Radical Induction Theory-Time to re-visit

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loulou82
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2014
Total Posts : 59
   Posted 4/20/2017 10:10 AM (GMT -6)   
Wow this is really interesting, I've been taking a probiotic supplement that only contains lactobacillus strains. I'm definitely going to stop taking them as of today. I'm still flaring so don't think they've helped anyway. I'm really curious now about which strains produce peroxide and which ones don't! I take it from the second article you posted that the bifidobacterium do not produce hydrogen peroxide?
34, Left sided colitis. Diagnosed 03/17
Hashimotos thyroiditis & acid reflux

Currently taking:
04/17 predsol enemas, 20mg Omeprazole, 100mcg levothyroxine
Prev tried:
01/17 reaction to pentasa enema, 03/17 reaction to entocort enemas

Waiting follow up with GI to start oral meds
Diet: Gluten free, limited dairy
Supplements: lglutamine, glycine, biotin, Omega3 & vitD

Old Mike
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2007
Total Posts : 3693
   Posted 4/20/2017 12:10 PM (GMT -6)   
Looks like bifido are ok, but if I remember correctly they might bother me, but I cant
be sure now if it was a single strain probiotic or not.

If you take probiotics whether they make you worse or better might depend on your
antioxidant status,as far as converting peroxide to water.
The nitty gritty is complex, but the basic concept should be easy for everyone to understand.
Old Mike
UC-1980, same flare since 1986. Still smoke. MEDS: None
SELENIUM for GPx, Zinc,NAC, glycine up to 10 grams a day, for Glutathione. Folate,B12.
SOD makes me worse. Why. Makes too much hydrogen peroxide from superoxide,
then not enough GPx and catalase to convert to water,then makes hydroxyl radical.
Curcumin-Thins my blood too much.

loulou82
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2014
Total Posts : 59
   Posted 4/20/2017 12:25 PM (GMT -6)   
Yes the basic concept is easy to understand, it's when I start digging into the detail it all gets very complex. Thanks for sharing the information, I'm still reading back over a lot of it to get my head around some of the detail. It's fascinating.
34, Left sided colitis. Diagnosed 03/17
Hashimotos thyroiditis & acid reflux

Currently taking:
04/17 predsol enemas, 20mg Omeprazole, 100mcg levothyroxine
Prev tried:
01/17 reaction to pentasa enema, 03/17 reaction to entocort enemas

Waiting follow up with GI to start oral meds
Diet: Gluten free, limited dairy
Supplements: lglutamine, glycine, biotin, Omega3 & vitD

Old Mike
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2007
Total Posts : 3693
   Posted 4/21/2017 7:58 AM (GMT -6)   
Here is another ROS generator.
NADPH oxidase.
Inhibitors, folate,berberine,I might guess there are others.

Like I said in another post I used to try and take supplements one or a few at a time so
I could determine what might be working if anything. Seems that nothing works for me anyway.
However now coming to the conclusion that if there is any chance to fix the mess,
that a multiple supplement approach might be necessary. This is due to the fact that there
are so many metabolic pathways that need to be blocked or upregulated.
Old Mike
/bmcgastroenterol.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1471-230X-13-159

looks like I am becoming forgetful, I have a 2014 thread on nadph oxidase
www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=38&m=3200657

here is something on butyrate and histone deacetylase, yet when they tested butyrate enemas
on UC people, it did not do much good
/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2959755

Post Edited (Old Mike) : 4/24/2017 8:57:36 AM (GMT-6)


Loulouburman
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2017
Total Posts : 21
   Posted 4/21/2017 12:54 PM (GMT -6)   
That's interesting. Apparently hydrocortisone is a NADPH oxidase inhibitor (this is all new learning for me):

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC322611

Looks like some flavanoids are also inhibiors:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/2959755

In a way it's good that you've tried these supplements before because although they didn't work for you individually you will know which ones to avoid or build up dosage slowly if you had any adverse effects previously. From reading all the information and I'm sure I've got more to read it definitely sounds like a multi supplement approach is worth a shot.

Old Mike
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2007
Total Posts : 3693
   Posted Yesterday 7:22 AM (GMT -6)   
I urge everyone to read Pravdas patent.
It explains what is going on with UC, quite well from a peroxide standpoint.
The RIT still makes the most sense to me, since when I quit smoking in 1977 got UC 1980.
Starting smoking again in 82 went into remission until 86 when I tried quitting again.
But ever since then no remission even with smoking.

Key points, he explains.
The electron transport chain in smoking.
Why UC hits in the rectum first.
Glutathione peroxidase more important than catalase.
Many other aspects,including Calcium pyruvate

Old Mike

/www.google.com/patents/US8476233

here is something on peroxide inducing tnf which I dont think Pravda covered
I have not looked into to this in the past

/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18562577

more info peroxide and tnf = double wammy
/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20845069

here is something on RA and Remicade reducing ROS
[url]http://www.clinexprheumatol.org/article.asp?a=3268[/url

this is for reference I have not tried calcium pyruavte yet which is an antioxidant




full article on calcium pyruavate-read it
Something is going strange with links, cant post properly

Post Edited (Old Mike) : 4/24/2017 8:59:54 AM (GMT-6)


Old Mike
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2007
Total Posts : 3693
   Posted Yesterday 9:03 AM (GMT -6)   

FlowersGal
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2017
Total Posts : 124
   Posted Yesterday 10:59 PM (GMT -6)   
Since you guys seem to understand all this better than I -- can I ask some advice about supplements? Basically what I've been doing is throwing everything plus the kitchen sink at it and I'm getting worried that I'm overdoing the supplements. Plus spending a lot of $$$ probably unnecessarily (but the vitamin shop loves me!)

So what out of the following supplements would you consider the best four UC?

Curcurmin, l-glutamine, zinc, coq10, boswellia, glycine, colostrum, reservatol, quercetin.
Partial Colectomy for diverticulitis Sept 2014
UC Diagnosis March 2016 - 18 days in hospital with pancolitis
Apriso .375 g x 4/day
Canasa suppositories as needed
Methotrexate 2.5 mg x 4/week
Levothyroxine .50 mcg/day
Zoloft for depression
Supplements: Zinc, L-glutamine, VSL #3, Folic Acid, CoQ10, turmeric,
Started Entyvio Wed., 3/29/17
Constant flares since March 2016 only relieved by Prednisone

Old Mike
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2007
Total Posts : 3693
   Posted Today 4:43 AM (GMT -6)   
I am afraid you might have to experiment, to see what might work for you if anything.
Some do well on curcumin, but it did nothing for me except make my blood thin.
Zinc, vitamin D,Selenium,for sure.
Rutin as opposed to quercetin, rutin makes it to the colon. I have done tons,did nothing.
Methyl folate as opposed to folic acid it you can handle it, gave me D,
but I am now trying at a lower dose.
Nac,theronine to make mucus,glycine to make glutathione with NAC.

But as I said before no supplement seems to do anything for me.
But I have had many adverse events from certain supplements.
I have boxes of stuff.

You can save some money if you buy on ebay, many times but not always it is less
expensive, than local.

This might not be the best thread to get the answers you are looking for.

Old Mike

Post Edited (Old Mike) : 4/25/2017 5:45:09 AM (GMT-6)


Loulouburman
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2017
Total Posts : 21
   Posted Today 6:43 AM (GMT -6)   
Thanks for the links old Mike, some more very interesting articles all pointing to the same issue perpetuating the ongoing cycle of UC. Can see that glutathione peroxidase is more important than catalase, just trying to pick out all the supplements that will help increase glutathione in the colon but that won't have counteracting side effects. Because these are new supplements for me I want to introduce them slowly to make sure I don't have negative effects. Keen to give them a go though!

Interesting article about calcium pyruvate too, will have to do some research on this particular antioxidant.
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