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davidgraham5
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2016
Total Posts : 140
   Posted 7/23/2017 7:01 AM (GMT -6)   
Any suggest good binder. I am on antibiotics and supplements for lyme and coinfections.

PeteZa
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2015
Total Posts : 8949
   Posted 7/23/2017 8:14 AM (GMT -6)   
Here is a thread where this was discussed before:

www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=3481972

Post Edited (PeteZa) : 7/23/2017 8:17:13 AM (GMT-6)


Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 26462
   Posted 7/23/2017 10:13 AM (GMT -6)   
I use Activated charcoal.

Others: Powdered bentonite clay, Diamotaceous Earth, and Cholestyramine (prescription )

Take the binder a few hours away from everything else you ingest.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

Post Edited (Girlie) : 7/23/2017 10:16:02 AM (GMT-6)


Pirouette
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 5813
   Posted 7/23/2017 10:57 AM (GMT -6)   
Did someone say binder???? That's my favorite discussion!!!

Seriously, though. I have discovered that using an effective binder has helped tremendously, if not solved many of my problems. Literally. But I have always had GI issues so this kind of makes sense.

There are good OTC options - activated charcoal as discussed. Also bentonite clay, psyllium husk, diameticious earth.

But my favorite is PURE cholestyramine or CSM. It's reserved for the serious binding but it's become my most important part of my protocol. They manufacture it in weak, ineffective versions that have a ton of fillers, even sugar - but it's cheap. Instead, I recommend the pure stuff you can only get at compounding pharmacies and it's expensive.

Here's more info I copied from my other post:

The benefits I have realized are as follows:

My favorite binder and one of the most impactful components of my entire treatment is PURE cholestyramine. It's expensive but I can't live without it. It has so many other benefits (at least that I've experienced - it's different for everyone) AND is also an expert binder.

I had a lot of GI issues and given the cost, it might not be necessary for those who just need a general binder but wanted to throw info about it into the mix - here are the other benefits I've experienced:

- A whole other "level" of detoxing, particularly when I chase the CSM w/ a bentonite clay--always at night after my meals/last supps/last abx dose and then I wait for a couple hrs, take my probiotics and head to bed to "heal".

- Once I started the CSM at high doses I had a downtick of symptoms, less GI cramping/distended belly/inflammation/diarrhea/constipation.

- I became super regular (like small BMs a couple hrs after each meal kind of regular... I've never experienced that in my life. I think keeping things moving can solve a lot of problems, since the longer fecal matter remains in our intestines, the more toxins are leached from them and the longer leaky gut has an opportunity to let toxins enter the bloodstream, etc...

- The BMs were also well-formed and "normal" - I had no idea they could be like that. And no longer had a lot of odor (although regular odor is not a bad thing--just that I was going so regularly that things were really moving, which is also much a critical way to detox.) LOL TMI, I know - sorry.

- I'm also a believer in the gut-brain connection and have experienced fewer psycho-neuro herxing that skyrocketed as I started treating bart again, and the CSM has helped me hold on to what little sanity I have left. I think this can be the binding action --or can be due from simply keeping things moving.

- I also experimented to see if the CSM could be effective with clearing yeast/fungal overgrowth and/or keep it in balance. I don't think it it has any anti fungal properties but it has allowed me to go off all antifungal Rx - for now, at least. Maybe it's preventing anything new from growing and/or settling in the gut maybe because it quickly removes it before it can get established.

I was Y/FO-free when I started it, then I went off all antifungals a couple wks later. Then right at the beginning of the year I had a huge flare up when I started busting biofilms and sure enough, the yeast/fungal issues cambe back. I went back on Ketoconazole and Nystatin, which helped, but it was the CSM that got be back in balance within days. I'm off the antifungals again with the help of CSM.

- I've had an uptick in energy, which could be due to a couple of things but noticed it around the time I started the CSM.

- I have also started sleeping better and more soundly since starting the high doses of CSM I dare say I might have even had a couple of dreams--I stopped dreaming when lyme & co entered my life.

- Also, when I get a head-ache or feel brain fog or "neurotransmittery" or "crazy" tick up I take the CSM - that plus Pinella/Burbur can sometimes kill the headache and I know it helps with the crazies.

Only busting biofilms brought back my appetite yet---nothing has been touched that but it has helped in every other aspect of GI suffering.

Other info:
If you can't get your hands on the PURE cholestyramine I would skip it altogether and stick with the OTC binders. The lesser cholestyramine products like Welchol or Questran are manufactured versions of the raw cholestyramine and contain unnecessary and sometimes disruptive fillers and sugars or sugar substitutes and very little quantity of the cholestyramine, in fact, you probably have to take so much of the manufactured version to get the full benefit you’re getting too much of the fillers and sugars and might as well use the other OTC binders.

PURE CSM is just that—the raw ingredient and nothing else (although you can also get it with stevia for improved taste). It can be expensive (appx $185 for 60-day supply obtained via Rx through a compounding pharmacist--let me know if you need contact info). But I would go w/out other components of my protocol before I'd stop the CSM.

I started very slow but worked up to my optimal dose of 6 grams at night.

Again, not everyone has GI issues like I do, so that is certainly a personal thing and the important info here is that binders are a really great way to detox.

-p

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 26462
   Posted 7/23/2017 11:57 AM (GMT -6)   
Pirouette said...
Did someone say binder???? That's my favorite discussion!!!


Huh? I thought Yeast/Candida was your favorite discussion??? confused



Seriously, though....thank you once again for sharing your in-depth knowledge with us...
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

davidgraham5
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2016
Total Posts : 140
   Posted 7/23/2017 1:27 PM (GMT -6)   
Wow thanks for all that info! I need to look into it.

Just one more question...does it matter what antibiotics you are or can you take the binder with any?

Pirouette
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 5813
   Posted 7/23/2017 1:43 PM (GMT -6)   
David -

You can take any kind of binder with any abx (I'm pretty sure about that but hope someone will correct me if I'm wrong).

Binders have a few rules since they are generally designed to drag everything out, including stuff you want to stay!

- Always take with lots of water and remain well-hydrated throughout the day.

- Before you take any binder, wait at least 1 hr (2 hrs if you have slow motility or are dehydrated) after consuming anything orally or via IV.

- After you take any binder, wait at least 2 hrs (3+ hrs if you have slow motility or are dehydrated) before resuming anything orally or via IV.

- Once you have acclimated to binders, you can combine them (I like chasing charcoal or CSM with bentonite clay in water). And you can also take them mulitiple times a day (after antimicrobials is best) if you can fit it into your schedule.

-p
Lyme Moderator
Chronic late-stage lyme—likely infected in '00; Clinically dx Mar'14 w/ Babs, Fry Labs+ Bart-like, CDC+ Bb. First treated 4-5 viruses & GI/immune. Herbal antimicrobials in May; IV port-started Rocephin in Nov; added vancomycin Mar'16;
DETOX: Pinella/Burbur/Parsley/Milk thistle/Burdock/Red root; Samento/Banderol/Enula; JK/Turmeric; BFM-1; antifung; many many supps; cholestyramine!

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 26462
   Posted 7/23/2017 4:07 PM (GMT -6)   
I would recommend always waiting 2 hours after consuming meds, other supplements etc before taking the Charcoal...or other binders.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

k07
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2015
Total Posts : 2039
   Posted 7/23/2017 4:14 PM (GMT -6)   
I use modified citrus pectin. LOVE it! If i skip it i have trouble sleeping. Tried switching to welchol per my llmd and i was having severe insomnia. Switched back to modified citrus pectin and all is good again.
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