Is physical pain worse than nerve pain? Or visaversa?

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Tony McGuire
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2009
Total Posts : 483
   Posted 4/24/2009 10:37 AM (GMT -7)   
I've had pain from a lot of things. Nothing major in a life-threatening way, or in a whole-body way, but PAINful nonetheless.

But I've not had CHRONIC pain from physical sources.

Only from neuropathy - which is non-pain (many would argue).

For those who have experienced or who do experience BOTH types of pain, how would you compare the two?

If you would, compare them both if you were and weren't able to get the medicine or machine treatment that reduces or clears your pain (either or both).

I really believe this will help me understand my own pain better. But maybe not since I don't have the 'physical' kind of pain.

Your participation appreciated if you qualify for both types of continuous (untreated) pain.
Wife: Liz, the choice of a lifetime
Dogs: Koshka Prayer & Chomp Prayer


TroubleMaker
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2007
Total Posts : 119
   Posted 4/24/2009 11:25 AM (GMT -7)   
Hey Tony,
 
I dont know if I can help or not.  I had a ruptured disc that started up in 2005.  I didnt have surgery until 2007, and I was in horrible pain.  They would give me Vicodin which would help but nothing got rid of the pain.  I would have spasms that would throw my upper body forward and I'd have to hold on to someone or something.  When they finally took me serious and sent me for an MRI I had a ruptured disc that was over 50% out.  (L-3 and L-4), the doctor that did the surgery on me was suprised I was able to walk must less sit on his table with my legs crossed indian style.  (Fat and limber, thats ME) He wanted to do the surgery that next day but had to wait til Monday, when he saw me and hubby, he told Alan he was scared all weekend that I would have moved wrong and he'd be putting me in a wheel chair.  With all this I also started having pains down my legs...Sciatic nerve started up, now that was fun... NOT.. I would sit in a hot tub, as hot as I could stand and cry... nothing would help...Since the surgery, in April of 2007 there were about 3 months that the pain was managable.  I could stand it and I asked the doctor for another MRI and was told you have scar tissue and he couldn't tell me why I still hurt.  I left crying and swore I'd never darken his door again which I have not.  The pain I'm having now is not much different for me, but the new doctor said that he thought I have nerve damage. He's got me on steroids now and I can tell a little bit its helping but I'm still hurting. (But some of it is the burns on my back also, heating pad accident)
 
I dont think I've helped you much, after re-reading what I've wrote.  LOL, sorry.  I dont know if what I'm feeelin now is much different.  From the time before the surgery nothing could stop the pain, it would get worse and worse, and I could not sit still.  I still can not sit still for long or lay still I an constantely (sp) moving.  Alan says even at nite when I sleep I'm moving.  I work at a desk and sit from 9 til 5 Monday through Friday, and my boss is really understanding.  If I get to uncomphy, I get up and walk around or lay on the floor.  At one point I had my phone and notebook under my desk LOL... yea I know the visual will make you fall out of your seat.  (Everyone put on your seat belts.) 
 
I also have bad cramps since I was 17 or 18 I'll be 40 in a few days. (woo hoo on getting old), talking with the doctor Monday he seems to think it is from my back (nerve damage).  After talking with him and thinking back, I remember falling at Six Flags when I was 12 to 15 and landed on all 4's and arched my back really hard.  After that (17-18) I would walk and my legs would start cramping, I thought it was cause I didnt warm up or something, it kept on for years.  Getting worse as I get older and also I started having problems with my back, never put two and two together til now. Now I'm really wondering if it has to do with the fall when I was a kid.  Could I have messed my self up all those years ago and didnt know.
 
Lord, I've got to stop LOL... I'm sorry I've been rambling.  I really dont know if I helped or not, I dont think I did, I think I just confused you and me more.
 
I wish you all the luck in the world to find help and get relief.
 
Trouble
 
 


PAlady
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 6795
   Posted 4/24/2009 11:44 AM (GMT -7)   
Tony,
I've got neuropathic symptoms and sciatic pain, and they are both physical pain, just different types of sensations. Not sure where you learned neuropathic pain isn't "physical" pain but that's not accurate according to any doctor or anything I've ever read.

They are challenging to treat, and for me and many others require different medications. I think the cymbalta and lyrica (if i remember correctly) you're on are designed more for neuropathic pain, along with other things. I do find for me combining an opiod with neurontin is helpful for both kinds of symptoms, but none totally remove the pain - either type.

PaLady

Post Edited (PAlady) : 4/24/2009 12:47:40 PM (GMT-6)


Tony McGuire
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2009
Total Posts : 483
   Posted 4/24/2009 11:57 AM (GMT -7)   
I'm in it for the Neuropathy all the way.

I'm on Lyrica first, with Cymbalta to enhance its ability to fight the nerve pain; the Cymbalta doesn't kill nerve pain directly the way I understand it.

Then I'm on Methadone, with Morphine for B/T. Seems that taking the Morphine is a timing issue; if you don't take it at the right time, the Methadone will kill some of its ability to kill pain.

I do find for me combining Methadone with Morphine is helpful for partial treatment of the neuropathic pain, but only about 1/2. And right now I have breakthrough pain with shooters into the 10 range. Getting worse day by day, lately.

I've learned TONS about Methadone in 4 months. I've read several differing opinions (on the Internet) about how Methadone acts.

My body is going about 6 different directions where pain and bloating are concerned.

I'm hungry for everyone's experiences so that maybe I can find something for me. Well, and others if it solves some of my issues. Or at least helps resolve some of my issues. Right now, I've probably got more questions than when I started here. But then, that is good.
Wife: Liz, the choice of a lifetime
Dogs: Koshka Prayer & Chomp Prayer

Post Edited (TonyMcGuire) : 4/24/2009 1:20:43 PM (GMT-6)


Scarred_for_life
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2008
Total Posts : 1559
   Posted 4/24/2009 1:08 PM (GMT -7)   
I think that physical pain where you can actually see what is wrong is much better then that you cannot see but you know it hurts. For one thing with physical pain it can actually be detected and you know that it is there. But with the ones you cannot see you know its there but the doctors are reluctant to treat it for fear of retribution. Too there is a long standing ideology that with the pain a person cannot see, through MRI's and etc. there is the stigma of "its all in your head." type position that I think many medical personal take towards us. Then for the patient we feel like gee what's wrong with me....is it all in my head? So we second guess ourselves because of the fact that the doctors can't find what is wrong. Its frustrating and can lead to a lot of depression.

With me, until they actually discovered that I did have an impinged nerve deep inside my back I actually was becoming very frustrated. But too, I am still frustrated because I know there is something out there that MIGHT help to lower my pain and decrease my medications but I can't have it right now so that is Very frustrating.

Anyway....that's my two cents.

Hugsssssssssssssssssssssss

Scarred
What doesn't kill us only makes us fight back harder! :P


shannon1
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2005
Total Posts : 369
   Posted 4/24/2009 2:03 PM (GMT -7)   
Hi Tony!

Unfortunatly, i suffer from both.

As a child, age 5 i was run over (twice, back, then forth) by a ride on lawnmower, over my left leg/foot. Long story short, i had severe gangreen, lost a toe, had broken just about every bone in the foot, with pins that went into the top of the toe bone all the way through each toe bones to hold them together. I suffered multiple compound (out of the skin) fractures in the leg, even up past the knee.

Fast forward 30 yrs. I now suffer from nerve damage and serious arthritis, and bone pain, joint pain, pain where my screws are, pain walking on the foot due to bonespurs, pain in my hips and back from walking off kilter so many years.

I take percocet for my pain, i have tried lyrica, neurontin, and a few others for the nerve pain, all of which have not helped. I have nerve blocks which help, but recently had radiofrequency done which has helped ALOT!

I wish i had more for you, but i have yet to find longterm help either...
Jan. 2009, complete hysterectomy, diagnosed stage 4 endometriosis & adenomyosis (age 36)
2003, dx moderate UC
2000, dx selective IGA deficiency w/ anti IGA antibodies
2000, dx Antipholipid Antibody Syndrome
1999-2009, chronic hemmoragic ovarian cysts, w/ partial ovary removal
1977, complete reconstruction of foot after lawnmower accident (chronic pain)
 
Meds
6mp 75mg, prednisone 40mg (just starting meds again)
percocet 5mg 3x day
potassium 3x day
 


Pete trips again!
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 1899
   Posted 4/24/2009 2:20 PM (GMT -7)   
Tony>
Oh my old friend and constant companion>PAIN!!! It should be my middle name! I'm sure, no I know there are lots of others here who feel the same way about their pain! But when I think about my pain, it's very hard to remember much about it. How do you compare the intensity of the pain you had 20 or 30 years ago with pain you have now? I can't do it! I can say, oh that had to be a #10 back then but can you really remember? I think it may be a defence mechanism that our brains use so we are not terrified to live our lives in fear after some major pain insident. I'm sure some of the "smarter or more educated people" here probably know alot about the phycology of pain and hope they straighen us out on the subject. But now, I've reached the point in my life that I'm a real "CP'er" that is, some pain never goes away and thats a whole different ball game that going between different memories of pain with no pain in between! When you asked which pain is worse, it made me think about my pain. I know I have physical reasons for some of my pain or like you said the pain that can be traced by a doctor to something he can see and define a reason for it, but is that all I have? Am I like you and have pain that a doctor can't find a reason for? Yes, I think we all do weather you have a name for it or not, I believe it's there. It might be worse in some people than others but it's there! Now, which is worse? My opinion is the pain that will not subside is the worst weather it's detectable by a doctor or not!!!! The Doc may say, "this will only hurt for a second or two when preforming some procedure on you. Would you rather have an intence pain for 2 seconds or a modertate anoying pain for an hour? When you wake up in the morning in pain and you know that that might be the best you feel all day, thats the worst pain in my book!!! CP is the worst pain and people who don't have it will never understand it!! Think about the poor people in this forum who live with and have been living with #8 or #9 pain constantly for years! I know mine isn't that bad and although it goes up there sometimes. On the other hand, I'm sure we have some here who stretch the truth a little when they talk about their pain but it's not their fault. These people are used to trying to explain their pain to someone who hasn't a clue about how they feel. The have to exagerate for anyone to listen to them because the people they are trying to convince just haven't got a clue what they are going through when that pain just does NOT go away!! Oh boy, I better quit now before I totally confuse everyone!! I appologize for rambling on like this, it's Tony's fault for making me think!!!
All for now, my poor little brain is smoking and not from cig's!!!
Love You People!!!
Pete
56 years old, Surgury, Radical Prostatectomy 8/20/03, PSA 6.6, Gleason 3 + 3 = 6, Adenocarcinoma extent (moderate) Stage & Margin:T2NOMX, No Metastases, Organ Confined, bone scan: Neg. 3 1/2 years of depression after surgery prior to Hypogonadizm DX, Testosterone Theropy> new 2/6/09> 400mg injections once a month. 56 and so glad to still be here to see my two sons grow up to be fine young men. They are both serving in the US Navy, one on the aircraft carrier USS John Stennis in port in Singapor and the other on a Gator Freighter USS Bataan stationed in Norfolk, Va. to be deployed to the Middle East in early May. I am one very proud (what they call me)> Big Pops! 


Chartreux
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2006
Total Posts : 9622
   Posted 4/24/2009 2:33 PM (GMT -7)   
Tony give me a few days to think up a responce, I'm hurting and too dang tired today!!!!!!!
soft hugz to you though.......
the mri yesterday took a lot out of me............
**********************************************
* Asthma, Allergies, Osteoarthritis, Spinal Stenosis, Degenative Disc, Fibromyalgia, Gerd,
Enlarged Pituitary Gland, Sjogren's and Ocular Migraines

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White Beard
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Feb 2009
Total Posts : 3611
   Posted 4/24/2009 3:04 PM (GMT -7)   
Pete I think you are wiser than what you might think, you have pretty well nailed it on most things anyway! Pain is so personal, and really, everyone feels it just a little differently. But chronic pain is something that wears you down, reguardless of its orgin! Physically, and emotionally it takes it toll! When your in pain it doesn't really matter whether it is neuropathy, or phantom, physical, or whatever, if you constantly feel it, and it makes you miserable, then all you really want, is to have it gone!
 
   I can't feel your pain and you can't feel mine, that is why we were taught in nursing school that pain is what ever the patient says it is PERIOD!. And to be honest with you, it really does have to be that way, because what might be on a pain scale of 8 by one person, might be only rated as 2 or 3 by another person! Who is right on the amount of pain they actually feel???  How can I tell a person that they don't feel as much pain, as they claim they do? I can't feel, what they are feeling! I have no idea what or how they actually feel and I certainly don't have any way of gettig into their body or brain to find out! I have to, take them at there word!  Even the amout of pain medication it takes to relieve the pain varies so much from one person to another. 5 mg of oxycodone might knock one person out, and yet not even phase another person. Yet they might have the exact same thing wrong with them!

Tony I think it is commendable for you to want to find answers and try to better understand your pain by listenign about experiences  of others, but I really don't think you will ever really get the answers that you seek! Because I really don't think there are any! and I don't think it really matters whether your pain is physical or neuropathy in orgin! You have it, and you feel it, and you own it, and what ever fixes it for you, is what works for you! But really it only works just for you! And after all, that is what counts anyway, isn't it!?!  I do hope that all this makes sense! Good Luck to You!

White Beard


  I'm Retired USAF, went back to school and became an RN, and now am on full disalbility!--Degenerative Disc (affecting mostly the thorasic disc but all levels involved), C6/7 laminectomy/diskectomy& fusion, Osteoarthritis, Ulcerative colitis, Chronic Pain, Fibromyalgia, Complex Sleep Apnea, and host of other things to spice up my life!(NOT!) Medications: Oxycontin, Percocet, Baclofen, Sulfasalazine, Metoprolol, Folic Acid, Supplemental O2 at 3lpm with VPAP Adapt SV

Post Edited (White Beard) : 4/24/2009 4:15:50 PM (GMT-6)


PAlady
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 6795
   Posted 4/24/2009 3:29 PM (GMT -7)   
But I'm still confused about why anyone thinks neuropathic pain is not physical pain? It's not emotional (although any pain affects our emotions) - at least my neuropathic pain isn't! I just think it's harder for doctors to pinpoint the causes for some pain, so some may not validate our pain. And White Beard as you wisely say it's the patient who validates the pain! Even if it's all emotional, it's still pain that deserves to be treated!

Years ago it used to be thought that "phantom pain" - the kind of pain people would report when they had an amputation, for example, was all in someone's head. A person would say they could still "feel" the missing arm or leg, and the doctors thought that wasn't possible. But now research shows that's exactly what is happening; the information from the nerve endings is communicating with the brain just as if the limb was still there. And from what I hear that can be excruciating pain and one of my doctors said that's why they don't completely severe a nerve when they do a radiofrequency procedure (like Shannon had) because when they did that in earlier years to supposedly "kill" the nerve people would feel phantom pain which was worse than what they were tryng to cure! So now they just injure the nerve in an RF procedure, which is why it may grow back over time, but you don't have the phantom pain.

Ok, now I'll stop rambling!!

PaLady

White Beard
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Feb 2009
Total Posts : 3611
   Posted 4/24/2009 4:32 PM (GMT -7)   
PALady
Your not rambling what you say is true, Phantom pain is notoriously difficult to treat! and and as far as neurpathic pain goes, heck look at diabetics they suffer from neuropathy, whether it be pain or numbness and tingling, that pain and the feelings they have is real! I personally don't think that it matters what type of pain a person has, if a person has pain, then you are absolutely right PALady it deserves to be treated!

White Beard
  I'm Retired USAF, went back to school and became an RN, and now am on full disalbility!--Degenerative Disc (affecting mostly the thorasic disc but all levels involved), C6/7 laminectomy/diskectomy& fusion, Osteoarthritis, Ulcerative colitis, Chronic Pain, Fibromyalgia, Complex Sleep Apnea, and host of other things to spice up my life!(NOT!) Medications: Oxycontin, Percocet, Baclofen, Sulfasalazine, Metoprolol, Folic Acid, Supplemental O2 at 3lpm with VPAP Adapt SV


golitho
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2008
Total Posts : 1670
   Posted 4/24/2009 6:27 PM (GMT -7)   
I think all these postings have given me real food for thought, so thanks Tony. Now I know I'm not in as much pain as you guys, I can take a couple of codapane forte and really push it into the background. (Plus my humira and methotrexate to control inflammation) I still work part time and still volunteer at my kids activities. But I do have constant pain. I've had two right shoulder reconstructions after two accidents, it still hurts me but I've learnt to manage it, changing positions keeping my elbow in to the side of my body, using my left hand etc.. also injured my lower back with the first accident which I am sure is why I have osteoarthritis there now. The psoriatic arthritis is flaring recently, swollen knees, hips, elbows and thumbs, all these joints sort of ache full time and hurt to use. I get flashes of nerve pain down my right leg and my hands can really bother me with numbness and burning. Sounds terrible but it is not as bad as it sounds. I some how get the old body up and into a hot shower and the more I move it sort of lubricates the joints and I start to free up. My pain level sort of jumps around depending on what I'm doing. It is increasingly hard to get myself started at times, but my rheumy is very anti pain killers. Luckily my local doctor is more sympathetic. I didn't mean to do a big "me" speal but pain is sort of relative. If you can still manage to move and work it takes your mind off it to some extent but when it is so bad like so many of you have it, it becomes all encompassing, no matter if its nerve or physical, my heart really goes out to you all.

opnwhl4
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 4961
   Posted 4/24/2009 8:20 PM (GMT -7)   
Tony,
I agree that neuropathy is real pain. I have been dealing with it in my right ribs after lung surgery over a year ago. Fortunately my surgeon understands this and doesn't hesitate to treat it. Unfortunately the Neurontin doesn't work as well as it used to and my insurance company won't pay for Lyrica that he wants to switch to because I don't have diabetic neuropathy. I'm not sure which is worse, but I know neuropathy is very painful.

Take care,
Bill

White Beard
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Feb 2009
Total Posts : 3611
   Posted 4/24/2009 8:38 PM (GMT -7)   
golitho it is OK to do the "me" speal thing. Where better place to talk about your pain than right here? It doesn't matter if your pain is more or less that some one else, if you have it and it bothers you, that is what is important!
Hope you have a good evening!

White Beard
  I'm Retired USAF, went back to school and became an RN, and now am on full disalbility!--Degenerative Disc (affecting mostly the thorasic disc but all levels involved), C6/7 laminectomy/diskectomy& fusion, Osteoarthritis, Ulcerative colitis, Chronic Pain, Fibromyalgia, Complex Sleep Apnea, and host of other things to spice up my life!(NOT!) Medications: Oxycontin, Percocet, Baclofen, Sulfasalazine, Metoprolol, Folic Acid, Supplemental O2 at 3lpm with VPAP Adapt SV


golitho
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2008
Total Posts : 1670
   Posted 4/24/2009 10:56 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks White Beard. I am a bit addicted to this site at the moment. Going through a low patch and reading here is very sobering for me. You guys are a truely wonderful bunch of very caring people.

PAlady
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 6795
   Posted 4/24/2009 11:33 PM (GMT -7)   
Golitho,
I think I'm in the same boat. Don't know what i'd do without the "family" here. If it's an addiction, it's a healthy one for a CPP's.

Join the crowd! It especially helps me get through low patches, anxiety, and lots of stuff.

PaLady

Pamela Neckpain
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 1821
   Posted 4/25/2009 2:16 AM (GMT -7)   
Tony,

I don't know what kind of pain I have. If you looked at me, you wouldn't see much
wrong except there is a curve in my neck that other people don't have. Pinched
nerves and herniated discs and other not good stuff shows up on my MRI's. I
have a difficult time of it. My head is sitting on a bad place. The pain that I feel
in my neck and shoulders is nerve pain, I guess. I hoped that surgery like Pete
had would be an option. Unfortunately, it won't work on me. The only kind of
medical procedure that would help at this point is to remove my head, take care
of the problem and then carefully replace it.

I've heard of some good neurosurgeons who can reattach heads on decapitated
patients. However, I've never heard of one so skilled that they can remove the
head and successfully and replace it. : (

When I hear others say, "I'm in pain," I take it at that. I never doubt pain. I know
it all too well. A diagnosis of Fibromyalgia would be TERRIBLE. Many doctors
don't believe it because they can't see it.

Oh, I don't know what's what. Not at all. Not one bit. Not a pinch. I go to research,
get distracted or lost and punch off this Mac and menace it with my mean face.

How do you take Morphine to help with your Methadone? My doctor says to take it
midway between Methadone. Let me know how YOU take it. OK?

Pamela

For inquiring minds or those who need a replacement:
The neurosurgeon that replaced the head is somewhere in Arizona. rolleyes

Post Edited (Pamela Neckpain) : 4/25/2009 3:19:45 AM (GMT-6)


angel8
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2009
Total Posts : 109
   Posted 4/25/2009 3:12 AM (GMT -7)   

Hi Tony and sorry for the delay in getting here as I didnt get on at all yesterday.

Pain versus neuropathy? My gosh lets see I have sciatica that flares only at this point and I CANNOT imagine having that kind of pain 24/7 my friends. When it hits it does so with a vengence and there isnt awhole lot of anything I can do to slow it down,speed it up,or darn even give it a break.

I like Pamela "look" very normal and all my limps and drags from the numerous knee ops are now long gone(except during sciatica flare) so when we dont look like a CPer for some dumb reason we have a much more difficult battle with all things from convincing ourselves we havent lost out mind to convincing the Doc we really are in pain to warrant this much meds.

I can darn sure wear a brave face when I have to doesnt mean if you were to take look into my dental scope you wont find bit cheecks,ground teeth etc. Lol

I am sanely watching you on the lyrica and cymbalta as they have been suggested and one even tried by me and my Doc but the lyrica had some strange effects on my sanity and it isnt much to brag about to begin with. The other I am still hoping for.

I cant only tell you a story here that makes my blood run cold even after all these years. My Dad one day out of nowhere has this shoulder problem come upon him. NOw he is 60 years old and still working so I am thinking maybe he did something,doesnt recall it. It gets worse as far as the pain,they cant find nothing wrong anywhere in the are at this point. Send him to PT. It doesnt help and he still is freakin after 11 months of this. I am at his house one day and he is outside when I walk up the drive and I see him banging his shoulder on the brick wall of the house! I am like OMG what is he doing? I ask him in a not so nice voice just what is going on down here and simply states that the physical pain much outweighs whatever that burning pain is in his shoulder! That about sums up how I feel sometimes during one of those flares.

Turns out Dad had a tumor high up in the cervical region that had been secondary to lung cancer and he was gone from me in 45 short days later. Never know do we? He had been to numerous Docs of every kind noted and yes even a Neuro and spiny and it was not once seen or found until it was far too late. He never got sick,didnt take off work till the day before he did and he left a few hours early,lay down that next night and went gently into a coma and was gone within 12 hours. Had it not been for the pain of those long months in his shoulder and oh by the way no one treated that pain cause they couldnt find a cause and that was the most difficult part of the entire thing for me,knowing he suffered all those months without so much as a glorified tylenol,and he was well into the last stages of lung cancer it would have been a perfect exit. So it irritates me when I see Docs who wont write nothing until they find something. You whats going thru their minds when somehting like this happens? Doesnt it both them to know that because they were terrifed of the DEA or afraid to give out a few pills a man spent the last months of his life hitting banging his shoulder against a brick wall?

Well thats enough on that soap box but I wish you the best of luck and sure hope this thread helps as I see alot of good info here and I am going to read it all again.


Pamela Neckpain
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 1821
   Posted 4/25/2009 3:32 AM (GMT -7)   
Oh Angel,

I am sitting here at the ol' Mac just totally stunned. I am almost speechless.

I keep meaning to write something to someone about the DEA and the harm they
cause. I mean to and I don't do it. I need to find the king and have him (yes him)
put a stop to the brutality that happens in doctors offices.

It's not the fault of the doctor - some of them are sadistic, but few. It's their fear
of the DEA taking away their license. They'd lose their home, their family ...
everything.

I am sorry about what happened to your dad, Angel. I'm furious. mad

angel8
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2009
Total Posts : 109
   Posted 4/25/2009 4:28 AM (GMT -7)   

Thanks Pamela, I was pretty irate myself to think someone I loved suffered such for no reason,made me a nasty advocate for pain management though.LOl

The DEA has wrecked havoc here in KY this month making arrests and busting Docs and knocking down doors and all this hype ends up hurting who? The legit folks trying to have some kind of life!

The greedy have been driving to Florida and hauling back thousands of ocy,methadone,zanax,you name it and in numbers that are astounding and putting them on the street. Evidently FL has no kind of tracking for narcotics in place that is working and the money was more then the risk of getting caught to these guys. They have made somewhere around 60 arrests netting more then 2.4 million dollars in cash for themselves as well as all the cars,houses,whatever else they get when they take you down,to coiffers of KY and many of these are small towns and thats alot of money!

The street value alone for these drugs they confiscated were nears a billion!

Now what they did to the Docs I havent got wind of yet as they were all based in lower FL,one of the kids busted said he was told by someone else he could get whatever he wanted in that state and to go there and find one of those weekly free papers I think all states print and open to the middles pages and he would find a list of Docs and clinics that prescribed narcotics shocked   He did and was written 120 oxy-40's 180 zanax bars,and oxy ir 15mgs right on the 1st visit no MRI's,x-rays,nothing other then his word of what was wrong with him! 19 years old and a college athlete no less.  Cost him $240 for the visit,gas to get there and he was raking in somewhere close to $5000 for his trouble each month,next month he took 2 friends and they got their preferred meds as well!

I get sick reading this kind of thing as I know so so many CPers that cant get nothing more then tramadol! What folks dont do is read the stories in their entiriety and all they see is "drug busts" Oxy-c,methadone, Docs raided" These are NOT professional folks and CPers here these are folks diverting these things to the street for money.

Still scares alot of good Docs and makes them leery of anyone seeking meds.

I know I have seen posts here from pain folks that cant get relief that live in FL and that really irks me to no end. How can these Docs do this kind of thing for profit and allow the real folks needing the stuff to flail around in misery? I fear now after all the hype it will get worse for them living in that state.

I cant begin to know how to fix it other then FL needs to get a better tracking system in place and do a little better job of finding out why someone drives 20 hours from their home to get pain management as I dont know too many folks on the up andup that can afford to do that. I couldnt.


shannon1
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2005
Total Posts : 369
   Posted 4/25/2009 6:36 AM (GMT -7)   
Palady, i totally agree, nerve pain is physical pain!!!! And i do indeed find my nerve pain to be more painful then the rest of my pain. I suffer from phantom feeling (like u mentioned) where i lost my toe. Accident was 30yrs ago, and i STILL have phantom feeling in that toe!!!! Sometimes i even had the need to scratch the missing toe and just can't get to it! LOL

Angel8, u r indeed correct about FL. I live here, and have seen many news reprots of people comming from other states to get drugs! And here i am having to BEG my PM to up my dose a little! Sad, but true!!!!
Jan. 2009, complete hysterectomy, diagnosed stage 4 endometriosis & adenomyosis (age 36)
2003, dx moderate UC
2000, dx selective IGA deficiency w/ anti IGA antibodies
2000, dx Antipholipid Antibody Syndrome
1999-2009, chronic hemmoragic ovarian cysts, w/ partial ovary removal
1977, complete reconstruction of foot after lawnmower accident (chronic pain)
 
Meds
6mp 75mg, prednisone 40mg (just starting meds again)
percocet 5mg 3x day
potassium 3x day
 


LLPLUV
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2009
Total Posts : 1158
   Posted 4/25/2009 8:42 AM (GMT -7)   
Heres my take on this. Pain is Pain regardless if its physical or nerve. I have both and at times they both blend together that I can't tell which one is which I see and feel it as PAIN. This morning it took my percocet just to get out of bed. They say my morning pain is nerve pain. I sprained my ankle on Thursday trying to mow the lawn. Yes I shouldn't of been out there and this is how fate bit me in the butt. That pain is pain but wasn't as bad as my nerve pain. But then I ended up in the ER last week with a kidney stone and that hurt worse then nerve pain.

So in the end once again pain is pain regardless of its origin....

Laurie
Chronic Kidney Stones, PKD (Polycystic Kidney Disease), Chronic Kidney Failure, Severe Hypertension, Urological RSD


Tony McGuire
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2009
Total Posts : 483
   Posted 4/25/2009 10:52 AM (GMT -7)   
Pamela Neckpain said...
Tony,

I don't know what kind of pain I have...My head is sitting on a bad place. The pain that I feel in my neck and shoulders is nerve pain, I guess.
...
Many doctors don't believe it because they can't see it.
...
How do you take Morphine to help with your Methadone? My doctor says to take it
midway between Methadone. Let me know how YOU take it. OK?

Pamela


Best way to say what kind of pain I have is "It Hurts, but nobody believes me!" Unfortunately, that is too true. No one around me takes me 100% at my word, although my wife does ANYTHING I ask, trying to help and to understand.

Pam, you make an amazing statement: "Many doctors don't believe it because they can't see it.". The amazing thing is, it is true. Even the doctors charged and paid to take care of that pain, sometimes don't know what to do because they can't see it.

I didn't realize it when I asked the question here, but that may be exactly what I was looking for.

How do I take them? (Methadone & Morphine) At the same time, oddly. The time it takes to digest them, the time it takes them to settle in and start working.

Again, this may be something that only my PM of all the people in the world understand, but FOR ME it works. And yes, when I learned what Methadone was actually all about and how it interacted with Morphine, I was amazed that it actually worked.

When I have B/T, I take it whenever the B/T raises its ugly head. I cannot take more Morphine on top of the Morphine I am taking (at the same time) for the B/T (my PM was very explicit about this at my appointment this last week when I asked). I am getting more and more B/T to the point that I will just be taking it every 4 hours on schedule rather that feeling for B/T. I think it must be time to raise dosage of something, but don't ask me what.

And I could easily have misunderstood the PM about Morphine adding on top of what I am currently taking.

As I had hoped, I am continuing to understand more and more as you respond, and I greatly appreciate you all sharing your fount of knowledge.
Wife: Liz, the choice of a lifetime
Dogs: Koshka Prayer & Chomp Prayer

Post Edited (TonyMcGuire) : 4/25/2009 11:56:52 AM (GMT-6)


PAlady
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 6795
   Posted 4/25/2009 12:04 PM (GMT -7)   
Angel,
So very sorry to read about your father - especially that untreated pain. I wish you'd report his doctors to the licensing board, and ask them to defend why they didn't treat his pain, but that may raise it all back up for you.

Shannon -
Was the RF you had on your toe? I had just heard they had better ways of dealing with phantom pain, now that it's better understood (certainly than it was when you had your accident). It's got to be awful to have that all these years, on top of your other pain.

PaLady

shannon1
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2005
Total Posts : 369
   Posted 4/25/2009 12:54 PM (GMT -7)   
Palady, no, the RF was for nerve pain i have the is located at the ball of my foot, they did the RF at my middle to lower back. I was having nerve blocks for it, but i was having to have them to often, so we tried the RF, it seems to have setteled down my nerve pain and it has been over 6mo since i have had my severe nerve pain related to it....we honestly have never even addressed the phantom feeling i have, thankfully my PF is not painful, but rather bothersome when i can't actually itch it! Is there something better for nerve pain then RF? or were u only refering to the phanotom feeling????
Jan. 2009, complete hysterectomy, diagnosed stage 4 endometriosis & adenomyosis (age 36)
2003, dx moderate UC
2000, dx selective IGA deficiency w/ anti IGA antibodies
2000, dx Antipholipid Antibody Syndrome
1999-2009, chronic hemmoragic ovarian cysts, w/ partial ovary removal
1977, complete reconstruction of foot after lawnmower accident (chronic pain)
 
Meds
6mp 75mg, prednisone 40mg (just starting meds again)
percocet 5mg 3x day
potassium 3x day
 

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