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Lymeymom
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 33
   Posted 9/9/2009 9:31 AM (GMT -6)   
Has anyone else had incidents of 'blacking' out? Saturday I blacked out/passed out suddenly. I don't remember anything that happened. I was told by girlfriends I 'disappeared' from our group without telling anyone anything (which is NOT like me). They said I was sweating profusely and mostly unresponsive. Mumbling but could not form audible words. Completely dead weight and then was like I was just 'asleep'. Heart rate and breathing appeared normal. They thought maybe I just had 1 to many glasses of wine (only had 3 small glasses of wine in a 2.5 hour period) and not enough to eat - NOT. They took me home, put on my PJs, and put me in bed. Blacked out appx 8:30pm. DO NOT REMEMBER ANYTHING!  I slept from appx 8:30pm until 5:30am the next morning. Woke up crying and extremely upset because I couldn't remember anything! For several hours that morning I felt strange - almost 'out of body' type experience. Later during shower I found a large bump on the top of my head and injury to my right ankle (from a fall when I blacked out?) No one knows.
 I have been back to regular physician this morning and have been 'shaky', nervous, feverish, left elbow killing me, not myself all morning. I felt like I have been having some sort of panic attack. Uncontrollable crying since 8:30 this morning. They took blood to test Thyroid, white count, testing for Lupus also. Trying to get me in today for a CT brain scan. I am at home - not work -waiting to hear from doctor now. Any thoughts or similar experiences? smhair

+Lyme
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Date Joined Apr 2009
Total Posts : 1304
   Posted 9/10/2009 7:52 PM (GMT -6)   
Lymeymom -- this could be a long shot, but I'm wondering if you could possibly have become hypoglycemic? It believe it is possible for Lyme to cause this. about 30 yrs ago, when I was diagnosed w/ hypogly, I did a lot of study on it. It is like so many other things -- everyone is affected in different ways.

A single blood test cannot tell you if your blood sugar drops too low, because it depends on what is happening at the time. If you believe you have any of the symptoms, you would need a 5 hr glucose test.

I read a book on this and it showed many differing graphs. Someone like me starts out w/ blood sugar level a little high (cause I drink frappacinno first thing in the am) and then it starts dropping. I don't bottom out til the 4th and 5th hour, and then my liver signals my pancreas (or liver?) and adrenals to send out more sugar/glucose. That is what causes the weakness and shakiness. So far, my liver's been good and I may bottom out, but will recoop, altho it doesn't feel too good.

Some people's graphs show that during the 5 hr glucose test, their blood sugar starts dropping and continues to drop until they faint/pass out.

Some people's blood sugar drops more quickly than others, and some (like me) have so far (knock on wood) have never bottomed out, meaning, I have been weak and shakey, but my body seems to buck it back up.

Lymeymom, you might want to look up hypogylcemia and see if those symptoms seem to fit/ come together. Because it can tag along w/ Lyme.

Hypoglycemia can also cause irritibility to rage, along w/ passing out, fainting, etc.
Bit 1972: Acute and chronic tonsillitis, UTI, miscarraige, appendicitis, hypoglycemia,  chronic neck pain w/ crushed vertibrae, chronic severe back pain, mitral valve prolapse, depression, resolution?
Bit Mother's Day 2007: Lyme, Babesia microti, hypothyroidism, EBV, HHV6, Parvovirus B19, low adrenals &misc other hormones, depression, anxiety, more of the above.
What don't these nasty bugs cause? 
CD57= 60, so we're in pretty good shape.
 


CajunGrl
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Date Joined Mar 2009
Total Posts : 4717
   Posted 9/10/2009 8:24 PM (GMT -6)   
I second what Lyme just said. Get the 5 hour glucose test. This was the only way they figured out I had low blood sugar. Most new doctors don't run this test anymore. You may have to ask for it. When they tested your blood sugar those few times, it may have been back to normal.
**You never know how STRONG you are....until being STRONG is the ONLY choice you have**

Co-Moderator Lyme Disease Forum


Lymeymom
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 33
   Posted 9/11/2009 5:12 PM (GMT -6)   
blood sugar tests have shown normal levels.....more on other results in a few - my 5 year old is calling...lol

CajunGrl
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Date Joined Mar 2009
Total Posts : 4717
   Posted 9/11/2009 5:20 PM (GMT -6)   
LymeyMom,

But did you do the 5 hour glucose(sugar) test? A normal blood test can show that your sugar levels are normal even if they aren't. Mine kept showing normal on regular blood tests until I did the 5 hour glucose test. I nearly passed out by the 5th hour of testing.

It may be food induced, so you should have the 5 hour (or however long they do it now),test done
**You never know how STRONG you are....until being STRONG is the ONLY choice you have**

Co-Moderator Lyme Disease Forum

Post Edited (CajunGrl) : 9/11/2009 5:23:30 PM (GMT-6)


Traveler
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2007
Total Posts : 35705
   Posted 9/11/2009 5:24 PM (GMT -6)   
I keep having issues with this as well - last time I gave myself a minor concussion - =(

Some of the time, I notice absolutely nothing wonky - other times I have this buzzed feeling.

I eat a relatively high protein diet - force of habit more than anything. I also have noticed that sometimes after eating is when I get that buzzed feeling - a very strange thing to happen after eating!

I was assuming it had to do with Neuro Lyme.

My daughter is slightly hypo-glycemic, so I do have a basic understanding of that condition - when my Lymie brain will allow!!!
- Traveler
"Conditions": Lyme Disease (neuro, gastro, bone, brain, muscle, hearing involved), STARI, RMSF, Hashimoto's Thyroiditis, Lyme Arthritis, Neuro LD, FM, Chronic/acute EBV, IBS-C, Diverticulosis (& "itis") & now Lyme arthritis (?).


Lymeymom
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 33
   Posted 9/11/2009 6:49 PM (GMT -6)   
no i did not have the 5 hour test, but will definately ask about this...i have had a few 'incidents' kind of similar since 1991, but never completely blacked out with no memory until now...sugar checked almost every time but well after the incidents so i see what you're saying . mom says maybe the lyme is 'triggering' this?

Lymeymom
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 33
   Posted 9/11/2009 6:53 PM (GMT -6)   
i am really confused and frustrated. as of this afternoon, all tests and levels are supposedly normal - thyroid, lupus, rhuematoid, blood sugar, liver, normal MRI, and despite first positive test for lyme 8/7/9 with GP now infectious disease says lyme is negative? WHAT?? what then is causing all my issues?
 
i've heard and read so much about false negatives - especially from ID perspective. I don't want this to be lyme but so much 'fits'...my anxiety is really peaking and causing other issues. Help please....EEG with neurologist not scheduled till next month, but i am really worried about another black out episode...single parent of kindergartener - working full time - i need some answers asap.

Post Edited (Lymeymom) : 9/11/2009 7:26:00 PM (GMT-6)


CajunGrl
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2009
Total Posts : 4717
   Posted 9/11/2009 7:53 PM (GMT -6)   
LymeyMom,

I understand your frustration. Take a deep breath and take on one thing at a time. The most important thing right now seems to be figuring out why you are passing out. Lyme Disease can definitely mess with glucose levels so go get that test done first.

As for that ID doctor saying your test is negative, that's typical of them. You need to see a Lyme Literate Medical Doctor. If you have ANY bands specific for Lyme, an LLMD will say that you have Lyme. I mean, think about it...why would any test pick up antibodies for Lyme if nothing is there?
**You never know how STRONG you are....until being STRONG is the ONLY choice you have**

Co-Moderator Lyme Disease Forum


+Lyme
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2009
Total Posts : 1304
   Posted 9/11/2009 8:14 PM (GMT -6)   
Lymeymom, I am so very sorry you are experiencing such serious problems! This is really dangerous for you!

Of course, we cannot know for sure what is the cause of your illness, but we do know that Lyme CAN cause hypoglycemia and we know that a single blood sugar test here and there is NOT likely to show as low unless they happen to catch you while it's low!

When I did the 5 hr test, my first few hours were normal -- they started slightly high, then gradually got lower, but within normal range. It was around the 4 th hour that the lab techs came looking for me (I was wandering around the hospital). They said they expected me to be passed out, my blood sugar was so low. They asked how I felt and I said just like I normally do when my blood sugar drops. I was weak, shakey and had a blinding headache.

Some people would have blacked out before this hour, at this hour, or even the next hour. It all depends on your pancreas, liver and adrenals.

There is one very safe way you can 'test' yourself: Consume NO sugar, eat high protein and/or complex carbs every 2 hours. Keep your meals SMALL and be sure to eat every couple of hours.

IF you are hypoglycemic, you may crave sugar, but if you will lay off it for 3 days, this craving will pass and you will be fine w/o it. IF you are hypoglycemic, you will begin to feel better in about a week. You will be able to tell when it is dropping -- you will get weak and shakey, often very irritable and you will need some protein or complex carbs.

I hate to sound like a zealot, just because I experienced this (still do -- I still have to eat every couple of hours, but not as strict about what I eat), but w/ Lyme, it's a very real possibility. I have never passed out, but MANY people w/ hypoglycemia do!

Do not overeat at any meal or snack.

Lyme and some of the co-infections can cause your anxiety -- so can hypoglycemia. Taking on a hypoglycemic's diet can help you determine if this is part of your problem.

btw, Orange juice does have sugar in it. But if you get in a fix -- when you FEEL the bottom dropping out, drink down a glass of OJ. It pulled me out of many fixes when I was waiting tables. The Bar knew I had a problem when I stopped by and said 'Give me some OJ NOW!'

Also, my mother has a friend who has to keep a glass of OJ by her bed. She cannot get out of bed without it.
 
Contrary to popular belief, do NOT eat a candy bar when you feel your sugar level is low. (unless you are diabetic, which is a whole different thing). IF you are hypoglycemic, you have too much insulin, whereas the diabetic doesn't have enough.  If a hypoglycemic eats sugar, it gets burned up too fast because of too much insulin.  Eating protein and complex carbs takes longer to break down into sugar.

Everyone is different. That is why the 5 hr test is so important. Everyone's 'graph' is different. Still, without the test, you can test this yourself and possibly get rid of the black outs.

If hypoglycemia is not causing this, then I'm really sorry -- you are going to need a Dr who cares enough to help you.

I think we all already know that a negative lyme test does not mean you do not have LYme. Some of the sickest Lymies have negative tests.

Meantime, make sure you do not leave the house w/o snacks -- peanut butter, cheese, etc (on rye is good) and do not overeat at any snack or meal.

Gosh, I hope we can help you last til the neuro!! Please keep us posted!
 
PS: doesn't low blood pressure caust black outs?  anybody?


Bit 1972: Acute and chronic tonsillitis, UTI, miscarraige, appendicitis, hypoglycemia,  chronic neck pain w/ crushed vertibrae, chronic severe back pain, mitral valve prolapse, depression, resolution?
Bit Mother's Day 2007: Lyme, Babesia microti, hypothyroidism, EBV, HHV6, Parvovirus B19, low adrenals &misc other hormones, depression, anxiety, more of the above.
What don't these nasty bugs cause? 
CD57= 60, so we're in pretty good shape.
 

Post Edited (+Lyme) : 9/11/2009 8:19:29 PM (GMT-6)


Tallison
Regular Member


Date Joined Jun 2007
Total Posts : 417
   Posted 9/13/2009 8:15 PM (GMT -6)   

Hi, thanks, great info!  One thing I'm confused about... the sugar from the oj vs a candybar... can you explain that more?

I too get hypoglycemic episodes... my sugar level goes really high after eating and then drops waay low.  I don't really get shakey.  Just real real tired about 1/2 hour after eating.  And if I don't eat I get irritible (more so then the avg person).

Trying to teach myself more about the difference between diabetes and hypoglycemia... confusing because the treatment most doctors use is the same (calling what I have pre-diabetes, or syndrome x).  Using Metformin.

I hope, Lymeymom that this info helps you!  There is a test that is used recently by endos who specialize in sugar issues- it is:

Insulin like growth factor binding protein-1

Supposedly a newer and easier way to test for a sugar issue.
 
Yes, also a good idea for you to get checked for orthostatic hypertension- a neuro will do that.  Do you feel dizzy after standing at all?
 
Ok, I know it's difficult and scary, but hang in there.... you are not alone though it might seem it..

CajunGrl
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2009
Total Posts : 4717
   Posted 9/13/2009 8:27 PM (GMT -6)   
Lyme,

If your blood pressure gets low enough, it can cause you to pass out. Most people are really tired when their BP is low.
**You never know how STRONG you are....until being STRONG is the ONLY choice you have**

Co-Moderator Lyme Disease Forum


Lymeymom
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 33
   Posted 9/13/2009 10:49 PM (GMT -6)   
Thanks so much to everyone for all the input. Even if this is not related to the Lyme, I have to explore all possibilities to ensure another episode like this does not occur again. It was very scary. What if I had been alone or with my child driving down the road!?! I believe I have probably had other similar episodes in the past (before the Lyme), and they all seemed to point to blood sugar problems, but no blood sugar testing after episodes was timely enough to produce results indicative of this type problem. However, no other previous episode involved the total lack of recall. Only one other episode (before the Lyme) demanded the need for immediate sleep thereafter. Also immediately prior to other episodes I felt something 'coming on' and warned friends with me I felt like I was having a major hot flash, dizziness, and/or nausea. Not the case this time....I felt completely fine until I woke up appx 9 hours later with no memory whatsoever of what happened.

CajunGirl: My blood pressure has always been on the low side even during severe stress which I have always found odd. Initial Lyme test on 8/4 showed positive for band Iggp 41, Igmp 41, and Igmp 23. Now ID says his Lyme test is negative - waiting for hard copy of those tests.

Tallison: Sounds like the Insulin like growth factor binding protein-1 test you talked about is much better/easier than a 5 hour glucose test? I will definately ask my GP about this. I will have to look up orthostatic hypertension as I am not familiar with this at all. I have had dizziness that I feel is associated with the Lyme, but there have been times (again before the Lyme) where I felt dizziness after standing up too fast? But certainly not to the extreme of passing out. Another thing that blows my mind is the profuse sweating. I was told more than once by different people who witnessed these 'episodes' that they had never seen anyone sweat like 'this'.

+Lyme: I did not realize Lyme can cause hypoglycemia. Great...maybe my Mom was right about the Lyme 'triggering' this. If other episodes I've had before the Lyme were related to hypoglycemia, I guess the Lyme could definately be a major contributing factor? I have read and heard about all the negative Lyme test results so that will not deter me. Believe me I don't want this to be Lyme, but I feel so sure in my gut that it is. My GP is furious that ID downplayed the Lyme, and I am seeking out an LLMD. Closest one has over 3000 patients and no appt available till January 2010 and my only script of doxy was finished on 9/1/9. I can only pray my symptoms and diminishing sanity don't become completely unbearable until I can get to the LLMD.

GP ordered an MRI 9/9/9 which returned a normal result...now wants neurology to do EEG to look for any seizure type activity as we all know there are many different types of seizures. I am pushing to get that done asap of course. Thyroid, rhematoid, & lupus tests all came back normal, and finally white count down to 8.9 for the first time in 3 months. It has been as high as 18.9.
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