My 1st week on BWF A-L complex. Extreme Herx reaction! Any guidance?

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TTB
New Member


Date Joined Feb 2011
Total Posts : 10
   Posted 2/21/2011 8:13 PM (GMT -6)   
Here is my 1st week on the Byron White Formula:  A-L Complex. 
 
Started on Tues:  2 drops in AM & 2 drops in PM.  Both taking with water, held in mouth and swallowed.
Wed:   3 drops in AM & 3 drops in PM.  AM dose was taken with water, held in mouth and swallowed.  PM dose was taken by putting drops in a empty capsule and swallowed with water.
Thurs:  4 drops in AM & 4 drops in PM.  AM dose was taken by putting drops in a empty capsule and swallowed with water.   PM dose was taken with water, held in mouth and swallowed.
Friday:   4 drops in AM & 4 drops in PM.  Both taken with water, held in mouth and swallowed.
Sat:  5 drops in AM & 6 drops in PM.  Both taken with water, held in mouth and swallowed.
Sunday:   6 drops in AM.  0 Drops in PM due to Herx.   Taken with water, held in mouth and swallowed.
Sunday- Herx Reaction:  I started to Herx really bad.  Started feeling strange in morning and progressively got worse as the day went on.
Symptoms:  Very tired, high fever- as high as 103.3, muscle soreness/twitching, extreme headache(pressure in head), shivers/shakes.
Monday:  Same symptons as Sunday.  Took a few Advil, broke the fever a bit but then it would jump back up. 
As of now, I am still not feeling well.  I hope this clears in the next day or so.
 
So to my questions: 
Anyone have a similiar reaction?  
How should I proceed with the A-L?  Right now I am not taking it because I still feel awful.
Should I go back and start with 1 drop and take that for a few days.  Then go up from there. 
And when should I start taking it again?  Once the reaction is gone?
The info in BWF's literature does not really state how exactly to take this or how to continue once a Herx reaction has starte. 
Thank you!
Tom

bucci
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2006
Total Posts : 1489
   Posted 2/21/2011 11:10 PM (GMT -6)   
Wow...TTB.. last time I had 103 was from pic line infection and the walls were closing in on me. Holy Cow.

This is high fever for an adult.

I read that at the Klinghardt conference in NY this month that BWF got good reviews.

which one is A-L ? what is ingredients.

who is your doctor? is anyone prescribing this dosage?

are you very nauseous? alkasltzer is good for herx too .

It seems like a lot to take on first round.

I did japaneese knotweed and teasel root once and it knock me out bad.

It is hard to believe that we could actually feel sicker than we feel already and then we take these meeds and really go over the top.

all I can say is, I watched my Mom go thru this with leukemia chemo. she died and came back to life and those treatments take everything out of us.

Just remember.."the body wants to heal".

definitely I would ease up on the dosage but you gotta talk to your doctor.

i was just thinking today to take the BW formula for bartonella. I really have nothing to loose anymore
and have only to gain.

keep us posted and hopefully someone will come on post who has taken this.

keep cool rag on your head. A fever that high can take you into an altered state.

If it doesn't come down I think go hospital just to get IV fluids or what ever support. !!!!!!

Sound like you really nailed it though. Something got rattled.

Fever is a sign the body is fighting infection???? I think??? keep fighting. You gotta be madder than it.
keep seeing yourself as winning.

You get a punch and then you punch right back!

Everyone has a hard time with this lyme thing because it knocks out the Spriit. 103.3 !!! Your Spirit is coming alive.

Remember this is a poison that has infected every part of your body. You have to be like a Bengal Tiger!!!

keep us posted Tom and if you get chance. (if you can even see the screen) google betterhealthguy.com
there is a few things that BWF is working very well.
20 yrs of doctors . DEC. 2009 tested positive for lyme, bartonella, ehrichiosis, HHPV6, chlamadyal pneumonia .
parasites :strongylides, diaoebia fragialis, hook worm.

Hep C ....fibro, rhumatoidal,depression,

CajunGrl
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2009
Total Posts : 4717
   Posted 2/22/2011 1:36 AM (GMT -6)   
I'm sure it is from the bacteria being killed off but I am not a doctor so I cannot say for sure. I used to run fever on treatment so this is just from my experience. Is there anyway you can contact someone there to ask them if this is normal? Also, when you feel up to it, try to do a detox bath. It will help pull some toxins out.
Co-Moderator- Lyme Disease Forum

Lyme Disease, Fibromyalgia, Hashimoto's Thyroiditis, Rheumatoid Arthritis
Prescription Meds:Sulfasalazine(RA), Medrol pack(Steroids), Cymbalta(Fibro),
Oxycodone(BT Pain), Tramadol

Supplements:Folic Acid, Probiotics, Vitamin D, Multi Vitamin

TTB
New Member


Date Joined Feb 2011
Total Posts : 10
   Posted 2/22/2011 7:03 PM (GMT -6)   
Still feeling bad.... my fever finally broke this afternoon.
But my head still hurts alot... feels like alot of pressure. Especially when I move quickly.
Going to the doctors tomorrow.
I will post more when I am feeling a bit better.
Thanks!

Traveler
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2007
Total Posts : 13784
   Posted 2/23/2011 12:07 PM (GMT -6)   
Herxing is a natural response to any meds that kill off a great deal of bacteria at a time. There is a ton of info on herxing on the internet, but you can read up on how to handle these 'healing crisis' in the "New to Lyme?..." thread. A bit of dry skin brushing & some detox baths will help you feel much better!!!

The other thing is that you should back down on your dosage just a bit whenever using natural products & you begin to herx. It just means that you have reached the amount of product that your body can tolerate & easily remove the toxins on it's own.

Of course, I'm not a doctor - so you should at least call your doc to get advice. I can only comment on what I have experienced & have learned through my own reading - but I do hope it helps!! That's how I get through those times.
Co-Moderator, Lyme Disease ;)

Treating with Acupuncture, Traditional & Modern Chinese Medicine & Western Herbs.

"Absence of proof is not proof of absence" - Dr. Edwin Masters, great LLMD & researcher -RIP

I break up my post because my eyes have been effected by TBI's as well, which makes long paragraphs very hard to read.

TTB
New Member


Date Joined Feb 2011
Total Posts : 10
   Posted 3/1/2011 2:43 PM (GMT -6)   
I will try to update as best I can.
 
I went back to the doctor and they did some energentics testing and found that the A-BAB was a better fit for me.  So they put me on A-BAB and told me to stay off the A-L for a bit.
 
I also went for Vit. C and other suppl. IV drips.  I did 2 of these. 
 
I started taking A-BAB, 1 drop twice a day.  This was started on Wed (2/23).
Today I will be taking 3 drops twice a day.
I also started taking 1 drop once a day of the A-L again.  This started on Monday 2/28. 
 
I am still having the following symptoms:
- Headace
- foggy brain
- tired
- sore throat
- night sweats
 
I have been taking detox baths every day... I may have missed 2 days in the past 2 weeks.
I plan to start foot baths soon.
 
I feel alot better than I did when I had the Herx reaction.
However, I am not feeling like I was before I started the herbs.  Overall I feel worse (see symptoms above).
Well I hope this passes soon and things start to get better!
 
 
 

Traveler
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2007
Total Posts : 13784
   Posted 3/2/2011 12:56 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi TTB!
I'm glad to hear that you are feeling a bit better!! Hang in there & keep on detoxing, hopefully you will be feeling a lot better soon!!

Please be sure to keep us all updated as you feel up to it. I hope things get easier soon for you.
Trav
Co-Moderator, Lyme Disease ;)

Treating with Acupuncture, Traditional & Modern Chinese Medicine & Western Herbs.

"Absence of proof is not proof of absence" - Dr. Edwin Masters, great LLMD & researcher -RIP

I break up my post because my eyes have been effected by TBI's as well, which makes long paragraphs very hard to read.

Sonya Fights Lyme
New Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 9
   Posted 4/21/2011 4:10 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi TTB!

I would like to know how you are doing with the Byron White herbs. I have a PiCC line & I would love to move to herbal. I am on Teasel in addition to my IV rocephin & oral Biaxin.

I am interested in taking A Bart to treat what I believe is Bartonella symptoms. My doc won't treat me unless I test positive. He takes insurance & isn't very risky.

Thanks!

Sonya
Sonya
http://LymeStore.blogspot.com

TTB
New Member


Date Joined Feb 2011
Total Posts : 10
   Posted 5/17/2011 4:26 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi Sonya,
Sorry for the late response, I have been travelling, etc.

Currently I am doing a lot better.

The 1st week of March they told me to stop both the A-BAB and A-L. I have not taken it since.
I did do a few more Vitamin C IVs in March.
I also went on a pretty restrictive diet: No Gluten, Diary, Coffee, Alcohol, sugar.

The doctor wanted me to build up my immune system before putting me back on the herbs.
But I have recovered quite well and right now we don't plan on getting back on them anytime soon.

I feel like I am back to normal, just alot thinner than when I started. Due to diet and exercise.

Good luck with your treatments and keep a positive outlook!
Take care!
TTB

Sonya Fights Lyme
New Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 9
   Posted 5/17/2011 5:34 PM (GMT -6)   
Thank you for the reply! Nice to see you are traveling. I am taking the A-Bart. Too soon to tell. I am doing 2 drops twice a day in a little water holding it under my tongue (well in my mouth) for 1 minute.

I also have the A-L Complex & started with that, but my main issue is Bart for now.
Sonya
http://LymeStore.blogspot.com

TTB
New Member


Date Joined Feb 2011
Total Posts : 10
   Posted 5/17/2011 5:46 PM (GMT -6)   
Best advice I can give you is take it slow!!

I think I may have increased the dosage too quickly. I started to feel "off" and I continued to take the higher dosage for 2 applications too many. Then it all hit me at once. Listen to your body and if you start to feel worse, back off a bit.

If I ever go back on them, I will take it very slow with increasing the dosage.

Best wishes!

TrailWalker
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2011
Total Posts : 28
   Posted 5/18/2011 7:12 AM (GMT -6)   
I am taking the A-bart 3 days a week and A-L once a week. I did notice that that the A-L has arteismea (sp. AKA that Bab herb).

According to Schaller (in his book) taking small doses of this herb to see if you herx very badly is a good way to see if you have Babs. He said only malaria and Babs react to this herb.

I believe he recommends the Zhang formulation.

Just a though.
Bartonella Diagnosed 12/10
Rifampicin 300mg BID Doxy 100mgBID 10 weeks

Off meds 6 weeks then relapse :(

Levaquin 500 mg 04/11

Watch a free documentary I directed about a healing gathering

lymelite
New Member


Date Joined Mar 2010
Total Posts : 3
   Posted 10/27/2011 12:22 PM (GMT -6)   
I have been on the bw a-l for about 5 weeks now and do my drops 3 times a day. I started having strong herxing at around 8 drops per day and had to back off. After 5 weeks I am just now getting up to 14-15 drops 2-3 times a day and am once again having strong herxing. All along I have been having lots of joint aches and trouble sleeping, but when the herxing get really bad I get the constant headaches, severe exhaustion, and increased joint pain in my hips and shoulders mainly.

The BEST relief I can find for herxing is detox baths. I fill the bath tub with 98.6 degree water (too warm with cause more pain), then use a nature boar bristle brush (I bought mine at Sally's beauty supply), to brush your entire body from head to toe always working toward the heart, make sure you do the bottom of your feet since they have the more pores. Add about 3-4 cups of Epsom salt to the tub and a 32 ounce bottle of hydrogen peroxide to the tub (I buy my supplies at Costco). Find a book, put on the tv or just chill in the tub for at least 30 minutes. I often go for an hour when I am feeling bad. I feel almost immediate relief and have been doing this for over a year. Best sure to shower afterwards and drink plenty of water. I hope this brings you relief. for more information google Lyme detoxing.

Traveler
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2007
Total Posts : 13784
   Posted 10/27/2011 2:58 PM (GMT -6)   
HI Lymelite,
Welcome to our forum! How long do you believe you have been infected? All of that info is also available in our "New to Lyme?...Start here!" thread.If you haven't read through it yet, may I suggest that you do? It's full of great info and very informational links!

We always encourage our members to detox regularly! Do you know about drinking either lemon or lime water as well? It helps to keep your body in a more alkaline state rather than an acidic state that bacteria prefer.

Also, you might find this article interesting as it really gives support to the need for detoxing - findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0ISW/is_285/ai_n19170382/?tag=content;col1

We look forward to getting to know you better through your posts!!! smilewinkgrin
Co-Moderator, Lyme Disease ;)

Treating with Acupuncture, Traditional & Modern Chinese Medicine & Western Herbs. Before tx, I had all but 20 of the symptoms on the "Master Symptom List"

"Absence of proof is not proof of absence" - Dr. Edwin Masters, great LLMD & researcher -RIP

I break up my post because my eyes have been effected by TBI's as well, making long paragraphs very hard to read.

lymelite
New Member


Date Joined Mar 2010
Total Posts : 3
   Posted 10/27/2011 3:44 PM (GMT -6)   
I have been to the site before when I was first diagnosed 19 months ago. That is where I read about the detox.

I will try the lemon water. I also had almost all the symptoms on the master list and believe i was infected sometime between 2004-2006.

I have a LLMD and have tried RIFE light treatment for the first year. Had a great summer this year and thought I was on the mend but have had a relapse the last couple of months.

I was sick and then very sick for several years and saw 6+ doctors and was never tested for Lyme even though i live in the northeast.


Finally I was diagnosed by a friend who was a nurse and familiar with Lyme.

Thank you for your email response.

Lymelite

Traveler
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2007
Total Posts : 13784
   Posted 10/27/2011 4:51 PM (GMT -6)   
I'm so glad to hear that you had a great summer!! So did I!! First time in 12 years that I had a summer like that! I'm really looking forward to what my continued treatment will do for me.

I am so sorry to hear that you have had a relapse!! What do you plan to do? Are you going to go back to using Rife? Or try another route? We don't have many members using Rife, but we do have a few that have used it, and a few more that I believe are getting ready to start using Rife.

Actually, I would love to see a thread for those using Rife to treat their infections - whether using Rife along or in combo with other things! I think for those who are still searching for a treatment that will work for them, and for those that are just curious, it would be great if they had a way to learn more about it.
Co-Moderator, Lyme Disease ;)

Treating with Acupuncture, Traditional & Modern Chinese Medicine & Western Herbs. Before tx, I had all but 20 of the symptoms on the "Master Symptom List"

"Absence of proof is not proof of absence" - Dr. Edwin Masters, great LLMD & researcher -RIP

I break up my post because my eyes have been effected by TBI's as well, making long paragraphs very hard to read.

zolacatz
New Member


Date Joined Nov 2013
Total Posts : 5
   Posted 11/26/2013 5:13 PM (GMT -6)   
I get so upset when I hear people suffering from A-L etc and other herbals, because their doctor didn't dose them correctly. It happened to several people I've met in forums and here in my home town at social support groups. They wouldn't just willynilly give someone some meds without learning how to use them correctly but they think they can with herbs? Luckily my doc knew what she was doing and made sure to give me the support formulas that go WITH the A-L and A-BAB. I take Detox 2, sometimes NT detox when I have neurological flares and A-inflamm which has a lot of turmeric in it that some folks in another section were talking about. I have very little herxing because of it and I had TWO ticks last year.

zolacatz
New Member


Date Joined Nov 2013
Total Posts : 5
   Posted 11/26/2013 5:16 PM (GMT -6)   
Oh forgot to say that I didn't leave it entirely up to my doc tho (trust issues) and went to the company's website and blog and researched myself! The blog is where all the info is really.

Shelly71
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts : 370
   Posted 3/30/2014 4:53 PM (GMT -6)   
hi.  I just started the BW A L complex last wednesday.  started with 1 drop 2xday for 4 days
 then started 2 dropps 2xday today.  i do believe i can feel it kicking in.  was very very tired day 1 & 2.  added nattokinase on day 3, and was not as tired, actually had energy (was it from natto?  who knows?)  now day 4 i started with scratchy throat & mild nasal congestion that comes & goes.  (is it a cold or a herx? again, who knows?)  today cold symptoms are a bit worse, and i have a bit of a headache, and neck stiffness on left side. 
 
my doctor didnt give me the detox items you mention above, but did give me parsley, burbur & pinella by nutramedix.  havent tried them as of yet.  any experience with them? 
 
thanks!!! 

opugirl
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts : 3096
   Posted 3/30/2014 8:08 PM (GMT -6)   
Parsley is a really good detoxer.....

How are you Ms. Shelly!

It could also be allergies, mine are starting to come around and pollen is supposed to be really bad this year with the rough winter.

Let us know how it goes!
Forum Moderator

July 2007 - Deer tick bite w/ physician confirmed EM Rash - given 10 days of Doxy
October 2012 - My world gets rocked January 2013 - My world turns upside down
March 2013 - Igenex +, start treatment with LLMD, LLND, and herbalist
August 2013- Finished all abx, continuing with herbs and homeopathy, Feeling good!
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