Saccharomyces cerevisiae (brewer's yeast) overgrowth - not candida! HELP!

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astroman
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   Posted 5/2/2017 6:24 PM (GMT -7)   
I tried s. boulardii (Florastore) one of the times I had candida. It was a big mistake , my gut felt much worse. Felt like the Goodyear blimp. Wont do that again.

Pirouette
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Date Joined Mar 2014
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   Posted 5/2/2017 8:01 PM (GMT -7)   
Huddie, and others -

I think we need to organize the information being discussed, as it is a little complicated and not the typical GI yeast/fungal overgrowth discussion... maybe others can chime in w/ their own experiences.

GENERALLY, the GI yeast/fungal overgrowth we usually discussed here is due to the antimicrobial/antibacterial protocols we're taking orally (even including the herbal tinctures for some since they're often suspended in alcohol) that kill all the bacteria--including the good bacteria that keep the yeast/fungus in balance.

Sounds like the saccharomyces cerevisiae overgrowth in two of our members here has manifested in places other than the GI (vaginal and urethra). I went through a period where 1/2 glass of wine exploded in a crazy vaginal overgrowth, so there are opportunities for GI to become "other" really fast.

This is a fungus, not a bacteria. And it isn't uncommon for some probiotics to exacerbate y/f overgrowth in those of us struggling with it (one of the reasons it's important that you're taking a product with as many different strains as you can find) - so it is something to investigate if you're having trouble dealing w/ the overgrowth. I stopped taking the probiotics a year ago, which has helped. This is a little trial-by-error since some probiotics may work just fine for some of us and I don't want to discourage it.

JellyBean -
fluconazole/diflucan might not be effective against Sacch cerevisiae. The antifungal Rx and naturals don't work against all yeast/fungal strains. You should have fairly quick results w/ an antifungal Rx and 3 wks is plenty of time.

I'd ask your MD to explore a different antifungal Rx like ketoconazole, itraconazole. There might be sources online that indicate which is more effective - I'll look after I post this. And I'd also recommend the PURE Nystatin powder. You can gargle it, drink it, douche with it, and create a topical paste.

Hope this is helpful -

-p
Lyme Moderator
Chronic late-stage lyme—likely infected in 2000; Clinically dx Mar'14 w/ Babs, + for Bart, CDC + for Bb. Multiple viruses & GI/immune treated first; started AL-Complex in May, A-Bart & A-Bab in July; Nov'14 IV port installed-started Rocephin; added vancomycin Mar'16
DETOX: Pinella/Burbur/Parsley/Milk thistle/Burdock root; cholestyramine / jap. knotweed L-5-MTHFR LMN-V-II probiotic

Pirouette
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   Posted 5/2/2017 8:18 PM (GMT -7)   
Here is an article that indicates fluconazole is somewhat effective and amphotericin B would be "antifungal agent of choice".
/academic.oup.com/cid/article/40/11/1625/445600/Saccharomyces-cerevisiae-Fungemia-An-Emerging

JellyBean and 1000Daisies -
I would be on the phone daily w/ your MD's office, providing updates and asking for a solution. They have a lot more resources available to them than we'll reach through google. This prompts the MD to be actively searching and reading these studies to find another antifungal to try... You need some relief and these buggers need to be stopped!

-p
Lyme Moderator
Chronic late-stage lyme—likely infected in 2000; Clinically dx Mar'14 w/ Babs, + for Bart, CDC + for Bb. Multiple viruses & GI/immune treated first; started AL-Complex in May, A-Bart & A-Bab in July; Nov'14 IV port installed-started Rocephin; added vancomycin Mar'16
DETOX: Pinella/Burbur/Parsley/Milk thistle/Burdock root; cholestyramine / jap. knotweed L-5-MTHFR LMN-V-II probiotic

astroman
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Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 4200
   Posted 5/2/2017 8:38 PM (GMT -7)   
1000- It looks like this was sort of discussed here, well, more how to avoid it, mentions a lab that tests for it too:

/www.celiac.com/gluten-free/topic/39820-attention-all-those-allergic-or-sensitive-to-yeast-non-candida-problems/

I always figured that some of the many "GF sensitive" people are actually sensitive to bakers yeast, and just dont know it. Adding to it just makes it populate more.

Pirouette
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 6201
   Posted 5/2/2017 8:39 PM (GMT -7)   
Here's a study suggesting tea tree oil can effectively alter membrane properties of the fungus - add tea tree oil to suppository or douche (in the case of vaginal manifestation):
/academic.oup.com/jac/article/53/6/1081/900843/Antifungal-effects-of-Melaleuca-alternifolia-tea

-p
Lyme Moderator
Chronic late-stage lyme—likely infected in 2000; Clinically dx Mar'14 w/ Babs, + for Bart, CDC + for Bb. Multiple viruses & GI/immune treated first; started AL-Complex in May, A-Bart & A-Bab in July; Nov'14 IV port installed-started Rocephin; added vancomycin Mar'16
DETOX: Pinella/Burbur/Parsley/Milk thistle/Burdock root; cholestyramine / jap. knotweed L-5-MTHFR LMN-V-II probiotic

JellyBean597
New Member


Date Joined May 2017
Total Posts : 3
   Posted 5/2/2017 8:46 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks for all the info. This is great! There isn't a lot out there on this particular organism as it is rare to get infected with it. I emailed my doc today and he is trying me on one more week of the fluconazole to see if anything changes. I will ask him about the amp B. I have also heard this is the drug of choice for this particular species. I was hoping the fluconazole was working, because my symptoms got worse once I started taking it. Things have leveled off, but definitely not all better. It is so nice to find a place to be able to talk about this. Thanks again all!

1000Daisies
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Date Joined Apr 2016
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   Posted 10/12/2017 9:19 PM (GMT -7)   
JellyBean597 said...
I also got the fungal infection from taking a probiotic containing saccharomyces boulardii. This yeast causes an overgrowth of saccharomyces cerevisiae, which causes the infection. Mine just happens to be in my bladder, but it can be almost anywhere from what I have read. It is very rare, so there is not a lot out there about it. My doc is also stumped as to how to treat this, because there is not one tried and true that has worked.

They did check me for lyme disease, but that came back negative.

Thanks, all!

JellyBean, not sure if you have notifications for this post thread, but I was wondering if you had an update on your situation?

So sorry I missed your responses on this thread, as I must have missed it because it was months after my original post. So sorry.

Hoping you come back and post an update. Sure hope all is better for you. And if, I'd love to hear how you/your doctors decided to treat. This is a very persistent, stubborn strain (for me, at least).

1000Daisies
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 2139
   Posted 10/12/2017 9:26 PM (GMT -7)   
Thanks for the additional information on this. I really appreciate it.

FWIW - I believe I have had this yeast issue ongoing for some years now actually. Several years probably, if not more. Back then, I wasn't taking Florastor/s. boulardii. That was something I added temporarily a few years back ... back when I thought it was "safe" to take. I don't believe I necessarily have this strain from a supplement (I would guess I don't). Who knows... I could have had a different strain that I was resolving but then caused a new strain imbalance with the s. boulardii supplement. I just don't know and will probably never know at this point.

Tea tree oil - I have generally not found benefit from this for skin issues, but it's something I wanted to retry for my issues.

P - my doctor won't prescribe the meds for this strain because he has serious concerns about the risks/side effects of these meds. I haven't pushed him on it because I'm not comfortable with the risks either at this point. It's really frustrating to have such little options. Plus, he doesn't have experience with anybody with this strain specifically, so as you know, MDs just aren't very knowledgable about these yeast issues like I have.

Astroman - thanks for the helpful link too! I had retried s. boulardii in a different supplement to see how my body would react (if was part of a well respected supplement that is used for anti-yeast). I didn't last on it, as I felt off and didn't trust it at all.
Kid#1: Extremely sick for several years, very difficult to treat, but doing great now!
Kid#2: Very sick now despite being treated for years, still very bad
Kid#3: Generally good but relapsing off/on.
Me: Adv Labs positive 2016 (suspected I passed to my kids)-not as sick as others, mostly battling fatigue and yeast issues (heart/kidney issues resolved)
Treating with herbals now.

Jaz4
New Member


Date Joined Jan 2018
Total Posts : 3
   Posted 1/12/2018 3:16 PM (GMT -7)   
Anyone on here still who has an overgrowth of Saccharomyces cerevisiae ?

Girlie
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Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 28735
   Posted 1/12/2018 5:30 PM (GMT -7)   
Hi Jaz4 - welcome to our community.

1000Daisies is still posting on the forum.


Do you have lyme disease, Jaz?
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

astroman
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 4200
   Posted 1/12/2018 5:50 PM (GMT -7)   
foods-contain-yeast:

//www.allergy-details.com/yeast-allergy/foods-contain-yeast/

www.allergy-details.com/yeast-allergy/foods-contain-yeast/

1000Daisies
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 2139
   Posted 1/12/2018 9:48 PM (GMT -7)   
Jaz4 said...
Anyone on here still who has an overgrowth of Saccharomyces cerevisiae ?


I haven't tested negative for it yet. I was successful in knocking it back and helping a lot of my yeast-related symptoms (kidney pain/sickness, headaches, menstrual headaches, etc). But I still tested positive for it (several months ago). My doctor said I don't have just an infection.... but a colonization instead. sad

Admittedly, I haven't test lately (it's been several months), but I will be retesting in the next few months.

Why do you ask? Anything we can help with?
Kid#1: Extremely sick for several years, very difficult to treat, but doing great now!
Kid#2: Still sick now despite being treated for years but doing better (not well yet).
Kid#3: Generally good but relapsing off/on.
Me: Adv Labs positive 2016 (suspected I passed to my kids)-not as sick as others, mostly battling fatigue and yeast issues (heart/kidney issues resolved)
Treating with herbals now.

1000Daisies
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 2139
   Posted 1/12/2018 9:52 PM (GMT -7)   
Girlie said...
Hi Jaz4 - welcome to our community.

1000Daisies is still posting on the forum.


Do you have lyme disease, Jaz?


Can we still help if they don't? smile

This is such an atypical strain with very little information on. I've had a few people (who don't frequent this board and don't have lyme/etc disease) post here on this board about it because they find my prior posts via google-type searches. That's how little information there is about this strain.

I'd be happy to share information with people - even if they don't have lyme and just pop in for a minute. I felt so alone on this strain and so frustrated with the lack of help and information on the internet. I am still frustrated by the lack of information/help with this.

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 28735
   Posted 1/12/2018 10:59 PM (GMT -7)   
1000Daisies said...
Girlie said...
Hi Jaz4 - welcome to our community.

1000Daisies is still posting on the forum.


Do you have lyme disease, Jaz?


Can we still help if they don't? smile



Yes, of course! I asked the question because I don't want to assume Jaz does have lyme disease...and point her to the "New to Lyme thread" and also ask if she needs help finding a LLMD. smile
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

Jaz4
New Member


Date Joined Jan 2018
Total Posts : 3
   Posted 1/13/2018 9:24 AM (GMT -7)   
Hey all, thank you all for taking time to answer you all seem so helpful. I do not have lymes, i didn't realise i was in a lymes forum when i wrote that. I did what 1 of you wrote. I was searching net for saccharomyces cerevisiae & this thread comes up.
I just wanted to know what symptoms you all suffered from the overgrowth. As i had so many.

I am symptom free but it took me a year.

Do/did any of you suffer from drunkness ? Iv never found any one like myself on forums. At 1 point if i ate i was drunk because of this strain of yeast . Tests showed i was drunk. It was like i had drank 15 alcoholic drinks and the hangover feeling each morning was unbearable. Couldnt lift my head off my bed for most the day.

Jaz4
New Member


Date Joined Jan 2018
Total Posts : 3
   Posted 1/13/2018 9:26 AM (GMT -7)   
I should add what i had was called auto brewery syndrome.

Casa11
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2017
Total Posts : 209
   Posted 1/13/2018 11:37 AM (GMT -7)   
Just a thought, but I also have( hopefully HAD) severe yeast overgrowth involving many different strains ( not sure if yours was one of them though) .

Severe kidney pain and UTI type symptoms were a constant for me. I believe the kidney pain was yeast related.

I was already taking oregano oil, but my nd suggested adding Agricept -L . It really worked for me. My kidney pain & issues went from constant and severe to occasional & mild. UTI /bladder stuff is gone.

I’ve made a lot of changes to diet & in treating Lyme & co , so I can’t say for sure that it’s just the Agricept that helped, but I really think it was.

A few days ago I had some minor kidney pain & took an extra dose of the Agricept & it was gone within hours. My ND told me to take 10 drops / 3 x a day.

I go back to see the ND in a few weeks, he’ll test me for yeast again.I’m interested to see if I’ve gotten rid of (at least)some of it...

Ps. I have no affiliation with whoever it is that makes Agricept.

ChickenArise
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Date Joined Nov 2015
Total Posts : 1280
   Posted 1/14/2018 11:09 AM (GMT -7)   
Much commercially available S. Boullardii is contaminated with S. Cerevisiae

I now avoid this probiotic as I didnt react well to it. Although the source quote below was a hospital acquired infection and it involves allopathic medicine, I hope it helps someone.

Short Version: liposomal amphotericin B (3 mg/kg/day)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5333505/

2014 Mold Sick,2015 Clinical Lyme and co.,2016 Morgellons,2017 Remission
YT: ClintFromNYtoVA2
Twitter: @ClintFromNYtoVA
Blog: www.fascinatingtimetobealive.blogspot.com/
" Expectations are the leading cause of disappointments "

Notime4lyme
Regular Member


Date Joined Dec 2017
Total Posts : 33
   Posted 1/15/2018 12:51 PM (GMT -7)   
I'm so glad I saw this thread. I think I was getting a yeast infection from taking a b vitamin with brewer's yeast in it. It said "saccharomyces cerevisiae" and I thought it was some kind of probiotic. I probably would have been okay though, if I hadn't taken antibiotics earlier this year.

1000Daisies
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 2139
   Posted Yesterday 2:42 PM (GMT -7)   
Jaz4 said...
Hey all, thank you all for taking time to answer you all seem so helpful. I do not have lymes, i didn't realise i was in a lymes forum when i wrote that. I did what 1 of you wrote. I was searching net for saccharomyces cerevisiae & this thread comes up.
I just wanted to know what symptoms you all suffered from the overgrowth. As i had so many.

I am symptom free but it took me a year.

Do/did any of you suffer from drunkness ? Iv never found any one like myself on forums. At 1 point if i ate i was drunk because of this strain of yeast . Tests showed i was drunk. It was like i had drank 15 alcoholic drinks and the hangover feeling each morning was unbearable. Couldnt lift my head off my bed for most the day.


Thanks for posting.

I have read what you are referring to. Auto-brewery syndrome (gut fermentation syndrome).
No, I didn't not have that. It's rather uncommon, but I have read what you are talking about. I honestly don't think they look for this or know that much about it.

I stated this earlier, but my symptoms were primarily kidney pain (that made me sick), headaches, and menstrual migraines. These all pretty much went away after self treating. I do get very minor kidney pain from time to time, but it's very infrequent and does not make me bedridden sick like it use to.

Curious - what exactly did you do to treat? I'd really love to know. I've struggled alone on this for far too long, and I had to self-treat and stumble my way through it. I'm much better in regards to yeast symptoms, but I doubt I'd test negative for it.

What testing did you also do?

I'd love to hear more about your personal experience. Not many of us out there....

1000Daisies
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 2139
   Posted Yesterday 2:48 PM (GMT -7)   
Casa11 said...
Just a thought, but I also have( hopefully HAD) severe yeast overgrowth involving many different strains ( not sure if yours was one of them though) .

Severe kidney pain and UTI type symptoms were a constant for me. I believe the kidney pain was yeast related.

I was already taking oregano oil, but my nd suggested adding Agricept -L . It really worked for me. My kidney pain & issues went from constant and severe to occasional & mild. UTI /bladder stuff is gone.

I’ve made a lot of changes to diet & in treating Lyme & co , so I can’t say for sure that it’s just the Agricept that helped, but I really think it was.

A few days ago I had some minor kidney pain & took an extra dose of the Agricept & it was gone within hours. My ND told me to take 10 drops / 3 x a day.

I go back to see the ND in a few weeks, he’ll test me for yeast again.I’m interested to see if I’ve gotten rid of (at least)some of it...

Ps. I have no affiliation with whoever it is that makes Agricept.


Thank you so much for sharing your personal experience. I looked up the Agricept, and it looks like simple enough ingredients. It's definitely worth a try for me.

I also am interested that you had kidney pain that you also associated with yeast. I swear - I thought I was the only one at times with this issue! One doctor tried to convince me that I was confusing it with back pain (oh good grief) when she couldn't figure out what was wrong with me.

I really appreciate you taking the time to share your experience and this with us. As I've said previously, this isn't well known, and the medical doctors really failed to help me on this. I struggled by myself on this. So, I greatly appreciate others sharing their experiences. We can always learn a lot from each other (IMHO). THANK YOU.
Kid#1: Extremely sick for several years, very difficult to treat, but doing great now!
Kid#2: Still sick now despite being treated for years but doing better (not well yet).
Kid#3: Generally good but relapsing off/on.
Me: Adv Labs positive 2016 (suspected I passed to my kids)-not as sick as others, mostly battling fatigue and yeast issues (heart/kidney issues resolved)
Treating with herbals now.

1000Daisies
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 2139
   Posted Yesterday 2:52 PM (GMT -7)   
Notime4lyme said...
I'm so glad I saw this thread. I think I was getting a yeast infection from taking a b vitamin with brewer's yeast in it. It said "saccharomyces cerevisiae" and I thought it was some kind of probiotic. I probably would have been okay though, if I hadn't taken antibiotics earlier this year.


YES!! I had kidney pain/sickness from taking a B vitamin complex. I swear I flared from it. Pain went away after I stopped the supplement. At the time, it made absolutely no sense at all why this would be related. (I didn't figure it out until much later.) I have also read that you have to be careful with B vitamins and yeast.....

Chocolate flared it. So did some probiotics too.

You are so lucky you figured out the connection!!

1000Daisies
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 2139
   Posted Yesterday 2:56 PM (GMT -7)   
ChickenArise said...
Much commercially available S. Boullardii is contaminated with S. Cerevisiae

I now avoid this probiotic as I didnt react well to it. Although the source quote below was a hospital acquired infection and it involves allopathic medicine, I hope it helps someone.

Short Version: liposomal amphotericin B (3 mg/kg/day)

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5333505/



Thanks for sharing that article. Fascinating, and concerning, read. THANK YOU!

As for that medication, my regular GP doctor won't even prescribe it to me due to the serious side effects/risks. He suggested I treat mine herbally instead.

As for the differences between s. boulardii and s. cerevisiae, here are some quotes:

"Saccharomyces boulardii, known as baker's yeast, is a subtype of S. cerevisiae."

"Although S. boulardii was initially identified as a separate species of the hemiascomycetes genus Saccharomyces, in recent years, the classification of many yeast species has changed in light of molecular phylogenetic studies . The results obtained in some studies show that S. boulardii is genetically very close or nearly identical to S. cerevisiae. These findings are also supported by some clinical studies, in which S. cerevisiae recovered from patients and S. boulardii strains isolated from probiotic preparations were proved to be genomically identical. With the use of molecular techniques S. boulardii has been classified within the species S. cerevisiae"
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