Is Bartonella The Only Thing That Causes The Red "Scratch Mark" Lines ?

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Tommy08
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 73
   Posted 5/21/2016 3:20 PM (GMT -6)   
I have them - the red lines that look like little comets, or actual scratch marks .. They are not the "stretch mark" type patterns, but more like red arches and streaks ..

The marks coincide with upheavals in symptoms, and have come out during treatment with herbs, and when taking doxy and also rifampin ... The red marks seem much more likely to appear when my blood gets circulating - for example, I had not had any marks for weeks and weeks, and on Thursday, I went for a vigorous 2 mile walk ( first time since last summer ) .. within 24 hours, I had them on my arms and across my chest ..

I have asked this question to 3 different LLMDs that I have seen : one said the red lines are as specific to bartonella as a bull's eye is to lyme ... Another said NO, the red lines are NOT unique to bartonella ... and the other said that it is probably a sign of some sort of vasculitis, so any organism that lives in the blood vessels could trigger the marks ..

Maybe it is pointless to ask ??

Because if I am getting them, it is a sign that whatever I am doing being effective, right ??

In the past, I have stopped because the symptoms got really bad, and the docs would always say OK STOP EVERYTHING ...

But does anyone have any theories on the red lines, or has your doc given any clues to what, other than bartonella, could cause them ??

Thanks !!!

Post Edited (Tommy08) : 5/21/2016 3:27:46 PM (GMT-6)


PeteZa
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Date Joined Jul 2015
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   Posted 5/21/2016 3:44 PM (GMT -6)   
I got what I thought was bartonella scratch makes on my chest once and I thought maybe I had scratched myself. So I intentionally scratched myself to see if it looked the same. It did not.

So.... I concluded it was a bart scratch mark. Am I sure? Nope.

I never saw it again and will always wonder.
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Tommy08
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 73
   Posted 5/21/2016 5:01 PM (GMT -6)   
PeteZa said...
I got what I thought was bartonella scratch makes on my chest once and I thought maybe I had scratched myself. So I intentionally scratched myself to see if it looked the same. It did not.

So.... I concluded it was a bart scratch mark. Am I sure? Nope.

I never saw it again and will always wonder.


PeteZa, was that prior to your diagnosis, or after you began treatment ?

Do you recall an upheaval in symptoms ?

PeteZa
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   Posted 5/21/2016 5:35 PM (GMT -6)   
It was in the middle of treatment and I only saw the scratch mark that once. I did not have a upheaval in symptoms.

That was what prompted me to scratch myself to see if I could copy the mark.
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Mister Mike
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Date Joined May 2016
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   Posted 5/21/2016 5:35 PM (GMT -6)   
How long do they last?

Tommy08
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 73
   Posted 5/21/2016 5:55 PM (GMT -6)   
The lines that come during an obvious herx-type reaction usually last less than 24 hours

This sounds crazy, but if I cannot say it here, I can't say it anywhere as I know the people here are very open minded and have experienced strange things - but I have sat in an IR sauna and over a period of 30 minutes, seen the lines appear

Tommy08
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 73
   Posted 5/21/2016 5:57 PM (GMT -6)   
I will try to upload some photos .. I have a CD w/ pics that I took to show my doctor

PeteZa
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Date Joined Jul 2015
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   Posted 5/21/2016 5:59 PM (GMT -6)   
I have no idea how long mine was there. I was getting into the shower and saw it. I took a cool shower and about an hour and a half later it was gone.
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Tommy08
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 73
   Posted 5/21/2016 6:13 PM (GMT -6)   
The lines are hard to photograph = they look more dramatic and larger in person .. But here are a few

Between the shoulder blades

VIEW IMAGE

Tommy08
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 73
   Posted 5/21/2016 6:18 PM (GMT -6)   
And a few on the inside of my arm

VIEW IMAGE

VIEW IMAGE

Mister Mike
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Date Joined May 2016
Total Posts : 192
   Posted 5/21/2016 6:44 PM (GMT -6)   
They don't get puffy, itchy and then disappear in 15 minutes do they? What you posted certainly look like Bart scratches to me. Do you have "Bart symptoms" as well? If so, my gut is that they are increasing due to treatment.

Tommy08
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 73
   Posted 5/21/2016 6:52 PM (GMT -6)   
Mister Mike said...
They don't get puffy, itchy and then disappear in 15 minutes do they? What you posted certainly look like Bart scratches to me. Do you have "Bart symptoms" as well? If so, my gut is that they are increasing due to treatment.


No, they never itch or get puffy - in fact, other than the overall herx type feeling I usually have when I get them, I would never know they are they unless I see them ... Finding them and first seeing them is always a "surprise" ..

Yes, everything I feel with symptoms points to bartonella : burning pain, awful shin pain, foot pain, feeling very antisocial and irritable ( this probably stems from frustration too as I miss enjoying my friends ) ..

I have no joint pain .. It feels more like inflamed blood vessels and lack of blood flow, esp in the leg and foot ... Pretty much everything is on the right side, including the lumps in that area in front of my ear and a few down the neck

Tommy08
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 73
   Posted 5/21/2016 6:55 PM (GMT -6)   
.. and thanks for your reply Mister Mike .. this entire thing is very humbling and at times downright scary

Mister Mike
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2016
Total Posts : 192
   Posted 5/21/2016 7:31 PM (GMT -6)   
Those lumps certainly sound like inflamed lymph nodes and Bart especially loves lymph nodes. And inflamed blood vessels too - as Bart is a disease of blood vessels. Totally makes sense. Have you tried detoxing more than usual to see if they will go away?

Tommy08
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 73
   Posted 5/21/2016 8:17 PM (GMT -6)   
Mister Mike said...
Those lumps certainly sound like inflamed lymph nodes and Bart especially loves lymph nodes. And inflamed blood vessels too - as Bart is a disease of blood vessels. Totally makes sense. Have you tried detoxing more than usual to see if they will go away?


Just recently I bought a mini trampoline, so that has inspired me to do more in the way of detoxing .. I also bought a brush for dry brushing, which I now do before the mini trampoline

Things have changed since I began that, plus receiving acupuncture two times per week

I went into this thinking that I could simply take double or triple the recommended doses of things and get rid of it faster .... big mistake

I am very glad to have found this forum

NotQuiteAntonio
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Date Joined Jan 2015
Total Posts : 1054
   Posted 5/21/2016 10:11 PM (GMT -6)   
I have a ton of stretch marks all over, but I just thought it was because I used to be insanely fat when I was a kid. They're the white, skin-colored kind though, not red. I'd take pictures, but they blend in so well, I'm not sure how good they'd come out.

I suspect I have Bart though.
scrape myself off the pavement ten thousand times over

ToddPaul
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Date Joined Nov 2012
Total Posts : 884
   Posted 5/22/2016 8:29 AM (GMT -6)   
Those scratches look a lot like the ones I get. For some reason they only occur on my back so I'll miss most of them. My other rashes and tiny itchy bumps occur pretty much anywhere. I also don't have joint pain but do get the burning/tingling mostly in my legs and feet.

needhelp4
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2014
Total Posts : 648
   Posted 5/22/2016 9:53 AM (GMT -6)   
Tommy- if you live near someone who has a H.C. syncrometer, they'd be able to test you on the spot and confirm it or not.
ToddPaul- the rashes and tiny. itchy red bumps you mention could be ringworm - daughter has the exact same thing, then Bartonella reared its ugly head.
Syncrometer confirmed both for her.

PeteZa
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Date Joined Jul 2015
Total Posts : 8946
   Posted 5/22/2016 9:56 AM (GMT -6)   
Tommy you could slowly add more detox methods into your day. Here are some ideas on why and how.

www.tiredoflyme.com/detox-methods.html
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