Kratom as a natural pain reliever?

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Lymer
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   Posted 10/10/2012 11:03 PM (GMT -6)   
Has anyone tried Kratom?

If so, is it safe? Effective?

I'm looking for natural alternatives to treat my symptoms.

This is mainly because my doctors insist I should be taking Prednisone for pain. Even though I insist it's making everything worse.

It's time to take matters into my own hands.

As much as possible, anyway

borderlyme
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Date Joined Jul 2011
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   Posted 10/11/2012 9:59 PM (GMT -6)   
I can't vouch specifically for this herb, but natural remedies can be just as effective - and potent - as pharmaceuticals. They're essentially natural versions of drugs, so just like pharmaceuticals, they can have side effects, and interact with other things, and need to be taken responsibly. If possible you could try to find an herbalist or naturopath to consult with.

Unfortunately, doctors don't always listen to their patients. Steroids like prednisone often cause problems for people with lyme disease by suppressing immune function. Of course no one here can tell you what to do, but neither can your doctor. You don't have to take the prednisone!

I'm no expert on herbs, but usually anti-inflammatory herbs are a good go-to for pain management. There are so many out there - here's one list of many you can find by doing a little internet research theconsciouslife.com/9-natural-anti-inflammatory-herbs.htm

Teasel root is another one that I hear of a lot of people using with lyme - usually more for the arthritic kind of pain. I love a little chamomile when it comes to nerve-related pain. Hope this helps some!
Co-Moderator, Lyme Disease Forum

ekwp123
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Date Joined Dec 2013
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   Posted 12/16/2013 10:45 PM (GMT -6)   
I have had some success with Kratom as a natural pain reducer. It's hard to say if it works for everyone but I have not heard about any negative experiences, just that it can be ineffective for some. Depends on your situation but it might be worth a try.

I know that the online store I buy from mails a free sample if you just ask.

www.kwikkratom.com

Post Edited (ekwp123) : 12/16/2013 9:49:54 PM (GMT-7)


Traveler
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   Posted 12/17/2013 11:49 AM (GMT -6)   
Please be aware of interactions with other drugs. It's not recommended for those on warfarin and other blood thinning therapies. This has not been studied well and so those who choose to use it really need to do a lot of their own research to be sure that it's not something that will only make them worse, or put them in the hospital.
Treatment for Lyme & Bart ended Dec. 2011 - no active symptoms
Treatment for Babesia ended Dec. 2012 - no active symptoms
Healed and loving life!

Had Lyme, Bart, Babs, RMSF, Ehrlichia, Myco, Anaplasmosis, EBV

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Lichen
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Date Joined Nov 2013
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   Posted 12/17/2013 12:56 PM (GMT -6)   
ekwp123,

How much Kratom should a person take for pain relief, and what is the best way to take it, in your opinion? Any info you can provide is much appreciated. Thanks!

Lichen

justin2016
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Date Joined Dec 2016
Total Posts : 4
   Posted 12/16/2016 10:44 AM (GMT -6)   
Kratom doesn't necessarily have any large medical studies that I'm aware of, but it has been used for centuries in Asian countries. I've personally experienced a lot of pain relief from kratom. You should consult with your doctor and do a bit of research on strains and dosage levels. There is a good post on this blog I added to regarding different strain effects: www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=16&m=3416854&p=1

There are tons of online vendors but I usually buy kratom from PA Botanicals www.pabotanicals.com

PeteZa
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   Posted 12/16/2016 11:13 AM (GMT -6)   
From the information I have seen on Kratom, it can be addictive if used on a daily basis. And, it appears that you can get a tolerance to it and will need more and more.

I have a lot of osteoarthritis pain and so I looked into it for that.

It didn't sound like the right choice for me. But, we are all different.

This guy keeps his site pretty well updated regarding Kratom - www.sagewisdom.org/kratomguide.html
____________
When life gives you lemons, just add them to water and detox.

Girlie
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Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32685
   Posted 12/16/2016 12:09 PM (GMT -6)   
Lichen - I have no input about the Kratom, but just wanted to welcome you back to the forum.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14; added biaxin Sept. 26/14 Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.; Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin); Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif; Nov. switched mino to

Psilociraptor
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Date Joined Jul 2016
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   Posted 12/16/2016 12:23 PM (GMT -6)   
Kratom is a godsend for pain and productivity. It has a learning curve and can cause some terrible nausea while you're learning how to use it properly but once you got it down... start low and slow. Don't make excessive motions until you know your constitution better

Psilociraptor
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Date Joined Jul 2016
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   Posted 12/16/2016 12:41 PM (GMT -6)   
Also while Kratom is absolutely addicting the risk is way overstated. Coffee is far more addicting IMO (though I find coffee more addicting than most drugs). I've been practically dependent on moderately large daily doses of kratom the past semester to get through school. Yes I wanted it ever day. Come Christmas break with no school stress my cravings disappeared and I have been cold turkey for several days after 3 months of continuous use with no issue. I've been doing this on and off for years. So life factors can certainly factor into dependence but in and of itself it's not some malicious entity that makes helpless users nor is the risk of physical dependency very large. Some do get withdrawals but it's rare. Nowhere close to. Conventional opioids. I would consider kratom about as safe if no more so than MJ and with far less behavioral impacts.

dogsblood
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2016
Total Posts : 200
   Posted 12/16/2016 5:54 PM (GMT -6)   
I've ordered some but am worried about taking it with ABX due to interactions or stressing my already overworked liver.

madisongrrl
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2016
Total Posts : 230
   Posted 12/17/2016 1:18 PM (GMT -6)   
I have not taken it myself, but it has helped many on my neuropathy forum with their severe pain. I do know that it isn't legal everywhere. I can not get it in Wisconsin.

ChickenArise
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Date Joined Nov 2015
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   Posted 12/17/2016 3:19 PM (GMT -6)   
i have been using it for about 5 months. i must say i agree with everything the pro kratom people have said before me including the cautions.

I used 7-8 grams as needed (4-6 hours daily) to come off of Oxycontin, Gabapentin, NSAIDS, and cut my alprazolam use to half of what it was. Most need just 3-4 grams for effect. My dosing is on the high side, but that is what works for me.

Take it after eating as eating itself dampens the effect. This is good to know in case you feel like you took a bit too much, just eat something.

Tolerance has caused me to need 9-10 grams. It does happen quickly. I reset this level by using whats left of my Oxy for four days but always go back to Kratom.

Soon i wont have the luxury of anything other than Kratom. When this is the case then I will rotate strains. I have no desire to get high and dont think Kratom is good for that anyway.

It works great for me for pain and anxiety. it provides much needed energy and bettter focus.

I prefer Green Maeng Da for daytime dosing and Borneo at night as the former is a bit too stimulating.

It works so amazingly on pain that one might expect to get high from it and I think these people will be the only ones disappointed.

I haven't had any known reaction with any meds I was or am taking. I did have a reaction to too much coffee while using Kratom which led to tremors, but about the same time I was coming off of Gabapentin so its difficult to say what caused what.

It took high doses of alprazolam to stabilize the few times this has happened. This hasn't happened in a while and I have about a mug of coffee daily.

I buy from EZ Kratom wholesale. This is the only way it makes economic sense. You would want to try some before ordering a kilo. Avoid the extracts as they aren't worth the added cost and are overhyped.

Post Edited (ChickenArise) : 12/20/2016 10:38:13 AM (GMT-7)


dogsblood
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Date Joined Sep 2016
Total Posts : 200
   Posted 12/20/2016 10:37 AM (GMT -6)   
I took four grams of red kratom the other night and the pain went away quickly.

Psilociraptor
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Date Joined Jul 2016
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   Posted 3/16/2018 5:35 AM (GMT -6)   
So since this thread is old I'll add an update to my experience... which is just to say that I still use kratom daily with no issue. TBH though i need it more for my fatigue and motivation than my pain these days. I love it

ChickenArise
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Date Joined Nov 2015
Total Posts : 1508
   Posted 3/16/2018 9:26 AM (GMT -6)   
That is great that it is working for you. If for any reason it stops working or you need it more frequently then consider that the source of your pain or ailment still exists in your environment. If you have a failed dose, be careful how much you add to it.

A word of caution to those who are thinking of trying it. Avoid the enhanced or extracts. It adds cost and risk. You should only be using this in its natural form the way nature intended.

1000 mg of Agmatine Sulfate daily goes a long way to keep tolerance lower. If you find yourself in a position of weaning in the future, this addition may be key for you as everyone's withdrawal stories are different ranging from nothing and extending to rehab clinics. The less regular you use the more effective it will be.

I am a daily user for well over a year now and this fall it will be two. My dose is now 13 grams as needed. I am coming from a place of former medical dependence on opiates, so this Kratom has been a godsend for me. Compared to opiate withdrawal this should be a breeze, but it has been said that everyone must pay the piper at some point.

Will that be true for me also? I dont know. I have gone a day without it but not two. When it comes time to come off of this I will share the experience with all of you.

2014 Mold Sick,2015 Clinical Lyme and co.,2016 Morgellons,2017 Remission
YT: ClintFromNYtoVA2
Twitter: @ClintFromNYtoVA
Blog: www.fascinatingtimetobealive.blogspot.com/
" The path to disappointment is paved with expectations "

Post Edited (ChickenArise) : 3/16/2018 9:36:36 AM (GMT-6)


insomniaaa
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Date Joined Apr 2017
Total Posts : 150
   Posted 3/17/2018 5:22 PM (GMT -6)   
Can I use kratom as a sleeping aid?

Should I ingest it in the morning?

What dose should I start with?

How do you consume it? can I just eat it?

Thanks.

Inspiredby3
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2013
Total Posts : 359
   Posted 3/17/2018 5:49 PM (GMT -6)   
Thanks for posting about this. I have been taking Butrans patch and Tramadol for pain relief and after about 4 years, the Butrans stopped working. I was put on Fentanyl patch and it’s not giving me any relief. I have constant severe pain and can’t take care of my kids and home when am in so much pain. Would really love to have more natural way of relieving pain than stronger and stronger opioids. Even if just to take every so often to bring down tolerance to other pain meds. Would definitely love all the info as asked in questions in post by Insomniaaa.
Found tick and oval rash March 2012
Got sick 2.5 months later.
Tested negative for Lyme and coinfections. Treatment started Dec. 2012. In 2014 tested positive for Bartonella. Clinically diagnosed with a Babesia in 2015. Taking - Minocycline, clindamycin and Plaquenil. Buhner and Cowden herbs. MTHFR mutation

Lapis_29
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Date Joined Sep 2017
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   Posted 3/17/2018 5:57 PM (GMT -6)   
Inspiredby3 said...
Thanks for posting about this. I have been taking Butrans patch and Tramadol for pain relief and after about 4 years, the Butrans stopped working. I was put on Fentanyl patch and it’s not giving me any relief. I have constant severe pain and can’t take care of my kids and home when am in so much pain. Would really love to have more natural way of relieving pain than stronger and stronger opioids. Even if just to take every so often to bring down tolerance to other pain meds. Would definitely love all the info as asked in questions in post by Insomniaaa.

\]

try dmso, works great. natural anti inflammatory and pain reliever. just make sure area is claen before applying.

look for dmso products on amazon sold by 'dmso store' those are what you want, others are mostly crap.

ChickenArise
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Date Joined Nov 2015
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   Posted 3/17/2018 6:23 PM (GMT -6)   
Q:Can I use kratom as a sleeping aid?

A:There are some sedating strains, Red Borneo and to a lesser extent Green Raiu. Many strains are stimulating so you would want to avoid most types 3 hours before bed.

Q:Should I ingest it in the morning?

A: The stimulating strains like Green Maeng Da, Green Malay, and all Whites should be used in the morning. I am not a big fan of many Red strains whereas some swear by them. Green Maeng Da is my favorite for pain and motivation.

Q: What dose should I start with?

A: 3-4 grams. You should time how long it takes to affect you. For me its 1 hour but I have heard as little as 20 minutes. This way you know when to add another gram or two if needed. Try not to add more than 2 grams in this period.
(If coming off narcotics you should use a high dose and cease taking the narcotic. 7-8 grams is a high dose.)

Q: How do you consume it? can I just eat it?

A: Some make a tea using lemon juice. There are videos on line for how to make this. I have never succeeded at making a powerful batch of tea. In my opinion you get more from the method called Toss and Wash. Although it is very bitter.

I place a bit of sweet liquid in the bottom of a used 20 oz iced tea bottle which has a wider mouth and makes it easier to spoon in with a tiny spoon. Then I tare the scale to zero. Then I add the Kratom powder unitl it reaches my desired dose. Put the lid back on. Shake it and drink it down. Then pour in some more drink in, shake, and rinse so I get all of the goodness as well as accurate dosing. If you pour the powder in first it will stick to the bottom so pour some liquid in first.

Some cant stand the taste and add it to apple sauce. Be cautious of coffee consumption as it potentiates the Kratom. I have heard Grapefruit juice does also but in my opinion this is one of the more dangerous potentiaters. Alcohol should not be used either.

If you ever take too high of a dose, or accidentally double up like I did, you might get some tremors which will be relative to the dose. If this happens eat a decent amount of food. Food consumption seems to lessen its effect. For me Alprazolam will calm this down also but I have needed a relatively large 2.5 mg dose. Then go lie in front of the TV until it wears off. The TV will help keep your mind off of it.

2014 Mold Sick,2015 Clinical Lyme and co.,2016 Morgellons,2017 Remission
YT: ClintFromNYtoVA2
Twitter: @ClintFromNYtoVA
Blog: www.fascinatingtimetobealive.blogspot.com/
" The path to disappointment is paved with expectations "

insomniaaa
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2017
Total Posts : 150
   Posted 3/18/2018 3:47 PM (GMT -6)   
Thank you very much for the answers.
I forgot to ask some key questions though:

Is kratom bactericidal / antiviral / antifungal ? Can it cause herxheimer reactions?

Does Kratom increase the heart rate? Or any other side effects that I should know about?

Thanks.

ChickenArise
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Date Joined Nov 2015
Total Posts : 1508
   Posted 3/18/2018 4:22 PM (GMT -6)   
insomniaaa said...
Thank you very much for the answers.
I forgot to ask some key questions though:

Is kratom bactericidal / antiviral / antifungal ? Can it cause herxheimer reactions?

Does Kratom increase the heart rate? Or any other side effects that I should know about?

Thanks.


There is no evidence that Kratom has any antibiotic activity of any kind nor do I suspect it does.

Kratom although stimulating has no more effect on heart rate than coffee as it is from the same family of plant.

At doses higher than recommended it might lead to temporary anxiety or tremors but I have not noticed any other side effect. Some have indicated an increase in constipation or bowel movements which may be green from all the powder. So expect this may happen. They may also have more volume when you toss and wash the powder, so dont be alarmed if you experience this.

I use magnesium to keep things moving easily.

2014 Mold Sick,2015 Clinical Lyme and co.,2016 Morgellons,2017 Remission
YT: ClintFromNYtoVA2
Twitter: @ClintFromNYtoVA
Blog: www.fascinatingtimetobealive.blogspot.com/
" The path to disappointment is paved with expectations "

ChickenArise
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Date Joined Nov 2015
Total Posts : 1508
   Posted 3/21/2018 7:34 PM (GMT -6)   
I want to make a correction. It appears Kratom has anti- fungal properties and possibly anti parasitical properties. One article even mentions anti-bacterial properties. Of course we wont find any studies in Pub Med but nice to know there may be benefits in addition to its pain killing properties.

One person claims it cleared their candida. So maybe good for mold.

/www.curezone.org/forums/am.asp?i=1996596
/www.nuenergy.org/5-surprising-benefits-kratom-natural-health/

2014 Mold Sick,2015 Clinical Lyme and co.,2016 Morgellons,2017 Remission
YT: ClintFromNYtoVA2
Twitter: @ClintFromNYtoVA
Blog: www.fascinatingtimetobealive.blogspot.com/
" The path to disappointment is paved with expectations "
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