Stay away from Dairy

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JennInPA
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 228
   Posted 10/11/2009 4:57 PM (GMT -6)   
I'm a newbie to healingwell, but I can tell you for a fact that dairy is an absolute 100 % trigger. I suffer mostly from joint and muscle pain, if I have dairy (even something like creamer in coffee) I am almost bedridden. I'm not sure if others have noticed this but it is just killer for me. I read that milk is too acidic and that is what causes the inflammation.

alone&scared
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 177
   Posted 10/11/2009 5:10 PM (GMT -6)   
My sister has fibromyalgia (well, so do I and probably the rest of everyone on this forum too:) Anyway, she has been having female pains. Bad ones. She went to her np the other day and ended up having a 3 hour appointment about what she should and should not be eating. All kinds of things like the obvious fake sugars and artificial everythings, but dairy too. There are just too many additives and hormones/chemicals, etc in food. She is starting that diet. I am starting Atkins in a couple days (when all my junk food is gone!Lol), but am going to try to do it as naturally as possible. Dairy hasn't ever bothered me, but truthfully I don't know because i have never not consumed it:) I'm gonna have to try to cut that out too eventually and see what happens.
I also read somewhere that the human body does not posess the enzymes needed to digest cow's milk or anything made from it (butter, cheese, etc.). Supposedly, it is really freakin bad for you. I laugh everytime I see one of the "it does a body good" commercials or "Got milk?" I just love our government!

JennInPA
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 228
   Posted 10/11/2009 6:30 PM (GMT -6)   
I'm not a big dairy person either, but once you cut it out completely, I was like oh wait, no cheese on my turkey burger. Oh wait, no creamer in my coffee, oh wait, no cheese on my taco. Darnit. LOL. I try to stay away from anything cow related. lol There's some website called MilkSucks and its loaded with good info. I haven't even switched my 17 month old to cow milk, and not sure I will. Rice milk or almond milk is a great alternative.

I can tell you that when I do have dairy (yesterday I had pudding) it changes me completely. I felt ok yesterday, but after the pudding I could barely get myself off the couch and today I was super tired, depressed, and couldn't even put my baby's shoes on him because of the pain and weakness in my hands.

Once you reallllllly take notice of what you've eaten vs how you feel the next day, you start to put 2 and 2 together.

As far as Atkins, if you do it very very strict, please note that you might herx after the 1st few days... headache etc....

Willowrose
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Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 699
   Posted 10/11/2009 9:59 PM (GMT -6)   
This is all very interesting. I've had a life-long ambiguous relationship with dairy products. Recently I underwent allergy testing and discovered that dairy, particularly cow-based dairy, is a problematic food for me. However, goat products were much better. As with so many things in lyme (and life) it's a balancing process. In my experience, it is difficult to absorb calcium from supplements, even when magnesium, vitamin k, and D3 are included. I've read that calcium is more easily absorbed from food sources. Yes, there are vegetarian sources of calcium, but I'm not sure I can eat enough of those to give me an adequate amount of calcium. Being a woman with osteopena (a step removed from full-blown osteoporosis) and someone whose blood levels of calcium usually test low despite taking supplements, I'm concerned about getting enough calcium. Therefore I wouldn't discontinue all dairy completely unless I was sure, as you are for yourself, that it was a trigger for inflammation. Instead, I eat it once every few days (rotation diet), alternating with other calcium rich foods. When I do eat dairy, usually it is organic goat yogurt so that I am also getting the benefit of probiotics, and I'm eating as pure a product as I can find.

I'm much more concerned about ingesting sugar, artificial additives, hormone and antibiotic-ridden foods, hydrogenated oils, and other foods and additives that are universally proven bad for us. Are you sure it wasn't the sugar (or artificial sweetener) in the pudding that caused the problem? Just my opinion, but I wouldn't like to see everyone boycot dairy. (And no I'm not a dairy farmer.) If there is a suspicion that dairy is the culprit for you, you could try the elimination diet. That is a good way to find out what foods bother you.

I like the idea of using almond milk. I haven't checked the carb count on that, but since I'm on antibiotics and taking probiotics to fend off yeast, I buy the unsweetened almond milk. It's pretty good.

Have you done the Atkins diet in the past? Do you use ketostix to check for ketosis?

Thanks for an interesting post. It got me thinking.

Rose


I have Lyme; it doesn't have me.


JennInPA
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 228
   Posted 10/12/2009 5:20 AM (GMT -6)   
I've actually talked to a Macrobiotic Chef. She is who suggested that Dairy is a no no for all Lymies. There's a long list of course... sugar, soda (or anything carbonated) it goes on... I took some classes. Macrobiotics is very interesting, and is extremely strict, but has been known to cure people from lots of diseases. (including cancer) I agree with you on the sugar, artificial additives etc... however I've eaten as little as a few bites of cheese with the same effects.

Miso Soup is VERY healing, ( and almost no carbs) it is suggested that Lymies eat it daily. I have to admit when I do eat it, I definitely see improvement. I just get bored with it.
* Miso is high in the minerals iron, copper and manganese, it is naturally high in protein, vitamin K, and vitamin B12.
* Miso is rich in the immune boosting mineral zinc, is great for the digestive tract because miso is high in fiber and probiotics.

I haven't done Atkins but I've done a yeast cleanse that is no carbs. It worked wonders but I think because I had Lyme and didn't know it, that when I stopped the cleanse (it was 2 months long) my cravings and such came back. It's a great regimen though if you are interested and the author replies to your questions with in 24 hours usually. He is amazing. His name is Kelley Eidem. The hub it's listed on is http://hubpages.com/hub/How-to-Flatten-Your-Tummy-and-End-Food-Cravings-EFFORTLESSLY

oh and I do alkaline strip testing.

JennInPA
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 228
   Posted 10/12/2009 5:24 AM (GMT -6)   
and I found this.... Some of the best calcium rich foods for vegans are green leafy vegetables – including spinach and kale; but when it comes to calcium content, turnip greens reign supreme at 276 mg. of calcium per serving. In contrast, an eight ounce glass of milk has 300 mg. of calcium. Other vegetables high in calcium include okra, bok choy, and broccoli.

I try to incorporate veggies wherever I can. USually I chop up some kale and put it in ground turkey and make burgers. You can also puree veggies and add it to almost anything. I do that with carrots and throw it in my chili. My toddler doesn't know the difference. :)

Willowrose
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 699
   Posted 10/12/2009 8:21 AM (GMT -6)   
Jenn - It sounds like you have a healthy diet. I know about dark leafy greens and eat them and other veggies regularly. I was on the pH Miracle diet (mostly vegetables) for several years and also do alkaline strip testing. Do your tests come out well? Are you on an alkaline diet? I haven't tried it but I think it would be pretty difficult to get enough nutrition combining the Atkins and pH diets (though they both recommend limiting grains and fruits). Also, after reading a book about Lyme (which confirmed information from another source) I've eliminted potential inflammation-causing foods from my diet, further narrowing the choices for nutrition. As far as calcium goes, I'm less concerned with how much calcium is in someting than I am with how much I am able to absorb from it. This seems to be a problem for me, though recently I started taking enzymes with my meals and maybe that will help.

I don't eat Miso - would have to research to see if it is something I would eat. When I was on the IC boards (pre Lyme diagnosis) I learned that Miso can be a bladder irritant so I haven't eaten it for years. I do however eat pumpkin seeds which are also a good source of zinc.

I'd be interested to learn more about the yeast cleanse. I've done the yeast (connection) diet several times when fighting an outbreak, but I don't know about the cleanse. The yeast diet I've done recommends eating a little yogurt each day, but I've read in other sources that dairy should be avoided completely. It's difficult to weed through the various recommendations. In my experience, if you look around enough you can find an expert of one kind or another who will recommend pretty much anything. Some say it's all about cutting carbs and eating a high protein diet (Atkins, South Beach, adrenal fatigue guide, and several Lyme sources). Some say we eat way too much protein and it's all about eating raw, fresh veggies (pH Miracle, vegetarians). Some say eat lots of fruit, but others say the sugar in fruit is always bad and only low-sugar fruits should be eaten (pH Miracle, candida guidelines). Our government "experts" have the food pyramid that includes dairy, grains, and fruit as part of a healthy diet. I've read that the Japanese diet is good with its high rice, fish, and vegetable content. But I've also read that limitiing fish intake is advised because of contaminants and that white rice isn't desirable. I've read both that fermented and aged foods are healthy choices, and in other sources that they are not. I've read that yeast is great for you (and some people take it as a supplement), but I've also read that it should never be eaten. The list goes on and on. In the end, I believe it's best to do what you are doing and listen to your body and follow your best judgment as to which expert has the right answer for you.

Rose

Rose
I have Lyme; it doesn't have me.


JennInPA
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 228
   Posted 10/12/2009 5:38 PM (GMT -6)   
My tests are not good! my PH level is at 5.5 constantly which means I'm sick. DUH. :) And you are so right there are so many theories out there. I guess we just have to keep trying them until we find out what works best for our bodies. I never heard of the pH Miracle Diet but I'm going to look into that. I forgot about pumpkin seeds! I'm definitely going to save mine when we carve our pumpkin!

Willowrose
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 699
   Posted 10/12/2009 6:11 PM (GMT -6)   
Jenn,

Unless I stick to the pH diet absolutely mine is 5.5 to 6 also. I've been told that that is because of toxins making my urine (and presumably the rest of me) acidic. Before I knew I had Lyme I couldn't figure out why I would be so riddled with toxins because I have always been very careful with my diet and environment, and I did a lot of cleansing things. My husband, who eats whatever he wants, also tested his urine and his pH was perfect. That let me know that it was me, not just the food that was causing the acidity.

When I developed interstitial cystitis in 2007 I went on the pH diet in an attempt to diminish the acidity of my urine and thus ease the bladder pain. The book is interesting; the author contends that harmful microorganisms (and cancer) can't live in an alkaline environment and therefore keeping the body at a targeted alkallinity will help eradicate them. He and his wife developed a couple of cook books to go with their dietary recommendations. The way you have to eat to follow that diet is not similar to what most people in this country eat. If you are a vegetarian it will be easier to follow. I had two problems when i was on the diet. First, I could not maintain enough weight (great if you want to lose weight), though that was partially due to the fact that I could not eat some of the foods because they were contraindicated by the IC diet that I also had to follow. Second, I developed yeast overgrowth while on the diet. Theoretically that should not have happened since yeast is a harmful microorganism (I think). Another concern is that the diet includes a few foods that some Lyme books say can cause inflammation. However, if you eliminate them the diet is still viable so that's not a big problem.

In the interest of trying different things to see if they work, it could be a useful experiment. I haven't read the book for awhile, but another thing I wonder is how well good bacteria and microorganisms live in an akline environment. I'm sure he talks about that.

Rose
I have Lyme; it doesn't have me.


alone&scared
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 177
   Posted 10/12/2009 7:27 PM (GMT -6)   
Oh my! This all sounds too confusing for me. Even more I am going to try to figure out once I start treatment. I think it just figures that now that my brain doesn't work well anymore I am supposed to be able to figure all of this stuff out:(

Willowrose
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 699
   Posted 10/12/2009 11:35 PM (GMT -6)   
Alone&scared,

What works for me is to pick something to try and to write down all of the other interesting things I may want to try in the future. If I tried to keep track of it all at once, or worse, if I tried to do it all at once, I think it would be too confusing and it wouldn't be good for me. I'm doing this thing one step at a time, but I'm also finding out everything I can about it so that I have an informed approach to options in the future.

Rose
I have Lyme; it doesn't have me.

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