What was the general consensus about blood clots?

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Red_34
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Total Posts : 22177
   Posted 9/28/2010 6:59 AM (GMT -7)   
I know we had a post about this recently but I just wanted to know what the general consensus was about passing blood clots? I think I am starting to get better but I can't be sure.

I've been on steroid enemas for 4 weeks, 25mgs of 6mp, 100mgs of Allopurinol, 9 Colazal and 3- 20mgs of Bentyl daily.

My symptoms went from severe cramping (like wanting to pass out from the pain cramping), a lot of dark red blood dripping in the toilet, passing large amounts of mucous and 6 bm's a day to slight cramping, still having about 6 bm's a day, still having dark red blood but not as much and same with the mucous. However, now I have been passing blood clots the size of about a quarter. Does this mean that the clots are from the open "ulcerations" of the colon sloughing off and they are trying to heal? Should I be concerned?
SHERRY
Moderator-Allergies/Asthma and Alzheimer's, Co-moderator-UC
current status: flaring! Ugh!
~Left sided Uc-'92**Unable to tolerate ALL mesalamines**
Colazal(9 daily)/6mp(25mgs), Allopurinol (100mgs)/Bentyl-Prilosec~allergies-Singulair/Zyrtec~Reynauds Syndrome~OA-Tylonel Arthritis/Celebrex~Scoliosis~Sacroilitis~Dry eye-Restasis/GAD - Klonopin (.25mgs)

songlady
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Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 3252
   Posted 9/28/2010 7:15 AM (GMT -7)   
Gosh, Sherry, I don't know! In your case, it does sound as if the ulcerations might be trying to heal over and then that "scabbing" is what you are seeing, as it's being rubbed off....?
How long has this been happening? - are you comfortable with just observing it longer...?

I haven't dealt with that extent of bleeding in some years so I can't be of much help otherwise...
Glad you think you are improving!!!
Co-Moderator, UC Forum
Age 54. Diagnosed UP 1983, UC 1986
Asacol - down to 13 pills/day,
almost off Cortenemas. Rowasa 2x a week.
Metamucil - 2 doses/day
VSL#3DS and other probiotics, Multivitamin, Calcium and D
homemade yogurt each day
doing well!
Son, 17, dx pancolitis 2007, in remission

Red_34
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Apr 2004
Total Posts : 22177
   Posted 9/28/2010 7:45 AM (GMT -7)   
I've had the blood clots for a couple days now. I see my GI next week so I will ask him then but I was just wondering whether or not this warrants yet another call to him or not. I went to my primary yesterday for a follow up after being placed on Klonopin but it ended up as being an appointment for my concerns of the Allopurinol. I was having some pretty bad stomach pains and nausea so my primary called my GI for me, in which he placed me on 40mgs of Prilosec instead of my 20mgs. It helped a little yesterday with the second 20mg dose but the pain was still there. I have to go in for blood work today for which I am grateful because I am beginning to suspect that I am becoming anemic too.

He really really wants me to go on Pred but I am afraid because of my sensitivity. Both my GI and my primary get frustrated because they can't do more to help me since my body reacts weirdly to so many medications. And their frustrations fuel mine as well. *sigh*

But I did mention to my primary yesterday that I am giving this med combo a try for a least six months before I consult a surgeon and she said that sounded reasonable considering everything that I've gone thru. But the stomach pains that I have been having was concerning me a bit so who knows if I will be able to even stay ON it.
SHERRY
Moderator-Allergies/Asthma and Alzheimer's, Co-moderator-UC
current status: flaring! Ugh!
~Left sided Uc-'92**Unable to tolerate ALL mesalamines**
Colazal(9 daily)/6mp(25mgs), Allopurinol (100mgs)/Bentyl-Prilosec~allergies-Singulair/Zyrtec~Reynauds Syndrome~OA-Tylonel Arthritis/Celebrex~Scoliosis~Sacroilitis~Dry eye-Restasis/GAD - Klonopin (.25mgs)

aguywithuc
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jun 2010
Total Posts : 2579
   Posted 9/28/2010 12:04 PM (GMT -7)   
Blood clots are in the veins and arteries so what your experiencing in your GI tract would be called something else.

I can tell you that nothing was helping the flare I had in August where I lost 40 lbs until I tried LIBRAX. I just received Mebeverine from Canada and it has some dual action that had me very interested but the doc could only get LIBRAX here in America and that was enough to halt the bleeding and I went up ten lbs but did not expect to go up any more until I got tapered off the useless prednisone.

Zippy123
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2009
Total Posts : 735
   Posted 9/28/2010 12:14 PM (GMT -7)   
I would like to know the significance of blood clots as well. Blood is similar color to Red's, medium color not bright red usually.
I see blod clots, then another time I can go and I don't notice any. In my case I usually go only maybe 2 or 3 times a day, cramping sometimes but not usually real bad. Need to get and keep stools softer.

This sounds weird but I just started using organic coconut oil mixed with slippery elm tea in a small enema, and seems to sooth things a bit in there. I want to continue experimenting with it for a while after I get this lower GI done and see how it goes..

quincy
Elite Member


Date Joined May 2003
Total Posts : 25881
   Posted 9/28/2010 1:07 PM (GMT -7)   
It's not the colon sloughing off..I asked my doc about that a long time ago. The clots would be blood mixed in with mucus and maybe stool or blood that's sat around for a while in the colon if you're not having diarrhea.

The colon doesn't scab...there is no air in there to do so.

Sherry...you should take the Bentyl 3 times a day for sure. ARe you on 10mg or 20?
You could double the 10mg to 20mg dosage...maybe ask the doc if can do that at night time.

Can you do some research to possibly find the butyrate enemas? maybe that could help. As well...maybe change your probiotic?

q
*Heather* I give suggestions, do with them what you will.
Status: ...Asacol 3 @ 2x daily; Salofalk enema @ 3rd night (nightly/ flares, tapered/maintenance)
~diagnosed January 1989 UC (proctosigmoiditis)
~Bentylol 20mg as needed; Ranitidine; Effexor XR 37.5mg (depression), Pulmicort/Airomir (asthma)
~vitamins/minerals/supplements; Probiotics....(RenewLife Ultimate Flora Critical Care+Primadophilus Reuteri capsules @ bedtime
~Metamucil capsules 6 twice daily with meals; Vitamin D 2000 IU
~URSO for PSC (or PBC) 500mg X 2 daily (LFTs back to NORMAL!!)
My doc's logic.. "TREAT (FROM)BOTH ENDS" worth it !!!

subdued
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 3231
   Posted 9/28/2010 9:09 PM (GMT -7)   
aguywithuc said...
Blood clots are in the veins and arteries so what your experiencing in your GI tract would be called something else.


confused Someone needs to do his homework.

quincy
Elite Member


Date Joined May 2003
Total Posts : 25881
   Posted 9/28/2010 10:54 PM (GMT -7)   
and male too....women relate the term "clots" because of periods I would think...and we get it.

q
*Heather* I give suggestions, do with them what you will.
Status: ...Asacol 3 @ 2x daily; Salofalk enema @ 3rd night (nightly/ flares, tapered/maintenance)
~diagnosed January 1989 UC (proctosigmoiditis)
~Bentylol 20mg as needed; Ranitidine; Effexor XR 37.5mg (depression), Pulmicort/Airomir (asthma)
~vitamins/minerals/supplements; Probiotics....(RenewLife Ultimate Flora Critical Care+Primadophilus Reuteri capsules @ bedtime
~Metamucil capsules 6 twice daily with meals; Vitamin D 2000 IU
~URSO for PSC (or PBC) 500mg X 2 daily (LFTs back to NORMAL!!)
My doc's logic.. "TREAT (FROM)BOTH ENDS" worth it !!!

aguywithuc
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jun 2010
Total Posts : 2579
   Posted 9/29/2010 1:06 AM (GMT -7)   
subdued said...
aguywithuc said...
Blood clots are in the veins and arteries so what your experiencing in your GI tract would be called something else.


confused Someone needs to do his homework.


That someone is you. I just spent a week in the hospital/ICU for a blood clot called a thrombosis and I was on Heparin and am now on Coumaden and Lovenox. I think I have done enough homework myself. Bloody stools/diarhea is simply not a blood 'clot' its just blood.

You can do your homework here: www.ahrq.gov/consumer/bloodclots.htm Nowhere do they reference blood in your stool as a 'clot'.

"Blood clots can be dangerous. Blood clots that form in the veins in your legs, arms, and groin can break loose and move to other parts of your body, including your lungs. A blood clot in your lungs is called a pulmonary embolism (POOL-mo-nar-e EM-bo-liz-em). If this happens, your life can be in danger. Go to the emergency room or call 911."

"A blood clot that forms inside a blood vessel or within the heart and stays there is called a thrombus. A thrombus that breaks loose and travels from one location in the body to another is called an embolus. The related medical disorder is called an embolism. For example, an embolus that gets stuck in the lungs is called a pulmonary embolism."

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrombus

4 Ways to Recognize Signs of a Blood Clot

www.nutralegacy.com/blog/general-healthcare/4-ways-to-recognize-signs-of-a-blood-clot/

Post Edited (aguywithuc) : 9/29/2010 1:15:14 AM (GMT-6)


subdued
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 3231
   Posted 9/29/2010 2:26 AM (GMT -7)   
confused

When I'm in a bad flare, I get:

bloody stools
diarrhea
blood clots
urgency
...

Blood clots are a common occurrence with rectal bleeding:

http://www.procto-med.com/rectal-bleeding/

http://www.procto-med.com/images/2009/05/flexible-rectosigmoidoscopy-showed-blood-clots-in-the-rectum-300x297.jpg

And are a known symptom of ulcerative colitis:

http://www.webmd.com/ibd-crohns-disease/ulcerative-colitis/digestive-diseases-ulcerative-colitis

Blood clots can form in the veins of the colon. I get them all the time. They are much bigger than the one shown in the above pic too, about the size of a quarter in diameter, round like a ball.

Yes. Blood clots can be very dangerous. My mom used to get them in her legs a lot from birth control pills. My sister got one in her lungs, again from birth control pills and had to be hospitalized. I've never taken birth control pills due to my genetic background. In fact, now that I have IBD, I know I too am predisposed to getting them.

My GI knows I get blood clots that pass out my butt when I'm flaring. In fact, he told me they were blood clots when I described them to him. He will ask me how many and how often I get them when I'm in a flare. He doesn't say, "Oh, that's just blood."

Post Edited (subdued) : 9/29/2010 2:49:06 AM (GMT-6)


Red_34
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Apr 2004
Total Posts : 22177
   Posted 9/29/2010 4:25 AM (GMT -7)   
Q, yes I am taking 20mgs of Bentyl 3 times a day. I will look around for the Butyrate enemas, not quite sure how to go about finding studies for it in my area though.
SHERRY
Moderator-Allergies/Asthma and Alzheimer's, Co-moderator-UC
current status: flaring! Ugh!
~Left sided Uc-'92**Unable to tolerate ALL mesalamines**
Colazal(9 daily)/6mp(25mgs), Allopurinol (100mgs)/Bentyl-Prilosec~allergies-Singulair/Zyrtec~Reynauds Syndrome~OA-Tylonel Arthritis/Celebrex~Scoliosis~Sacroilitis~Dry eye-Restasis/GAD - Klonopin (.25mgs)

aguywithuc
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jun 2010
Total Posts : 2579
   Posted 9/29/2010 8:08 AM (GMT -7)   
subdued said...
confused

When I'm in a bad flare, I get:

bloody stools
diarrhea
blood clots
urgency
...

Blood clots are a common occurrence with rectal bleeding:

http://www.procto-med.com/rectal-bleeding/

http://www.procto-med.com/images/2009/05/flexible-rectosigmoidoscopy-showed-blood-clots-in-the-rectum-300x297.jpg

And are a known symptom of ulcerative colitis:

http://www.webmd.com/ibd-crohns-disease/ulcerative-colitis/digestive-diseases-ulcerative-colitis

Blood clots can form in the veins of the colon. I get them all the time. They are much bigger than the one shown in the above pic too, about the size of a quarter in diameter, round like a ball.

Yes. Blood clots can be very dangerous. My mom used to get them in her legs a lot from birth control pills. My sister got one in her lungs, again from birth control pills and had to be hospitalized. I've never taken birth control pills due to my genetic background. In fact, now that I have IBD, I know I too am predisposed to getting them.

My GI knows I get blood clots that pass out my butt when I'm flaring. In fact, he told me they were blood clots when I described them to him. He will ask me how many and how often I get them when I'm in a flare. He doesn't say, "Oh, that's just blood."


Nonetheless it is just blood and we all get that.

I bled all August and dropped from 200 to 160 until I found Librix. From what I read its not a 'clot' until it obstructs something and it obstructed blood draining from my Sagittal Sinus in my brain effecting my right arm. One week ago my arm was nearly unusable now I am back to work typing away. Of course I have been reading about this every single day as I can imagine you would if it happened to you so I don't appreciate the punky remark/personal attack to 'do my homework' - lets limit this discussion to the science and not the individuals involved.

My clot resulted in seeing a neurologist, being in the ICU and getting on blood thinners, as far as I can see from what I have read that is a true blood clot, if your not on blood thinners its bleeding not 'clotting' your welcome to your opinion on what a clot exactly is but you can keep your opinion on how rigorously I am doing homework to get out of this situation to yourself. So called blood clots in waste simply get passed and are gone, a clot like the one causing my stroke will take weeks/months for the body to breakup and dissolve and hopefully it wont break loose and travel somewhere else in the meantime.

There is a world of difference between the two.

subdued
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 3231
   Posted 9/29/2010 2:23 PM (GMT -7)   
aguywithuc said...


Nonetheless it is just blood and we all get that.

I bled all August and dropped from 200 to 160 until I found Librix. From what I read its not a 'clot' until it obstructs something...

...as far as I can see from what I have read that is a true blood clot, if your not on blood thinners its bleeding not 'clotting' ...


Sorry I offended you. I wasn't trying to discount your condition. I realize how serious blood clots can be. My sister was hospitalized for getting one in her lungs.

However, here is the definition of a blood clot:

"A semisolid, gelatinous mass of coagulated blood that consists of red blood cells, white blood cells, and platelets in a fibrin network."

You will see, there is no mention of obstruction or blood thinners.

Moreover, "blood clots form when there is damage to the lining of a blood vessel, either an artery or a vein. The damage may be obvious, such as a laceration, or may occur on the microscopic level."

The blood that passes through our colon has to come from somewhere. In our case, it's from ulcers that are eating into the veins that are in the lining of our colons. The veins become damaged and blood clots form. Luckily, it is easier for the blood clots to pass through the colon than through the tiny veins.

However, a blood clot can be very dangerous when it passes through the veins/arteries to the lungs or brain. That's why my GI gets very concerned and wants to put me on stronger medication when I tell him I'm passing blood clots. Seeing how dangerous blood clots can be, I think it is very important to let others know. It is also a consideration when deciding what meds to take, whether or not to take stronger meds, and whether or not to get surgery. They should not be simply discounted as being just blood.

Post Edited (subdued) : 9/29/2010 2:27:00 PM (GMT-6)


quincy
Elite Member


Date Joined May 2003
Total Posts : 25881
   Posted 9/29/2010 3:39 PM (GMT -7)   
There are NO veins in the musocal layer, they are capilliaries.
The clots are clotting of blood from the damage or bursting of the capilliearies within the mucosal layer or the submucosal layer that lay upon the surface for a length of time, long enough for it to clot. They are also a mixture of mucus, blood and probably a bit of stool or unabsorbed water/fluid.

q
*Heather* I give suggestions, do with them what you will.
Status: ...Asacol 3 @ 2x daily; Salofalk enema @ 3rd night (nightly/ flares, tapered/maintenance)
~diagnosed January 1989 UC (proctosigmoiditis)
~Bentylol 20mg as needed; Ranitidine; Effexor XR 37.5mg (depression), Pulmicort/Airomir (asthma)
~vitamins/minerals/supplements; Probiotics....(RenewLife Ultimate Flora Critical Care+Primadophilus Reuteri capsules @ bedtime
~Metamucil capsules 6 twice daily with meals; Vitamin D 2000 IU
~URSO for PSC (or PBC) 500mg X 2 daily (LFTs back to NORMAL!!)
My doc's logic.. "TREAT (FROM)BOTH ENDS" worth it !!!

subdued
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 3231
   Posted 9/29/2010 5:28 PM (GMT -7)   
I guess I should have been clearer. Yes. The veins branch off into capillaries. But the ulcer can go far enough to damage the veins. Portal vein thrombosis is a rare complication in ulcerative colitis. But it does exist.

quincy
Elite Member


Date Joined May 2003
Total Posts : 25881
   Posted 9/29/2010 6:26 PM (GMT -7)   
I don't know if PVT is caused by the deeper ulcers...which only go as deep as the submucosa I think.

I thought you might have meant ischemia...

Could the PvT be a separate issue....guess off to google.

q
*Heather* I give suggestions, do with them what you will.
Status: ...Asacol 3 @ 2x daily; Salofalk enema @ 3rd night (nightly/ flares, tapered/maintenance)
~diagnosed January 1989 UC (proctosigmoiditis)
~Bentylol 20mg as needed; Ranitidine; Effexor XR 37.5mg (depression), Pulmicort/Airomir (asthma)
~vitamins/minerals/supplements; Probiotics....(RenewLife Ultimate Flora Critical Care+Primadophilus Reuteri capsules @ bedtime
~Metamucil capsules 6 twice daily with meals; Vitamin D 2000 IU
~URSO for PSC (or PBC) 500mg X 2 daily (LFTs back to NORMAL!!)
My doc's logic.. "TREAT (FROM)BOTH ENDS" worth it !!!

aguywithuc
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jun 2010
Total Posts : 2579
   Posted 9/29/2010 6:45 PM (GMT -7)   
Well this was an expensive variety of clot, I called the hospital and for one week they want $64,000.00. There were 2-3 days of ICU in there I am not sure which but the insurance will only cover 25k because its terrible insurance and I was working on lining up interviews with companies that have great insurance when this happened. The interview I missed is rescheduled for this friday. My doctor wrote a note saying I am excused from work for 3 weeks but that does not change anything I am not about to cancel the interview again but I could have really used a one full week from discharge to do my regular job and prepare for the technical grilling I am going to get.

subdued
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 3231
   Posted 9/29/2010 11:35 PM (GMT -7)   
Sorry to hear that.
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