Anyone with pain from compressed nerves in lower back?

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nasalady
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   Posted 2/26/2010 5:50 PM (GMT -7)   
I went to a neuro appt recently, to go over my lumbar spine MRI results. The report stated that bulging disks are in contact with the nerves at L3-L4 and L4-L5. This fits in very well with an EMG done by a previous doctor that found that I had pinched nerves at L3-L4 and L4-L5. So I thought I had found the reason for my terrible lower back pain.

But my current neurologist just blew me off! He said that 80% of people my age have this condition and it doesn't cause pain! (I'm 54 BTW) The neurologist says that whatever is wrong with my back is mechanical not neurological.

My rheumy seems to think otherwise....I showed him the MRI report and he's offered to give me steroid shots (caudal block) and prescribed fentanyl patches for me as well.

So my question is, could the disk/nerve thing be the cause of my severe lower back pain? I have to use a wheelchair if I'm going to stand more than a few minutes or walk even 1/2 a block.

Is there anyone on this forum who has this condition and experiences severe pain because of it? I thought that I had seen posts from people here indicating that this CAN be a painful condition, but may have been hallucinating....

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated!! I just need a little reassurance because I feel like I'm going crazy!

Thanks!
JoAnn
Lyme Disease, AIH, Hashimoto's, lupus, fibro, RA, celiac disease, asthma, psoriasis, Raynaud's, hypertension, osteopenia, sleep apnea, RLS, GERD, degenerative disc disease, cubital tunnel, tarsal tunnel, Doxycycline, Prednisone, Imuran, Plaquenil, Lyrica, Cymbalta, Levothyroxine, Atenolol, Cozaar, Zyrtec, Fosamax, Albuterol, Prilosec, CPAP, Darvon, Morphine Sulfate

autoimmunediseasesgfliving.blogspot.com


Snowbunny21
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Date Joined Jan 2010
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   Posted 2/26/2010 6:05 PM (GMT -7)   
I would definitely get another opinion from a Board Certified Neurosurgeon or Board Certified Orthopedic Surgeon...

Bulging discs that effect the nerves can absolutely be painful...so that is a ridiculous statement from that Dr..

While it's true that most people over 30..if you did an MRI on them..would should degenerative changes in their discs, (DDD), and some can even have bulging discs and have no pain at all...but for him to say that it 'can't' cause pain is untrue..

Are you still taking both the Lyrica and the Cymbalta? These are usually prescribed when there is any type of nerve pain as opiates are not as effective and go to a different 'receptor' in the brain...so maybe the next step is another Dr. could possibly change/up the dosage for those.

As well as looking into getting a round of steroid injections which can be very helpful to alleviate the pain and help the inflammation. That is really the key...to do as many modalities to release the nerve pressure...

Even light traction...in a Dr. office...can really help release the nerves from the pressure of the disc.

I truly think that finding another Dr. asap would be a good idea...The quicker that you can treat bulging discs the better to keep them from going to a total herniation...

Take care,
SB and "the pup who snores loudly" 
 
ACDF C5-C7, (no hardware), with autograft bone Nov. 2001
(reabsorption of bone 2 years later...still lost in body..expect to burp it out at anytime..haha")) 
ACDF with hardware, allograft bone Nov. 2005 
Anterior and Posterior CDF, allograft bone with BMP, removal of old hardware, use of titanium plates, rods, screws, & kitchen sink (lol) Dec 2006
 
 


PAlady
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   Posted 2/26/2010 6:12 PM (GMT -7)   
Nasalady,
Snowbunny is right on. Of course a disk somehow putting pressure on a nerve can cause pain! DUH! (sorry for my sarcasm here, but I don't know what's up with your neurologist). It's a very individual thing - and one which many of us here with a variety of spine issues can relate to.

It may be true that the problems with your back are "mechanical", but the pain is caused by whatever is happening to the nerves. Get another opinion - maybe your Rheumy can refer you, but I agree with Snobunny - get at least one (more if you consider surgery) opinion from a Board Certified Neurosurgeon.

Good luck!

PaLady

nasalady
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Date Joined Sep 2009
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   Posted 2/26/2010 6:37 PM (GMT -7)   
Thank you Snowbunny and PALady...I really appreciate your replies and helpful suggestions!

I was so shocked when he said that the disk/nerve thing wouldn't cause pain, "just numbness or tingling". I will definitely get another opinion.

Yes, Snowbunny I am still on both the Lyrica and the Cymbalta. Neither one of those has ever helped my lower back significantly, although they seem to be very effective for other types of pain, particularly my fibromyalgia. I do plan to get the steroid shots and hopefully they will make a difference in the way I feel.

Thanks again!
JoAnn
Lyme Disease, AIH, Hashimoto's, lupus, fibro, RA, celiac disease, asthma, psoriasis, Raynaud's, hypertension, osteopenia, sleep apnea, RLS, GERD, degenerative disc disease, cubital tunnel, tarsal tunnel, Doxycycline, Prednisone, Imuran, Plaquenil, Lyrica, Cymbalta, Levothyroxine, Atenolol, Cozaar, Zyrtec, Fosamax, Albuterol, Prilosec, CPAP, Darvon, Morphine Sulfate

autoimmunediseasesgfliving.blogspot.com


Mrs. Dani
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Date Joined Jun 2009
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   Posted 2/26/2010 7:46 PM (GMT -7)   
 
 
   Dear Jo Ann,
 
      Good evening. I hope you have had a few moments to relax today. It sounds like you were put through quite an ordeal with the neurosurgeon. I am sorry he did that to you. *hugg*
 
        You know, I was told at one point 2yrs ago (before any X rays were taken) he said, "nearly everyone in their thirties and forties has some form of lower back pain." To which I replied "Im turning 27 in a few months.....". Needless to say that was the next to last time we would speak with one another. The second time was quite some time later when he was apologizing to me. Gosh, it was awfully hard to hold my tongue.
 
       In any case, I have boneloss which is causing degeneration and rotation on the verticle axis of my spine. Kinda looks like one really big "C" shape. The lower back hurts rather badly, though for some reason I do not "feel" the "damage" as badly in the other areas of my spine. Though all of my spine is effected. Why? I have no clue. The nerves are pinched, blocked, inflammed, damaged, and in most areas beyond repair. It is, indeed, VERY painful. Unfortunatly no surgeon will touch me with a ten foot pole without full diagnosis reguarding the rapid progression, let alone without effective control of the bone loss. So..... I think what I am trying to say is you need a second opinion. Badly. I can tell you without a doubt that the majority of the pain I feel originates from my low back and hipps. Yet all of my spine is damaged.
 
       I know it isnt something that will be easy. I know you had to go through alot just to get to the neuro surgeon. I am very sorry he wasted so much of your time and money. That has got to be hard. *hugg* Please, don't give up. Get a second opinion. You need help, not someone to send you on your way and tell you to be quiet. All that will do is cause more damage to your spine in the long run. That is the last thing you need right now.
 
       You are in our hearts here. Stay strong!
 
*hugg*
  dani
 
p.s. I sure do wish we could get refunds on defective doctors.... devil

 

 

Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood

 

 


nasalady
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Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 1176
   Posted 2/26/2010 11:14 PM (GMT -7)   
Dear Dani, thank you so much for your kind post....it really encouraged me!

I've been diagnosed with SO many autoimmune diseases and various disorders and illnesses in the past two years, but until now, no one could ever tell me why my lower back hurt so much. Indeed not one of my doctors ever even acted interested, even though I ended up purchasing a power chair on my own dime because the pain got worse and worse until I could only walk very short distances! I must have heard that same same phrase a hundred times: "Most people over the age of 30 have some degree of back pain"....as if I were a sissy for even mentioning it!

They never realized that I've always had a high pain threshold....all four of my children were born without anesthetics, the last two at home with a midwife, because I wanted it that way.

Of course I'm the one who had to insist on getting the spinal MRIs; the neurologist never would have ordered them on his own.

Dani, it sounds as though you've been through an awful lot yourself in the past two years! And I'm so sorry you're having to deal with such a terrible condition without a real diagnosis and without the full support and assistance of the medical profession!

Why is it that we have to strive so hard to get the help that we need? There is truly something wrong with this picture.... sad

Sending prayers and gentle (((((hugs))))) your way!
JoAnn
Lyme Disease, AIH, Hashimoto's, lupus, fibro, RA, celiac disease, asthma, psoriasis, Raynaud's, hypertension, osteopenia, sleep apnea, RLS, GERD, degenerative disc disease, cubital tunnel, tarsal tunnel, Doxycycline, Prednisone, Imuran, Plaquenil, Lyrica, Cymbalta, Levothyroxine, Atenolol, Cozaar, Zyrtec, Fosamax, Albuterol, Prilosec, CPAP, Darvon, Morphine Sulfate

autoimmunediseasesgfliving.blogspot.com


Mrs. Dani
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Date Joined Jun 2009
Total Posts : 2787
   Posted 2/26/2010 11:36 PM (GMT -7)   
 
 
   Dear Jo Ann,
 
      Now, I have a great team of doctors, and they work very hard to find answers and keep my as comfotable as possible mentally and physically. The incident happened 2yrs ago, before the inital xray was taken. Apparently that was all that was needed to get the ball rolling. The man / doctor I was referred to originally never did a single test. Literally stood there and told me I wasnt in pain. Crazyness I tell you. later thou, as I was getting ready for procedure (steroid injections) he came by and apologized. I hope with all my heart he learned his lesson...but goodness it took all I had in me! To not tell him exactly what I thought of his poor behaviour  smhair
 
*warm huggs*
       dani


 

 

Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood

 

 

Post Edited (Dani Henson) : 2/26/2010 11:39:19 PM (GMT-7)


White Beard
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Date Joined Feb 2009
Total Posts : 3610
   Posted 2/27/2010 12:07 AM (GMT -7)   
JoAnn

You were right your Doctor was just blowing you off, you really do need to have a second oppinion, I think the epidural injections is a good idea, I know my neurosurgeon told me that having the epidural injections can also help confirm that the problem is with the nerve root being impinged and the location of the impingemt! You know I had a neurologist tell me the same thing but it was with a disk in my neck! I told him to his face that I thought he was blowing me off, I had also had the MRI and the EMG done, and it pointed to the disk in my neck. But my neurologist said there was nothing that could be done and that epidural steroid injections would not help and seeing a neurosurgeon was a waste of time. Well my Pain Doctor thought differently, he done the epidural injections and he also sent me to a neurosurgeon. I had a ACDF Anterior Cervical Disk Fusion and as soon as I came out of it. my arm pain was gone! One of the major symptoms of nerve root impingement is severe pain in the limb that, that nerve innervates, you can also have numbness and tingling, but severe pain is the thing that makes it unbearable! If you can not stand because of the pain in your leg then you definitely need help and have that treated! I can't tell you how mad I get when I hear about Doctors like that! I wish you well JoAnn! and Good Luck to YOu

White Beard

nasalady
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Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 1176
   Posted 2/27/2010 12:15 AM (GMT -7)   
Dani Henson said...
Now, I have a great team of doctors, and they work very hard to find answers and keep my as comfotable as possible mentally and physically.


Dear Dani,

I'm so glad! I was a bit alarmed when you said "no surgeon will touch me with a ten foot pole without full diagnosis.....", etc., and thought that maybe you were still having to fight to get proper medical care. It's good to have doctors you can trust, who actually care!

Have a good night.....as pain free a night as possible!!
(((((hugs)))))
JoAnn
Lyme Disease, AIH, Hashimoto's, lupus, fibro, RA, celiac disease, asthma, psoriasis, Raynaud's, hypertension, osteopenia, sleep apnea, RLS, GERD, degenerative disc disease, cubital tunnel, tarsal tunnel, Doxycycline, Prednisone, Imuran, Plaquenil, Lyrica, Cymbalta, Levothyroxine, Atenolol, Cozaar, Zyrtec, Fosamax, Albuterol, Prilosec, CPAP, Darvon, Morphine Sulfate

autoimmunediseasesgfliving.blogspot.com


nasalady
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Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 1176
   Posted 2/27/2010 12:44 AM (GMT -7)   
White Beard, thank you for your supportive message. I do appreciate all of the support and encouragement I've found here. I'm glad to hear that you were able to tell that doctor to his face that you knew he was just blowing you off.....I wasn't quite that bold the other day at my own doctor's appt, although I do wish I had been!

I suppose I was somewhat in shock at his rudeness and obvious bias against me; when I was trying to discuss some of my other neuro symptoms (vertigo and double vision), I mentioned that I also felt safer in the wheelchair because of severe vertigo. He had the nerve to say that was a better "excuse" for the wheelchair than my back pain! mad

In any case, it's so encouraging to me to hear that the treatments helped you with the pain! Thank you for sharing that with me!

I know you've been going through a lot lately, and my prayers are with you!
Take care....all the best to you!
JoAnn
Lyme Disease, AIH, Hashimoto's, lupus, fibro, RA, celiac disease, asthma, psoriasis, Raynaud's, hypertension, osteopenia, sleep apnea, RLS, GERD, degenerative disc disease, cubital tunnel, tarsal tunnel, Doxycycline, Prednisone, Imuran, Plaquenil, Lyrica, Cymbalta, Levothyroxine, Atenolol, Cozaar, Zyrtec, Fosamax, Albuterol, Prilosec, CPAP, Darvon, Morphine Sulfate

autoimmunediseasesgfliving.blogspot.com


White Beard
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Date Joined Feb 2009
Total Posts : 3610
   Posted 2/27/2010 7:55 AM (GMT -7)   
JoAnn

Having worked on both sides of the fence so to speak, I know that Doctors tend to be intimidating, most think that they are superior. I like to think of them as plumbers, or auto mechanics, or anybody else that you would hire to do a job for you! After all in reality that is what they are, you hired them and your paying them to work on you and fix you! Just as you would hire a mechanic to work on, and fix your car! One way or the other they are getting paid by you! So with that in mind, doesn't that make you, their boss? Your their employer! I know it is easier said than done. But how dare a Doctor make a comment like that to you! Who does he think he is, you are paying him to treat you ! You are his boss! If a mechanic or plumber talked that way to you, I bet you would be hiring a new one! I know I would!

JoAnn I am sorry for ranting, but this is a really sore subject with me! When I worked in the hospital, the first thing I did when I introduced myself to my patient, was let them know that they were my boss and I was there to serve and take care of them! I was their advocate, to their Doctors and everyone else in the hospital! I took that job seriously! After all I was working for them!

I do wish you well, Good Luck to You!

White Beard

hydrangea
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2007
Total Posts : 190
   Posted 2/27/2010 9:11 AM (GMT -7)   
i agree with everyone....make sure that you get a second opinion. The doctor was correct when he said that people have the same problem with out pain. But clearly you don not fall into that category and are in pain. Find another doctor who will listen to you.
Diagnosed crohns Disease 07, Bladder tumor and inflammation, Herniated disc, spinal stenosis, facet arthritis, degenerative disc disease, siatica, Three laparoscopis, hysterectomy, physical therapy, trigger point injections, spinal epidurals, Meds lyrica, vicodine, amrix.


auntkay
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Date Joined Apr 2004
Total Posts : 1199
   Posted 2/27/2010 9:25 AM (GMT -7)   
OH my gosh just reading this thread makes me think that just maybe there's hope out there still. I have to say your dr. was soooo wrong in saying that your condition causes no pain. I have the same type of problem .My l5 disc is pressing on the s1 nerve and is causing intense pain .I have extreme lower back pain and pain all the way down the right leg thats making life miserable. I haven't went back to any drs. for the fear of being blown off just figured i'd be in this pain the rest of my life or praying by some sort of mirical it would just go away on it's own . I'm sorry to say it seems to be getting worse and sitting and driving is becomming quite painful ,but so is standing and twisting all the things i do on my job.I wish you well and keep looking for a good dr. i may have to start looking again myself good luck.

Mrs. Dani
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Date Joined Jun 2009
Total Posts : 2787
   Posted 2/27/2010 10:25 AM (GMT -7)   
 
 
   Dear Jo Ann,
 
      Good morning *hugg* I hope you were able to get a little rest last night. How is your pain doing today??
 
       You said ~~>"alarmed when you said "no surgeon will touch me with a ten foot pole without full diagnosis.....", etc., and thought that maybe you were still having to fight to get proper medical care."
 
        Only "needed" surgicals for medical "necessity". For instance all my teeth crumbled out of my mouth in 3 months flat (like chalk, dust), and I had to have all the "peices" surgically removed. Or the case of my eyes. I lost my vision in a month flat and had to have eye surgery to see...sort of, better than no vision I suppose but apparently the vision loss is progressive. So basically just the "basics". Anything beyond that they want more answers, and better bone loss control before we discuss anything beyond that. Their reasons are understandable. I have some planns in mind to help them in the comming weeks.. But, I wont go into it now, then I would be typing all morning! (which wouldnt be so bad as you are fantastic company!)
 
      You know the more I read about your visit, the more upset I get. I do not know how you were able to maintain your composure so well. His statment reguarding your vertigo is upsetting to say the least. It boggles my mind at the level of arrogance that some doctors seem to have. He acts like you WANTED to be there? As if you had nothing better to do than toss money away?
 
      I hope you can get a referral to a different neuro surgeon right away. Will you have to make another appointment with your primary care or can it be done via the telephone? Hopefully the latter, as I am sure you could use a day to yourself to relax.
 
      I am afraid Ive eaten up all my "me time" and need to get started on my day. Stay strong and know you are in our hearts here.
 
*hugg*
   dani
 
         

 

 

Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood

 

 


nasalady
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Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 1176
   Posted 2/27/2010 2:58 PM (GMT -7)   
Dear White Beard, hydrangea, auntkay, and dani, I do so appreciate your help and support!

White Beard, you must have been an awesome nurse and a compassionate patient advocate! I wish there were more medical professionals like you! hydrangea, thank you so much for your encouraging reply! auntkay, I hope you look into treatment for your pain...it's dangerous to neglect something like that. But I understand your fear of being blown off, because it happens so often!

Dani, my dear, you have gone through so much....the more you tell me about your own medical issues, the more my own problems pale in comparison! I hope that you and your doctors will be able to figure out some way to make a positive difference to your bone loss issues!! Thank you for your kind and caring heart...(((((dani))))).

Fortunately my pain levels are OK today....the new prescription (fentanyl patch) seems to be helping with that. And because I have a PPO insurance plan (paying an arm and a leg for that through my work!!) I can pick a new neuro doctor without asking anyone for a referral. And I plan to do that ASAP! :)

((((hugs)))) to all!
JoAnn
Lyme Disease, AIH, Hashimoto's, lupus, fibro, RA, celiac disease, asthma, psoriasis, Raynaud's, hypertension, osteopenia, sleep apnea, RLS, GERD, degenerative disc disease, cubital tunnel, tarsal tunnel, Doxycycline, Prednisone, Imuran, Plaquenil, Lyrica, Cymbalta, Levothyroxine, Atenolol, Cozaar, Zyrtec, Fosamax, Albuterol, Prilosec, CPAP, Darvon, Morphine Sulfate

autoimmunediseasesgfliving.blogspot.com


Scarred_for_life
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Date Joined Jul 2008
Total Posts : 1559
   Posted 2/27/2010 5:27 PM (GMT -7)   
JoAnn;
First off hello from KS. We have not met as of yet, but I wanted to put that in first. I know what you are going through. It hurts so bad you just want to cry. Believe me your pain is exactly where mine is and that ain't good!

I had a laminictomy in sept of 2000, but the ortho sent me back to work too soon and the whole disc buldged again causing me gobs of pain. I found a great neuro that really helped me a bunch and fusion was what it took to get my pain down. 2 years I was out of pain after that until 2003 when L3-L2 decided to go and I was back in the operating room for another fusion. But that was a short lasting recovery as the fusion did not take on the second time and I was back under the knife for another time. 4 surgeries and losing my job later....(this would have been 7 years ago.) I was totally messed up and suffering from Chronic Pain, failed back syndrome and nerve pain that has taken me long ways down the road.

I say to you.....find another doctor to give you areal diagonises!

hugsss

Scarred
I live to "Tame My Pain!" 


nasalady
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Date Joined Sep 2009
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   Posted 2/27/2010 10:45 PM (GMT -7)   
Scarred_for_life said...

First off hello from KS. We have not met as of yet, but I wanted to put that in first. I know what you are going through. It hurts so bad you just want to cry.


Hi Scarred, nice to meet you!

Yes, I have cried plenty of times, that's for sure! It doesn't help to cry though.....I cried in front of my (former) PCP and she made a note in my chart that I was "depressed". This was after she looked at the xrays of my back and said in a cheerful voice, "Gee, you're the only person over the age of 40 that I know who DOESN'T have arthritis in your back!!"

I wasn't "depressed"....just in serious PAIN. I've had so many doctors who just don't "get it". sad

Scarred_for_life said...
Believe me your pain is exactly where mine is and that ain't good!
I had a laminictomy in sept of 2000, but the ortho sent me back to work too soon and the whole disc buldged again causing me gobs of pain. I found a great neuro that really helped me a bunch and fusion was what it took to get my pain down. 2 years I was out of pain after that until 2003 when L3-L2 decided to go and I was back in the operating room for another fusion. But that was a short lasting recovery as the fusion did not take on the second time and I was back under the knife for another time. 4 surgeries and losing my job later....(this would have been 7 years ago.) I was totally messed up and suffering from Chronic Pain, failed back syndrome and nerve pain that has taken me long ways down the road. I say to you.....find another doctor to give you areal diagonises!


I'm sorry that you've had so much pain (including the loss of your job) and so many surgeries! You definitely been through the wringer! I do take your advice and that of the others very seriously because of that. I did feel that somehow there was something really wrong with the way some of my doctors responded to my complaints of back pain, so was very glad to get confirmation of that here.

Thank you for sharing about your treatments, both successful and unsuccessful....

I will find another doctor, definitely.

Best wishes to you!
((((hugs))))
JoAnn
Lyme Disease, AIH, Hashimoto's, lupus, fibro, RA, celiac disease, asthma, psoriasis, Raynaud's, hypertension, osteopenia, sleep apnea, RLS, GERD, DDD, L4 and L5 radiculopathy -> severe lower back pain, cubital tunnel, tarsal tunnel, Doxycycline, Prednisone, Imuran, Plaquenil, Lyrica, Cymbalta, Levothyroxine, Atenolol, Cozaar, Zyrtec, Fosamax, Albuterol, Prilosec, CPAP, Darvon, Morphine Sulfate

autoimmunediseasesgfliving.blogspot.com


Scarred_for_life
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Date Joined Jul 2008
Total Posts : 1559
   Posted 2/28/2010 7:52 PM (GMT -7)   
JoAnn;

Great to hear that you are going to find a new doctor for sure. I don't think that your situation is in any different then that of me or any other person having our same problem. Somewhere out there is a neuro that knows what you are going through and will help you to get the relieve you desire. If your next doctor doesn't give you a good enough advice then find another and so on until you find that one that will treat you as a patient that is in horrible pain.


Huggggssss

Scarred
I live to "Tame My Pain!" 


bsjaguar
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Date Joined Jun 2009
Total Posts : 974
   Posted 3/1/2010 4:16 AM (GMT -7)   
JoAnn, just wanted to give you a heads up. My insurance company doesn't require a referral either but alot of doctors do. I had to have on for my PM & othopedic surgeon before they would see me. I imagine they do this to weed out all the people that could actually be treated by a PCP and don't really require a specialists care.

Hope you have great success in finding a new doctor!!!
---Jag---
 
DDD, osteoarthritis, facet syndrome, fusion surgeries C-5/7 & L-4/5 both in 2006, torn meniscus surgeries left knee 2000 & 2002, buldging disc L-2/3

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