Ut oh! Meds wrong?

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Screaming Eagle
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   Posted 8/20/2010 5:58 PM (GMT -7)   
I called my Surgeon today, and explained that I was still in some pain, and thought it might be from muscle tension or possibly from inflammation.
The nurse called back and said that the surgeon was willing to provide a script of Flexeril and ultram, and asked if I wanted one or the other or both.
I said both as I thought one would be for the inflammation, and the other for a muscle relaxant.

When I got home I looked up the meds they were sending out, and was shocked to see that the Tramadol was for pain, and not to be used with Percocet's.
I thought maybe I had not listened well enough when she call, so I waited for the wife to pick up the meds, and sure enough Tramadol was one of the meds, 50mg 30ct

This does not sound right to me. Anyone here, know anything about this med? I will not take it until I call back Monday, and see if there is a mistake.
The Flexeril is 5mg 45ct and I'm OK with that.

SE
"Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."

Blessedx8
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   Posted 8/20/2010 6:32 PM (GMT -7)   
Hey Michael,

This is my "educated/experienced patient/not a doctor" response... so take it for what it's worth :) I understand your caution - and think that's a good thing. Tramadol (Ultram) is not an anti-inflammatory...it's a pain reliever... but it CAN be used in combo w/ Percocet. I think your doc probably gave it to you as an "additional" pain reliever.

It works in a different way than a normal opiate...I have a wicked headache or I'd explain better... but it may help w/ your pain. You could use it at the same time as your percocet or alternate it at different times. You can confirm all this w/ your pharmacist... or just try the flexeril and see if that works first.

Again, I understand your caution - especially since you were thinking you were getting an anti-inflammatory...

Feel better, my friend.

--Tina
Main Health Issues: Dysautonomia/POTS; CFS/Fibro; Chronic Pain (back issues, migraines, carpal tunnel, among other things); Chronic Hypertension; Hypothyroidism and Hypoadrenalism; Mixed Sleep Apnea (on BiPap); Depression/Anxiety; Vitamin D Deficiency.

MAJOR surprise - Pregnant, w/ twin little girls (after six boys). Due Sept, 2010. Praying they are healthy. YES, you can have chronic pain AND have a successful pregnancy - not easy, but it can be done. :)

hydrangea
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Date Joined Mar 2007
Total Posts : 190
   Posted 8/20/2010 6:36 PM (GMT -7)   

screaming eagle,

Tarmadal is the same as ultram and is a non nacodic medication.  My surgeon did give me Ultram to take at regular times and still take norco for break through pain.  Did you surgeon still realize that you were taking you pain meds still? I really do think that surgeons will just keep writing scipts for meds without even asking. Maybe you should consider going to a pain management Doctor to try to control the pain.   Flexeril is a muscle relaxer. I hope that we don't have to deal with this pain forever.  Soooo tired of it all as you are!!!! 

Keep us posted. 

Hdrangea

 

 


Diagnosed crohns Disease 07, Bladder tumor and inflammation, Herniated disc, spinal stenosis, facet arthritis, degenerative disc disease, siatica, Three laparoscopis, hysterectomy, physical therapy, trigger point injections, spinal epidurals,
Meds lyrica, norco, amrix,metanx,pentasa.
Spinal Fusion 3/2010

Screaming Eagle
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Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 5005
   Posted 8/20/2010 6:39 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks Tina! I told the nurse I did not want an increase in pain meds, as I'm wanting to get off of them, so I'm surprised that they gave this script out to me.

I will call Monday morning, and reconfirm with the nurse, to see what they were thinking.

Looking forward to the babies getting here! :)


SE:)
"Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."

Screaming Eagle
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Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 5005
   Posted 8/20/2010 6:44 PM (GMT -7)   
Hydrangea, the nurse told me that after six months recovery, they usually refer a patient back to their PCD and will discontinue writing scripts for pain meds.

I received my last refill today, so I will now have to go back to my PCD for more care if needed with my back problem.

I too, hope we don't have to put up with this pain much longer, but I fear that we may never get rid of all of it,

Take care!

SE:)
"Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."

MIKEL99
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Date Joined Feb 2010
Total Posts : 914
   Posted 8/20/2010 7:33 PM (GMT -7)   
Keep the faith Michael , its frustrating when doctors aren't clear with the scripts , and I can't offer any knowledge about those meds , I wish I could bro , sorry . But I beleive you can overcome anything just stick with it bro , but its smart of you to be cautous , thats the ticket . Good luck , I hope that pain decreases real soon my friend . Your Buddy Mikel
HIV+. meds - epzicom, Kaletra . oxycontin as needed , indothemiacin . hip replacement surgery scheduled for August 23rd !

Screaming Eagle
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Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 5005
   Posted 8/20/2010 7:47 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks Mikel! Right now....you need to be in beddy bye...to rest up for the big day! So scram! :)

Love you man! :)

SE:)
"Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."

Tirzah
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Date Joined Jul 2008
Total Posts : 2279
   Posted 8/20/2010 8:25 PM (GMT -7)   
Actually, Tramadol is a narcotic, but is considered a weak narcotic. It does have some unusual properties for a narcotic, though, and it is not officially recommended that people take it with much of anything. That said, I was on both for a very short while & didn't have any issues related to taking them together. The main thing is to definitely not take Tramadol with anti-depressant meds, sleeping pills or migraine meds (triptans) without double checking with your doctor -- and then still be super careful.

The issue is that it can produce serotonin syndrome. But that is really rare to start with & almost always occurs through combination with psychiatric meds or migraine meds, rather than in combination with other pain meds. If your doctor wrote it for you, it should be fine. If you are starting to feel horrible beyond belief, that probably means you're the one in a million who can't stand it. I got serotonin syndrome from a different combination once -- trust me, you'll know if you have it. Just go straight to the hospital, it's very treatable.

Otherwise, I'd say it's worth a shot. It interacts with the brain differently than most other narcs. So you might get an added benefit vs. just taking more Percocet. If you're wanting to quit, Tramadol is much easier to quit than Percocet.

feel better,
frances

Screaming Eagle
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Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 5005
   Posted 8/20/2010 8:30 PM (GMT -7)   
Thank You Frances! Good stuff to know! I appreciate your effort to reply.

I'm very careful with my meds, and do not just pop a pill in my mouth when given to me, even if it comes from a Dr.

It is a good thing to always research the meds one is on (IMO)

Blessings to you!

SE:)
"Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."

Alcie
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Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 4643
   Posted 8/21/2010 7:17 AM (GMT -7)   
Do not ever take tramadol and Flexeril on the same day!!!!! I did and got serotonin syndrome really bad - body temp went way up, turned beet red, and of course, the usual muscle spasms.

When it grts bad enough to lose control of body temp it's dangerous, can be lethal. Fortunately I had some diazepam, which is an extremely good muscle relaxant and happens to hit the same receptors. 2mg every 6 hours or so got me over the serotonin reaction. Without it I would have neded to go to the ER.
Alcie
 
 

Screaming Eagle
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   Posted 8/21/2010 7:19 AM (GMT -7)   

 

 

      Thank you Alice. I will call right away Monday morning. Something is just not right here.

 

             SE


"Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."

Mrs. Dani
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Date Joined Jun 2009
Total Posts : 2787
   Posted 8/21/2010 8:49 AM (GMT -7)   
Dear Michael,

     It is good to hear from you. I am glad to hear the nurse got back to you so quickly. Now, is this set of scripts the last that he will be providing you with? If so are you going to go to a pain managememnt doctor next?

     Tramadol is kinda nice for "everyday" use. When coupled with my Tricyclic it does work well.... it just has a bad habbit of causing seratonin syndrome in some people. So, be sure to watch out for that the first few days... though at 50mg (per day?? or 3xs per day?) I wouldnt think that would be a very big concern? I was just "monitored more frequently" for the first month because of the "combination of medicines" I take. IE Tramadol +Tricyclic, BT med, muscle relaxer combo 3 most times daily. Obviously it didnt happen with me, but they just called alot and I had to be seen / checked up on in the first month or so.

~~~~> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serotonin_syndrome

~~~~> http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/serotonin-syndrome/DS00860

     For muscle relaxer I take Baclofen 3x per day and it works great, but leaves a bit of "foggy-ness". So far, its effectiveness hasnt gone down atall. It might be something to consider if the Flexaril doesnt cut it.

     For inflammation though, I use cortisteroid epidural series along my spine and a medicine called Nabumetone. The combination of those two are great. Hands down the "heavy hitter" in my pain "cocktail".

*hugg*
  dani

 
TWO roads diverged in a yellow wood
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
 
Chronic Pain Moderator

Screaming Eagle
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Date Joined Sep 2009
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   Posted 8/21/2010 9:18 AM (GMT -7)   

 

     Dani, ....yes, this will be the last. His nurse said he will only provide up to Six months of pain meds.

   She said I will have to go back to my PCD for the next round, or take other action.

    I'm hoping that the Flexeril will take care of the problem, and can be totally off of the pain meds shortly.

     The Tramadoll says to take every 6hrs 50mg....and the Flexeril is 5mg taken up to x3.

 

           I have my fingers crossed, and of course I still have six more months to his the 12 month mark on my recovery.

       I'm so glad that you had a good laugh this morning....from reading the other post! :)

 We do need a good laugh from time to time! :)

 

         SE:)


"Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."

Mrs. Dani
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Date Joined Jun 2009
Total Posts : 2787
   Posted 8/21/2010 10:19 AM (GMT -7)   

 

   Dear Michael,

    Above all else, I hope you are able to get through this pain increase quickly. You have worked so hard! But, if it doesnt work out, I hope you can get into your primary care as soon as possible. It looks like the meds will run out in a few weeks. Who knows? You might be able to get your flu shot early and your yearly physical out of the way while you are there. Two birds, 1 stone? ..It is like pulling teeth to get my husband to go in for his yearly physical. I often have to resort to blackmail rolleyes When the nurse mentioned "other actions", did she give suggestions?

     I really admire your drive and strength.  Rest up! Know you are in our prayers :-)  

*hugg*
  dani


 
TWO roads diverged in a yellow wood
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
 
Chronic Pain Moderator

Mrs. Dani
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Date Joined Jun 2009
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   Posted 8/21/2010 5:24 PM (GMT -7)   

   For anyone wondering about the med in question....

~~> "...

Tramadol is a narcotic-like pain reliever.

Tramadol is used to treat moderate to severe pain. Tramadol extended-release is used to treat moderate to severe chronic pain when treatment is needed around the clock..."



Read more: http://www.drugs.com/tramadol.html#ixzz0xI0D3VGW

  It is designed so patients can "tolerate" it easily, without burdonsome side effects.

*hugg*
  dani


 
TWO roads diverged in a yellow wood
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
 
Chronic Pain Moderator

flower123
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Date Joined Apr 2009
Total Posts : 856
   Posted 8/22/2010 9:07 AM (GMT -7)   
I'd just like to add that I have read that withdrawal from it can be very difficult, even though it is not considered a strong narcotic. I have actually read that the withdrawal can be much worse that a medication that does not have SSRI properties--and that's why it's so hard to stop taking it.

So, basically, for some it feels like they're getting off of two meds.--an opiate and an SSRI.

Just wanted to let you know.



Hugs,

Flower

Dagger
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Date Joined Apr 2008
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   Posted 8/22/2010 1:11 PM (GMT -7)   
I found that stopping tramadol was much harder than stopping percocet. I only take up to 50mg of tramadol 3x/day for up to a few months then stop and I go through withdrawal every time if I don't taper off slowly. I never had that problem when taking a low dose of percosets for a few months then stopping. I agree with Flower, I think the SSRI properties are what gives me the problems when I stop it. This doesn't happen to everyone but it's not pleasant.

(yes, this sounds strange, starting and stopping but there is a good reason for it even though stopping is rough for me.)

Screaming Eagle
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   Posted 8/22/2010 1:57 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks for the information. I do not plan on taking this stuff, and I made it very clear to the nurse that I did not want to increase my pain med intake.
I will call Monday to see what they were thinking.

SE:)
"Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."

Screaming Eagle
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Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 5005
   Posted 8/24/2010 6:01 AM (GMT -7)   

 

     Hello all! Well I went to work yesterday, and after about an hour, I told my boss that I really needed the day off, as I was totally worn out. He said "See you tomorrow" He knew that I was pushing my body, and could tell that I was hurting.

 Ok,....I called the nurse yesterday on my way home, and she promptly returned my call, and told me it was OK to take the Ultram (Tramadol) with my Percocet's, or I could take just the Ultram by istelf. She said that I had reduced my pain meds way down from where I had started from, and that the Ultram was way less than the Percocet's that I am now taking.

      She did say that working 7 days a week probably was not helping the situation, and that I needed some down time, as she thought I was probably keeping my back irritated. My job requires heavy lifting, bending, twisting, and at times, long periods of sitting in a chair. The stress level is fairly high as some of the parts we make cost a quarter of a million dollars.

       I have been asked to bring a new machine on line in our shop, and that is stressful in itself, and can take a few weeks to do. Taking off, made me feel like a new man this morning, and I have a little hope again. We will see!

     Today, my focus is on Mikel, and we all are waiting to hear some good news about him.

     Hang in there Mikel!....you have a lot of members pulling for you! :)

      SE:) 

      



"Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."

Post Edited (Screaming Eagle) : 8/24/2010 7:28:35 AM (GMT-6)


Tirzah
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Date Joined Jul 2008
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   Posted 8/24/2010 7:34 AM (GMT -7)   
SE-
I was on Ultram for a long time. It was the only med my first PM would write for. It can be habit-forming, but it takes longer than many medications to cause dependence -- though in addition to the narc dependence, you can also develop an SSRI dependence if on it for several months (usually they say it's around 9 months for SSRI dependence), but if you take breaks sometimes so you don't take it every day, it will limit the likelihood of dependence.

I'm not sure why drugs.com says it's "narcotic-like" because the literature from Ultram's manufacturer describes it as a "centrally acting synthetic opioid analgesic" (i.e., a narcotic). www.ortho-mcneil.com/ortho-mcneil/shared/pi/ultram.pdf .

But I really truly wouldn't worry so much about Serotonin Syndrome. There are an average of 7,000 cases of it nationwide each year. The likelihood of almost anything else happening to you is higher than the likelihood of you getting SS. I'm not going to say it didn't suck, but they just pulled me off the a/d's & gave me plenty of fluids. After a couple days I was fine. And almost no one gets it.

I agree with your doctor that heavy labor is almost certainly a big piece of the issue, but I also well know how hard jobs are to come by right now. Looking for a job that will be less physically demanding is certainly a good idea, but in the meantime if you do need meds, sometimes that is the best choice. There are medical dangers from staying in pain too -- high hr, low bp (or sometimes high bp), increased illnesses, lack of sleep (which causes a myriad of health problems), decreasing ability to cope with pain, etc. The difficulty is always to weigh the benefits/risks of using medication vs. the benefits/risks of not using medication. If you can manage better without meds, by all means: steer clear of them!

Just don't make the mistake that my mom did & avoid them at the cost of your health. She was so determined to avoid addictive meds except a couple times per week that she ended up now needing surgery for constant infections & having 2 heart attacks from all the stress of not sleeping and continuing to work 6-7 days a week even though she really could have cut back. Now the number of medications that she needs is much greater -- and she had no choice about taking them.

But it's a tough choice that you face. Flexeril is tough b/c over some weeks it can break down muscles and cause weakness, which in turn increases pain. Such a tough choice. Just wanted to encourage you not to make the mistake of trading away the bad for the worse.

feel better,
frances

Screaming Eagle
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Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 5005
   Posted 8/24/2010 8:16 AM (GMT -7)   
 
     Frances....Thank You for the information.....and I value your experience on this. I have been on Percocet around 8 years and was on Oxycontin for around 6 to 8 months if I remember correctly. I have had a long standing fear of withdrawls from these meds, and have actually taken myself off of them for a few days. In doing so, I never really suffered withdraws to speak of. Maybe very mild....but never as decribed by some of the members here.
 
      My thought here is to replace the Percocet, and take the Ultram, since it is a lower dosage. But since reading your post I may want to rethink my decision. I know, many of the members here will chastize me for this, but one of the reasons that I want off the meds, is because of guilt by peers and Dr's here. We had a quack Dr here that was just convicted of killing several of his patients on overdoses. (Oxycontin, Percocet's)
 
       My PCD has been very good in supporting me in the pain management, but does not like me being on them. I have always been a pleaser first in life. The other reason that I want to be off of them, is I need my mind to be sharp in order to do my job, plus.... I miss so much in life, with my mind dulled by them.
 
      At first, when I started taking them, life seemed to be pretty good, and carefree, but it didn't take me long to realize that I did not want this for the rest of my life. I wanted my old superman self I once was. .....and there lies the problem.....in faceing reality.    This was one of the main reasons that I left HW during my recovery, as I was struggling mentally with what was possible.....and seemed to be so far out of my reach.
 
     I'm sure that there are members with Failed back Syndrome, who may understand what I'm talking about. Everybody's back surgery is different as is the recovery. It's so unpredictable...but there are things we can do to increase the odds of succesful outcome.
 
      I'm guessing by now, you are saying "This guy is a Loney tune"......this is what can happen to a person during a very long recovery. Even a negative responce or lack there of from members can affect one mental state as they are looking for hope from anywhere they can get it.
 
       So!.....where do I go from here?....well....I will keep on pushing for hope, listen to good advice such as yours, and strive to do my best in life, and support those who will let me.
 
     By the way.....I'm having one of those rare pain free days.....completely pain free. Odd....I know but this has been going on for the last two months. I will have a few pain free days, and then sink back into the same old pain as before. When this happens, I get my hopes up, and believe that I can get off the meds.
 
         Again, Thank You!
 
           SE:)
"Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."

Post Edited (Screaming Eagle) : 8/24/2010 10:52:53 AM (GMT-6)


Chartreux
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Date Joined Aug 2006
Total Posts : 9622
   Posted 8/24/2010 8:29 AM (GMT -7)   
Michael,
Thinking of you and hope you'll be able to take it easy for a few days.
Lots of healing hugz coming your ways ...
(((((((((((((((((((((((((Michael))))))))))))))))))))))))))
**********************************************
* Asthma, Allergies, Osteoarthritis, Spinal Stenosis, Degenative Disc (Lower Lumbar S1-L3 and Cervical C5,C6, C8 and T1), Fibromyalgia, Gerd,
Enlarged Pituitary Gland, Sjogren's, Ocular Migraines, mild carpel tunnel, ect.... "Would be nice if we could use the edit button in real life"...

********>^..^<********>^..^<********>^..^<********

Screaming Eagle
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Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 5005
   Posted 8/24/2010 8:33 AM (GMT -7)   

 

     Chartreux! ......I'm just tikled Pink!....that you are back! :) Wahoo! :)

          SE:)


"Respect your fellow human being, treat them fairly, disagree with them honestly, enjoy their friendship, explore your thoughts about one another candidly, work together for a common goal and help one another achieve it."

tmjpain
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Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 2022
   Posted 8/24/2010 9:43 AM (GMT -7)   
My dearest Michael
I know your struggles my friend, but I also have great faith that you will make the right decisions for you. I'm here for you buddy and I support your decisions. I pray that you continue to feel more like yourself every day. Listen to your body, be easy on yourself and enjoy your life with your beautiful wife!!

Huge hugs
One day at a time!!

SUZANE

Mrs. Dani
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jun 2009
Total Posts : 2787
   Posted 8/24/2010 2:56 PM (GMT -7)   

 

   Dear Michael,

   I am sorry I have been away. Not feeling to goo and trying to keep up with a whril wind schedual myself. I am glad you nurse got back to you so quickly! 50mg is such a low dose, but of course what you decided to do, or not to do, is your choice :-)   What I hope the most for you is that this is just a "bump in the road" so to speak. Hang in there

*hugg*
  dani


 
TWO roads diverged in a yellow wood
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
 
Chronic Pain Moderator
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