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Dave2012
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 35
   Posted 11/12/2011 8:22 AM (GMT -6)   
I have enema usually at night. In the morning, I usually find a wide range of mucus. This drives me crazy.

I don't know whether it is normal after enema or it is a sign of very serious flare.

Actually right now I feel no pain, very little blood per 5 day.

If the flare is down, with enema each day, people will still pass mucus???

kazbern
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2010
Total Posts : 6459
   Posted 11/12/2011 8:23 AM (GMT -6)   
In my experience, mucous is the last symptom to go. Be patient.
*******************
49 yrs old, IBD diagnosis in spring '01. Proctitis, gastritis, ileitis.
Currently taking Pentasa (3g/day)Colazal (9 pills/day), Sulfazine (1.5 g/day), Prevacid, folic acid, vit. D (2K iu), flax seed oil (2 tsp/day), mesalamine enema as needed. Gluten free as of 5/30/11.

notsosicklygirl
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 9606
   Posted 11/12/2011 9:41 AM (GMT -6)   
Sometimes you're passing some of the enema and it looks like mucous. I definitely pass more white substance when I use enemas or suppositories but they also help keep my UC at bay.
Co-moderator: Ulcerative Colitis
Diagnosed with Pancolitis, Laryngopharyngeal Reflux & Migraines. Battling Extreme Exhaustion.
Currently: Asacol (3200mg) + 6mp (50mg) + Pristiq (50mg) + Canasa (1g PM) + cerazette

Dave2012
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 35
   Posted 11/12/2011 11:43 AM (GMT -6)   
kazbern said...
In my experience, mucous is the last symptom to go. Be patient.



Thanks for your input. I have experienced several low and high recently. I rarely seen any blood but the mucous is always on the way.
I will try slippery elm bark powder enema next week. Hope it will help.
Also wish you health all the time.

Dave2012
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 35
   Posted 11/12/2011 11:47 AM (GMT -6)   
notsosicklygirl said...
Sometimes you're passing some of the enema and it looks like mucous. I definitely pass more white substance when I use enemas or suppositories but they also help keep my UC at bay.


Thanks for your kindly reply.

The enema is liquid. You mean after the 8 hours' stay in the intestine, it will become something like mucus?

I don't know if there is any relation between the amount of mucus and the size of ulcerate area.

Or enemas liquid is something our intestine resists to, therefore it results in the mucus?

Also wish you health all the time.

notsosicklygirl
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 9606
   Posted 11/12/2011 12:46 PM (GMT -6)   
Dave, I notice some white substance in the toilet the morning after using rectal medication. It's probably left-over medication that doesn't absorb. Mucous is usually present all the time and I don't think the best time to determine whether you have mucous is after using rectal medication. The left-over substance could easily be confused for mucous. Do you have this mucous all the time of only after using rectals? Are you experiencing other symptoms? Increased mucous is usually a sign that there is inflammation but some also notice it when they are healing so it's not necessarily a bad thing. Are you still going 5x a day? I aim for 1 or 2x a day, formed, no cramping, mucous or blood. It sounds like you're still dealing with a bit of inflammation, you may want to see about using rectal medication 2x a day. Enemas before bed and suppositories in the morning. Talk to your GI, 5x with occasional blood is mild but you want the inflammation to subside completely.

Thank you for the positive thoughts. I hope you continue to improve.
Co-moderator: Ulcerative Colitis
Diagnosed with Pancolitis, Laryngopharyngeal Reflux & Migraines. Battling Extreme Exhaustion.
Currently: Asacol (3200mg) + 6mp (50mg) + Pristiq (50mg) + Canasa (1g PM) + cerazette

quincy
Elite Member


Date Joined May 2003
Total Posts : 25163
   Posted 11/12/2011 1:43 PM (GMT -6)   
how long have you been on the enemas nightly?

The enemas are NOT supposed to be absorbed into the colon. It's a topical medication that's in a suspension. The medication will be "absorbed", but not the suspension it's in.

The suspension is white....so it'll come out either alone or with stool.

q
*Heather* I give suggestions, do with them what you will.
Status: ...Asacol 3 @ 2x daily; Salofalk enema @ 3rd night (nightly/ flares, tapered/maintenance)
~diagnosed January 1989 UC (proctosigmoiditis)
~Bentylol 20mg as needed; Zantac 150mg; Pulmicort/Airomir (asthma);Effexor XR 37.5 (depression)
~vitamins/minerals/supplements; Probiotics....(RenewLife Ultimate Flora Critical Care+Primadophilus Reuteri capsules @ bedtime)
~Metamucil capsules 6 twice daily with meals; Vitamin D 4500 IU
~URSO for PBC(or PSC?) 500mg X 2 daily (LFTs back to NORMAL!!)
My doc's logic.. "TREAT (FROM)BOTH ENDS" worth it !!!

Dave2012
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 35
   Posted 11/12/2011 10:00 PM (GMT -6)   
notsosicklygirl said...
Dave, I notice some white substance in the toilet the morning after using rectal medication. It's probably left-over medication that doesn't absorb. Mucous is usually present all the time and I don't think the best time to determine whether you have mucous is after using rectal medication. The left-over substance could easily be confused for mucous. Do you have this mucous all the time of only after using rectals? Are you experiencing other symptoms? Increased mucous is usually a sign that there is inflammation but some also notice it when they are healing so it's not necessarily a bad thing. Are you still going 5x a day? I aim for 1 or 2x a day, formed, no cramping, mucous or blood. It sounds like you're still dealing with a bit of inflammation, you may want to see about using rectal medication 2x a day. Enemas before bed and suppositories in the morning. Talk to your GI, 5x with occasional blood is mild but you want the inflammation to subside completely.

Thank you for the positive thoughts. I hope you continue to improve.


I haven't experienced any other symptoms. I passed very little blood once per 5 days (not 5x a day) in the last wek. For other BMs, everything seems fine, one BMs per day but with a wide range of mucus. I don't feel any pain all the time. I think you are right, inflammations are still there, from the amount of mucus.

Dave2012
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 35
   Posted 11/12/2011 10:03 PM (GMT -6)   
quincy said...
how long have you been on the enemas nightly?

The enemas are NOT supposed to be absorbed into the colon. It's a topical medication that's in a suspension. The medication will be "absorbed", but not the suspension it's in.

The suspension is white....so it'll come out either alone or with stool.

q


I think it definitely was mucus since the enemas that I used were water with some probiotics. I did night enemas at 11pm and had my BM around 9am in the next morning.

MmeMulot
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2006
Total Posts : 106
   Posted 11/12/2011 10:10 PM (GMT -6)   
I always have some after-effects of the enemas and suppositories when I use them.
Ulcerative proctitis, diagnosed about 1998
Rowasa nightly, Canasa suppository in morning
Taken off Asacol under suspicion it caused low white-cell count
Fish oil, magnesium, multivitamin, Align probiotics
Allergies to dust, molds, penicillin, some trees and grasses, and cats (but I still have three!)
Occasional migraines
Pescetarian (eat fish but no other meat)

Dave2012
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 35
   Posted 11/13/2011 8:07 AM (GMT -6)   
MmeMulot said...
I always have some after-effects of the enemas and suppositories when I use them.


Your after-effects are mucus in BM?

Thanks

sherbear46
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Jun 2011
Total Posts : 2520
   Posted 11/13/2011 11:43 AM (GMT -6)   
I too almost always have enema "leftovers" the next morning. It isn't passed as liquid for me if its been in all night. It almost is like mucous but at this point I know the difference. I do still occassionally pass some mucous and I consider myself in remission (only 1-2BM per day). For me it may just be I ate something I probably shouldn't have which I tend to do more when I'm feeling good. :)
Diagnosed April 2009

Currently taking Lialda 2 tabs in am, Protonix 40mg every day, Xyazal, Probiotics, and Rowasa enema every 3rd night

quincy
Elite Member


Date Joined May 2003
Total Posts : 25163
   Posted 11/13/2011 9:04 PM (GMT 0)   
yes, but the OP isn't using Rowasa or any processed meds. Different relation.

If you are having mucous, it's actually a good sign..meaning your lining has enough integrity in it to produce mucous.

But, if you're having bleeding...is it around the stool, in the toilet, on the toilet paper..etc? clarify.

What's the consistency of the stool? is the mucous around or in the stool, alone in the toilet, etc?

q
*Heather* I give suggestions, do with them what you will.
Status: ...Asacol 3 @ 2x daily; Salofalk enema @ 3rd night (nightly/ flares, tapered/maintenance)
~diagnosed January 1989 UC (proctosigmoiditis)
~Bentylol 20mg as needed; Zantac 150mg; Pulmicort/Airomir (asthma);Effexor XR 37.5 (depression)
~vitamins/minerals/supplements; Probiotics....(RenewLife Ultimate Flora Critical Care+Primadophilus Reuteri capsules @ bedtime)
~Metamucil capsules 6 twice daily with meals; Vitamin D 4500 IU
~URSO for PBC(or PSC?) 500mg X 2 daily (LFTs back to NORMAL!!)
My doc's logic.. "TREAT (FROM)BOTH ENDS" worth it !!!

Dave2012
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 35
   Posted 11/13/2011 9:48 PM (GMT -6)   
quincy said...
yes, but the OP isn't using Rowasa or any processed meds. Different relation.

If you are having mucous, it's actually a good sign..meaning your lining has enough integrity in it to produce mucous.

But, if you're having bleeding...is it around the stool, in the toilet, on the toilet paper..etc? clarify.

What's the consistency of the stool? is the mucous around or in the stool, alone in the toilet, etc?

q



When there is bleeding, sometimes it is around the last stool that I passed or on the toilet paper.

The stool so far is well-formed. Mucus always come out with the first stool that I passed.

quincy
Elite Member


Date Joined May 2003
Total Posts : 25163
   Posted 11/14/2011 7:34 AM (GMT 0)   
So, it seems more inflamed in the lower part, irritated more by the stool passing through which touches along the area causing it to bleed.

Seems all is doing better...

Why are you not on 5ASA rectal meds?

q
*Heather* I give suggestions, do with them what you will.
Status: ...Asacol 3 @ 2x daily; Salofalk enema @ 3rd night (nightly/ flares, tapered/maintenance)
~diagnosed January 1989 UC (proctosigmoiditis)
~Bentylol 20mg as needed; Zantac 150mg; Pulmicort/Airomir (asthma);Effexor XR 37.5 (depression)
~vitamins/minerals/supplements; Probiotics....(RenewLife Ultimate Flora Critical Care+Primadophilus Reuteri capsules @ bedtime)
~Metamucil capsules 6 twice daily with meals; Vitamin D 4500 IU
~URSO for PBC(or PSC?) 500mg X 2 daily (LFTs back to NORMAL!!)
My doc's logic.. "TREAT (FROM)BOTH ENDS" worth it !!!

Dave2012
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 35
   Posted 11/14/2011 7:37 AM (GMT -6)   
quincy said...
So, it seems more inflamed in the lower part, irritated more by the stool passing through which touches along the area causing it to bleed.

Seems all is doing better...

Why are you not on 5ASA rectal meds?

q



In fact, I am living far from my hometown and seeing doctor in a different country is very difficult. Turmeric seems work and also the probiotic enema. I will continue using them.

Thanks.

pb4
Elite Member


Date Joined Feb 2004
Total Posts : 17713
   Posted 11/14/2011 12:20 PM (GMT -6)   
Fibre daily and indefinitely has helped me with mucous issues, if you an't tolerate fibre via food then supplements are a good alternative, just know that it takes time for your system to adjust to fibre so starting with a small amount (which may initially bring on gas/bloating which is normal) is best and taking it with plenty of water as well. Good luck!
bee propolis caps 500mg one cap twice/day
omegas 369 caps one cap twice/day
probiotics 10 billion cfu once/day
vitamins C-calcium ascorbate (easy on the gut) and vitamin A each once/day
Prodiem fibre supplement one cap before bed
I've also altered my diet (no junky stuff at all, processed, fast-foods, refined sugars, ect) and exercise regularly.
I went from 30+ bloody BM's/day with lots of lower back pain to an average of 5/day no bleeding no back pain and completely formed stools, still have severe urgency issues.
~~~~~~~~My bum is broken....there's a big crack down the middle of it! LOL :)~~~~~~~~

DBwithUC
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2011
Total Posts : 1438
   Posted 11/14/2011 3:57 PM (GMT -6)   
Which probiotic are you using? is it E. coli Nissle? ... or some other probiotic? What is the strength, is it prescribed? How often?

Part of your immune system is still overresponding if there is a lot of mucous. But, it is also hard to know if the muchs response is the origianl autoimune (bad), or possible just the immune system response to the massive dose of good bacteria (temporary) - hey, it is still bacteria.

If I understand the expected result is that introduction of the probiotic will restore a balance in gut flora - possibly outcompeting bad flora for niche/nutrients. The whole probiotic idea seems to be that whatever got skewed in the immune system form the imbalance, will sort itself out with balance restored. At some point you should be able to stop the probiotic enemas and the re-balanced immune system will not flare. IS this more or less the theory?

What happens if you suspend the probiotic enemas for a while?

Dave2012
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 35
   Posted 11/15/2011 12:02 PM (GMT -6)   
pb4 said...
Fibre daily and indefinitely has helped me with mucous issues, if you an't tolerate fibre via food then supplements are a good alternative, just know that it takes time for your system to adjust to fibre so starting with a small amount (which may initially bring on gas/bloating which is normal) is best and taking it with plenty of water as well. Good luck!


Thanks, hope you are always better.

I am also considering bee propolis caps. Is that helpful?

Dave2012
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 35
   Posted 11/15/2011 12:06 PM (GMT -6)   
DBwithUC said...
Which probiotic are you using? is it E. coli Nissle? ... or some other probiotic? What is the strength, is it prescribed? How often?

Part of your immune system is still overresponding if there is a lot of mucous. But, it is also hard to know if the muchs response is the origianl autoimune (bad), or possible just the immune system response to the massive dose of good bacteria (temporary) - hey, it is still bacteria.

If I understand the expected result is that introduction of the probiotic will restore a balance in gut flora - possibly outcompeting bad flora for niche/nutrients. The whole probiotic idea seems to be that whatever got skewed in the immune system form the imbalance, will sort itself out with balance restored. At some point you should be able to stop the probiotic enemas and the re-balanced immune system will not flare. IS this more or less the theory?

What happens if you suspend the probiotic enemas for a while?



I am using Jamieson probiotic 10 billion. I use two cap in the morning enema and two cap in the nightly enema, sometimes I add 2-3 cap Vitama E each time. I began doing enema with taking turmeric 4 cap (1 cap =400mg) per day, which helps me get into 1BM per day, well-formed stool.

DBwithUC
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2011
Total Posts : 1438
   Posted 11/15/2011 12:59 PM (GMT -6)   
I read that Jamison had:
 
Bifidobacterium bifidum HA-132 6.0x108 CFU
Bifidobacterium breve HA-129 2.5x109 CFU
Bifidobacterium longum HA-135 7.0x108 CFU
Lactobacillus acidophilus HA-122 8.0x108 CFU
Lactobacillus paracasei HA-196 2.1x109 CFU
Lactobacillus rhamnosus HA-111 2.7x109 CFU
Lactobacillus rhamnosus (B) HA-114 5.0x108 CFU
Lactobacillus salivarius HA-118 1.0x108 CFU
 
.... so no E. coli Nissle, which from what I read has the most research based support for treatment of UC. (See, http://www.biomedcentral.com/1472-6882/10/13 ).
 
I too take turmeric (actually Curcumin) tablets and percieve some benefit. I have not tried the vit-E added to my rectal meds. I bought some food-grade oil last time I was bleeding a lot, but the bleeding slowed down just about when the package arrived.
 
There was some research posted here recently that suggested those strains of biffido and lacto bacteria would die off if you were bleeding a lot because they could not tolerate the iron level in the colon.
 
Are you sure your improvement is not mostly due to the turmeric? I think the potential for water-based OTC probiotic mixture 2x daily irritating the colon as much as helping the UC is an open question. Your mucus could be a response to the enema - especially if there is little bleeding. My generic 5-asa enemas irritate my colon after 3 or 4 nights, and I alternate use of hydrocortisone enema twice a week to try to balance irritation from the enemas against benefit of 5-asa therapy for the UC.
 
 

Dave2012
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2011
Total Posts : 35
   Posted 11/15/2011 4:10 PM (GMT -6)   
Maybe I should try also E. coli Nissle. Thanks for this.

I think some improvement surely comes from Turmeric. I just ordered slippery elm bark powder online and hope using this for enema will help a lot in soothing my colon and stopping bleeding.

I have heard that the Oregon oil will be helpful for UC. Is it something that you bought (food-grade oil)? Is there any benefit?

pb4
Elite Member


Date Joined Feb 2004
Total Posts : 17713
   Posted 11/15/2011 11:36 PM (GMT -6)   
Dave,

For me, the bee propolis stopped my bleeding, and severe lower back pain the next day after taking it...a few days after that, it cut my daily BM's down from 30+/day to about 15/day and it got better from there as I slowly and carefully added the rest of the things I use in my regime listed in my sig below. I started with a liquid form I purchased from my local health food store, then after about a month and a half I went onto caps that I purchase from puritans pride online.
bee propolis caps 500mg one cap twice/day
omegas 369 caps one cap twice/day
probiotics 10 billion cfu once/day
vitamins C-calcium ascorbate (easy on the gut) and vitamin A each once/day
Prodiem fibre supplement one cap before bed
I've also altered my diet (no junky stuff at all, processed, fast-foods, refined sugars, ect) and exercise regularly.
I went from 30+ bloody BM's/day with lots of lower back pain to an average of 5/day no bleeding no back pain and completely formed stools, still have severe urgency issues.
~~~~~~~~My bum is broken....there's a big crack down the middle of it! LOL :)~~~~~~~~

pb4
Elite Member


Date Joined Feb 2004
Total Posts : 17713
   Posted 11/15/2011 11:38 PM (GMT -6)   
Dave, check out this link from the crohn's forum here at HW, it's from Brian M whom I met on another support forum years ago that I learned about the bee propolis from, he's been in remission from it ever since way back and he recently got in touch with me here at HW again to update and give more info...check it out...
 
http://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=17&m=2254244
bee propolis caps 500mg one cap twice/day
omegas 369 caps one cap twice/day
probiotics 10 billion cfu once/day
vitamins C-calcium ascorbate (easy on the gut) and vitamin A each once/day
Prodiem fibre supplement one cap before bed
I've also altered my diet (no junky stuff at all, processed, fast-foods, refined sugars, ect) and exercise regularly.
I went from 30+ bloody BM's/day with lots of lower back pain to an average of 5/day no bleeding no back pain and completely formed stools, still have severe urgency issues.
~~~~~~~~My bum is broken....there's a big crack down the middle of it! LOL :)~~~~~~~~
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