Confused newbie

New Topic Post Reply Printable Version
[ << Previous Thread | Next Thread >> ]

New Member

Date Joined Dec 2017
Total Posts : 11
   Posted 12/31/2017 9:13 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi everyone. I have been reading posts here for the last month and this is a wonderful, supportive community. I am not sure that I should actually be here as I have had no diagnosis, but I am at a stage where I have to cover every possibility. I will try to make this as short as I can.

about seven years ago I began to get ill with sore, scratchy eyes, tingling arms and legs, vertigo and fatigue. I lived like this for about three years just hoping it would go away. Finally, when it didn't, I began researching and settled on candida as it matched most of my symptoms and I had a history of repeated strep throat and consequent heavy antibiotic use. Since then I have cut out all sugar (including fruit...haven't eaten a piece of fruit for 18 months) and opted for a vegetable heavy diet with adequate protein. I have also used every herbal method (and I am talking about 40 different herbs) to eradicate candida as well as diflucan and nystatin. I made good progress but could never seem to get completely well, and also suffered horrible relapses that made me think I was dying.

I decided that there must be something else at play. When I was about 35 (I am now 52) I had an extremely debilitating but self-limiting disease which started with sores all over my tongue. This was diagnosed as mononucleosis from a blood test although I had only one swollen lymph node at the back of my neck. about a month after that I had bell's palsy which took three weeks to resolve. Anyway, because of this I thought that EBV might be part of the problem.

I also suffered African tick bite fever when I was about twelve but that seemed to resolve naturally. (African tick bite fever does not carry lyme but can often transmit all the other coinfections like bartonella).

Anyway, after years of candida treatment I decided to try the Buhner protocol. Japanese knotweed was a constant brain fog lifted. This however is not diagnostic as apparently the herb can alleviate many chronic conditions. Cat's claw and Samento seem to not really affect me so much. I quickly got up to full dose on these without too much herxing. Then I took neem and noni (and OMG...felt so sick and stopped after a month). Then I tried Buhner's EBV protocol (Isatis, licorice, lomatium, reishi, and a few others). I literally couldn't walk straight. One cup of red root had the same effect. I was so worried I went to hospital. I got a blood test and everything was normal (liver and cholesterol were marvelous) but my WBC count had dropped below normal (first time ever).

Anyway, I stopped all tinctures for three days but took three drops of houttuynia this morning. For so small a dose, it is having a big effect. I am off balance, strange pain in my spleen and really thick head with extremely blurred vision.

My problem is that none of these things are diagnostic. All of these herbs are so broad-acting that my reactions could be coming from candida, EBV or a tick borne/parasitic illness. The reason I thought it might be bartonella is after researching I have found some symptoms that seem indicative. My reaction to any strong herbal medicine has been extremely painful leg muscles, and unbelievably painful calf and foot cramping at night until I actually have to get out of bed (I have screamed sometimes it is so sore). I have had occasional burning sensations on the top of the foot and after starting the Isatis EBV combo my left arm has developed a deep in the bone type of pain which I have never had before. I used to have extreme panic attacks (but those have been much better over the past 2 years), but I still have scary air hunger where I try to draw in breath but it feels like I can't (usually directly after taking a herb).

I am a man, from the U.K., but currently residing in Borneo where I teach. Before this, I was posted on the northern Thai/Myanmar border and before that in Vietnam. Needless to say, none of these places offer any form of support for chronic microbial conditions (much less an actual LLMD or any relevant testing procedures). I am totally on my own in this. Occasionally I have become so ill that I thought I would have to return home. I am, however, unlike some poor souls on this site, usually able to hold it together for work (although sometimes it's by the thinnest thread). I love my job and really want to overcome this without putting my ability to work in jeopardy. Unfortunately, the school holiday ends tomorrow. Obviously the HH is doing something and I was thinking of continuing with Japanese knotweed, cats claw and eleuthero and adding a really small dose of HH and sida acuta and seeing how it goes. I am really worried however by the drop in my WBC and wonder of these herbs are too strong. Any ideas at all would be most welcome.

Okay, I said I would keep this short and now look at what I've gone and done. Thank you for your patience and understanding.

Veteran Member

Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 2009
   Posted 12/31/2017 10:12 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi there! Welcome to the forum. So sorry you're sick and unsure of exactly what you're dealing with. If you haven't already, please check out the information under New to Lyme at the top of the page.

From what you've said, sounds like you could have Lyme or at least some type of chronic infections. There's information in that section about testing, too. I'm sure other members will reply soon with more help about how to get tested.

Considering you've been in lots of places in the world and have knowingly had some unusual illnesses, there may be other infections in the picture.

I will say that I am using Buhner's protocol and had pretty strong responses to just a few drops of isatis/houttynia/alchornia combo and also to sida acuta. There are others here who also have strong reactions to tiny doses of the herbs. Isatis and houttynia are strongly antiviral, so they could be acting on many things.

Just wanted to add, you have the right idea. You've already tried treating candida and moved on to Buhner's herbs. In case you get tested for Lyme and coinfections and still don't get positive results, which is very possible, don't give up. In addition to his books on Lyme and coinfections, Buhner also has an Herbal Antibiotics and Herbal Antivirals books. If you don't have those, they could be a great help to you. Also since you don't have easy access to an LLMD, what about an herbalist? Are there any near you? If all else fails, you could continue experimenting with the herbs and continue with those you have a response to, even if you're not sure specifically which infections it's hitting. It could be that as you continue herbs that more symptoms will come out and the identity of the infections will more obvious.

One more thing. Air hunger is a common babesia symptom, although I don't believe it's confined to babesia. Bone pain is very common with bartonella. Sida acuta is effective against both babesia and bartonella.

Post Edited (WalkingbyFaith) : 12/31/2017 8:32:09 PM (GMT-7)

Veteran Member

Date Joined Jul 2015
Total Posts : 9729
   Posted 12/31/2017 10:58 PM (GMT -6)   
Howdy Seb4 and welcome. If you do have lyme it sounds like you have had it for a long time.

Here are a couple of tests that are easier than a lyme blood test. She how you do on these.


Maybe these will confirm you diagnosis.

Treating with herbs is not a quick fix. It takes a lot of time to treat and you should not stop until you have no symptoms for a couple of months. Most people quit way too soon and relapse.... My husband did this too.

It takes a long time and a lot of patience.

Hang in there, you will get there.

New Member

Date Joined Dec 2017
Total Posts : 11
   Posted 12/31/2017 11:02 PM (GMT -6)   
I can't tell you how much I appreciate your response. Seriously. You are the first person in seven years that has taken me seriously. Don't know why I didn't join this forum ages ago (I guess I didn't want to believe I had lyme and all its horrors). Anyway, thanks for the info about sida acuta. I think I might stop the HH because I feel it's stirring up EBV which might have been latent before (apparently a low white blood cell count is indicative of a virus). I might just stick with sida acuta or try cumanda. Thanks again for your advice, all of which makes good sense.

New Member

Date Joined Dec 2017
Total Posts : 11
   Posted 12/31/2017 11:04 PM (GMT -6)   
Thanks to you too Peteza. I will look at those links right now. I really appreciate it.

New Member

Date Joined Dec 2017
Total Posts : 11
   Posted 1/1/2018 2:46 AM (GMT -6)   
Just a quick update: The houttuynia herx is still going strong (in fact much STRONGER) 9 hours later. What is this stuff!!! 3 drops and I feel like I'm gonna fall over 9 hours later and I can't think straight? You know the kind of herx where you can't sit down and you go from room to room, pacing around the house like a demented wind-up toy. Anyway, does HH target anything especially or is it, like just about everything else, antibacterial, antifungal and antiviral?

Forum Moderator

Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 33852
   Posted 1/1/2018 5:14 AM (GMT -6)   
Seb - Houttuynia is part of Buhner's Bartonella protocol. It could be hitting Bartonella.

It has antibacterial properties, so could be also hitting other infections.
and yes, It also has anti-viral and anti-fungal properties.

What are you doing for detox?
This is something you will want to be doing regularly to flush out the toxins.
Multiple methods of detox daily.

- Are you taking probiotics daily? (gut health)
- something for liver support?
- drinking plenty of water?

Here's a link to a site with lots of detoxing suggestions:

One of my favorites is taking a warm epsom salt bath. (I dry brush my skin prior)

You should consider backing down the dosage of the Houttuynia until the herxing clears...and then slowly up the dose again.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi
New Topic Post Reply Printable Version
Forum Information
Currently it is Thursday, August 16, 2018 5:12 PM (GMT -6)
There are a total of 2,993,420 posts in 328,043 threads.
View Active Threads

Who's Online
This forum has 161225 registered members. Please welcome our newest member, wendigomike.
294 Guest(s), 12 Registered Member(s) are currently online.  Details
PeterDisAbelard., Artist Mark, sebreg, SueLP, Paxton, Tudpock18, Pratoman, InTheShop, garyi, commandersorebod, kit49, Aerose91