Circadian rhythm disorder- melatonin dosage?

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Agent Bex
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Date Joined Jul 2017
Total Posts : 39
   Posted 8/12/2017 6:33 AM (GMT -7)   
Hey guys! I have a circadian rhythm disorder/sleep disorder in which I tend to go to sleep late and wake up late.

Taking 200mg of Neurontin has so far shifted my sleep schedule back by about 2-3 hours. However, before trying 300mg of Neurontin, I would like to see if melatonin helps.

My LLMD recommended 1-3mg of melatonin 90 min. before bed. The lowest dose I could find in the supermarket was 3mg.

However, I'm not sure if the ideal dose. I tried the 3mg last night and the night before. It actually didn't make me fall asleep sooner, but it did make me wake up after only 2-3 hours of sleep...

I've done a bit of research on the ideal dosage of melatonin, and found this article based on a study that showed that 0.3mg is the ideal dose for most people, and that more can actually disrupt hormones and make sleep worse! https://www.google.com/amp/m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_56deff8ce4b03a40567a1e1e/amp

What are your experiences with melatonin, especially for circadian rhythm issues?

I would like to hear others' experience before I invest in *yet another* supplement. Also, I have been sending my LLMD a lot of questions, so I feel more comfortable asking you guys for now.

Thanks so much!

PeteZa
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Date Joined Jul 2015
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   Posted 8/12/2017 7:05 AM (GMT -7)   
I did not do melatonin but hubby did a combo of herbs for sleep. It had melatonin, valerian, hops, lemon balm, passion flower, and a lot of other herbs. He said it worked for him.

I did Benadryl children's liquid. I did the dose for an 11 yr old child.

Neither of us did these on a regular basis. We just did it as needed for help.

Agent Bex
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Total Posts : 39
   Posted 8/12/2017 7:31 AM (GMT -7)   
Thanks PeteZa! Do you know what dosage of melatonin was in the herbal combo?

Sweetlife
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   Posted 8/12/2017 10:20 AM (GMT -7)   
For me it doesn't matter if I take 3 mg or 15, I always wake up after 3-4 hrs - doesn't 'keep' me asleep

Girlie
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   Posted 8/12/2017 10:58 AM (GMT -7)   
I don't take it, but my husband does.

He combines a 'regular' one with a time-released one...and he gets 7 hours of sleep on a good day....5 or 6 on a bad.

I think he's still taking about 1 mg of the regular and 1/2 mg of the timed release.


You can get 1 mg dosages - but it's harder to find in the recent years...I think maybe they've realized that more is needed?
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Traveler
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   Posted 8/12/2017 12:34 PM (GMT -7)   
I use melatonin as one of my sleep aides - as well as several other things. I need a combination of things to help me sleep because of adrenal issues.

Have you had your adrenals checked by a 4 point saliva test? That's the only way to accurately test the levels throughout the day so you know if they are working properly.

You can easily find 1 mg melatonin tablets online. We have a list of places that have been used by members for ordering herbs and supplements for those that aren't used to ordering online and what to look for in the 'New to Lyme?' thread.

The ideal dose is different for each person. I have needed as much as 10 mgs at first, but I'm now on only 3 mgs.
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Sweetlife
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2017
Total Posts : 95
   Posted 8/12/2017 12:52 PM (GMT -7)   
Vetiver rubbed on the back of the neck helps a lot for sleep

Georgia Hunter
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Date Joined May 2012
Total Posts : 2018
   Posted 8/13/2017 5:11 AM (GMT -7)   
Melatonin is something I have studied in the past. Part of the problem with Melatonin supplementation is that it has multiple functions in the body. In high doses, it does other things than signify darkness. We all know of it as a sleep aid, but it is also an antioxidant. As an antioxidant in someone like us that has chronic inflammation, the little that is made won't get used much to signify sleep but rather to decrease oxidative stress. Your thinking about the higher doses is correct. Optimal dosage for creating normal nocturnal melatonin blood levels in the literature is 0.3mg. To obtain normal blood levels, a 9am dose is required. It will not act as a zeitgeber time signal, but in CRSD, you just need normal nocturnal blood levels. A 1mg dose produces a 100 fold increase in circulating melatonin levels and we may get benefit from its antioxidant properties and its oral temperature reduction, but the sleep latency is longer than the smaller dose.

If it were me, I'd take Lithium Orotate 10mg at bedtime before I upped or went on Neurontin. I'd do this for a week and then add in Vitamin D at bedtime. I use 4000 IU but your dose may be different. Getting in the sun is much more efficient but some of us don't produce and absorb the Vit. D as well as others. The ebb and flow of melanin is the issue here but another immune topic. There can be multiple reasons why someone can't stay asleep and melatonin is usually farther down the list of things going wrong.

Agent Bex
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2017
Total Posts : 39
   Posted 8/13/2017 10:36 AM (GMT -7)   
Thank you, everyone, for your responses! I appreciate hearing what other people have tried and how it worked for them.

I do think the 3mg melatonin was causing me to wake up after a couple of hours of sleep, because I didn't take it yesterday, and I slept about 8 (?) hours. I plan to email my doc to tell her I had problems sleeping with 3mg melatonin and see what she suggests.

Traveler, my doc actually is thinking the same thing you are about adrenal issues! She ordered me the cortisol/DHEA saliva test from Genova and I plan to use it tomorrow. Hopefully, it will provide some answers.

Thanks for the suggestion, Sweetlife! I've heard that it's not that great to rub essential oil directly on your skin...do you use a diluted product/a carrier oil?

Georgia Hunter, thank you for the detailed information. I am a little confused, because I thought melatonin was supposed to be taken when it's dark out...did you mean 9am or 9pm? Why do you think sleep latency is longer with a larger dose than a smaller dose?

Again, thank you everyone for your help!

Georgia Hunter
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Date Joined May 2012
Total Posts : 2018
   Posted 8/14/2017 3:13 AM (GMT -7)   
Agent Bex said...

Georgia Hunter, thank you for the detailed information. I am a little confused, because I thought melatonin was supposed to be taken when it's dark out...did you mean 9am or 9pm? Why do you think sleep latency is longer with a larger dose than a smaller dose?

Again, thank you everyone for your help!


Melatonin begins to be made when it is dark, but to have normal melatonin levels circulating in the blood when it becomes dark, you must supplement at 9am, not 9pm. The studies showed that melatonin timing was just as important as the amount of melatonin administered. As for sleep latency being slightly longer with the larger doses, that comes from the scientific literature.

mpost
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Date Joined Feb 2015
Total Posts : 1167
   Posted 8/14/2017 3:26 AM (GMT -7)   
i take 3mg of melatonin every night for the last 2 years, never had any problems, i don't wake up at night, no heart issues, etc...

May i suggest that it is not melatonin that is waking u up 3hrs later, that is exactly when you should wake up when u have a cortisol spike.

You should try ashwagandha before bed, it is one of those herbs that has a double blind placebo controlled study that backs its effects, so you know it does work:

A Prospective, Randomized Double-Blind, Placebo-Controlled Study of Safety and Efficacy of a High-Concentration Full-Spectrum Extract of Ashwagandha Root in Reducing Stress and Anxiety in Adults
/www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3573577/

"By the end of the study period, the two groups’ average serum cortisol levels were considerably different (P=0.006). After 60 days of treatment, a reduction of 27.9% from baseline was observed in the Ashwagandha group. In contrast, a reduction of 7.9% was observed in the placebo-control group. The difference in the reduction of serum cortisol levels in the two groups on Day 60 was statistically significant"

Careful to stop it when your sleep regulates, it may affect the thyroid function if u take it for too many months.

Agent Bex
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2017
Total Posts : 39
   Posted 9/10/2017 8:08 AM (GMT -7)   
Hey guys, I just wanted to update you on my sleep disorder/insomnia.

I returned the 3mg Melatonin supplement to the pharmacy and decided to order a liquid melatonin supplement online (that way, I can adjust the dose to me personally) with the advice of my doctor. After doing some research, I decided on the Benevolent Nourishment brand of liquid melatonin found here: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01FL9MXXG/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Overall, it works really well; I take 3 drops (0.3mg). I've had one unwanted all-nighter in the last couple of weeks, but I actually fall asleep by 11pm almost every night and some of my cognitive symptoms have improved a lot with the improved sleep.
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