Nutritionist advised not to use probiotic with too many strains?

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Szabo246
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2017
Total Posts : 484
   Posted 1/23/2018 3:59 AM (GMT -6)   
I thought the more strains the better?!

She said you don’t know how your body will react to all so it’s better to use one with a couple of strains? I’ve always heard the opposite. Also said mine contains d lactate... is that bad?

Has recommended me a very expensive probiotic called therebiotic factoer1 and 4

Any advice ?

astroman
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2014
Total Posts : 4880
   Posted 1/23/2018 9:50 AM (GMT -6)   
I never heard of that one.

LVS#3 is said to be one of the best. It has 8-10 strains I think. Its $60-$80 for 60 pills, not cheap.

1000Daisies
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 2438
   Posted 1/23/2018 10:00 AM (GMT -6)   
I think probiotics are completely trial and error personally. Over the years, I've seen people very simply and casually say "use "probiotics". That is overly simplistic for a complex issue. Rebalancing our gut microbiome is not always an easy task, and given how everybody is different and there isn't good testing for this, it very much is trial and error.

S. Boulardii has been all the rave these past few years, but I personally can't take it because it causes my yeast imbalance to worsen. Yet you rarely ever see people mention the negative effects of s. boulardii (I do mention it a lot on this board because I wish I had known the negative effects of it!). And this ingredient (yeast) is being added to more and more probiotic multi-strain products! Major UGH in my opinion!!

This is very similar, to me, in regards to multi-herbals products (or many supplements). If you don't have an issue with it, then great. But if you do, then you need to try to figure that out.

I personally prefer the multi-herbals products and have worked well for me. However, the multi-ingredient supplements for adrenals have not worked for me so far. Bleck.

So - long story short - I think it depends on the person and is very much trial and error.

We personally have used single or few strain products, as well as multi-strain products - depending on what was going on with us at the time.
Kid#1: Extremely sick for several years, very difficult to treat, but doing great now!
Kid#2: Still sick now despite being treated for years but doing better (not well yet).
Kid#3: Generally good but relapsing off/on.
Me: Adv Labs positive 2016 (suspected I passed to my kids)-not as sick as others, mostly battling fatigue and yeast issues (heart/kidney issues resolved)
Treating with herbals now.

BabsBunny
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Date Joined Mar 2017
Total Posts : 530
   Posted 1/23/2018 10:37 AM (GMT -6)   
I'm dealing with this right now as we're looking into mast cell disorders and a low-histamine diet.

Apparently some strains of probiotic release more histamine than others, which can be the cause of so many sensitivities. Some strains are histamine-degrading.
https://www.marksdailyapple.com/histamine-intolerance/

My ND has recommended Primal Probiotics for low-histamine strains. Unfortunately they only come in 10 billion CFU, and on abx I'm supposed to work up to 10 a day. That's $300 a month just for probiotics. I'm losing my mind.
Lyme, Babesia, Bartonella. Symptoms began 5/2016, didn't start treatment until 9/2016. Slow but steady recovery.

*twitch twitch*

BabsBunny
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Date Joined Mar 2017
Total Posts : 530
   Posted 1/23/2018 10:44 AM (GMT -6)   
Szabo246 said...
Has recommended me a very expensive probiotic called Therbiotic factor 1 and 4

Any advice ?


This post lists supplements at the bottom and Therbiotic Factor 1 appears.

/wholenewmom.com/health-concerns/low-histamine-probiotics/

Right now I'm spending a small fortune on Klaire Labs Therbiotic Complete. When my Primal Probiotic arrives, I'm going to compare strains, and probably try to buy individual strains from the low-histamine list.

I can't take VSL3 (recommended by my LLMD) because it contains corn derivatives. smhair
Lyme, Babesia, Bartonella. Symptoms began 5/2016, didn't start treatment until 9/2016. Slow but steady recovery.

*twitch twitch*

The Dude Abides
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2017
Total Posts : 1135
   Posted 1/23/2018 3:26 PM (GMT -6)   
The more strains overall, the fewer Colony-Forming Units (CFUs) of each individual strain. For anyone taking probiotics, I would suggest rotating through different brands/strains, to ensure diversity.

All that said, fermented foods are likely more effective than probiotic supplements. But, do the best you can, with what information and resources you have available.

1000Daisies, as usual, shared some great wisdom.

mpost
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Date Joined Feb 2015
Total Posts : 1522
   Posted 1/23/2018 11:46 PM (GMT -6)   
the human gut microbiome has thousands of species of bacteria and fungi. taking probiotics with multiple strains AND high numbers gives u better chances of low GI side effects to abx.

i take 3 types of probiotics every day. one is a special powder of s boulardii, anothet is a set of 10 strains and 12 bilion CFU and the third one is well PB8.... i take them on empty stomach, 3-4hrs away from abx with the exception of s. boulardii which i sometimes take with the abx because it is a fungus and i am not taking antifungal treatment right now....

5 months into treatment and i have had no gut issues at all yet. knock on wood. taking mino rifampin zithromax...

my advice is as in dr H's book: take many probiotics and of different brands and do not be cheap with this one...cdiff is a real danger with so many months of treatment.

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32685
   Posted 1/23/2018 11:50 PM (GMT -6)   
Like mpost, I also have a few different ones I take....I change it up.

I usually have three different (actually 4 now) ones that I take.

I've been on abx for over three years (with a few breaks) now and no gut issues - yet.

mpost - are they better on empty stomach? I haven't always done that.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

mpost
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2015
Total Posts : 1522
   Posted 1/24/2018 12:01 AM (GMT -6)   
me neither i am less careful with that than with taxing abx on empty stomach like rifampin. i think the important thing is take then away ot abx, daily and do not limit yourself to one probiotic producer.

girlie i think the idea behind taking it on empty stomach is will quickly go past the stomach and its acid, so more can survive to reach the gut. i think most strains resist acid so maybe is not as important.....

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32685
   Posted 1/24/2018 12:08 AM (GMT -6)   
mpost said...
me neither i am less careful with that than with taxing abx on empty stomach like rifampin. i think the important thing is take then away ot abx, daily and do not limit yourself to one probiotic producer.

girlie i think the idea behind taking it on empty stomach is will quickly go past the stomach and its acid, so more can survive to reach the gut. i think most strains resist acid so maybe is not as important.....



I take Rifampin on empty stomach, but some of my others' - like minocycline or doxy, I do eat food...or they do irritate my GI tract otherwise.

So, I take my Rifampin, wait about 45 minutes and eat my breakfast (or dinner) and take my other antibiotic.

My pee is a burnt orange color...I read that's a good sign....not sure if that's true.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

mokeyho
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 110
   Posted 1/24/2018 8:26 AM (GMT -6)   
My LLMD recommends VSL #3, so that's what I'm taking. I ordered it on Amazon Prime and it came in a Styrofoam cooler with an ice pack.
DX w/ Lyme, Babs, Bart in Sept '09. On IV abx Nov '09 until Mar '09. Orals for a few months and I felt great so I just stopped. In Apr '16, things suddenly went awry... my ability to walk was affected, double-vision, it hurt to touch my bare belly with my bare fingers, but no problem touching through fabric. Started three oral abx in Apr 2016. New problems in Dec 2016. Back to 4 abx Dec '16.

mpost
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2015
Total Posts : 1522
   Posted 1/25/2018 7:28 AM (GMT -6)   
Girlie said...

I take Rifampin on empty stomach, but some of my others' - like minocycline or doxy, I do eat food...or they do irritate my GI tract otherwise.

So, I take my Rifampin, wait about 45 minutes and eat my breakfast (or dinner) and take my other antibiotic.

My pee is a burnt orange color...I read that's a good sign....not sure if that's true.


yeah that's ok, it means it has got absorbed.
since 2 months ago im taking rifampin with mino and serrapeptase 250000 IU all at the same time on empty stomach, twice a day. I know mino is absorbed well with food but average abs is 88% , and depending on how much iron or dairy u got in your meal that can get towards 60%. so im not taking any chances, as long as my gut can handle it, i just take them on empty stomach.

zithromax though, i take with food, it's harder on the liver and i think two abx on empty stomach is enough. plus the Serrapeptase is pretty hard on stomach too. I remember when is started treatment it gave me somach pain 20 mins after taking it on empty stomach. Herx maybe. no i can take it with abx and there is no problem....

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32685
   Posted 1/25/2018 12:39 PM (GMT -6)   
mpost said...
Girlie said...

I take Rifampin on empty stomach, but some of my others' - like minocycline or doxy, I do eat food...or they do irritate my GI tract otherwise.

So, I take my Rifampin, wait about 45 minutes and eat my breakfast (or dinner) and take my other antibiotic.

My pee is a burnt orange color...I read that's a good sign....not sure if that's true.


yeah that's ok, it means it has got absorbed.
since 2 months ago im taking rifampin with mino and serrapeptase 250000 IU all at the same time on empty stomach, twice a day. I know mino is absorbed well with food but average abs is 88% , and depending on how much iron or dairy u got in your meal that can get towards 60%. so im not taking any chances, as long as my gut can handle it, i just take them on empty stomach.

zithromax though, i take with food, it's harder on the liver and i think two abx on empty stomach is enough. plus the Serrapeptase is pretty hard on stomach too. I remember when is started treatment it gave me somach pain 20 mins after taking it on empty stomach. Herx maybe. no i can take it with abx and there is no problem....


I do make sure I'm not eating dairy at the meal I take the mino or doxy with.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

gabybee
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2015
Total Posts : 207
   Posted 1/25/2018 3:26 PM (GMT -6)   
My naturopath who also wrote the book "The Candida Diet" recommended I use a high quality probiotic with lots of strains. When I'm at my dads house I take one with a little less strains. I've always felt better on the high quality ones with lots of strains.
22 years old, symptoms started in 2013 and was diagnosed in 2015
HHV6/EBV
Lyme
Bartonella
MTHFR
ecoli+klebsiella
Candida

Treating with multiple vitamins + Supplements, Byron white formulas, and bee venom therapy.
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