Male-Related Question: Lapis_29 or Georgia Hunter

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The Dude Abides
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   Posted 1/14/2018 10:35 PM (GMT -6)   
Georgia Hunter and/or Lapis_29,

I have a somewhat-embarrassing question to pose. It's related to my "Man Parts." shakehead

Over the past 6-12 months or so, I've had a gradual onset of what seems to be Peyronie's Disease. The onset has been gradual, and, thankfully, not to the extreme that many sufferers experience.

In my case, the underlying plaque (which I first palpated and my general practitioner confirmed) has caused an indentation on one side, just under the glans. There is a small amount of pain at rest and a bit more when stimulated. There also seems to be a minor loss in length, though I'm not sure why.

(Is nothing sacred?!?)

Would you have any thoughts of what might help halt/reverse this condition?

I've read some pretty discouraging reports from many men, no matter the treatments sought.

- Surgery seems to only create more scar tissue.
- Medications seem marginally effective and don't seem to address the underlying cause.
- There are devices one can "wear," with the promise of "straightening-out" things, but those seem marginally-effective, impractical, and uncomfortable - if not medieval.

I did find one website where some have claimed that applying Castor Oil topically has been somewhat effective. Some have taken to adding the use of a sonic toothbrush (the backside of a spare tip) for 5-10 minutes, after applying the Castor Oil, with the thought the sonic waves help break-up the plaque. They also suggest adding Acetyl-L-Carnitine and Gotu Kola. The website does NOT sell any of these items.

Any thoughts - from anyone - are welcome and appreciated.

Thanks,
The Dude

Post Edited (The Dude Abides) : 1/14/2018 10:23:04 PM (GMT-7)


Georgia Hunter
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   Posted 1/15/2018 4:00 AM (GMT -6)   
I am not well versed with your problem but did have a patient with it a couple decades ago. His was a calcification.

From the literature:

Deposition of fibrin in plaque tissue is consistent with the hypothesis that repetitive microvascular injury results in fibrin deposition in the tissue space and has served to provide insights into the pathophysiology of Peyronie's disease. We propose a model that accounts for the clinical and biological features of Peyronie's disease.

This lead to finding this one which was interesting. It's long but a good read.

www.health-science-spirit.com/pyroluria.htm



This 1947 study showed improvement with Vitamin E oil.
onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1749-6632.1949.tb55300.x/full

If it were me, I would have Nattokinase and Serrapeptase in my treatment protocol.

Lapis_29
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   Posted 1/15/2018 10:25 AM (GMT -6)   
dmso has been clinically proven to break down scar tissue in PD



read the whole page, multiple studies in various countries.


peyronies-disease-help.com/peyronies-treatment-options/dmso-peyronies-therapy/

Post Edited (Lapis_29) : 1/15/2018 8:31:39 AM (GMT-7)


The Dude Abides
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   Posted 1/15/2018 12:38 PM (GMT -6)   
Gentlemen, I sincerely thank you for your time and assistance! I will implement these suggestions!

Best regards,
The Dude

The Dude Abides
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   Posted 1/15/2018 2:08 PM (GMT -6)   
Lapis_29 said...
dmso has been clinically proven to break down scar tissue in PD

read the whole page, multiple studies in various countries.

peyronies-disease-help.com/peyronies-treatment-options/dmso-peyronies-therapy/


Lapis_29,

Since you're the undisputed DMSO expert on this forum, I'd appreciate your help with two more questions:

1. Does DMSO "expire" or "go bad"?

The reason I ask is I actually have a container of DMSO that I bought a few YEARS ago. The date on the container is January 2014, but that's the date it was received in the local alternative pharmacy where I bought it. (I just called them to verify, since the date is on their label.) I don't recall when I bought it, but probably sometime in 2014. If the DMSO does "go bad," I'll scrap it and buy more.

2. Whether it expires or not, the following images are exactly like the 2014 DMSO product that I have. Is this a good brand/concentration, considering the "sensitive" area where it will be applied?

/images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/712ma4qpn8L._SL1163_.jpg
/images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/81Kc-UYB%2BmL._SL1500_.jpg

Again, thank you very much. I truly appreciate and value your experience and wisdom.

Sincerely,
The Dude

Missouri
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Date Joined Sep 2017
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   Posted 1/15/2018 4:33 PM (GMT -6)   
I personally wouldn't trust any DMSO from a plastic container. I have noticed that it melts synthetic fabrics, and melts the vinyl flooring in my bathroom if it drips.

The Dude Abides
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   Posted 1/15/2018 5:02 PM (GMT -6)   
Missouri said...
I personally wouldn't trust any DMSO from a plastic container. I have noticed that it melts synthetic fabrics, and melts the vinyl flooring in my bathroom if it drips.


Holy moly. Thanks for that feedback. So, you have a brand that comes in a bottle? I certainly don't want to melt anything off of me. I have enough issues, as it is!

Girlie
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   Posted 1/15/2018 5:34 PM (GMT -6)   
The Dude Abides said...
Missouri said...
I personally wouldn't trust any DMSO from a plastic container. I have noticed that it melts synthetic fabrics, and melts the vinyl flooring in my bathroom if it drips.


Holy moly. Thanks for that feedback. So, you have a brand that comes in a bottle? I certainly don't want to melt anything off of me. I have enough issues, as it is!


Here's one in a glass bottle.

I believe this is what Lapis recommends.

/www.amazon.com/DMSO-Bottle-99-995-Dimethyl-Sulfoxide/dp/B01BSYQ0XC

Sorry, Dude...you did say males related...but I thought as a Mod, it would be alright with you if I checked out the thread.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

Post Edited (Girlie) : 1/15/2018 3:57:32 PM (GMT-7)


Lapis_29
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   Posted 1/15/2018 5:53 PM (GMT -6)   
i dont recommend the one with the tree on the label, they use the wrong kind of plastic

i recommend dmsostore.com , and they do sell on amazon also

also look into Allantoin for Peyronie’s, it has a keratolytic effect, which means it break down tissue. allantoin + dmso could work well, but i dont have specifics on dosages or anything

The Dude Abides
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   Posted 1/15/2018 6:05 PM (GMT -6)   
Girlie said...


Here's one in a glass bottle.

I believe this is what Lapis recommends.

/www.amazon.com/DMSO-Bottle-99-995-Dimethyl-Sulfoxide/dp/B01BSYQ0XC

Sorry, Dude...you did say males related...but I thought as a Mod, it would be alright with you if I checked out the thread.


Thanks, Girlie! Much appreciated! I didn't intend to prevent any ladies from reading the thread. It was more of a warning, in case they wanted to skip it. Obviously, at this point, I've nothing left to hide. smile

The Dude Abides
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   Posted 1/15/2018 6:12 PM (GMT -6)   
Lapis_29 said...
i dont recommend the one with the tree on the label, they use the wrong kind of plastic

i recommend dmsostore.com , and they do sell on amazon also

also look into Allantoin for Peyronie’s, it has a keratolytic effect, which means it break down tissue. allantoin + dmso could work well, but i dont have specifics on dosages or anything


My thanks to you and Missouri, for saving me from a potentially harmful mistake! I'll get a glass bottle from dmsostore.com.

I'll also look into Allantoin. I've never heard of that before, so I appreciate the ongoing education!

The Dude Abides
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   Posted 1/15/2018 6:47 PM (GMT -6)   
Also, I just read the following:

"Peyronie's disease has been linked to systemic conditions such as hypertension and diabetes. PD is associated with Dupuytren's disease (palmar aponeurosis), Ledderhose's disease (plantar aponeurosis), Paget's disease and knuckle pads. An immunologic component to Peyronie's disease has been proposed. These associations lend credence to using systemic oral therapy for this disease."

Source: /www.nature.com/articles/3900869.pdf?origin=ppub

Interesting, I do have a mild case of Dupuytren's Contracture that affects only the ring finger of my right hand. I've had that for over nine years, now. After developing Peyronie's, I'd wondered if the two conditions were related, as they both involve plaque/scar tissue.

In the following post, I explain how I started taking Systemic Proteolytic Enzymes, in hopes of helping the Peyronie's. I had no other thoughts or expectations. What I observed, however, was that it reduced the symptoms of the Dupuytren's Contracture.

/www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=30&m=3942762

Perhaps it would have helped the Peyronie's, had I taken it longer and/or in higher doses. I may try the enzymes again. Originally, I used two different brands, at different times. One brand (pHi-Zymes) had Nattokinase and the other brand (Zymessence) had Serrapeptase. Originally, I switched from the pHi-Zymes (with Nattokinase) because the manufacturer of Zymessence (with Serrapeptase) wrote the following:

Question: On products that tout they have Nattokinase and on how great Nattokinase is, why doesn't Zymessence contain Nattokinase?

Answer: Dr. Wong HATES Nattokinase. Of all the proteolytic enzymes, it is the only one that does not have a feedback mechanism to let it know when to stop lysing, (i.e. eating) blood proteins.

In nature, Nattokinase is always found with Vitamin K1 and that prevents the blood from becoming overly-thin when eating the natto curd and taking in the Nattokinase enzyme. When the Nattokinase is extracted from that curd, the Vitamin K is left behind. So, of all the proteolytic enzymes it is the one most likely to create the danger of overly thin blood and cause hemorrhagic bleeding issues. We've spoken to two docs, one of whom is a very famous alternative doc, who got both themselves and their patients in bleeding trouble by using what were modest dosing levels of Nattokinase.

Though Nattokinase is highly touted by health food industry hype, the Handbook of Proteolytic Enzymes tells us that Nattokinase does not do anything that the Serrapeptidase, Trypsin, Chymotrypsin or Papain does not do, including clearing the excess fibrin and adhesion molecules as well as lysing-away arterial plaque. In terms of fibrinolysis, Nattokinase and Serrapeptidase are nearly equal with the Serrapeptidase having a slight advantage. Another advantage of using Serrapeptidase and the other enzymes is they are considerably safer at doing that job than the Nattokinase."


Source: /drwongsessentials.com/zymessence-compared

But, maybe I will try mixing pHi-Zymes and Zymessence together.

Georgia Hunter
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Date Joined May 2012
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   Posted 1/16/2018 3:17 AM (GMT -6)   
Here is another.

europepmc.org/abstract/med/2991611

As for Natto vs Serrapeptidase, I didn't have a herx taking just Natto but when I added in the Serra, it hit me. Maybe it was the timing, but maybe a pulsed Natto would be better?

WalkingbyFaith
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   Posted 1/16/2018 9:49 AM (GMT -6)   
Are serrapeptase and serrapeptidase the same thing?

The Dude Abides
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   Posted 1/17/2018 1:12 AM (GMT -6)   
WalkingbyFaith said...
Are serrapeptase and serrapeptidase the same thing?


According to the following, it seems they are the same:

"Serratiopeptidase is the enzyme silkworms make to dissolve their cocoons. The tongue-twisting name of this enzyme is often shortened to serrapeptidase, serrapeptase, serralysin, serratia peptidase, serratio peptdisase, or Serratia E-15 protease. I'll use the terms serratiopeptidase and serrapeptase interchangeably in this article."

Source: myserratiopeptidasesite.blogspot.com/2012/04/welcome-to-my-serratiopeptidase-site-my.html

Also, thanks to one of the above links that Georgia Hunter shared, I was led to another link, which, in turn, led me to the following free e-book:

The 'Miracle' Enzyme Is Serrapeptase
/www.serrapeptase.info/wp-content/customcode/bookdownload.php?f=Full_Serrapeptase_eBook.pdf

foglikely
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   Posted 3/5/2018 3:25 PM (GMT -6)   
i have lichen sclerosus, an autoimmune scarring condition. My condition is advanced with severe scarring. The topical steroid ointment eventually became ineffective and I saw Dr. Casabona in Genoa (now Milan) for PRP and stem cell treatment in 2012. Some of the scarring - maybe 30% - reversed, but most of the scar tissue remained. The LS has remained inactive aside from one flare a few months ago. I don't know of any treatment that could totally reverse the remaining scar tissue but being pain-free again was a huge relief.

Dr. Casabona has had success using just PRP (platelet rich plasma) injections for men. In the US, PRP treatment is gradually becoming more common ("o-shot" and "p-shot") although it is not covered by insurance and there are only a few practitioners with experience outside of sports medicine or orthopedics.

I have also heard of a few success stories by people using DMSO & tee tree oil 50/50, DMSO & iodine (Dr. Jonathan Wright), Perrin's Blend (grape seed extract), borax, leech therapy, and an essential oil blend to stop the progression and restore skin health. I have been taking serrapeptase since first diagnosed.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19168293

http://cellularmedicineassociation.org/iscg/

My recent flare calmed down by alternating the Perrin's blend, oils, and the DMSO/iodine mixture, but if it were to continue unabated I wouldn't hesitate to do PRP injections again.

bluelyme
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   Posted 3/6/2018 12:58 AM (GMT -6)   
i stung my junk with a bee to save it ...lol...my nurse i work with will not do prp shot in a person with active infection ...btw fwiw

The Dude Abides
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Date Joined May 2017
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   Posted 3/6/2018 2:36 AM (GMT -6)   
bluelyme said...
i stung my junk with a bee to save it ...lol...my nurse i work with will not do prp shot in a person with active infection ...btw fwiw


Holy moly! The mind reels. (Plus, a lot of inappropriate jokes come to mind.) You've got a lot of resolve, my friend.

bluelyme
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   Posted 3/9/2018 2:23 AM (GMT -6)   
and u would have thought i would have learned from the first one but desire is a powerful motivator...tightening of tendons may be a mineral deficiency thing esp with lymeco....iv mag helped my spasms
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