Reason for lymph nodes swelling/discomfort from Bart?

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Rikky1
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Date Joined Jun 2015
Total Posts : 2860
   Posted 5/20/2016 6:53 AM (GMT -6)   
So I'm treating Bart and on occasion I'll get the swelling of the lymph nodes. Sometimes its a bit painful other times just swollen sometimes both it seems. What exactly is going on here? Is this just the dead bug debris collecting in the lymph nodes before drainage or does the Bart bacteria actually hang out in the lymph nodes themselves and cause pain and discomfort....or both? Thanks!

Krimpet 🍔
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 3274
   Posted 5/20/2016 9:24 AM (GMT -6)   
Which of your lymph nodes are swelling? Lately I've been having quite a bit in my neck area. I've been doing some new homeopathy and I'm definitely reacting to them as I'm on the higher dosages currently.

PeteZa
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Date Joined Jul 2015
Total Posts : 9729
   Posted 5/20/2016 9:57 AM (GMT -6)   
Rikky I have no idea what is the scientific reason.

However, I do know that our lymph system has no pump. We activate the lymph system by different means during the day. Walking and swinging our arms gets it to working. Jumping on a trampoline (or mini tramp) works and then there is the self massage.

All my life my lymph node behind my ear was my Mom's way of telling if I was really sick. She would feel behind my right ear and if it was swollen she said, "hop in bed."

Then many years later I got lyme and lyme really affected my lymph node behind my right ear. Horrible head pain. I have had migraines - not in that area - but these lyme swollen lymph nodes were more painful that those migraines. My husbands mounted vice in the garage looked very tempting to squish that pain away on many days.

Pirouette
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Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 6201
   Posted 5/20/2016 10:04 AM (GMT -6)   
Ahh - yes. I posted about this a few weeks ago when I started IV vancomycin for my bart…. I had multiple swollen nodes in/around head and neck - very uncomfortable for a few weeks. Much better now w/ red root and just getting more of the bart knocked out. Here is the thread FYI:
www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=3621915

From what I've learned, Bart and other infections (microbial, viral, parasite) often get caught in the lymph system. Lyme likes to hide out there to evade the immune system. And when you start treating, the blood pushes the meds through the lymph filters, causing debris and toxins to sometimes get caught up there.

So it's not an uncommon symptom. When I was younger, I had swollen cervical nodes nearly all through my teens and 20s - could never shake it. I also had recurring mono and bad TMJ that started when I was younger. I'm not sure about the chicken or egg - perhaps I became infected much younger than I thought.

This was an interesting study:
cid.oxfordjournals.org/content/35/6/643.full

-p

Rikky1
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Date Joined Jun 2015
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   Posted 5/20/2016 10:27 AM (GMT -6)   
Krimpet the most noticeable swelling is behind my knees and under my armpits. Weird huh? Well maybe not but you usually don't hear people swelling in those areas it seems its usually in the neck or somewhere else but those 2 areas are big collection areas.

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32619
   Posted 5/20/2016 11:44 AM (GMT -6)   
Infections do affect our lymph nodes...but Bart in particular likes to 'nest' there.

I didn't even know that the lump in my clavicle area was a swollen lymph node...until my first LLND appt.and he told me.

With treatment, it has improved about 80%...only rears it's ugly head now and again...when I'm flaring...or herxing.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14; added biaxin Sept. 26/14 Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.; Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin); Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif; Nov. switched mino to biaxin.

Krimpet 🍔
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 3274
   Posted 5/20/2016 12:49 PM (GMT -6)   
Pirouette thanks so much for that info. That makes so much sense. I just started More intensive therapy and my thyroid area has been so swollen. But here's the thing. I had this BEFORE I had RAI to the thyroid area....so apparently the virus and infections have been nesting there since then and now they are being evacuated. This is so interesting. Hopefully this doesn't last too long b/c it is so uncomfortable. How is the red root helping?

Ricky I have itching behind one knee which also started at the same time. I guess these things have just been hiding out. Ughhhhh.
Krimpet

Pirouette
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Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 6201
   Posted 5/20/2016 1:19 PM (GMT -6)   
Krimpet -
Red root helped a lot, I think. I also upped my detox a little bit and slept most of the day for about a week. Let the toxins work themselves out of the body.

-p
Chronic late-stage lyme—likely infected in 2000; Clinically dx 3/2014 w/ Babs, positive for Bart, CDC-pos for Bb. Multiple viruses & GI/immune treated first; started AL-Complex in May, A-Bart & A-Bab in July; 11/2014 IV port installed, started Rocephin; added vancomycin 3/2016
DETOX: Pinella/Burbur/Parsley/Milk thistle seed/Burdock root cocktail; japanese knotweed, L-5-MTHFR, LMN-V-II, probiotics

LymeDocSearch
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2017
Total Posts : 47
   Posted 4/3/2018 5:30 PM (GMT -6)   
I have had very painful neck lymph nodes and disabling fatigue for a year now. Tried abx and still doing Buhner's Bartonella protocol for about 5-6 months now with only improvement with the pain in soles of feet. I'm always extremely fatigued, nauseated with pain in neck lymph-nodes. Anyone else having any luck with reducing fatigue and lymph-node pain?

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32619
   Posted 4/3/2018 6:22 PM (GMT -6)   
Can't comment on the fatigue - have never had that symptom.

But my clavicle lymph node went away with bartonella treatment. I had another one pop up behind my ear while treating and it resolved after a few weeks.

I had the clavicle lymph node swelling early on and persisted through Lyme treatment..but Bart treatment resolved it - after several months of Rifampin/minocycline treatment.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

MooseSafari
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2018
Total Posts : 78
   Posted 4/4/2018 3:48 AM (GMT -6)   
I wonder if anyone else have swollen lymph nodes at the hips? I have had it since my tick rash back in 2015. I was bitten on the left thigh as well, where I developed the rash. Could it be that the lymph tends to be swollen around where the rash has taken place?

I didnt have had no swollen lymphs anywhere else on the body, eaven though plenty of head pressures and dizziness...

goshawk
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2016
Total Posts : 2115
   Posted 4/4/2018 3:10 PM (GMT -6)   
mine are under arms and backside of forearms. I use red root to help move things through the lymph system.


Head pressure may be Babesia. Buhner suggests kudzu for that.. I believe that Sida acuta helped mine.

MooseSafari
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2018
Total Posts : 78
   Posted 4/5/2018 12:54 AM (GMT -6)   
Do you remember if you had tick bite around the arms, hence the swollen lymphs?

I have been thinking about Babesia, though it is not to supposed to have spread to Sweden, there are no human cases here so far.
I got lab test results back last week and they found antibodies for lyme and possibly a still active infection so it seems like lyme is confirmed anyway. Not that it makes me any healthier.....

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32619
   Posted 4/5/2018 1:12 AM (GMT -6)   
I would look into Bartonella - it’s a common coinfection.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

MooseSafari
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2018
Total Posts : 78
   Posted 4/5/2018 11:26 PM (GMT -6)   
Thanks, yes and I understand pressure and aching head might be due to Babesia too.

I have started stepping up the diet eaven more taking a lot of vitamins and other stuff now and it seems to work though, I still have a hope maybe get to terms with the illness without using too much abx..
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