C. Diff currently on my 2nd relapse

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Hopeful2387
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Date Joined Dec 2010
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   Posted 12/21/2010 7:02 AM (GMT -6)   
Well, I am 23 years old and a few months ago I was prescribed Clindamycin for a 'dental abscess' that really didn't exist... ( misdiagnosed) and after that, I ended up having REALLY weird bowel movements.. I went in, and the doctor said he doubts I would have this but he'll test me for it, low and behold, I tested positive. I was put on Flagyl for 14 days, I finished it and was okay.
Three days ago I had similar-looking feces, and went to the ER, and again, I tested positive for c. diff... I am currently on Vancomycin for 14 days, in a compound liquid form.
I'm hoping this will treat it, I'm just wanting to talk to some other people that have dealt with this thing and I need positive reassurance right now.. I'm wondering if there is more that I can do ( naturally) to help my body get rid of this invader.

Thank you :)

killcolitis
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Date Joined Dec 2009
Total Posts : 2396
   Posted 12/21/2010 7:27 AM (GMT -6)   
My daughter has UC and thankfully hasn't had c diff but if I were you I'd try fecal transplant.

IamCurious
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Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 2224
   Posted 12/21/2010 9:15 AM (GMT -6)   
You need to supplement your antibiotics with probiotics to keep the C Diff out. Saccharomyces boulardii is a probiotic yeast that specifically targets C Diff from retaking hold in your gut. I would also add other regular probiotics during your course of antibiotics and every day after to ensure C. Diff does not return.
Male/59 DX ulcerative colitis Feb08, possible Crohn's colitis DX Mar10.
No Meds, allergic to Mesalamine. Allergy to shellfish contributed to 1st major flare. Food journal instead of SCD. Psyllium seed + VSL3 especially helpful.

Boswellia, E. Coli Nissle (Mutaflor), turmeric, fish oil, S. Boulardii, resveratrol, multivitamin, extra D3, K2, C, high gamma E, magnesium, DGL, phos choline, glutamine. Lots of vegetables & fruit (but no plums), no soda, no HFCS, no trans fat, tea instead of coffee, watch gluten, few processed foods, no carrageenan.

Nature created all of the locks, therefore Nature has all of the keys

Hopeful2387
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Date Joined Dec 2010
Total Posts : 7
   Posted 12/21/2010 10:23 AM (GMT -6)   
killcolitis said...
My daughter has UC and thankfully hasn't had c diff but if I were you I'd try fecal transplant.


Am I able to do that while I'm on antibiotics or should I try that if this doesn't get rid of it? What exactly does that entail and does it work?? I've been pretty positive so far even though the outcome may be gloomy

Hopeful2387
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   Posted 12/21/2010 10:25 AM (GMT -6)   
BabeintheWoods said...
You need to supplement your antibiotics with probiotics to keep the C Diff out. Saccharomyces boulardii is a probiotic yeast that specifically targets C Diff from retaking hold in your gut. I would also add other regular probiotics during your course of antibiotics and every day after to ensure C. Diff does not return.


Sorry I don't want to seem naive, I've asked the pharmacist and the doctor about probiotics etc and they said, " well, your on the strongest medicine, there is no other pill to take to 'help' get rid of your c. difficle"
So I'm wondering exactly where I go to pick that up, and what you would personally recommend ( brand names, names on the bottles) because I'm kind of new to this stuff. I recently started eating raw foods, haven't gotten into the natural medicine part of it yet.

I appreciate the both of you replying back.
It means a lot, thank you.

IamCurious
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   Posted 12/21/2010 11:11 AM (GMT -6)   
I don’t like recommending specific brands of supplements but Saccharomyces boulardii is shown to be the most effective probiotic against C. Diff. You can find it in Whole Foods and in most health food stores. Google it, you will find that the research is overwhelming. With all due respect to your doctor and pharmacist, most of the members of this forum have been taking probiotics for years and find them most effective for C Diff and UC. They work.

I also recommend taking a more conventional probiotic such as Primadolphilus, VSL3, or even Align or Culturelle, or any of the reputable brands found in Whole Foods and health food stores. Refrigerated probiotics generally are better as long as you can keep them refrigerated. (Might not be able to on road trips).

Take S. Boulardii and your other probiotic at a different time of day than your antibiotics and continue taking them every day after your course of antibiotics has ended. I will be very surprised if your C Diff returns.

I am not saying probiotics will cure a C Diff infection. Only antibiotics can do that. But probiotics may very well help you to prevent C Diff from returning for the 3rd time.

Post Edited (BabeintheWoods) : 12/21/2010 9:37:13 AM (GMT-7)


killcolitis
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Date Joined Dec 2009
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   Posted 12/21/2010 12:32 PM (GMT -6)   
Hopeful,
You can research s boulardi online, one brand is Florastor which many chemists carry. Unlike other probiotics it's not refrigerated so you might be able to order online. As for FT, you shouldn't do it until you are finished with abx so you can repopulate your gut with "normal" (donor) flora. You can google this and get the home protocol on line.

Hopeful2387
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Date Joined Dec 2010
Total Posts : 7
   Posted 12/21/2010 4:52 PM (GMT -6)   
Well thank you guys very very much, I will definitely look into all of this. I'm not sure why the Doctors don't want me to take extra supplements with this thing... they get their money out of treating you, I think that's what it is.

subdued
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Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 3231
   Posted 12/22/2010 3:36 AM (GMT -6)   
They don't know whether or not the probiotics will weaken the antibiotics. That being said, I would do both fecal transplantation and probiotics.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fecal_bacteriotherapy

Doctors are relatively clueless when it comes to UC.

Post Edited (subdued) : 12/22/2010 2:13:35 AM (GMT-7)


Hopeful2387
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Date Joined Dec 2010
Total Posts : 7
   Posted 12/23/2010 7:40 AM (GMT -6)   
subdued said...
They don't know whether or not the probiotics will weaken the antibiotics. That being said, I would do both fecal transplantation and probiotics.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fecal_bacteriotherapy

Doctors are relatively clueless when it comes to UC.


Where will they do fecal transplants? I got a hand out at the ER saying that is a very rare procedure etc...

So, should I just stay with this course of vancomycin, and hope it gets rid of it, start probiotics right after I finish it... and then if it comes back get the fecal transplant + probiotics?? This whole thing is so.. I don't know. I feel like I"ve been told I have cancer and there is no cure.

subdued
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Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 3231
   Posted 12/23/2010 1:52 PM (GMT -6)   
I can't advise about when to start taking probiotics. I haven't done the research. Perhaps someone else on this forum can provide more information. I do know that many people on this forum recommend VSL. You can ask your GI for a prescription. Mine wouldn't give me one. I buy whatever is on sale. VSL is expensive.

I did my fecal transplantation at home using my granddaughter's poo. Here are some links to the topic on HealingWell:

3/2008 http://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=38&m=1068548
2/2009 http://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=38&m=1394029
3/2009 http://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=38&m=1428425
7/2010 http://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=38&m=1856519
7/2010 http://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=38&m=1535233
10/2009 Part1 http://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=38&m=1612467
11/2009 Part 2 http://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=38&m=1647007
12/2009 Part 3 http://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=38&m=1662417
8/2010 Part 4 http://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=38&m=1865200

Some people have done fecal transplantation with great results. I'm one of them. Others haven't seen any results.

Hopeful2387
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Date Joined Dec 2010
Total Posts : 7
   Posted 12/23/2010 5:41 PM (GMT -6)   
I don't understand why they won't give a prescription when they know that it could actually possibly cure you for awhile... what is suppose to happen if you have a 3rd relapse and it's totally immune to antibiotics?? I guess I'd just be screwed... I'm just tired of Doctors and everything, because I bet if they had this they would be willing to try to do anything to feel better.

Thank you for your message, I'm going to look at your references

killcolitis
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Date Joined Dec 2009
Total Posts : 2396
   Posted 12/23/2010 5:53 PM (GMT -6)   
VSL won't cure Cdiff but will help your gut flora from being completely destroyed when on vancomycin. S boulliardi (the strain in florastor) is the only probiotic which will help ward off c-dfif as far as I know.
As for fecal transplant in the US, you're lucky in that there are now a few docs doing it in recurrent cases. One is Dr Alexander Khoutris (in Delawre), you can get his details by googling him. There are are few others but I don't remember off hand. There was an article about FT and C diff in the washington post and another a few months or so ago in the NYT, if you can find them online they mention and interview a few docs who carry out the procedure. Good luck. If you can't find someone near you you can do it at home and have your donor tested according to Dr Borody's protocol. It depends on your comfort level but the lucky thing for you is that it as a cure rate in the mid-high 90%s.

ben1be
New Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 15
   Posted 12/24/2010 8:58 AM (GMT -6)   
Do you have UC?
Your C-diff symptoms seem pretty mild and that may be why the doctor is prescribing the treatment he has.

C-diff is very hard to get rid of in some cases. I was hospitalized twice within a month for it. It was like a train wreck in my colon. The actual time to eradicate it was three or four months I think.
I don`t like to question your Dr., but a simple two week course of Vanco does`nt seem adequate. I think I tapered my treatment for a much longer period, adding pro-biotics later in the taper. Its my understanding that Vanco is such a powerful antibiotic that it kills the pro biotic.
The fact that you have re-lapsed once is troubling.

Off the mayo Clinic site I got this:

"Relapse Infection recurs in about 10 percent to 30 percent of patients, usually three to 10 days after finishing antibiotic treatment, though recurrence one to two months later has been noted. Risk factors for relapse include previous relapse, leukocytosis (a large increase in white blood cells in the blood), chronic renal failure, colon diverticula and recent abdominal surgery.

Options for treating relapse include:

Prolonged courses of vancomycin followed by gradual tapering
Five to seven-day intermittent treatment periods with a combination of antibiotics and anion exchange resin
Treatment with a combination of vancomycin and rifampin
New treatments to alter or restore healthy bacteria in the colon. These regimens use oral lactobacillus GG and oral nonpathogenic yeast, including saccharomyces boulardii."

I was able to cure the C-diff without a fecal transplant, but my gastro Dr. seemed to be up to date on the Vanco course of treatment.

You should probably speak to your Dr and ask him why he is`nt tapering you or recommending any restoration treatments when the Vanco is finished. He may have a reason.

Do a lot of online research for yourself. Than work with your Dr.

Good luck.
58 years old
Diagnosed: August 2006
c-diff hospitalization Dec 2006
a year to finally beat it (Vanco)
periodic six month flares w/ Prednisone
Asacol 3600 mg
Imuran 50 mg
Probiotic, multi-vitamin, B-complex, vitamin D 3000, fiber 2000 mg, fish oil 1000 mg, flax oil 3000 mg, iron 130 mg.
Canasa when needed
Currently tapering off pred

killcolitis
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2009
Total Posts : 2396
   Posted 12/24/2010 9:00 AM (GMT -6)   
Yes, also, for recurrent c-diff the vanco needs to be tapered.
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