Arm weakness & toxicity

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borderlyme
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Date Joined Jul 2011
Total Posts : 1486
   Posted 2/5/2015 11:10 AM (GMT -6)   
Hey all...just curious if anyone has any thoughts on this. One of the symptoms I've gotten on and off (by which I mean like on for a year off for a year) is this arm weakness, and to some extent my legs too. They always feel like I just lifted a 100 pound weight and they're about to collapse - it's a challenge just to hold my arm up to drive a car, and even then I have to switch arms every few seconds and I just feel like my arm muscles are completely exhausted!

The same sort of thing happens with my legs to some extent, I'll get up to walk and have bambi legs and sometimes I'll just stop and stand in the middle of walking because they're too weak to take another step, etc.

I've noticed it gets worse when I'm doing a lot of heavy antibiotic/antimicrobial treatment - the first time was while I was doing 3 different abx for over a year, and now it's happening again doing a lot of herbs & homeopathics & bee venom every week. Basically I'm wondering WHY my arms get so weak.

My doctor seems to believe that toxicity in regards to the Lyme bacteria dying and leaving toxins and dead cells and etc. is not an issue and the only need for toxin binders or anything "detox" is for heavy metals (I disagree and have always heard much different things).

I don't know if maybe the weakness is just a result of my body being in constant fight mode (the way your body feels weak when you have the flu) or if I'm full of toxic junk!

Long story short just wondering if anyone has similar symptoms, knows what causes them, or has any thoughts as to whether this might not be Lyme related...I'm getting to a point where so many doctors have been stumped as to how to get me better even when they Lyme treatment "should" be working that I'm worried there's something else going on that's being missed because I'm so laser focused on treating Lyme - thanks in advance!

astroman
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Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 4879
   Posted 2/5/2015 11:23 AM (GMT -6)   
I thought about this also. Think I wrote a post just like this in Dec or so!

I had this before and after abx with legs. Arms only started this after starting abx - they got pretty bad and llmd pulled me off doxy and flagil. Somewhat better now off abx. It feels like a lack of circulation almost because they feel better if I "pump" them up from weights. But that effect only lasts 2 days, unless I over do it, them I'm screwd. Its a very odd feeling, I hate it. One chiro I saw who is into all this weird enegry field stuff said I was toxicaly overloaded.

borderlyme
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Date Joined Jul 2011
Total Posts : 1486
   Posted 2/5/2015 11:31 AM (GMT -6)   
I've been trying so hard lately to understand what "toxic" means...there's so much media mumbo jumbo that it's hard to find real facts. I thought it was a bit odd for my doctor to be so confident in saying all my detox mechanisms are intact simply because I don't have a ton of heavy metals...doesn't mean I'm not bogged down in all of this junk....

Chapelle
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Date Joined Feb 2014
Total Posts : 2604
   Posted 2/5/2015 11:46 AM (GMT -6)   
It could be toxicity, but for me it was the actual lyme bacteria causing this. Just like I am typing on the computer now, as I typed, my arm got weaker and weaker until I couldn't type anymore. Totally scary. This freaked me out, but as I treated the lyme, it got better. My legs were also very weak - it almost felt like they were slowly becoming numb from the inside out. Lyme severely attacked my nervous system. You said - "Basically I'm wondering WHY my arms get so weak." -

My Dr said that the lyme affects the nerves and in turn the muscles are then affected
Registered Pharmacist in NY
Tick Bite in October 2013 (didn't realize it at the time)
Started with Flu Symptoms November 2013 then Muscle/Nerve Symptoms January 2014. Clinical Self Diagnosis (lyme test was negative) in Feb 2014.....Battled lyme and bartonella for over 7 months. Finished abx treatment in Sept. So far so good !!

borderlyme
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Date Joined Jul 2011
Total Posts : 1486
   Posted 2/5/2015 11:50 AM (GMT -6)   
I guess I just wonder why my Lyme symptoms get worse as I'm treating it. Does treatment just make it angry and more active?

sarahm620
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Date Joined Feb 2014
Total Posts : 1808
   Posted 2/5/2015 11:50 AM (GMT -6)   
Yeah, I think I've had some arm weakness too. For a long time (before I knew about Lyme) I was having shoulder/upper arm issues for really no reason. We thought it was tendonitis. Now I know it was from Lyme and co and it's been flaring again. It sucks.
Sarah
-positive IGM Western Blot- 39, 41 in January 2014// Igenex & CDC positive 11/14
-positive ANA and very low CD57
Chronic daily headaches since 2005

Chapelle
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2014
Total Posts : 2604
   Posted 2/5/2015 12:13 PM (GMT -6)   
it's one of two things - either the actual lyme bacteria doing the damage or the toxins - all depends, sometimes it is so hard to tell, esp. if you have been treating it for a long time. You got worse while on abx probably bc of the toxins.
Registered Pharmacist in NY
Tick Bite in October 2013 (didn't realize it at the time)
Started with Flu Symptoms November 2013 then Muscle/Nerve Symptoms January 2014. Clinical Self Diagnosis (lyme test was negative) in Feb 2014.....Battled lyme and bartonella for over 7 months. Finished abx treatment in Sept. So far so good !!

astroman
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 4879
   Posted 2/5/2015 12:23 PM (GMT -6)   
That why I went off all abx and bug killer herbs. For time to get the toxins out.Then to see how I feel after.
Lyme symptoms late 1980's, Dx'ed 2013 by LLMD. Doxy, Flagil ABX. Felt better for a while.

springsjean
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Mar 2009
Total Posts : 2164
   Posted 2/5/2015 12:31 PM (GMT -6)   
I had this too but it got much much better with treatment. Always hard to know if the bacteria or toxins but for me I also thought was bacteria since it was there before trestment.
Prior moderator
Lyme, HME, HGE, bartonella. 4+ years undiag. despite 10 drs.
Current meds: neurontin, cymbalta, Prior meds: bactrim, doryx, amantadine, amox, minocycline, tetracy, roxithyromycin. IV refused by ins. Supplements: boluoke, alpha lipoic acid, AG immune, magnesium, milk thistle, resistant microbes, cats claw
FEELING GREAT THESE DAYS! Hang in there - it does get better.

Utahgal
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2014
Total Posts : 1242
   Posted 2/5/2015 12:40 PM (GMT -6)   
I have this terribly too. It's in my arms and legs. It does get worse while on heavy abx. So far I have not found anything to make it better. I keep hoping that if I kill enough infection, that it will resolve.
43 yrs old, symptoms for 5 yrs.
(Anxiety/panic, weakness, fatigue, cognitive dysfunction, insomnia, hair loss)
Recent IGenex test: 8/14
IGM: 18+, 23-25 IND, 31+, 39 IND, 41+, 83-93 IND
IGG: 31 IND, 39 IND, 41++
Treatment: 10/1/14: 200 mgs minocycline, 2 tablets malarone
10/24: 200 doxy, 1000 flagyl
12/1: 200 mino, 300 rifampin, 1000 tindamax

CD3764
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Sep 2014
Total Posts : 4510
   Posted 2/5/2015 2:00 PM (GMT -6)   
I developed weakness in my left leg and both hands *after* I started abx treatment.

Thankfully, I haven't dealt with either issue for awhile now.

In my case, I'm going with the toxin idea :)
7/14/14 removed nymph deer tick and started 200mg doxy for 3 wks per PCP the next day
9/18/14 met LLMD who clinically dx'd me with Lyme due to Bells Palsy and started me on ABX
10/23/14 Igenex/CDC positive for Lyme
1/8/15 LLMD will be weaning me off ABX next month and starting me on herbal protocol
Symptoms mostly related to peripheral nervous system except when I herx

bbana
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2015
Total Posts : 81
   Posted 2/6/2015 4:07 PM (GMT -6)   
Oh guys ... your posts give me hope for my mom. Since starting home lyme therapy, her arm is weaker. Her legs are already shot, so it's pretty scary. The fact you are saying it improves eventually with crazy detox is so good to hear, you have no idea!!!
daughter of mom with late-neuro Lyme (ALS type sx)
Neuro symptoms began 3/2014. Preceded by 2 significant respiratory infections and gastroenteriris within 2 months of neuro symptoms.
Igenex IgG positive
Current cocktail: Cat's claw, Banderol (tried oral doxy - was intolerant)
Detox: liposomal glutathione, curcumin, milk thistle, reservatrol, foot baths
Other stuff: Deanna protocol, lunasi

what's going on?
New Member


Date Joined Jan 2018
Total Posts : 4
   Posted 1/16/2018 8:04 PM (GMT -6)   
This is pretty much an EXACT description of my symptoms!! so far I'm undiagnosed, with one neg lyme test and awaiting results of repeat test 3 months later. I'm so relived to hear this because now I know it's lyme and it will eventually get better with treatment. the severe arm weakness made it hard to brush my teeth, wash my body, type on the computer, pretty much everything. And to drive I have to prop pillows under my arms. I started antibiotics 5 days ago and so far my leg is consistently improved and it is now much easier to brush my teeth, but driving is still really hard and I get burning pain across my shoulder blades after I use my arms too much and it lasts for hours. because lyme has such horrible die off, I'm left constantly wondering if I'm actually getting better or not as symptoms seem to be improving two steps forward and one back. This thread is giving me hope! thanks everyone!

Intuition
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2017
Total Posts : 54
   Posted 1/16/2018 8:26 PM (GMT -6)   
BorderLyme,

Yes, I have experienced the same thing in reference to arm / leg weakness. For me, it's mostly only on the left side of my body (my left). My arm is the worst, sometimes I can barely feel it. My leg is similar, but it's less severe.

I, too noticed that these symptoms flare up while I am on an herbal protocol (Buhners). I took a few weeks off during the holidays after doing the protocol consistently for 6-7 months, and noticed that these symptoms were not as apparent or noticeable. Once I went back on the protocol, I started to notice them flare up again.

astroman
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 4879
   Posted 1/16/2018 8:51 PM (GMT -6)   
Intuition- This post was from 2015, these members have mostly moved on. Two declared healing, dont know about the others progress.

I've improved a lot since then. My limbs have doubled their strength in the gym since - it was slow though. I almost thought the abx did perm damage, I had candida in my blood too though.

Post Edited (astroman) : 1/16/2018 9:09:09 PM (GMT-7)


astroman
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 4879
   Posted 1/16/2018 9:01 PM (GMT -6)   
This is a simple way to get circulation back into arms and legs to promote healing and resume strength, called Gua Sha, its extreme detox for the limbs:

/www.youtube.com/watch?v=gHhA7Kcrwec

You dont need these tools shown in video. I've used a thick comb edge and smooth part of my TheraCane.

Also do this with the bathroom counter top edge, with aloe for arms. Forearms, triceps, bicepts. Need to be more aggressive than this video shows. Once the skin turns red from breaking capillaries, then stop and the healing begins. Looks normal as few days after with improvements.

Abx stopped progression of physical symptoms, but healing on its own was minimal. The above is something good trying for anyone experiencing the same slow healing.

Post Edited (astroman) : 1/16/2018 9:13:53 PM (GMT-7)


Dahlias
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Date Joined Jun 2017
Total Posts : 456
   Posted 1/17/2018 1:43 AM (GMT -6)   
Astroman, would it be a good idea to do that before an epsom salt bath? Would you need to be careful about loosening up too much toxic stuff at once? My legs feel funny -- want to try this on them.

mudshark
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 119
   Posted 1/17/2018 9:07 AM (GMT -6)   
It's funny that no matter what symptom I have or question that comes up that there is not someone else that has dealt with the same thing and an old thread to resurrect about it LOL.

At just over 4 weeks into abx treatment for Bart I started having leg weakness/fatigue symptoms again, which I had not really had for a few months and thought were behind me. I do get it in my arms as well, but really mostly limited to just the dominant right arm. Many of my other suspected Bart symptoms have been really ramping up as well since we starting attacking it, which I see others have experienced as well. I find some comfort in these threads that these are relatively common occurrences during treatment, but it's also aggravating that some things get worse as others get better. That's what sucks about these infections, you get one under control and the other seizes the opportunity.

astroman
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 4879
   Posted 1/17/2018 10:51 AM (GMT -6)   
Dahlias said...
Astroman, would it be a good idea to do that before an epsom salt bath? Would you need to be careful about loosening up too much toxic stuff at once? My legs feel funny -- want to try this on them.


Good idea, that would promote healing as tight muscles are starved of nutrients. I used epsom salt gel per location after I do this, it helps.

Experiment on a local area before doing your whole arm,leg or all at once. Then you learn your threshold.

As I mentioned, I've done this till red on tough areas, prob not never everyone needs to be extreme though. You tube shows this done extreme and lighter, so it depends on what works for you.

I do feel ones own body weight going against a heavy unmovable object (like a rounded counter top) works better than these "tools" shown on some of the vids. When I go lighter- I do this everday. Harder areas that require more pressure I do every other day. Undamaged muscle will be smooth and quiet. Starved, crunchy, stiff muscle will actually be make crunchy sounds when moving over the object- or using a "tool" moved across the muscle. Some vids will make note of the crunchy sound, so dont freak out.

Even Hamstrings can be done on a bathroom counter top edge, one leg at a time. Every week my crunchy sounding hammies get quieter and have better, normal feeling. Doing this to forearms will make hands work better.

Dahlias
Regular Member


Date Joined Jun 2017
Total Posts : 456
   Posted 1/17/2018 10:55 AM (GMT -6)   
astroman said...
Dahlias said...
Astroman, would it be a good idea to do that before an epsom salt bath? Would you need to be careful about loosening up too much toxic stuff at once? My legs feel funny -- want to try this on them.


Good idea, that would promote healing as tight muscles are starved of nutrients. I used epsom salt gel per location after I do this, it helps.

Experiment on a local area before doing your whole arm,leg or all at once. Then you learn your threshold.


Oops. I just did both arms and legs and then took a bath. We'll see how that goes. Ha.

WalkingbyFaith
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 1679
   Posted 1/17/2018 11:04 AM (GMT -6)   
mudshark said...
It's funny that no matter what symptom I have or question that comes up that there is not someone else that has dealt with the same thing and an old thread to resurrect about it LOL.

At just over 4 weeks into abx treatment for Bart I started having leg weakness/fatigue symptoms again, which I had not really had for a few months and thought were behind me. I do get it in my arms as well, but really mostly limited to just the dominant right arm. Many of my other suspected Bart symptoms have been really ramping up as well since we starting attacking it, which I see others have experienced as well. I find some comfort in these threads that these are relatively common occurrences during treatment, but it's also aggravating that some things get worse as others get better. That's what sucks about these infections, you get one under control and the other seizes the opportunity.


mudshark,
I'm right there with you.

jackinthebox
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2017
Total Posts : 69
   Posted 1/17/2018 12:15 PM (GMT -6)   
This was my second most noticeable symptom, after numbness in my feet and legs. My (mainly) left arm felt lighter than usual, weaker than usual, and weird, and falls asleep super easily if I raise it; makes it hard to do basic things like brushing my teeth, lol.

It is a lot better now, but still sometimes goes. I'm glad it will abate with treatment and time. I'd like to get back in the weight room some day. Never thought it might be toxicity, but an actual symptom.

My most noticeable symptom right now is a constant shaking and twitching of the fingers of my left hand; tremors, I guess you could call them. Does anybody have any tips for those?

Dillon's Mom
New Member


Date Joined Jan 2017
Total Posts : 9
   Posted 3/14/2018 12:12 PM (GMT -6)   
jackinthebox said...
This was my second most noticeable symptom, after numbness in my feet and legs. My (mainly) left arm felt lighter than usual, weaker than usual, and weird, and falls asleep super easily if I raise it; makes it hard to do basic things like brushing my teeth, lol.

It is a lot better now, but still sometimes goes. I'm glad it will abate with treatment and time. I'd like to get back in the weight room some day. Never thought it might be toxicity, but an actual symptom.

My most noticeable symptom right now is a constant shaking and twitching of the fingers of my left hand; tremors, I guess you could call them. Does anybody have any tips for those?



Jackinthebox I too am having constant tremors and twitching of my left hand fingers (ring and pinky) and thumb. Tremors are shaking, and twitching is random/sporadic. Left arm and shoulder doesn't so much feel weak but is fatigued and I have muscle burn/shaking like I have worked out, but I haven't. This is a brand new symptom (along with some others) for me after 1 year on abx. Had it now for 6 weeks, very uncomfortable and makes work and daily life difficult. Your post was from January 2 months ago - wondering if you've had any improvement, and if so what helped?
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