41 KD: IGG Reactive BUT.... IGM *NON Reactive*???

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NJRider
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2017
Total Posts : 3
   Posted 6/19/2017 7:02 AM (GMT -6)   
Thanks everyone in advance....

Per the results below, I've come back both reactive and non-reactive to #41....I have scanned a few different sources on-line, sufficient to be confused. However, given that my doc didn't even bother to comment on this, I am not that thrilled.

So, two requests:
Q1) any color on the below?
a) ground for concern
b) inconclusive... chill and re-test in a month or
c) ignore....'tis nothing

Q2) Source for LLMDs in NYC area?

Again.... thank you.

Component Your Value Standard Range
LYME IGG WESTERN BLOT INTERP Negative Negative
LYME 18 KD IGG Nonreactive
LYME 23 KD IGG Nonreactive
LYME 28 KD IGG Nonreactive
LYME 30 KD IGG Nonreactive
LYME 39 KD IGG Nonreactive
LYME 41 KD IGG Reactive
LYME 45 KD IGG Nonreactive
LYME 58 KD IGG Nonreactive
LYME 66 KD IGG Nonreactive
LYME 93 KD IGG Nonreactive
LYME ANTIBODY IGM, WESTERN BLOT Negative Negative
LYME 23 KD IGM Nonreactive
LYME 39 KD IGM Nonreactive
LYME 41 KD IGM Nonreactive

As per CDC criteria, a Lyme disease IgG immunoblot must
show reactivity to at least 5 of 10 specific borrelial
proteins to be considered positive; similarly, a positive
Lyme disease IgM immunoblot requires reactivity to 2 of 3
specific borrelial proteins. Although considered
negative, IgG reactivity to fewer specific borrelial
proteins or IgM reactivity to only 1 protein may indicate
recent B. burgdorferi infection and warrant testing of a
later sample. A positive IgM but negative IgG result
obtained more than a month after onset of symptoms likely
represents a false-positive IgM result rather than acute
Lyme disease. In rare instances, Lyme disease immunoblot
reactivity may represent antibodies induced by exposure to
other spirochetes.
Test Performed at:
Quest Diagnostics

Traveler
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2007
Total Posts : 35853
   Posted 6/19/2017 7:17 AM (GMT -6)   
Hi NJRider,
Welcome to our community! I'm so glad you found us.

The testing does not show that you have the infection - but, the testing is not very good. The fact that you reacted to band 41 is significant, as it has indicated that your immune system is producing antibodies for some type of spirochete (band 41 indicates the tail of the bacteria, but there are several types of spirochete infection - Pintas, Yaws, Syphilis, Lyme).

None of the testing is all that accurate because the testing requires the immune system to be functioning properly - but if you have Lyme disease, even in the early stages, the Lyme bacteria lower the immune function - so the testing misses many, many patients that actually do have the disease. I didn't test positive until after I have a full year of treatments - then I was "suddenly" positive for not only Lyme, but Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever. But my immune system was still too low for me to test positive for other infections I had - Bartonella, Babesia, Anaplasmosis and others.

Next you go to your symptoms. Here is a questionnaire that you can fill out to help you determine if you have the 'right' symptoms to be concerned about having Lyme: www.tiredoflyme.com/horowitz-lyme-msids-questionnaire.html

​If ​you haven't ​yet​, it would be helpful for you to start with reading through the thread at the top of the forum titled,"New to Lyme?...Start here!!", as​​ it is packed ​​full of ​​important information​​, symptom lists, helpful links and pdf's, how to detox when one has these infections, information on probiotics and much more.​​ ​​​​And, here's another good place to find helpful detoxing rout​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​​ines​​:​​​​​​ ​​​http://www.tiredoflyme.com/detox-methods.html​

If you aren't seeing an ILADS trained LLMD, I would also suggest that you only go to one of them. They are not miracle workers, but they are the best we have. If you need help in finding one, please do let us know, as we can likely be of help.
Herb only treatment for Lyme & Bart ended 12/11 - no active symptoms for 2 yrs -Herb only treatment for Babesia ended 12/12
www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=2977364
Had Lyme, Bart, Babs, RMSF, Ehrlichia, Myco, Anaplasmosis, EBV
New set of infections 8/2014 - still treating.
Come visit me: dogwoodtraditionals.freeforums.net/

NJRider
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2017
Total Posts : 3
   Posted 6/19/2017 8:17 AM (GMT -6)   
I tested negative for Syphilis....

And I do have some odd joint pains that cannot be explained (cortisone shots help for a few months)...

I've given my current MD a poke and will see if they offer to re-test or engage, else I will look for an LLMD in NYC.

Happy to try some herbals, fwiw,...

Thanks for your post

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 26320
   Posted 6/19/2017 10:16 AM (GMT -6)   
Not only is lyme testing not very good - as Traveler mentioned...but Quest in particular is really not very good.


If you do want to retest - I suggest Igenex. Just do the Lyme WB Igm and Igg for total of $210.

You may get some positive lyme specific bands.

Oh - you're a new member here! Sorry I missed that.

Welcome! Traveler has given you great information...
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 26320
   Posted 6/19/2017 10:18 AM (GMT -6)   
There are LLMD's in the NYC area...

you can post a new thread: "Looking for LLMD's in NYC" and then enable your email so members can send you recommendations privately.

In addition to recommendations - you can also contact me - via email...and I will send you names from my list of LLMD's. (no personal recommendations though)

And you can contact ILADS:

ilads.org/ilads_media/physician-referral/

Lyme should always be a clinical diagnosis...with testing to be used as a backup to the diagnosis.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

NJRider
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2017
Total Posts : 3
   Posted 7/6/2017 1:45 PM (GMT -6)   
Ok.... just to update my own thread... more for posterity.

I saw LLMD (Infectious Disease specialist)... old school doctor and has been doing this in the NYC area for 40+ years. FWIW, I liked him....
- Dr agree the Quest is weak
- Dr also noted when I brought up Igenex that they have a bad wrap as a lab & have had some serious problems.
- Dr likes Stony Brook as he has worked with them extensively over the years

My results from Stony Brook came back identical to Quest... reactive for 41KD IGG but negative everywhere else.

Overall, Dr considers this to be very good news and though he views the results as technically "inconclusive" that having 2 such results, especially one from Stony Brook, means I probably don't have Lyme. So, per the comments above, the testing is just a back up to the clinical and though I have unexplained joint pain (that responds to Cortisone), it is unlikely that Lyme is the underlying culprit.

FWIW......

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 26320
   Posted 7/6/2017 2:34 PM (GMT -6)   
I've not heard anything about igenex having a 'bad rap' as a lab.
It is still one of the best testing facilities for tick-borne diseases.

My question - is what prompted you to test? Is joint pain the only symptom you've had?

Lyme disease should always be diagnosed clinically...and testing provides back-up.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

Traveler
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2007
Total Posts : 35853
   Posted 7/6/2017 2:47 PM (GMT -6)   
My question would be if you don't have Lyme, have they ruled out the other infections that could produce a positive on band 41 then?

​ ​​​​​​​​Bands 18 & 41 (whether in IgM or IgG) are indicative of the tail of the bacteria, which can cross react with other Spirochetal bacteria such as Relapsing Fever, Pintas and Yaws, and Syphilis.

Many of us have only band 41 show up on our tests, then we get treatment for Lyme and most often the tests will become full positive at some point in treatment.
Herb only treatment for Lyme & Bart ended 12/11 - no active symptoms for 2 yrs -Herb only treatment for Babesia ended 12/12
www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=2977364
Had Lyme, Bart, Babs, RMSF, Ehrlichia, Myco, Anaplasmosis, EBV
New set of infections 8/2014 - still treating.
Come visit me: dogwoodtraditionals.freeforums.net/
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