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CathyA
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   Posted 6/18/2007 12:33 PM (GMT -7)   
Hi Keriamon,
    My HIDA scan is Wednesday morning and I have a couple more questions for you.
   First of all, I can sometimes get panic attacks when I have to lie flat, since sometimes I have trouble breathing.  But if I don't overeat or eat too much salt from now til then, I should be okay.   But I tend to freak out at strange sensations.   Will the radioactive stuff they put in my IV give my any sensations?  Will it affect my heartrate at all?
   When they give the stuff to make my gallbladder contract, might it give me diarrhea?
   I have this fear of crashing and not having personnel around who can save me.  I know its a silly fear, but I have it.   My husband has offered to be in the waiting room, but he will have to rearrange some things at work.  I want to be a big girl and do it by myself, in spite of my fears.   I don't want to inconvenience him for something simple.    Do I have any reason to think that this will be a rough ride??
Thanks!
   (Its not easy being me.....)

Keriamon
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Date Joined Jun 2005
Total Posts : 2976
   Posted 6/18/2007 12:42 PM (GMT -7)   
No, the radioactive stuff is just radioactive stuff. It's not a medicine of any sort, so there's no reaction to it, unless you are allergic to it (someone else on here said that they heard it was shellfish based). Now, the second stuff they put in will cause your gall bladder to empty, and that's the uncomfortable part. It will make lying down uncomfortable and you will feel nauseated. That will last about 5 minutes, tops, I seem to recall.

You're 100 times more likely to stress yourself into a heart attack than the medicine for the test to cause one. :-) If tests make you really nervous, then call your doctor's office and see if they will give you a valium to take beforehand. There shouldn't be any problem with taking one before the test, so long as you have somone to drive you. Of course, come to think of it, a valium might relax your gall bladder and digestive tract and it might not react accurately.

Anyways, I've had this done three times and I'm not dead yet, and I didn't vomit on anyone, so you'll be okay. It's not as bad as a colonoscopy, I assure you. :-)

It shouldn't give you D, but I can't say that for certain, as I had D off and on all the time, so how could I notice? Anyways, it didn't need to make me go to the bathroom before the test was over.

Make sure you tell your technician that you have some issues with tests and lying on your back. He or she may be able to play soft music for you or tell you jokes or something to keep you engaged. My mother came back with me for my first test, so if you need your husband, ask to see if he can come back and talk to you because you get panicy otherwise. My stepfather did my other two tests, so I watched the screen and asked questions while it was going on.

CathyA
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Date Joined Mar 2005
Total Posts : 1431
   Posted 6/18/2007 1:00 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks Keriamon!
You're absolutely right about giving myself a heart attack! lol! I have a sympathethic system that is always on overdrive, so sometimes, I just don't seem to have control over it. My angst is sort of like a runaway train.
I was thinking of pulling an all-nighter before, so I'd be so tired I wouldn't care what they did to me! hahaha
It would be cool to be able to watch it on the screen. Do you think I'll be allowed to do that, or did you get to do it because of your step dad?
I don't think I'll need my husband. Alot depends on the people working with me. Sometimes you get people who have no sensitivity at all, and other times they are real sweethearts.
about the diarrhea......I was just afraid of it hitting me hard while I was laying there! I have diarrhea alot too, but I would prefer not to have that explosive stuff when they are telling me to lie real still and hold my breath!
Do I have to hold my breath?
Can people have normal amylase lab values and still have gall bladder problems?
Do they ever consider the pancreatic enzymes when we have alot of bowel problems? This test doesn't look for any problems with the pancreas, does it?
Thanks!

Keriamon
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Date Joined Jun 2005
Total Posts : 2976
   Posted 6/18/2007 1:33 PM (GMT -7)   
No, you don't have to hold your breath, but you do need to lie still or the picture of your gall bladder will jump around and it won't be able to track how much is emptying out of it very well.

The way my stepdad's room was laid out, the screen was where anyone could see it. You should see a lot of bright white stuff in a big spot on it after you get the radioactive dye; that will be the radioactive dye concentrating. After they give you the dumping stuff, though, it's harder to see it moving out. It will scatter some, but probably won't be very obvious to you, especially at a distance.

I don't know what a normal amylase lab value is, but my bad gall bladder never showed up in any blood work.

Nope, the hida scan doesn't look at the pancreas.

CathyA
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Date Joined Mar 2005
Total Posts : 1431
   Posted 6/18/2007 5:00 PM (GMT -7)   
Does breathing cause some problems for the clarity of the picture?
How long do you have to hold still for?
Did they let you have a pillow?
 Do you take everything from the waist up off?
How long does it take the radioactive stuff to concentrate in in gallbladder?
Thanks!

Keriamon
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Date Joined Jun 2005
Total Posts : 2976
   Posted 6/19/2007 7:37 AM (GMT -7)   
No, you can breathe. As you have to lay there for about 30 minutes, asking you not to breathe would be a bit bad, lol.

You have to lay on the table for about 30 minutes. It probably depends on the technician, but I seem to remember be offered the chance to get up and go to the bathroom if I needed to, before the second injection.

Yes, you will have a pillow under your head. If you need a pillow somewhere else (like under a knee or under your back), let the technician know so he can get you situated before the test begins.

You don't take off any of your clothing.

I think the test is pretty well in equal measure, with about 15 minutes to get the radioactive stuff concentrated and about 15 minutes to track the GB emptying.

CathyA
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Date Joined Mar 2005
Total Posts : 1431
   Posted 6/19/2007 1:09 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks Keriamon,
I'm so fortunate to have someone like you to fill me in on this stuff! Thanks a bunch!
lol! yeah, I figured I didn't have to hold my breath for 30 minutes! But I didn't know if it was something I had to do alot of. I can get ectopy from holding my breath. Plus.....what makes it a little worse for me right now is I'm going through a period of having alot of ectopy. It seems to be 2 weeks with it, 2 weeks without. Makes me think its hormonal, even though I'm in menopause.
I had to lay on a cold hard table last year for my knee MRI for about an hour, so I think I'll do okay. If I can just have my head on a pillow, I'll be a happy camper.
When they give you the stuff to contract your gallbladder, do you feel any sensations anywhere else in your body?
You must think I'm really weird asking all these strange questions! I was born with a very weird body and it has strange reactions to things, so I don't like surprises.
I went through a phase awhile back whenever I would get drops to dilate my pupils (for an eye exam), I would feel like I was going to pass out. Not fun. I never really know what to expect from anything........hence the anxiety.
So.......our livers make enough bile to fill the gallbladder in about 15 minutes?? Seems like alot of bile. Maybe there's some feedback mechanism so the liver knows when the gallbladder is full and it quits making it?
And when people have their gallbladders removed, does the liver just keep pumping it out all the time? That would be a bummer.
Thanks again Keriamon for all your help!

Keriamon
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Date Joined Jun 2005
Total Posts : 2976
   Posted 6/19/2007 3:45 PM (GMT -7)   
It's my understanding of the liver/bile/gall bladder thing that the liver produces a steady amount of bile to fill up the gall bladder (it's not that big, you know)--mind you, I don't know how long that process takes. When you eat, though, the gall bladder dumps out bile, and the liver fills it back up again and the gall bladder holds it, waiting for food to come in again. So, think of the GB as a holding tank.

I have no medical proof for this, but I think my GB problem was that my liver produced too much bile and didn't let the gall bladder empty as much as it should, overflowed it, etc. and that's why it was chronically inflamed and why it would perodically dump out large amounts of bile when my stomach was empty and make me sick. Even now that the GB is gone, I have too much bile coming out if I don't take the Welchol to soak it up.

And yes, when you no longer have a GB, your liver will just trickle bile out of the bile duct into your intestines. Supposedly the bile duct can stretch out overtime and form a pocket so that when you eat, and the liver thinks, hey, time to refill the GB, it will push the bile out of the bile duct pocket and that sort of works like a GB. But I don't think that's happened with me. But that's why eating triggers D in so many people without GBs; when you eat, the liver just makes more bile and it doesn't get put into the digestive process when and where the gall bladder would put it, so that causes problems. I think maybe also the gall bladder being full is what turns off the liver's bile production, and without the GB, it just keeps on producing bile, so you end up with bile in your guts when you don't have any food, and that can also cause D.

Sarita might can tell you better how that all works (or doesn't work); some info I was able to glean off the web, but some is just hunches on my part, based on how I seem to work (or not work).

And no, I didn't feel sensations in my body anywhere but my upper chest/abdomen area. Felt similar to a typical gall bladder attack with nausea, tightness in the chest, a bit of pain.

CathyA
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Date Joined Mar 2005
Total Posts : 1431
   Posted 6/19/2007 6:08 PM (GMT -7)   
I wonder if there is ever a problem with the gall bladder, where it can be fixed with medication instead of surgery?
Well, my test is in the morning. I'll let you know how it went. Thanks again for your help!

dbab
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Date Joined Jan 2004
Total Posts : 4151
   Posted 6/19/2007 8:18 PM (GMT -7)   
Good luck with the scan Cathy... will be waiting to hear from you :-)
"Des"
Co-Moderator ~ IBS Forum
Co-Moderator ~ Lupus Forum 
Dx: IBS 1989, Diverticulosis 2004, Idiopathic Acute Colitis 2006, UCTD 2007
Meds: Plaquenil 400mg, Chlorzoxazone 500mg, Lyrica 50mg, Protonix 40mg, Naproxen 1000mg, Klonopin 2mg/day (tapering to PRN), Miralax 17g, Supplements


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Keriamon
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Date Joined Jun 2005
Total Posts : 2976
   Posted 6/20/2007 7:23 AM (GMT -7)   
There's no way to fix a gall bladder with medication, that I'm aware of. At one point in time they thought they could get rid of gall stones with the sonic treatments they use on people with kidney stones, but I hear that that didn't work very well; either because gall stones don't break up like kidney stones, or because the gall bladder is a bit further into the body and harder to reach with the sonic waves, or because gall stones reappear faster than kidney stones, so it doesn't work for very long. In most cases, though, they can't tell why your gall bladder is messed up if they can't see any stones, so there's no way to treat. They didn't know until after mine came out that it was chronically inflamed. If they had known that beforehand, maybe they could have treated it with anti-inflammatories, but there's just no test that can actually look at the gall bladder and see why it's not working. All they can see is that it is or isn't working.

Let us know how it went.

CathyA
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Date Joined Mar 2005
Total Posts : 1431
   Posted 6/20/2007 10:27 AM (GMT -7)   
Thanks Des and Keriamon.
I'm back! Actually, it was a piece of cake......except for the severe hip pain I got after about 45 minutes of laying flat on that hard table! I thought I'd go crazy. I had to lie perfectly still for 1 hour, then I ate a pudding with 9 grams of fat, and very little happened afterwards.
The tech said that right after I ate the pudding, they have to film until 35% of the gallbladder has emptied, or 1 hour....whichever comes first. I wasn't sure I could last an hour with my hips hurting so much.
She stopped after a half hour and said "you're done!" I was glad for that. But on the way home, I started wondering.........I know 35% might be enough to make sure I'm emptying enough........but how do they determine if I empty too much if they stop after 35%?? I sure hope she checked for everything. I really didn't have any symptoms.
I asked her a simple question and she said "I'm not allowed to say anything"...........so I'm sure she might not have known the reasons behind things.
I really expected more of a reaction. 9 grams of fat doesn't seem like that much! I asked her about the medication they sometimes give to get the gallbladder going and she said they don't use that anymore, since it causes too much cramping and they just use the pudding now.
Anyhow.........I'm very relieved, and I have the feeling my gallbladder is fine.........but I still need to figure out why I feel nauseous and yukky alot of the time. I think I'll finally go see the GI guy who did my colonoscopy, and then onto the ENT.
Thanks again for your help everyone.

dbab
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Date Joined Jan 2004
Total Posts : 4151
   Posted 6/20/2007 10:35 AM (GMT -7)   
Glad it went well and no complications Cathy. :-)

Take Care
"Des"
Co-Moderator ~ IBS Forum
Co-Moderator ~ Lupus Forum 
Dx: IBS 1989, Diverticulosis 2004, Idiopathic Acute Colitis 2006, UCTD 2007
Meds: Plaquenil 400mg, Chlorzoxazone 500mg, Lyrica 50mg, Protonix 40mg, Naproxen 1000mg, Klonopin 2mg/day (tapering to PRN), Miralax 17g, Supplements


http://www.healingwell.com/donate


CathyA
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Date Joined Mar 2005
Total Posts : 1431
   Posted 6/20/2007 1:43 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks Des,
Actually my doctor just called and said it was normal. I have an ejection of 37.9%.
I'm going to give myself the week off, but next Monday make an appointment with the new GI doc.
Now I'm paranoid that its my small bowel!
Another possibility is that IBS just got alot worse. I'll talk this over with the GI guy. But IBS shouldn't make you nauseous all the time, should it?
I suppose there are conditions where your gallbladder is normal, but your intestines can't handle the bile??

I seem to be going through very similar problems that I went through when I was going through perimenopause. When I told my doc I wondered if it was hormone-related, he said "You're in menopause, so its not that". Wouldn't you know a guy would say that? I've talked to so many women who are still having symptoms long after their periods stop.
I guess the OB/GYN should be on the list too. I'm going to be a busy girl!
Well........I guess I get to keep all my parts for a little longer! :)

Sarita
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Date Joined Mar 2005
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   Posted 6/20/2007 6:50 PM (GMT -7)   

Has your doctor mentioned anything about gastroparesis, by any chance?

Glad the scan wasn't so bad.  Lying on those hard tables is definitely annoying.  I did that for my thyroid test with my neck craned back so far I thought I'd rupture a disc!


CathyA
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Date Joined Mar 2005
Total Posts : 1431
   Posted 6/21/2007 6:39 AM (GMT -7)   
Thanks Sarita,
No, he hasn't mentioned gastroparesis, but I have only been seeing my Internist and not a GI doc. I think I have had gastroparesis in the past, but it seemed to get better. For several months I haven't had the bloating and pressure that I associate with that condition.......just this nausea/dizziness. My diarrhea is worse too.
I have fibromyalgia. I realize that no one really knows what that is. But this seems like a huge flare of that.......including sinus, ectopy, GI changes, depression, sleep problems, muscle/joint pains, etc., etc. I almost hate running to each specialty, trying to figure out what's going on, when I really feel it is something more with my hard drive! And even if I went to another neurologist, I have the feeling still nothing would show up.
I am considering an antidepressant. I'm thinking that stress causes these horrible flares and that maybe that medication would somewhat protect me from the stresses. I've avoided one up til now because of the potential side-effects.
Also........I came off my Toprol (beta blocker) last December, and things have slowly gone downhill from there. My BP is fine and my heartrate is fine, but I'm feeling all these pains everywhere. It had some side-effects which I hated (intensely hungry 24/7, total lack of motivation, no stamina, no brain), but I'm now wondering if alot of my "fibromyalgia" is something like too many beta adrenergic receptors all throughout my body.?? I'm always trying to come up with theories to explain what the hell is happening to me. Every test is always normal, yet I feel so bad I can hardly function some days.
So I am considering going back on the Toprol, at a low dose, to see if these various pains and problems don't start easing up.
Oh to have a normal body! People with bodies that behave truly don't know how good they have it!

dbab
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2004
Total Posts : 4151
   Posted 6/21/2007 7:03 AM (GMT -7)   
Hi Cathy,

I think I have heard that antidepressants is one of the treatments for fibro and conveniently enough one of the treatments for IBS so you may be killing two birds with one stone. I hear you about the side effects though. There are so many out there too so its hard to figure out which one would be the best to try. I hope you can get all of this under control soon. Keeping you in my thoughts.

Take Care
"Des"
Co-Moderator ~ IBS Forum
Co-Moderator ~ Lupus Forum 
Dx: IBS 1989, Diverticulosis 2004, Idiopathic Acute Colitis 2006, UCTD 2007
Meds: Plaquenil 400mg, Chlorzoxazone 500mg, Lyrica 50mg, Protonix 40mg, Naproxen 1000mg, Klonopin 2mg/day (tapering to PRN), Miralax 17g, Supplements


http://www.healingwell.com/donate


Keriamon
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Date Joined Jun 2005
Total Posts : 2976
   Posted 6/21/2007 8:54 AM (GMT -7)   
Fibro can cause a lot of bowel problems, so this all may be related to it. My mother has fibro and had a doctor tell her that going organic can help; something about chemicals and preservatives causing a more severe reaction. She said it has seemed to help lessen the severity of the pain, but, like you, she's now having some bowel problems to boot.

Pudding, huh? Sound better than the chemical I got; yes, it does cause a lot more problems than just eating something. Although my stepfather said that injecting it a little bit at a time over the course of a minute or two kept it from being quite as bad on people as injecting all of it at once.

If you are having bile problems--i.e. yellow, burning stools--they can still prescribe you the Welchol, like I'm on, even with a good gall bladder. All it does is soak up excess bile in your intestines. Sometimes people have excess bile in their intestines because their intestines are just moving things through too fast and there's no time for the body to reabsorb the bile.

CathyA
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2005
Total Posts : 1431
   Posted 6/21/2007 9:21 AM (GMT -7)   
Thanks Des and Keriamon,
The doc has wanted to put me on antidepressants for years, but I kept saying no. I know this sounds bad, but I didn't want to be put on the drugs that millions of Americans are on. I was hoping I'd come across something that would balance me out more naturally. But I'm ready to cry Uncle! Maybe its just our modern way of life that causes alot of this stuff.
I really thought I was balancing out last year. I just felt better and things were more consistently good. My severe fatigue was under control, and I didn't feel like I would be surprised every day by some bizzare, scary symptom. But last December I went off the Toprol (took 2 months to come off slowly). After a few months, I started having tons of joint and muscle pains. Then in May I started using the CPAP, got dizzy after 5 weeks, had a colonoscopy and proceeded to get incredibly nauseous, and still am. But now I'm just feeling sick all the time and breaking out into a sweat, getting headaches, blah, blah, blah. I'm so tired of even thinking about my body!!
I'm really anxious to get back on the CPAP, 'cause it was obviously helping my fatigue. But.......I'm so scared of that dizziness again. It really bothers me that my children have seen me like this for so long. I'm afraid this is how they'll always remember me......after I'm gone.
about 8 years ago, when I was having migraines every day, and burping constantly, I swore I was going to have a portrait done of me burping, wearing that blue ice bag on my head.......since I was sure that's how they pictured me! lol!
Oh well........I guess if we all felt great, life would be just too easy and boring, right??? ;)
Thanks again for all your help through this!
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