5, foraminal stenosis L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, herniations L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, central canal stenosis L3-4, L4-5 and L5-S1
POST OP CES 3/30-06
Neurogenic Bladder and Bowel, bilateral numbness legs and feet
Revision for failed Back surgery, pseudoarthrosis L4-5, hemilaminectomies L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, bmp added to revision fusion, replaced two bent screws that were reversing out of vertebrae - August 2, 2007
On going back pain and neuropathic pain, failed back surgery, consult for scs, decided not to do that at this point.
Adhesive Arachnoiditis also......just what I didn't need..9/08- adding bilateral ulnar neuropathy with severe compression to the mix. They want me to see a surgeon for ulnar nerve surgery, but I'm not biting.
I've seen enough surgeons over the last few years.


mom9mom
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2008
Total Posts : 489
   Posted 10/15/2008 9:01 PM (GMT -7)   
I just dont understand why you wont try the patch.I know that I could not get bye without mine.It gives you better pain control and more even control then pills.Its to easy to take another pill when you are hurting with the patch you know that you cant put a new one on so you are more willing to try tylanol or ibuprofen for brake through pain.Please just think about trying the patch(If I forget to cange my patch I dont have withdraws I just hurt real bad) if you dont like it you can stop useing it.
Lost half of my small intestine, Nerve damage to right leg,part of my right hip bone removed,hernia,infection in my back called discites,and depression


Pamela Neckpain
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 1821
   Posted 10/15/2008 9:59 PM (GMT -7)   
Sandi ~
"That time of year again" you say
It IS getting to be the time of year when I don't feel well.
I think about going to the stores and shopping for gifts & something
to wear to relatives house.
What do I do with this hair??
What do I do with this face?
Do I look pregnant? (THAT would make the Enquirer)
My feet are so wide. Will ANY shoes fit me?
Is that a liver spot or skin cancer?
My back hurts. I just want to lay on the soft couch and watch TV.
Of course, I'll brush my teeth but that's it.
It's everybody's birthday.
It's everybody's Christmas
This economy ... omg.
It makes everything hurt.
& maybe every one.
Pamela will now return to the TV
I think I've gone off topic shakehead shakehead shakehead shakehead
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