How many spirochetes do you see in your vision?

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LymePickle
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Date Joined Mar 2014
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   Posted 5/30/2014 8:06 PM (GMT -6)   
Just wondering if anyone else sees spirochetes in their vision and how many they counted? Back in February I remember looking around and seeing about 20... They were even wiggling around and were shaped like squiggles. The past 4 weeks I only had one, I think it is a dead one because he is not moving anywhere but he is right in the middle of my vision. I the past few days I noticed one going vertically. But this one was wiggling around so I guess they must be still left.

Maine76
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Date Joined Jan 2014
Total Posts : 993
   Posted 5/30/2014 10:13 PM (GMT -6)   
What?! I have floaters.. God I hope I don't see spirochetes in my vision. I do have vision problems. What color are they, blackish like floaters it what? I do not want to see them it's bad enough to know we have me, I am all set with seeing them.

LymePickle
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Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 2132
   Posted 5/30/2014 10:31 PM (GMT -6)   
Well I see squiggles... They look like spirochetes to me and move like spirochetes. They wiggle around, I wish they would go away because they are bugging me.
Caught Lyme, Bartonella, and Mycoplasma Pneumonia from a friends tear in an unlucky casual contact.
IND 31, IND 39, ++ for 41, and + for 58. Indicating an acute exposure.
ABX: Minocycline 100mg 2x day, Tinidazole 500mg 2x day 5 days on 2 days off, Septra DS 1 pill 2x day, Plaquenil 200 mg 2x day.
Other anti-microbials: A-Bart, Houttuynia, Banderol, Samento, Japanese Knotweed.

Mom of 2
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Date Joined May 2013
Total Posts : 306
   Posted 5/31/2014 9:41 AM (GMT -6)   
I've had the same sight issues for many years. When I first noticed them I made an eye appointment. The eye doc told me I had Scheerer's Phenomenon, copy and paste link below. I also see them with any light colored background, but the squiggles are dark in color as well as light. I can tell they are moving in fluid from the ripples I see, like a pebble dropping in water.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_field_entoptic_phenomenon

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 33957
   Posted 5/31/2014 12:53 PM (GMT -6)   
OMG - If I start seeing spirochetes in my vision I think that will put me over the edge. That will just be too much! ugh

MarieLS
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Date Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts : 2690
   Posted 7/8/2014 2:27 AM (GMT -6)   
Lymepickle,
Do you have any proof of the floaters being spirochetes? If so, please share it with us.

Please all, have a look at this link. It explains what floaters are, and how they are formed. You are not seeing spirochetes in your vision. A LOT of healthy people have floaters.

http://www.kellogg.umich.edu/patientcare/conditions/floaters.html

MarieLS
Moderator, Lyme Forum

Borrelia/Bartonella/Yersinia/Chlamydia Pn.

Started getting sick about 20yrs ago, diagnosed 2yrs ago.

Started treatment August 2012: 15 months of abx, followed by a modified Cowden Protocol since December 2013. On LDN for pain.

~The wound is the place where the Light enters you~

Soaring Free
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2013
Total Posts : 714
   Posted 7/8/2014 6:24 AM (GMT -6)   
Yep, I have floaters. I went BACK to my opthalmalogist and asked him about them. All he could say was they are 'debris' in the fluid around the eye and that EVERYONE has them, and that since I've suffered with them for 6-8 I should 'be used to them.'

I asked him what was the 'debris'. All he said was just debris, just debris, just debris. He had no answer.

He aslo said my new script/lenses are made wrong by the eye glass place. Of course he didn't do anything wrong.

WHY do all the dr's I see ALWAYS pass the buck? I'm so tired of all of this.

MarieLS
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts : 2690
   Posted 7/8/2014 6:54 AM (GMT -6)   
A lot of the drs are plain lazy. Over here it's almost a miracle if you get to see a dr for a total of 15mins. You haven't even finished asking your questions, and they already take their pen and book to write you the receipt and collect the money.
I make it a habit to make a list with all of my questions, and I go through that list. I don't get my money out as long as my list isn't finished, even if the receipt is already in front of me.
Moderator, Lyme Forum

Borrelia/Bartonella/Yersinia/Chlamydia Pn.

Started getting sick about 20yrs ago, diagnosed 2yrs ago.

Started treatment August 2012: 15 months of abx, followed by a modified Cowden Protocol since December 2013. On LDN for pain.

~The wound is the place where the Light enters you~

LymePickle
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 2132
   Posted 7/8/2014 9:53 AM (GMT -6)   
Hi MarieLS, sorry I didn't see your post before you were asking me if I have any proof that these are spirochetes in my vision.

Well I have no idea how to prove to someone I can see spirochetes in my vision since I'm the only one that sees from my vision.

To describe it... I see it in bright light, for example being outside in the bright sunlight or mid day. When I look around I can see squiggles. Yes squiggles, not "floaters". Floaters to me are little circles and yes I have had those before Lyme disease but very few of them. After Lyme disease I now see squiggles as well. At one point back in February I could swear they were even moving around! At times during antibiotic therapy they started to look dead like just floating there. Sometimes they appeared shorter and bent. There were also times when I see them form into a partial cyst form. You know where one end of the spirochete has balled up and it excretes that protective layer but the whole spirochete didn't ball up? So I see those half cyst half spirochete forms too. Lol. I'm not saying I know for sure these are spirochetes in my vision but it makes sense to me that they could be. I never saw these before Lyme disease, and they are squiggles not floaters.
I am taking 1500 mg amoxicillin twice daily with 500 mg GSE twice daily. I also take Septra DS twice daily.
I'm also taking daily detox, greens +, vitamin D, immune building mushroom mix, ashwagandha, Meriva -500 concentrated curcumin, NT factor, kelp, low dose naltrexone, coconut oil, and chlorella. I take serrapeptase and lumbrokinase for biofilms.
Caught Lyme, Bartonella, and Mycoplasma Pneumonia from a friends tear in an unlucky casual contact. Lyme is definitely spread in bodily fluids and I am living proof of that.

chloe24
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2014
Total Posts : 236
   Posted 7/8/2014 10:58 AM (GMT -6)   
I see exactly the same thing as you in bright light. When I turn on my light in the morning I see them, or outside. Some are round balls, some squiggles. It's like an outline.i want them gone too.
=]chloe

Roxie60
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jun 2011
Total Posts : 1150
   Posted 7/8/2014 11:56 AM (GMT -6)   
I call tjose sqiggly bent moving things you described as floaters. Yiu did good job describing them. Never seen circles.

Post Edited (Roxie60) : 7/8/2014 10:59:58 AM (GMT-6)


Tbrown2
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2013
Total Posts : 389
   Posted 7/8/2014 12:46 PM (GMT -6)   
I have "floaters" as well and didn't have them until Lyme. Lines, squiggles,circles etc. My LLMD never seems to be concerned when I mention them and claims she's hears patience say it all the time. I do not believe they are spirochetes just possible damaged collagen.

TICKLEDPINK
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts : 914
   Posted 7/8/2014 1:13 PM (GMT -6)   
I don't believe for a moment that any human eye is capable of detecting spirochetes,they're far too miniscule.......you would have to have the powers of Superman!

windypetunia
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2014
Total Posts : 80
   Posted 7/8/2014 1:28 PM (GMT -6)   
I have floaters that look like little bulls eye targets. Anyone else?

Traveler
Elite Member


Date Joined May 2007
Total Posts : 36310
   Posted 7/8/2014 2:51 PM (GMT -6)   
As disturbing as this can be, and although floaters have many shapes, and sometimes even some color, they are not the bacteria. We don't have super human vision to see that small. Floaters are something most people have (especially as we get a bit older), whether or not they notice them.

www.kellogg.umich.edu/patientcare/conditions/floaters.html
Herb only treatment for Lyme & Bart ended Dec. 2011 - no active symptoms -Herb only treatment for Babesia ended Dec. 2012 - no active symptoms
Healed from tick-borne infections, now healing from the damage they left behind.
www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=2977364

Had Lyme, Bart, Babs, RMSF, Ehrlichia, Myco, Anaplasmosis, EBV

Questions? Please email me!!!

needhelp4
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Date Joined Apr 2014
Total Posts : 648
   Posted 7/8/2014 3:54 PM (GMT -6)   
I see what you describe - especially when I am driving - I see those spirochette shapes vertically. The floaters are WAAAAY TOO MANY - IT'S ANNOYING AS HECK!! They are floating around as I am writing this. Do you find that your vision gets tired /fatigued easily and gets blurry? Lately, I can't even be on the computer long. It's ridiculous and just makes my anxiety worse. I started A-Bart lastweek - I wonder if that has anything to do with all this visual activity.

LymeLondon
New Member


Date Joined Aug 2013
Total Posts : 4
   Posted 7/8/2014 5:48 PM (GMT -6)   
This phenomenon also explains some of what people might be seeing here:

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_field_entoptic_phenomenon

LymePickle
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 2132
   Posted 7/8/2014 5:52 PM (GMT -6)   
I understand people think the spirochetes are 'too small' to be seen by the human eye.  Then why are these squiggles in exact proportion to the dimensions of a spirochete!  Also antibiotics has helped dissolve them away.  If there is just one photon of light that hits one cone in the eyes vision, we can say that is one kind of 'pixel' in the human vision.  It could be just the size of 1 beam of light!  So if that area is blocked by a spirochete the light would still pass through the spirochete and get to the fovea, but it will distort the light a tiny bit.  I think this is what is happening.  If you take your finger and move it closer to your eye it appears bigger than if you are holding it far away, so what ever is inside the eye can be picked up and be even more magnified. 
 
Before these things were swimming around in my vision even!  I'm pretty sure they are spirochetes.  If not then they are bundles of collagen caused from the damage of spirochetes.  But either way I'm going to keep taking antibiotics until they are all gone.  The eyes are actually one of the 'safe places' for lyme disease to get to. It is difficult to treat these infections but I would like to believe the amoxicillin is helping me. 

LymePickle
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 2132
   Posted 7/8/2014 5:53 PM (GMT -6)   
Anyways, I'm down to 2 spirochetes in my eye now. Quite a change since before I saw close to 100 but it was difficult to count because every time I moved my eyes the spirochetes also moved.

Traveler
Elite Member


Date Joined May 2007
Total Posts : 36310
   Posted 7/8/2014 7:08 PM (GMT -6)   
It's really quite simple, Lymepickle - the human eye simply cannot see bacteria without the aid of a microscope - even if they reside in the eye itself.

It is however, something interesting that we (I saw those squiggles too) see this specific shape, when we are infected with a bacteria that looks similar.
Herb only treatment for Lyme & Bart ended Dec. 2011 - no active symptoms -Herb only treatment for Babesia ended Dec. 2012 - no active symptoms
Healed from tick-borne infections, now healing from the damage they left behind.
www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=2977364

Had Lyme, Bart, Babs, RMSF, Ehrlichia, Myco, Anaplasmosis, EBV

Questions? Please email me!!!

Chapelle
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Date Joined Feb 2014
Total Posts : 2604
   Posted 7/8/2014 7:11 PM (GMT -6)   
so what are the squiggles? Is it just the vision that is impaired?? Because I thought the same, I thought it was impossible to see bacteria without a microscope?

MarieLS
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Dec 2012
Total Posts : 2690
   Posted 7/9/2014 5:51 AM (GMT -6)   
Spirochetes are usually much longer than they are wide, and often their width is below the resolving power of the light microscope. A Borrelia Burghdorferi spirochete may have a length of 10-30µm but a width of only 0.2-0.3µm. Therefore most spirochetes cannot be viewed using conventional light microscopy. Dark-field microscopy must be used to view spirochetes. Dark field microscopy utilizes a special condenser which directs light towards an object at an angle, rather than from the bottom. As a result, particles or cells are seen as light objects against a dark background.
The Borrelia Burghdorferi spirochete is as long, as a fine human hair is thick.



Floaters can have the form of dots, circles, lines, cobwebs, thread-like strands, or squiggly lines. They move as your eyes move and seem to dart away when you try to look at them directly. They do not follow your eye movements precisely, and usually drift when your eyes stop moving.

Floaters are small clumps of cells or tissue that form in the vitreous humor, the clear jelly-like substance that fills the inside cavity of the eye. Although they appear to be in front of the eye, they are actually floating in the vitreous gel and are seen as shadows cast on the retina (the light-sensing inner layer of the eye).
Moderator, Lyme Forum

Borrelia/Bartonella/Yersinia/Chlamydia Pn.

Started getting sick about 20yrs ago, diagnosed 2yrs ago.

Started treatment August 2012: 15 months of abx, followed by a modified Cowden Protocol since December 2013. On LDN for pain.

~The wound is the place where the Light enters you~

Post Edited (MarieLS) : 7/9/2014 6:54:54 AM (GMT-6)


TICKLEDPINK
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Date Joined Jul 2012
Total Posts : 914
   Posted 7/9/2014 7:35 AM (GMT -6)   
Brilliant explanation Marie

Thanks :-)

needhelp4
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Date Joined Apr 2014
Total Posts : 648
   Posted 7/9/2014 8:52 AM (GMT -6)   
Marie - that's good information, but I am still puzzled. Three years ago, I was told I have thinning of the retinas ( was seeing a lot of peripheral flashes, almost like rolling flames, but without the heat - still do practically EVERYDAY), but lately, it's been tons and tons and tons of floaters and especially worse when I am on the computer or driving. I also see those "spirochettes" that LymePickle speaks about. So is what you're saying, all due to the health/state of the retinas? By the way, my vision is REALLLLLLLY BAD ( coke bottles for glasses type situation - even the thinnest lenses look hefty.).

Traveler
Elite Member


Date Joined May 2007
Total Posts : 36310
   Posted 7/9/2014 8:54 AM (GMT -6)   
I've read this site as well, and what it says about this is:
"Floaters are small clumps of cells or tissue that form in the vitreous humor, the clear jelly-like substance that fills the inside cavity of the eye. Although they appear to be in front of the eye, they are actually floating in the vitreous gel and are seen as shadows cast on the retina"

What we are seeing are actually shadows.
Herb only treatment for Lyme & Bart ended Dec. 2011 - no active symptoms -Herb only treatment for Babesia ended Dec. 2012 - no active symptoms
Healed from tick-borne infections, now healing from the damage they left behind.
www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=2977364

Had Lyme, Bart, Babs, RMSF, Ehrlichia, Myco, Anaplasmosis, EBV

Questions? Please email me!!!
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