Saw the 2nd hand surgeon

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mrsm123
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2007
Total Posts : 1228
   Posted 1/10/2010 11:47 PM (GMT -7)   
Hi Guys,
I saw the 2nd hand surgeon, first to confirm what the one in NJ told me and secondly to see if I liked him more/better, and 3rdly to see if he had other options to offer me.
First, we took the train to the city ( NYC) and it was snowing, blowing all over........ah well. It was a nice train ride anyway. Then we had to hit the subways to get to the other end of Manhattan since this doctors office was way down by South Street Seaport......I had no idea it was that far away from GCT. shocked
Anyway, thankfully , I had told my husband that we should take an earlier train from where we live to the city in case we had any trouble figuring out the subway and where we  needed to be. Good thing I did, because we needed that extra hour and a half to get to the office.
Anyway, he took more xrays, and the bone has fractured yet again. That's twice now in the last 6 weeks. So far, I am not impressed with the rate of fractures happening. nono  I was under the impression that this AVN stuff was slow progressing, but not apparently in my case.
 
I didn't care for his communication at all. He seemed to be under the impression that because I had seen the local hand surgeon who couldn't handle this at all, that he didn't need to explain the problem or the surgery types that are my options. In fact, he spoke very little about avn at all. He did say however that he usually does a fusion, not removing the row of bones closest to the top of the wrist joint, only because he hasn't done too many of them.shakehead
 
He added a new stage that I have not seen in any documentation of avn - a stage 3C, which I am guessing is actually supposed to be stage 4, where there are no other options left. He said that it wouldn't get any worse, now I am not sure if that is supposed to mean that the bones in my wrist/hand are damaged as much as they can be with this problem, or what he meant, because he never bothered to explain..confused However,  he was pushing me to go for a fusion surgery . He didn't discuss at all my options of doing nothing and what would happen if that was the route that I chose to go.  I really wasn't impressed at all compared to the first guy we saw.. He seemed to be rather bored or rushed or disinterested.
 
The most time that he spent talking to us was to tell me that when I decided to schedule surgery , to let him know a few days ahead of time when I wanted to do it so that he could special order the plate that he would have to put in my wrist.......
Needless to say, he will not be the surgeon doing this operation on my wrist......that's for sure. I truly dislike doctors like him.......and there is a reason. There is a distinct lack of interest in communication / no doctor patient relationship.
Sandi
PLIF/TLIF Fusion w/Instrumentation L4-5 Spondololysthesis L4-5.Laminectomies L4-5, foraminal stenosis L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, herniations L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, central canal stenosis L3-4, L4-5 and L5-S1
POST OP CES 3/30-06
Neurogenic Bladder and Bowel, bilateral numbness legs and feet
Revision for failed Back surgery, pseudoarthrosis L4-5, hemilaminectomies L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, bmp added to revision fusion, replaced two bent screws that were reversing out of vertebrae - August 2, 2007
On going back pain and neuropathic pain, failed back surgery, consult for scs, decided not to do that at this point.
Adhesive Arachnoiditis also......just what I didn't need..9/08- adding bilateral ulnar neuropathy with severe compression to the mix. They want me to see a surgeon for ulnar nerve surgery, but I'm not biting.
I've seen enough surgeons over the last few years.
Avascular necrosis of left wrist- maybe hips too


skeye
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2008
Total Posts : 2976
   Posted 1/11/2010 9:33 AM (GMT -7)   
Hi Sandi,

Sorry to hear that your appointment didn't go as you had hoped, but at least now it is clear which doctor you want to operate on you! That first one really sounded golden. Hopefully he can fix you right up.

Sorry to hear that you've fractured again as well. Boy, that's really rough: two fractures in 6 wks! Ouch! Hopefully the surgeon can get you on his schedule quickly & take care of that poor wrist of yours!

hugs,
Skeye

Screaming Eagle
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 5005
   Posted 1/11/2010 10:03 AM (GMT -7)   

     Hello Sandi! Yes...I too, agree with Skeye! Follow your gut on this one, and it sounds like you have. When will the surgery be? Soon? Let us all know, and we wish the best to you!

        Michael


straydog
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Feb 2003
Total Posts : 13473
   Posted 1/11/2010 11:19 AM (GMT -7)   
Aw Sandi what a jackass and to go thru all you did to see him. But, like someone said at least now you know which one is the best at this point. So, one big kick to the curb for that idiot. I am with you, I have no use whatsoever for drs like him. They far like themselves so much more than anyone else ever will. Take care and keep pushing on. Hugs.
 

crohns disease dx 2002 & small bowel resection, still looking for remission whatever that is, chronic pain 22 yrs, added ulcerative colitis 6-05 to the mix, high blood pressure 28 yrs, aortic heart valve insuffiency, depression, osteoarthritis, osteoporosis lumbar spine, scoliosis lumbar spine, peripheral neuropathy hands & feet, COPD & on oxygen therapy, lupus & psoriasis and psoratic arthritis. Several other health issues just not enough room to list it all. Too many surgeries to list and too many medications to list. Currently on 17 different daily medications. Intrathecal pain pump implanted June 05.


golitho
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2008
Total Posts : 1670
   Posted 1/11/2010 1:34 PM (GMT -7)   
You poor thing. Two fractures and a horrible doctor to boot! Did you ask the first guy what happens if you do nothing? I thought the thing with AVN is that it keeps spreading if you do nothing? Keeps eating healthy bone etc? I really hope they fix it for you.

I'm thinking of you Sandi, best wishes, golitho

PAlady
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 6795
   Posted 1/11/2010 6:27 PM (GMT -7)   
Sandi,
I think everyone's said anything I could think of, except just to tell you that I care and understand how hard this all must be for you. Too much sometimes.

At least you have that one doctor you found, and now you can pursue work with him - even if that means another visit just to get more questions answered.

Many hugs sent your way...

PaLady

mrsm123
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2007
Total Posts : 1228
   Posted 1/11/2010 10:20 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks Skeye,
My PM sent me to this guy, told me how much I would like him. He was dead wrong on that one. He is either too conceited and believes that patients are just surgical cases and he knows best, therefore you don't question him, or he is incredibly lacking in interpersonal skills.
It was a shock to see how this one was, compared to the first one. I know that some people believe that you don't question a doctor but I am not one of them. No matter how many other doctors I had seen, he should have at the very least asked me if I had any questions or concerns instead of making the assumption that I had already been told about this whole "disease". If it hadn't been for the visit with the other doctor, I wouldn't know any more than I could locate on the internet.
I was surprised to see the 2nd break, but it was there, clear as day. One little bone is now in 4 pieces. By the time that I can get back to the first surgeon and get surgery scheduled, I wonder if there will be anything left to remove at all? LOL
Sandi
PLIF/TLIF Fusion w/Instrumentation L4-5 Spondololysthesis L4-5.Laminectomies L4-5, foraminal stenosis L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, herniations L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, central canal stenosis L3-4, L4-5 and L5-S1
POST OP CES 3/30-06
Neurogenic Bladder and Bowel, bilateral numbness legs and feet
Revision for failed Back surgery, pseudoarthrosis L4-5, hemilaminectomies L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, bmp added to revision fusion, replaced two bent screws that were reversing out of vertebrae - August 2, 2007
On going back pain and neuropathic pain, failed back surgery, consult for scs, decided not to do that at this point.
Adhesive Arachnoiditis also......just what I didn't need..9/08- adding bilateral ulnar neuropathy with severe compression to the mix. They want me to see a surgeon for ulnar nerve surgery, but I'm not biting.
I've seen enough surgeons over the last few years.
Avascular necrosis of left wrist- maybe hips too


mrsm123
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2007
Total Posts : 1228
   Posted 1/11/2010 10:23 PM (GMT -7)   
Hi SE,
I will need to get back in touch with Dr. Bazzini to get another appointment with him, to settle on which surgery I would prefer that he do and then get his surgery schedule. I also need to get through the rest of January and February before I have to worry about getting the surgery scheduled. We have a lot of stuff going on again for the next two months, and once that is over, then I can think about a 5-6 hour surgery and three months in a cast......sigh
I will let you all know once I know. I will give him a call this week and set up my next appointment.
Sandi
PLIF/TLIF Fusion w/Instrumentation L4-5 Spondololysthesis L4-5.Laminectomies L4-5, foraminal stenosis L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, herniations L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, central canal stenosis L3-4, L4-5 and L5-S1
POST OP CES 3/30-06
Neurogenic Bladder and Bowel, bilateral numbness legs and feet
Revision for failed Back surgery, pseudoarthrosis L4-5, hemilaminectomies L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, bmp added to revision fusion, replaced two bent screws that were reversing out of vertebrae - August 2, 2007
On going back pain and neuropathic pain, failed back surgery, consult for scs, decided not to do that at this point.
Adhesive Arachnoiditis also......just what I didn't need..9/08- adding bilateral ulnar neuropathy with severe compression to the mix. They want me to see a surgeon for ulnar nerve surgery, but I'm not biting.
I've seen enough surgeons over the last few years.
Avascular necrosis of left wrist- maybe hips too


mrsm123
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2007
Total Posts : 1228
   Posted 1/11/2010 10:26 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks Stray. The ironic thing is that if I hadn't seen the other guy first, I would have had no idea that there was another hand surgeon that actually treats his patients like patients- partners in their care. I would have just assumed that they were all going to be like this jerk.
I am so glad that I had the opportunity to meet the guy in NJ first. It is worth having to drive a little over an hour to see him to be treated as if I have a brain and can make informed decisions about my own care, especially something as important as the remaining use of my hand/wrist. It is a huge deal to me since I am left handed and don't want to loose any more function than I have to. I have a long life ahead of me still and I intend to keep being left handed. It's a little too late for me to become ambidextrous at this stage of my life......LOL
So, he is kicked..........
Sandi
PLIF/TLIF Fusion w/Instrumentation L4-5 Spondololysthesis L4-5.Laminectomies L4-5, foraminal stenosis L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, herniations L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, central canal stenosis L3-4, L4-5 and L5-S1
POST OP CES 3/30-06
Neurogenic Bladder and Bowel, bilateral numbness legs and feet
Revision for failed Back surgery, pseudoarthrosis L4-5, hemilaminectomies L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, bmp added to revision fusion, replaced two bent screws that were reversing out of vertebrae - August 2, 2007
On going back pain and neuropathic pain, failed back surgery, consult for scs, decided not to do that at this point.
Adhesive Arachnoiditis also......just what I didn't need..9/08- adding bilateral ulnar neuropathy with severe compression to the mix. They want me to see a surgeon for ulnar nerve surgery, but I'm not biting.
I've seen enough surgeons over the last few years.
Avascular necrosis of left wrist- maybe hips too


mrsm123
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2007
Total Posts : 1228
   Posted 1/11/2010 10:33 PM (GMT -7)   
Hi Go,
Yes, I asked the first one that I saw what would happen if I chose to do nothing, and he said that it depends on how fast things progressed, but eventually, the bone will continue to fragment due to the stresses on the bones and joint and if the bone completely fragments then the capitate (?) bone would try to move into the space created by the fragmentation. It would increase the amount of arthritis in my hand/wrist already and eventually I would have to have a fusion of the entire wrist joint to try to manage the pain.
It already looks like some of the other bones might be effected. There is a distinct porous look to a couple of the other bones, which is why the first surgeon said that he would like me to pick one of the options - one of two types of partial fusions, or the removal of the row of bones closest to the ulna and radius, knowing that what happened ultimately would depend on the look of the bones once he saw them up close. There is already a lot of arthritis, and since I am now 46, I still have a lot of years ahead of me where I want to be able to use the hand, but I am leaning toward one of the partial fusions if he can get away with it.
I don't know how much more bone I can afford to loose.......
sandi
PLIF/TLIF Fusion w/Instrumentation L4-5 Spondololysthesis L4-5.Laminectomies L4-5, foraminal stenosis L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, herniations L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, central canal stenosis L3-4, L4-5 and L5-S1
POST OP CES 3/30-06
Neurogenic Bladder and Bowel, bilateral numbness legs and feet
Revision for failed Back surgery, pseudoarthrosis L4-5, hemilaminectomies L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, bmp added to revision fusion, replaced two bent screws that were reversing out of vertebrae - August 2, 2007
On going back pain and neuropathic pain, failed back surgery, consult for scs, decided not to do that at this point.
Adhesive Arachnoiditis also......just what I didn't need..9/08- adding bilateral ulnar neuropathy with severe compression to the mix. They want me to see a surgeon for ulnar nerve surgery, but I'm not biting.
I've seen enough surgeons over the last few years.
Avascular necrosis of left wrist- maybe hips too


mrsm123
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2007
Total Posts : 1228
   Posted 1/11/2010 10:36 PM (GMT -7)   
Thank you PA Lady. It is good to see you posting again. How are you doing? How are things going for you? I worry about you all of the time.
Yes, I am in agreement, I think that I found the surgeon that I will allow to operate. Surgeons like him are a rare variety and I don't do well with someone who treats me as though what I think or feel is not important. It seems to me that in cases like this, as much as it may be routine for them, it is far from routine for me, therefore I want someone who is going to listen and address my concerns too.
Afterall I am the one who has to live with the results.
Thank you for thinking of me.
Sandi
PLIF/TLIF Fusion w/Instrumentation L4-5 Spondololysthesis L4-5.Laminectomies L4-5, foraminal stenosis L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, herniations L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, central canal stenosis L3-4, L4-5 and L5-S1
POST OP CES 3/30-06
Neurogenic Bladder and Bowel, bilateral numbness legs and feet
Revision for failed Back surgery, pseudoarthrosis L4-5, hemilaminectomies L3-4, L4-5, L5-S1, bmp added to revision fusion, replaced two bent screws that were reversing out of vertebrae - August 2, 2007
On going back pain and neuropathic pain, failed back surgery, consult for scs, decided not to do that at this point.
Adhesive Arachnoiditis also......just what I didn't need..9/08- adding bilateral ulnar neuropathy with severe compression to the mix. They want me to see a surgeon for ulnar nerve surgery, but I'm not biting.
I've seen enough surgeons over the last few years.
Avascular necrosis of left wrist- maybe hips too


melliflious
Regular Member


Date Joined Dec 2009
Total Posts : 79
   Posted 1/14/2010 4:31 PM (GMT -7)   
Sandi,

I'm so glad that you are so able to recognize what you need in a doctor. I saw an interesting commercial where a girl at a restaurant asks a billion questions, but when she gets to her doctor she doesn't ask a single question. I'm glad that you're able to be a participant and ask the questions, and I just hope you find a doctor who does treat you as an equal partner. I've had a real eye opening experience, seeing how often a doctor doesn't treat patients like real people. I'm so sorry to hear that your hand isn't doing well, and I hope that they are able to give you a good solution soon!

HUG!
Jenna
Pain Issue: Sub-scapular bursitis, scapular dyskinesia, nerve damage down left arm, shoulder and neck
Treatment: PT, Tens Unit, Tramadol, Flector Patches and a semester off of school!

“Pain is temporary. It may last a minute, or an hour, or a day, or a year, but eventually it will subside and something else will take its place. If I quit, however, it lasts forever.” - Lance Armstrong

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