health discrimination by countries..

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randynoguts
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 6049
   Posted 11/2/2008 6:00 PM (GMT -7)   
smhair  now ive heard everything!  last week a overweight lady was refused permanent living status in New Zealand to join her husband, they claim she will be a burden to the national healthcare.. now this past few days, a young boy with downs syndrome was refused the same in austrailia! even though his dad is a dr serving in the outback somehwere. now i can see refusing entry to people with infectious diseases , like TB, AIDS, Leprosy, Plague, etc... most countries do that, but to limit people for being fat or having an extra chromosome, i mean really, maybe we ugly americans aint so bad after all!    ok i edited myself...


randynoguts 



     http://www.geocities.com/randynogutsweb/

Post Edited (randynoguts) : 11/3/2008 2:05:48 AM (GMT-7)


Ides
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Nov 2003
Total Posts : 7077
   Posted 11/2/2008 6:17 PM (GMT -7)   
Randy, I agree with you that discrimination against those with medical issues is wrong. However, your second to the last sentence is probably going to cause some discord. I am tempted to edit it out but will leave it for now. If members get too over-the-top in discussing this as it pertains to our new president [whoever that is], then we are going to have to shut it down.

Peace...
Moderator Crohn's Disease Forum
CD, Ankylosing Spondylitis, lupus, small fiber peripheral neuropathy, avascular necrosis, peripheral artery disease, degenerative disc disease, and a host of other medical problems.
 


ivy6
Elite Member


Date Joined Sep 2005
Total Posts : 10404
   Posted 11/2/2008 6:24 PM (GMT -7)   
Thank you, Ides. As an Australian, I was quite offended by the editorialising in Randy's post and feel unable to respond, for fear of starting controversy.

Randy, as a forum member (not a moderator), I would ask you to either rephrase your post, or delete it. This is an international forum: if you are curious about other countries' health policies, I think it would be kinder to *ask* about those policies, rather than to condemn them outright.

I would also ask that you remember that the purpose of this forum is to provide support. We do allow a certain amount of freedom in debating controversial topics here, but you must remember that, by forum rules, the moderators are allowed to abort controversial discussions, in order to preserve peace on the forums.

Ivy.
Co-Moderator Crohn's Forum.


FitzyK23
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2005
Total Posts : 4219
   Posted 11/2/2008 7:15 PM (GMT -7)   
Hey Randy -

IMHO neither US presidential candidate is proposing national health care. Rather, the democratic candidate is proposing that those who do not have health care available through their work and can not get health care due to pre-existing conditions can buy into the same plan that is available to the members of congress. Basically, it provides an option for the self-employed with problems like crohns to be able to find coverage. This is a far cry from national healthcare. Most importantly he said they could "buy" into that plan not be given that plan. It is very scary to me that if one of us becomes to sick to work and is not married to someone with health insurance you are completely out of luck. This is the safety net that we need.

While the other candidates plan will give people some money to get insurance it is not enough to cover the cost of most plans, will tax employer plans, and those with pre-existing conditions will not be guaranteed coverage. There are plenty of people on this board with the money to buy insurance but because of their crohns can not find an insurer. That plan will not protect people with chronic illnesses.
 
To the mods:
 
If we can keep this discussion civil please do not edit it.  I believe that this campaign is very on topic for people with chronic illnesses like crohns!


27 Year old married female law student (last year!!). Diagnosed w/ CD 4 years ago, IBS for over 10 years before that, which was probably the CD. I am sort of lactose intollerant too but can handle anything cultured and do well w/ lactose pills and lactaid. For crohns I am currently on Pentasa 4 pills/4x day and hysociamine prn. I also have bad acid reflux and have been on PPI's since age 13. I have been through prilosec, prevacid, and nexium. Currently I am on Protonix in the morning and Zantac at night. I also take a birth control pill to allow some fun in my life.


broomhilda
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2007
Total Posts : 1488
   Posted 11/2/2008 10:07 PM (GMT -7)   

I for one am restraining myself from responding in full to this topic, however, I believe it is a vital issue to address especially now.  Thank you mods for having faith in us and not editing this post.

Randy is stressed as most of us are regarding the upcoming choices this country is about to make and the anxiety in all of us crohnies needs to be expressed and shared in a meaningful format so the entire country can hopefully heal.  Our priorities as a country are whacked out, our financial resources are depleted.  Yes, each of us, americans, are responsible for the shape this country is in today so the question must be asked, What course of action will you choose to change the course we are on"?  Get out, participate and vote....your healthcare and familie's wellbeing depends on it!

 


emrose
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 63
   Posted 11/2/2008 10:28 PM (GMT -7)   
I absolutely 100% agree with fitzy!

Not sure how long this post will be around so I thought i'd "gently" express my opinion while I can.

Very much anticipating the November 4th results. Healthcare obviously very important to my family!

eva124
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2007
Total Posts : 246
   Posted 11/3/2008 1:01 AM (GMT -7)   
i assume the lady wanting to come to new zealand wa able to work? our taxes pay for hospitals...thou i am surprised she wasnt allowed in i always thort NZ was a easy country to migrate to
dx 17 aug 2007
21 yrs old
13 dec 2007 resection/temp illeostomy 14 feb 2008 temp illeostomy reversed 
150mg azamun
3000mg pentasa


randynoguts
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 6049
   Posted 11/3/2008 2:11 AM (GMT -7)   
ivy and all, nothing personal, i was merely stating facts in the world news spotlight. that certain health conditions will keep you from living permantly in some countries. and also pointing out that some of us would not be welcome to live in other countries. i have personally always thought i would like to live in austrailia someday if i ever were to move to another country. maybe now i could not is all im saying.. lets all be nice now....:-0).
randynoguts 



     http://www.geocities.com/randynogutsweb/


gachrons
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2007
Total Posts : 4527
   Posted 11/3/2008 2:52 AM (GMT -7)   
Well to throw this in here as it has been crossing my mind. I was a bit put out by the fact that they are saying that Crohn's people have type A personalities. Is that going to cause problems getting medical care ? I call it a bit discrimatory because anyone that has and is sick for a long time has to find copping mechanisms. Are our coping mechanisms forseen as a problem to medical care givers? I feel that we are seen as a problem rather then having understanding in seeing that we are sick people at times. Not all medical care is the best we all I am sure have had problems getting care at some time doesn't that put a person on the defensive after all it sometimes comes down to survival. Randy I know you are not pointing to a country but looking at a problem of health concerns here. lol gail
Hallarious woman over 50 ,CD ,IBS 27 years--resection,fistula's,obstructions,hemmies,and still alive.lol gail


FitzyK23
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2005
Total Posts : 4219
   Posted 11/3/2008 6:40 AM (GMT -7)   
I wouldn't say that the US is an easy country to immigrate to either - we "discriminate" for a lot of reasons too.
27 Year old married female law student (last year!!). Diagnosed w/ CD 4 years ago, IBS for over 10 years before that, which was probably the CD. I am sort of lactose intollerant too but can handle anything cultured and do well w/ lactose pills and lactaid. For crohns I am currently on Pentasa 4 pills/4x day and hysociamine prn. I also have bad acid reflux and have been on PPI's since age 13. I have been through prilosec, prevacid, and nexium. Currently I am on Protonix in the morning and Zantac at night. I also take a birth control pill to allow some fun in my life.


MikeB
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2006
Total Posts : 1169
   Posted 11/3/2008 7:00 AM (GMT -7)   
Well, I won't wax political here, but economic: nations with national health care systems (that is, those financed by government, which means taxes) all, to some degree, must ration delivery of said health care. In Canada and Britain, rationing is usually done by waiting lists and limited access to some high-cost procedures. It appears that the down-under countries are applying some immigration limits as well, to prevent some people who may want to come in from doing so if they are seen as being high-level consumers of health care services. Simple economics shows us why rationing of health care services will always be a feature of nationalized systems, since in those countries they are funded by a finite tax base that also has other competitors for available dollars (education, defense, social welfare, etc.) If you doubt this, ask yourself, all things being equal, where would I rather have surgery, my local community hospital or the VA or one of those large inner city public hospitals? (yes I know you can get quality care at those places too, but be honest -- most folks rightly see government-run hospitals as second rate, for good reason . . . )

Zanne
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2005
Total Posts : 3763
   Posted 11/3/2008 7:30 AM (GMT -7)   
Yesterday my daughter was looking for a topic to present to her professor as the next subject for a social justice research piece and presentation she needs to do. I will have to direct her to this thread and then she can do some background info to see if it might fit. Its something that no one else has come up with and something that could spark a lot of debate. Its unbelievable. I thought it was bad when people were classified as far as who would get medicines in case of biologic attacks and such but this is just unreal.
Suzanne

CD 19 years offically, 29 unofficially. 3 resections '93, '95 '97
Symptoms constantly but all tests show only minor ulcerations. Currently having multiple episodes of gastritis with no known cause.


Prednisone, 6MP,Prevacid, B12 shots, Bentyl, Xifaxan.....


Sniper
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2004
Total Posts : 6518
   Posted 11/3/2008 8:21 AM (GMT -7)   
I will refrain from commenting on the topic but I must say I am proud of how this is being discussed civilly. I think we share a bond here that should allow us to agree or disagree with respect for each other. I'm glad to see that happening here.
If we would read the secret history of our enemies,we would find in each mans life sorrow and suffering enough to disarm all hostility.


Roni
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2003
Total Posts : 2480
   Posted 11/3/2008 9:29 AM (GMT -7)   
I think it is a good idea that countries screen for health problems. I especially don't want people to come to Canada if they have an infectious or contagious disease.

I feel compassionate toward sick people who are in countries that don't have proper health care. There are charities in Canada that will pay for some people to come here and get treatment or surgery. i'm pretty sure they have to have govt approval though.

In the US, there are companies who refuse to hire people based on their weight and whether or not the smoke, etc. because they are a health risk.

The truth is, being overweight is a health risk, but at some point in our lives, doesn't everyone get sick with something?

gachrons
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2007
Total Posts : 4527
   Posted 11/3/2008 12:35 PM (GMT -7)   
Hi Roni I guess that is why it is important to maintain a eye open to such things life is a more complex thing then it was years ago. As medicine finds new things hard to say where it will all end up. Just know it is not easy to live with something such as crohn's any way you look there are things to be dealt with. lol gail
Hallarious woman over 50 ,CD ,IBS 27 years--resection,fistula's,obstructions,hemmies,and still alive.lol gail


downunda
New Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 19
   Posted 11/3/2008 1:21 PM (GMT -7)   
Hi Randy/others

I'm a NZer and I just wondered if anyone had a link to the news story? I haven't heard about it until reading this. With no background on this my opinion is like Eva's and I thought NZ had a bit of a reputation of being easy to get into.
26F, Crohn's for 8 years, currently on 6MP and pentasa. Have previously tried remicade, iron, pred and entocort.


FitzyK23
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2005
Total Posts : 4219
   Posted 11/3/2008 1:34 PM (GMT -7)   
There is something about the child with Down's Syndrome on CNN.com
27 Year old married female law student (last year!!). Diagnosed w/ CD 4 years ago, IBS for over 10 years before that, which was probably the CD. I am sort of lactose intollerant too but can handle anything cultured and do well w/ lactose pills and lactaid. For crohns I am currently on Pentasa 4 pills/4x day and hysociamine prn. I also have bad acid reflux and have been on PPI's since age 13. I have been through prilosec, prevacid, and nexium. Currently I am on Protonix in the morning and Zantac at night. I also take a birth control pill to allow some fun in my life.


randynoguts
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 6049
   Posted 11/3/2008 7:46 PM (GMT -7)   
and the overweight lady story was on reuters news service and i think i saw it on BBC. it was about 10 days ago for time referance.. i will see if i can find it again ...
randynoguts 



     http://www.geocities.com/randynogutsweb/


randynoguts
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 6049
   Posted 11/3/2008 8:01 PM (GMT -7)   
ok i found it easier to google the ladys name Rowan Trezise and a whole slew of stuff come up.. i found the downs syndrome story at the telegraph.co.uk. lodon newspaper site.
randynoguts 



     http://www.geocities.com/randynogutsweb/


eva124
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2007
Total Posts : 246
   Posted 11/4/2008 12:36 AM (GMT -7)   
thou i do admit new zealands health care is not what i expected....it was actually quite horrifying to me,i had never really been into hospital b4 my surgeries,and i say that its the thing keeping me frm straying with my health...im terrifed bout hafing to go into nzs public hospital system,i felt like i was in some 3rd wrld country or something the nurses who were in my ward werent even meant to be wrking there,they were frm some other ward is there any place in the world where there is enough nurses and doctors to care for paitents effectivly,(my mum helped with me alot to mke things easier on the nurses)
dx 17 aug 2007
21 yrs old
13 dec 2007 resection/temp illeostomy 14 feb 2008 temp illeostomy reversed 
150mg azamun
3000mg pentasa


randynoguts
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2003
Total Posts : 6049
   Posted 11/4/2008 2:20 AM (GMT -7)   
no eva there is not... cuba claims to have care for everyone, but hardly worth staying alive if you cant have a microwave now is it? ;0). yes the story is true you can now enter alottery in cuba to get a microwave. and the wait list for aphone is down to 2 years after your investigated and found to have no contacts outside of cuba ..
randynoguts 



     http://www.geocities.com/randynogutsweb/

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