I'm totally confused

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frombc
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2006
Total Posts : 219
   Posted 6/23/2009 10:11 AM (GMT -7)   
Hi there, I don't know if you remember me, but I've been on the boards before. I used to frequent the Ulcerative colitis forum and pop in here every now and then with questions.

I bought myself a meter a couple of years ago after deciding that my BG was a little high. My Dr. laughed at me, but this something I wanted to do for myself.

The test I had done at the lab was 103 fasting and 119 (at 2 hours) after a 75g load of glucose. The Dr. told me that's perfectly normal.

I did some reading online and found that while in Canada up to 110 is considered normal, 103 is on the high side. That's when I bought the meter.

I've tested myself at all different times. Usually fasting, then 2 hours after meals. My after meal numbers are usually around 100 or just a little over. This is after eating whole wheat spaghetti, turkey burger on a whole wheat bun, rice with meals etc, even an A&W burger and onion rings. . The highest I've ever been, and it was only 1 time is 158 at 2 hours. . That was after eating a filet 'o fish and fries at McDonalds (lots of sugar in that c**p). The odd time it's been 130ish, but rarely.

I test for a week or so every few months to see what's going on...checking for changes. For months now my fasting has been steady at 84. Two hours after meals is usually 95-110.

I just started one of my testing phases again last week, and suddenly my fasting numbers are 90-100.

I'm wondering why the sudden little increase. Mind you I checked back in my records, and found that I did have 100 fasting in Feb 08 on occasion. Unfortunately I didn't keep records from Feb 08 until last week, but when I did test, I was always 84. I suppose there could have been times in there when I wasn't keeping records that there was an increase, but I guess I'll never know if small increases were a pattern for me.

Here's the part that really confuses me though. I always do my fasting test as soon as I get up. Today I decided to test it again 1.5 hours later (still in fasting state) and it had gone from 97 up to 106. This would explain why my fasting at the lab is always higher than my home fasting test. Why does it go up after you've been up and around for a while? My fasting numbers aren't as good as I thought they were if they're going up like that before eating anything in the morning.

I'm not freaking out or anything, but this does put me closer to being considered pre-diabetic. What do you all think? Would I be considered pre-diabetic with my postprandial numbers being as good as they are?

You read stuff my Dr. Bernstein or the "What they don't tell you about diabetes" website and they say truly normal people never, ever go above 120 no matter what they eat, normal people are from 70-85 fasting and that your A1C should be 4.7 at the most.

How many more people would be considered Glucose intolerant if the medical community adopted those standards?

I guess I'm just really confused as to what normal really is. There's so much conflicting information out there. Some of it almost seems militant in it's tone. I was adopted, so I don't have any family history to go by. It can make you feel like you're flying blind when it comes to health issues at times.

If anyone can answer my question about fasting numbers going up after you've been up for a while, that would be great. It seems fasting numbers aren't very accurate if they depend on when you take them.
48 year old female
Dx'd with proctosigmoiditis July/06
Asacol 9/day
Salofalk enemas 4(g) at bedtime
...Aloe
Vit B complex/folic acid
fish oil (pharmaceutical grade)
VSL#3

Post Edited (frombc) : 6/23/2009 11:26:20 AM (GMT-6)


TVEditor
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2008
Total Posts : 481
   Posted 6/23/2009 11:11 AM (GMT -7)   

From what I have learned, the numbers themselves aren't as important as the range & dynamics -- the spikes & valleys if you will.  Part of this is how fast your body recovers from an elevated BG load.  Normal varies from person to person and depends upon age, physical condition, weight, activity and many other factors.

In my situation, a pre-meal BG reading of below 5.0 (Canadian), while considered slightly high for normals,  feels very low to me.  A 2-hour after reading of below or around 6.0 is optimum for me but again, high by classic normal standards.

According to what I've read around here, meters are not 100% accurate.  I think this is what is producing the relatively small changes in your test figures.   Your morning fluctuations are probably the Dawn Phenomenon -- normals get this too.

Some of the meals you descibed are loaded with carbs.  I don't know if you are overweight but just for an experiment, lay off the burgers, fries, pasta & bread for a week and then take a few readings.

Let us know the results :-)
Chris - Forum Moderator, Diabetes

~ Diagnosed Type 2 in July/'08
~ Dropped 35 or so pounds after following HealingWell advice
~ Diabetes under control / no meds - so far - knock on head
~ My doctor thinks HE is responsible (Don't tell him! He's happy ;)

I used to eat 100% wrong -- now I eat 95% right


LanieG
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 5406
   Posted 6/23/2009 11:23 AM (GMT -7)   

Hi there again.  You're back!   "Dawn Phenomenon"  is when the blood sugar starts to rise in the morning after you wake up.  One explanation is that your body sends blood sugar into the blood stream to be ready for your day's work, giving you the energy you need for activity.  This would explain why you would have a higher reading an hour after your first one even if you hadn't eaten breakfast in between the two times you test your blood sugar.  This might be a good reason not to skip breakfast!  Anyway, as far as your blood sugar readings, you're doing fine.  Since you don't know your family history, it's probably a good idea to be aware of what your blood sugar is.  At this point, you're ok.  If you see that your blood sugar is slowly rising, then cut down a little on the carbs.  For example, substitute another vegetable for a potato.  Switch to whole grain bread if you're eating plain white.  Don't eat a whole meal of pasta - make sure there's protein and fats like oil and cheese with it.  In this way, you can drag out the blood sugar rise if it's starting to get elevated. 


Lanie
forum moderator - diabetes
diabetes controlled so far by low/no carb diet and exercise; no meds
                                                                 


frombc
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2006
Total Posts : 219
   Posted 6/23/2009 12:20 PM (GMT -7)   
Hi Lanie and TVEditor, Thanks for your replies.

I have heard of the "Dawn Phenomenon" and figured that's what it probably was. So if my readings are "normal" when I first get up, but go up into the PD range in an hour, which am I normal or PD. If you never waited that hour, you'd never know would you? Does DP affect a normal person as much as a person with D or PD?

TVEditor, I'm a 50 yr old female, 5'6" and weigh 130 lbs. Blood pressure is 90/60 and I have very high HDL, low trigs, so my cholesterol is great.

I actually eat a fairly healthy diet, but do include some carbs like spaghetti, brown rice, barley, whole wheat bread etc. along with lean proteins and often a salad. The fast food is a rare thing.

Just when I think I'm doing pretty good, I read these websites where the threshold for PD is so low, I wonder who is correct with the description of "normal". If Dr. Bernstein is right, then there's a whole lotta people walking around with PD or D whose Drs. are telling them they are normal.

I will keep an eye on my carb intake and see if that has an effect on my fasting nos.
48 year old female
Dx'd with proctosigmoiditis July/06
Asacol 9/day
Salofalk enemas 4(g) at bedtime
...Aloe
Vit B complex/folic acid
fish oil (pharmaceutical grade)
VSL#3


LanieG
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 5406
   Posted 6/23/2009 1:28 PM (GMT -7)   
There are many undiagnosed diabetics and "pre"diabetics walking around and because there's an explosion of diabetes around the world, many medical organizations have lowered the parameters by which diabetes is diagnosed.  So, in general, you want to have fasting under 100.  Because of dawn phenomenon, it's important to eat breakfast (but not laden with carbs).  Most 'normals' produce enough insulin to counteract the glucose in the blood during the early morning but type 1s especially may be hit by DP because they don't produce insulin.  Type 2s may still produce some insulin but they're insulin resistant and can't metabolize the glucose efficiently.  So, there's the DP in action.  Scrambled eggs with cheese, coffee with cream.  That will help you stabilize the morning's blood sugar.

Lanie
forum moderator - diabetes
diabetes controlled so far by low/no carb diet and exercise; no meds
                                                                 


SmurfyShadow
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 2386
   Posted 6/24/2009 5:32 PM (GMT -7)   
A normal range is 90-130. Some doctors say in the 80s are fine. It sounds like you are pulling a trick I do. Given of what I eat the day before my pancreas either makes too much or too little insulin.
 
Smurfy Shadow/Desirèe 
DX: Wegener's Disease, Migraines, Diabetese Type II, PCOS, Lactose Intolerant, Benign Heart Murmer, Depression, Asthma, Asperger's Syndrome, Necrotizing Gramultous Inflamation in eye, A.D.D., Acid Reflux, Tumor Behind the Eye, Carpal Tunnel, Fibromyolgia, Clasterphobic, Arthritis
Medications:  Tri Nessa, Percocet, Metformin, Prilosec, Protonix, Zantac, Advair, Cingulair, Albuterol, Calcium + Vitamin D, Pro-Air, Pepcid, Rolaids, Zofran, Compuzeen, Refresh Plus Eye Drops  PRN: Epi-Pen, Albuterol Nebulizer, Benedryl
Undergoing Radiation Taking Lorazepam (Ativan) on Radiation Days


aimsgirl16
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 1469
   Posted 6/24/2009 6:01 PM (GMT -7)   
Hey there, I was told that 72-125 is where most people should be...At night I will drop down in the 40's and 50's and try to go back to sleep without eating (before I knew what I was supposed to do) and then a few hrs later is would be back up in the 100's. At first I thought this was my meter, but I have since gotten a new one and having the same numbers...its a mystery to me!


Amy

 

21 years old...Systemic Lupus , lupus nephritis , raynoids , Carpal Tunnel

Ultram, Prednisone, Cell-Cept, Lisinopril,  Ambien, Flexeril, Darvocet, Ferrious Sulfade, Calcium, Vitamin B12, Aspirin 81 mg, Vitamin C

The Old Normal is no more so I and we have to find a New Normal...

 


LanieG
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 5406
   Posted 6/24/2009 6:23 PM (GMT -7)   
Doctors and labs say that under 100 is what is normal for fasting blood sugar.  However, a person who is not diabetic would most likely wake up with blood sugar in the 80s.  Fasting blood sugar from 100 to 125 on more than one occasion and with high results on the OGTT would be considered "pre-diabetic" or diabetic depending on how high the OGTT is.  126 and over is considered diabetic.  No one should be striving for fasting over 126 on a regular basis.

Lanie
forum moderator - diabetes
diabetes controlled so far by low/no carb diet and exercise; no meds
                                                                 


frombc
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2006
Total Posts : 219
   Posted 6/25/2009 5:04 PM (GMT -7)   
It's weird, because if you're in Canada where I am, you're not considered PD until you're above 110 fasting. I think WHO also goes by this criteria. From what I've read the U.S. is the only country that considers under 100 to be PD.

I sometimes wonder about LADA (type 1.5) because I'm not the typical type 2. I know there can be slim, fit type 2s though.

There really isn't much information on LADA online, but I figure my nos. would have deteriorated in the last 3 1/2 years if my mild blood sugar irregularities were heading toward LADA.

Anyone know the answer to that? Thanks.
50 year old female
Dx'd with proctosigmoiditis July/06
Salofalk enemas 4(g) at bedtime every 3rd night
...Aloe
Vit B complex/folic acid
fish oil (pharmaceutical grade)
VSL#3


LanieG
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 5406
   Posted 6/25/2009 6:20 PM (GMT -7)   

Hi frombc, here are some websites to look over. 

http://www.diabetes.org/pre-diabetes/pre-diabetes-symptoms.jsp

http://www.diabetesmonitor.com/lada.htm

This second website is about LADA.  Maybe you can find more information there.  And remember that an endocrinologist is the specialist that can help determine this.


Lanie
forum moderator - diabetes
diabetes controlled so far by low/no carb diet and exercise; no meds
                                                                 


gallyndur
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2005
Total Posts : 43
   Posted 7/3/2009 3:24 PM (GMT -7)   
Just a quick thought: do you brush your teeth after your first fasting reading but before your second? Brushing my teeth would always raise my number 40-60 points when my doctor would take my fasting number until it finally occurred to me to use sugar-free toothpaste...Toothpaste may be affecting your second reading, just not dramatically because you're not truly diabetic. Just a thought...

frombc
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2006
Total Posts : 219
   Posted 7/17/2009 4:06 PM (GMT -7)   
I'm very scared. Suddenly today, after eating some meals that normally don't make my BGs go up above 110 at 1 hour it's gone all the way up to 165.

What could be going on? I've been feeling really stressed the last week or so with peri-memo symptoms. Constant butterflies in my stomache. How could my numbers go from basically normal to this in a matter of days?

I did retake it with the extremely high of 165 and it was the same. Is it possible my meters batteries are giving out. My fasting was at about 99 this morning, which lately has been normal for me. Could LADA come on this quickly. less than a week?
50 year old female
Dx'd with proctosigmoiditis July/06
Salofalk enemas 4(g) at bedtime every 3rd night
...Aloe
Vit B complex/folic acid
fish oil (pharmaceutical grade)
VSL#3


LanieG
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 5406
   Posted 7/17/2009 7:01 PM (GMT -7)   
Stress and illness (like cold or flu) can cause your blood sugar to rise.  Other medication you take can do it too just like food.  It's possible it could be a weak battery.  How old is the meter?  I've had a couple of meters for 2 years and they're fine.  I think those batteries last a long time.  I don't know how the onset of LADA is.  Gradual or not.  It seems to me you'd be having numbers like a roller coaster ride.  So, I'd just keep an eye on it.  If you do have very erratic numbers for no discernable reason, I think a trip to the doctor would be a good idea.  Otherwise, it could be stress?
Lanie
forum moderator - diabetes
diabetes controlled so far by low/no carb diet and exercise; no meds
                                                                 


frombc
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2006
Total Posts : 219
   Posted 7/17/2009 7:40 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks Lanie. The meter is only a few months old...so probably not that.

From what I've read, LADA can hit you quite suddenly, but it's not like type I in children. The older you are the slower it comes. I've been watching my numbers for over 3 years now, and I've never seen it do this. I think LADA would be more of a roller coaster as you say.

I have this constant adrenaline feeling in my gut for 2 weeks now, which I know is the peri hormones. I'm hoping it's just that and I can get back on track once it settles down.

I do have an app't at the Dr. next week for my yearly physical. I'll ask for an A1c this time and see what he says. He just laughs at me when I tell him I think I have a glucose problem. I can't say as I blame him, because according to the Canadian Diabetes Assn'n I'm perfectly normal....except today ;)

Thanks for talking to me.
50 year old female
Dx'd with proctosigmoiditis July/06
Salofalk enemas 4(g) at bedtime every 3rd night
...Aloe
Vit B complex/folic acid
fish oil (pharmaceutical grade)
VSL#3


LanieG
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 5406
   Posted 7/17/2009 8:27 PM (GMT -7)   

One of the best things you can do is have a log of your days recording what you eat and what your blood sugar is.  I'd also add how you feel at the moment when you test.  It might not be scientific but the readings should help when you explain what's going on to the doctor.  I went through menopause before I started testing my blood sugar so I have no idea what effects it had.  (And, oh gosh, that would have been one more thing I didn't need to worry about!) 

I'm sorry you're going through a rough time now with adrenaline in your gut.  I hope that resolves itself.  Good luck with your doctor's visit.  I hope you get some relief and some answers.  Try not to stress yourself further over the blood sugar though so you don't end up in a never ending cause - effect cycle.

Take care, smurf


Lanie
forum moderator - diabetes
diabetes controlled so far by low/no carb diet and exercise; no meds
                                                                 

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