Reactions to foods: yeast/fungus or something else?

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NotQuiteAntonio
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   Posted 2/2/2018 7:39 PM (GMT -6)   
So, lately, I've been trying to advance my diet, as I've been on a ketogenic diet for a couple years now, and I'm getting sick of the limited variety. Though, more than that, I'm concerned about excess fat and protein putting strain on my kidneys, gallbladder, etc. I eat a lot of them. I have to in order to keep my intake up, but also feel satisfied.

Carbs are easier to digest, right? I'd like to get back into eating some more complex carbs, low sugar fruits, etc.

Though, the past few times I've tried, I've experienced these sensations of pressure, tingling in my sinuses, as well as a subtle change in level of consciousness. They make me more of a nut, is the simplest way to put it. Just don't feel right in my skin, basically.

My doctor and I feel mold is a problem for me. It's a problem with the house that needs fixing, but isn't an option at the moment. I plan to contact HUD/Habitat for Humanity in the spring to see about possible remediation or even moving, but I can't do that right now. I treat with sprays, a fan filter in my room, but I don't feel it's enough. What progress I do make is reversed by constant exposure to the source.

Though, I'm wondering if the food is a problem for the mold or if it's just some other response r/t my not eating carbs for such a long time. I've heard of things like the "keto flu" when you're first transitioning to processing fats, rather than carbs, so maybe there's something similar for transitioning back to a more traditional diet.

Whenever I eat foods that trigger those responses, it always seems to be localized to my sinuses, head, etc. I don't feel it's a systemic thing. I never experience any unsettling symptoms in my GI, elsewhere in the body, when I eat things like sweet potatoes, brown rice, more of the safer carbs to reintroduce.

Though, this past time, a sore throat set in about a day after trialing some of these foods, but I'm not sure if it's related to that, as I've had some pseudo-sicknesses the past year or so.

I just thought I'd get some input, if anyone cared to give it.

Thanks :D

PDXtransplant
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   Posted 2/3/2018 12:32 AM (GMT -6)   
a coworker who had gastroparesis related to diabetes was told by her dr that whole grains are harder to digest so if you want easy to digest carbs white rice, white bread is easier to digest but unf also convert to sugar.

Eiren
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Date Joined Aug 2017
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   Posted 2/3/2018 3:06 AM (GMT -6)   
I'm not sure if grains are easier to digest. If they are heavily processed, like a cracker, then yes, it's easier to eat. But that goes for all things, hot dogs are easier to eat than a steak.

White rice, yes, I read somewhere that it's thought to almost immediately break down in the stomach. Very boiled and smashed white potato is the same. When people have stomach issues in undeveloped countries they usually just eat white rice or boiled potato, or both.

But what you're describing sounds similar to a sugar rush. Maybe it's understandable since you maybe haven't given your body any sucrose or anything for external glycogen in a long time.

Why did you start keto? Are those reasons still relevant? I think keto can be healthy long term, but on a personal and individual level what is theoretical must go behind what makes your body feel best.

Maybe start small? A few blueberries along with your high-fat breakfast, just to slow down how quickly the sugar hits your head.

Or maybe your head is saying that it doesn't want carbs. I think high-fat diets can be healthy (I'm typing this while drinking my bullet-proof coffee) as long as you stick to whole, quality foods. Fat is very easily digested and utilized in the body. You can eat too much protein, true. But you can calculate that and see if you're going over.

But if by keto you mean zero carbs, yeah, that can get boring. I hate reducing food to numbers, but you can break it down. So if you eat 25g carb now, have a week where you go up to 35, then bump up to 50, and so on.

NotQuiteAntonio
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   Posted 2/3/2018 7:20 AM (GMT -6)   
Well, ammonia is a byproduct of protein breakdown, correct? In excess, coupled with all of the other toxin-bearing things going on in my body, along with the environent (see: mold, mainly), I’m worried that coukd be a problem.

Along with that, while there are many in favor, and I’ve seen a lot of claims made in favor, though the body does have its way of reaching sugars through fats, ketones are still a factor, and they’re acidic. Diabetic ketoacidosis, while a much more severe of a thing, the ketones play a part in it just being... not good for you.

It’s only been a couple of years, I can’t say I FEEL all that terrible directly due to diet, but... I don’t know that either. It’s been so long, I forget what it’s like to not be in ketosis. A couple years it’s been, for sure.

I feel like I’ve read that grains can increase inflammation, but I’d definitely be sure to avoid glutinous grains, and eat them in moderation. I doubt I’ll eat anything as processed as a cracker, chip, anything like that again. Starchier vegetables, rices, few sweet potatoes, low sugar fruits in small amounts. I really just want enough carbs to stay far enough away from ketosis. I doubt I’ll be hitting the RDI, unless my health miraculously improves to pre-infection state, and it’s been about a decade now, so...

As far as the body’s difficulty breaking down nutrients, whether fats, proteins, or carbs, I’ve always assumed the former two were more troublesome. I mean, maybe it’s simplistic, but they seem to have more byproducts, at face value. Ketones, ammonia, etc.

What are the byproducts of grain digestion et utilization? Sugars? Personally, I’d be aiming for ones that take longer to breakdown, and lower on the glycemic load. I don’t want to give it to myself, or whatever pathogens, in quick bursts. I don’t know if that logic is sound. It’s interesting to hear how quickly they can breakdown in the stomach, though.

I just want to say that I see you’ve hit some of these bases, Eiren. I kind of just think out loud when I’m here.

I don’t do near as much research as I should. It’s a constant struggle to keep getting out of bed, going to school, work, treat halfheartedly, try to be an adult, gain independence. Though, you could argue my health is not as bad as it could be, if I’m able to stay afloat as such, I suppose.

I agree in that I should titrate my carbs, and I typically do. It’ll be a jump from 25-40 NET carbs to, maybe... 100-125.

Relevant factors in my eating this way? I’d say the risks are still there, but I’ve tried a number of things fot yeast/fungus. Fluconazole, itraconazole, nystatin, and in long-term. Probiotics. Starving it out, obviously.. right?

But, again, whenever I do eat these things, it always feels like the symptoms are confined to my nasal passages/sinuses. I used to get this deeply unsettling feeling in my gut whenever I’d eat foods that compromised my health. My GI would be telling me, no, it was like. I don’t feel that with foods anymore. None of the itching either.

I think if I could get my house fixed up, or, if not that, eventually move out on my own, I’ll get a lot better. The mold. I need to get on that this spring et summer.

Post Edited (NotQuiteAntonio) : 2/3/2018 6:24:38 AM (GMT-7)


Eiren
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Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 58
   Posted 2/4/2018 7:33 AM (GMT -6)   
I asked if there was a reason you did keto because some people do keto diets for psychiatric seizures or to control diabetes or whatever. Diets are personal things, but I was wondering if there was a reason for it, and if that reason is still important to you.

As far as digestion goes, grains and plant foods in general can cause problems for some people. Fiber can tear up the intestines. Fructose can cause some people to bloat. Goitrogens. Our intestines can't digest cellulose (not long enough). And then there's the "anti-nutrients" that some plants have which some people have issues with.

Comparatively, the amino acids in protein and the various chains of fat are relatively simple once your stomach acid gets hold of them.

But it's all so individual. I do best on high fat and low fiber. I might be in the minority, but that's me.

The sinus/nose feeling is something that I can relate to whenever I go off-script with some birthday cake or whatever. So that's why I do think it has something to do with a flush of glucose. It's sorta like the medicine head you get when you're sick and take a hefty dose of Nyquil, except just the front of my face. Sorta. Weird visual, I know.

But yeah, once you eat one way a while your digestion gets used to it. Change all of a sudden and your body will throw a fit. Like the day I hung out with my Indian friend and ate a bunch of legitimate Indian food (unbelievably spicy). Yeah...my body was like ***???? after that, lol. So go slow. smile

Traveler
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   Posted 2/4/2018 11:05 AM (GMT -6)   
What about the possibility that your gut is the issue, and not the grains? If you aren't able to break them down properly, then you could have more issues as well. Do you have enough stomach acid and are your intestines seem to be working well enough to rule that out?

I've been a bit of a rebel with diet this whole time. I have limited but never cut out dairy, grains, small amounts of low sugar fruits (usually, on the other hand, I have oranges sitting on the counter right now - I go 'with' my healthy cravings). What I have seen in my case is that as my gut has healed more, I seem to be getting more benefits from the food I do eat.

Just a thought.
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Notime4lyme
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Date Joined Dec 2017
Total Posts : 273
   Posted 2/4/2018 12:31 PM (GMT -6)   
Have you tried low-sugar fruits, like green apples or berries? Maybe they would be easier to digest.

NotQuiteAntonio
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Date Joined Jan 2015
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   Posted 2/4/2018 6:05 PM (GMT -6)   
Not for awhile. I tried a bit of rice yesterday, though. Not a good time, and my stomach’s not even wanting to tolerate tinctures anymore. It’s a bit of a surprise, actually. Very unsettling response, for all I have done to my gut.

It’s been such a long time, and I have tried most of what’s available to me, as far as treatment. Illnesses compounding on each other, resistance to the antifungal medications, my immune system, mold in the home, I’m not sure to what the delay is owed.

What can you do, besides starve it out, which, while you’re definitely not feeding the buggies and avoiding unpleasant symptoms in doing so, the good bacteria aren’t being fed a wide range either, right? I’d like to think there’s a portion of my biome that would very much benefit from a fuller diet. I eat, I’m able to maintain body weight, feeling with energy, but there’s a definite sense of malnourishment.

But, again, what can you do, besides limit your diet for months, taking natural or prescription medicine, and probiotics in an attempt to change the landscape of your gut? What happens when that doesn’t work? Well, you just keep trying, of course.

But... like, is it a running in circles game, or have I just not tried the right products, right time, right duration? Who knows?

Realistically, I’d be fine eating the couple dozen things I can safely eat, just to avoid feeling this way, but I can’t act like it’s not a weight on the heart, social situations, and that there’s not an element of my just feeling unhealthy. Meat, low starch veggies, avocados, oils. Forever. Least I’m alive, though. Could be worse. I can still enjoy some things. I just gotta get back to baseline from this rice response.

Blah blah. You guys know the deal, in some way or another. Take care of your tummies.
Do the work, be the prize.

NotQuiteAntonio
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Date Joined Jan 2015
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   Posted 2/4/2018 6:24 PM (GMT -6)   
Increasing reactions to foods is why I started eating this way. It wasn’t intentional. I’d eat things that made me feel unpleasant, whether it’s crawling, tingling sensations in my sinuses, indigestion, an ugly feeling in my gut, irritability, or a total change in personality.

I said, not a good time, regarding my response to eating rice, right? I feel like a different person. I’m so broken and unmotivated, suicidal, etc. It’s amazing, terrifying that a cup of rice could do that, you know? It’s not the first time I’ve experienced something like this either. That’s why I started eating the way I normally eat, because these other foods literally ruin me.

My options slowly dwindled to nothing, but meat, low carb vegetables, and healthy oils. I was on a ketogenic diet, without even realizing it. I’m not doing it as, like, some health kick. For my sanity, rather. I wouldn’t dream of eating Indian food with my friends. I can’t imagine. A cheat day? What’s that?

Grains, fruits, starchy vegetables, what have you. After the reminder that I got yesterday, and into today, you’d have to pay me to eat any of those things... a lot.

I used to eat beans, rices, low sugar apples, berries, and the like, just fine. Then, something changed. I’ve been trying to put it together for a couple years now. I’ve done kefir, sauerkraut, most of the commonly recommended probiotics, px antifungal agents for months, garlic, whatever.

It’s just one of those things. I’m sorry for whining about my withered diet, because I’d eat chicken and broccoli every day to just feel comfortable in my head, but it does suck. I do miss cookies and crap.

I’m sorry I’m so unsightly, guys.

Love you, stay wonderful. Thank you for taking the precious time out of your lives.

I’ll be strong again, someday. smile

edit: I appreciate everything you’ve said, and acknowledge the truths. Read, even if I did not respond to particular points. Just can’t.

Eiren
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Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 58
   Posted 2/5/2018 6:53 AM (GMT -6)   
Do what your body tells you and what makes you feel best.

You have my permission. :D

The only thing is to watch your protein. There's calculators online that tell you what is too much. Boneless, skinless chicken breast is almost pure protein, so I have a little caution there. Rabbit sickness, also called rabbit starvation, is a thing.

But there's people who eat keto for years and years and do well and are healthy. There's also zero-ers, who pretty much only eat fatty meat. They get their blood checked and it turns up fine. So I think you'll be fine. But you can always ask your doctor to run cholesterol panels and whatever every once in a while to make sure.

MooseSafari
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Date Joined Jan 2018
Total Posts : 78
   Posted 2/6/2018 11:23 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi NQAntonio, it was great to read your story, I can really identify my condition with your current state. Feeling that some food are literally smiting both body and mind every time I have a meal. Then some meals are more okej than others and I am desperately trying to find out what food is causing what symptoms.

I would be very happy if you could be kind and post a detailed list of the food you have found out so far is causing less symtoms and what renders more horrible effects. And I would really like to compare this list with my own home-made list of cause and effect.

WalkingbyFaith
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   Posted 2/7/2018 12:03 PM (GMT -6)   
Antonio,

Yeast/mold/food sensitivities could all be plausible causes. The sinus stuff could also be MARCONS, which is especially common in those exposed to mold. Have you recently been tested for MARCONS?

Razzle
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   Posted 2/7/2018 1:44 PM (GMT -6)   
A whole cup of rice is a lot of carb. Try one small bite in the middle of a normal meal. Try non-grain starches first, as some find any grains too difficult to tolerate.

Also consider the toxins from mold will linger even after mold exposure itself is gone. Must work on getting those toxins out.

Also consider the additives in some kinds of white rice - synthetic, possibly fungal-derived fortified vitamins are not healthy in my opinion...
-Razzle

Chronic Lyme, Bart., Gluten & Sulfite Sensitivity, Many Food/Inhalant/Medication/Chemical Allergies & Intolerances, Asthma, Gut dysmotility & non-specific inflammation, Lupus, Osteoporosis, etc.; G-Tube; TPN-dependent
Meds: Essential Oils, Homeopathy, etc.

NotQuiteAntonio
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   Posted 2/7/2018 7:25 PM (GMT -6)   
I suppose, Razzle. Another user recommended that I increase by 10g per week. I’m not sure if that was here, though. I’d wanted to eat a small portion, yet sizable enough to make a difference in my intake for that day.

It was 40g of carbs, I believe, putting me at around 80 for the day, when I normally take in around 30-40. That’s a pretty large jump, looking at it. Part of me had been hoping the ill effects were related to my body not being used to processing sugars in that way, and it might be partially r/t that, but I’m certain there are other factors involved, be they mold, yeast, leaky gut, etc.

I did eat it with a normal meal. Well, normal for me. I ate brown rice, also. Organic, whatever that is worth, these days.

As for trying another small bite, I’m not going there again, sorry. Not for awhile. It’s been a few days, and I’m can’t say I’m back to baseline. I have a job, school, etc. I need what little security in my head that I’m able to put together on my best days.

That’s my plan, though. No grains. I was able to tolerate sweet potatoes in the summer, but then chronic constipation contributed to something resurfacing, I feel. They sat in my gut too long.

It’s a number of things. They float in and out of my head, from time to time. I never really have the time to delve too deeply. Life’s a mess, as you’ve all experienced. I’m just trying to get to a point where I can stay afloat currently, then put more time into healing again. I can’t say I ignore it completely, but the picture is a lot more complex than the time I’m able to put into appreciating it would tell you. Health is everything in this life, but time is money, and the world won’t wait for me to get better. I am trying, of course. I just got it in my head that I wasn’t gonna let Lyme keep me from progressing a couple years ago, and... got wrapped up in school, career path, etc. I mean, there was a necessity to it - I need money, but I was tired of sitting in my room as well.

Anyway, yeah, I need to work on my gut, more, detox is always a struggle, and get out of this house, because mold is definitely at play, yes. Those are the big things right now. Then, comes how I’m going to do more than keep myself from getting sicker as opposed to healing.

Hoping it’ll all fall together. I just do my “best.” Surviving in my own way. I’ll get there. Keep it positive, eight? smile

I’m sure we’ll see each other again.

MooseSafari:

For protein, I eat a lot of chicken, fish, seldom grassfed beef, and eggs. The rest, avocadoes are great for calories, along with avocado, coconut, and decent quality olive oil, though not as often as the first two oils. Calories. Apart from that, all the green vegetables. Broccoli, brussel sprouts, lettuces, spinach, kale, cucumbers, zucchini, asparagus, green beans, and the couple others I’m forgetting. Garlic, onion, peppers, sometimes. I wish they had more calories, because I’ve learned to love them these past couple years, broccoli especially. Mm. Gets old, though, yes. I’m able to take in Green Vibrance for extra, though I can’t say I feel depleted without it. Colloidal minerals. A B Complex. Nothing excessive as far as supplementation to offset deficiencies.

Post Edited (NotQuiteAntonio) : 2/7/2018 6:31:28 PM (GMT-7)


MooseSafari
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Date Joined Jan 2018
Total Posts : 78
   Posted 2/8/2018 2:56 AM (GMT -6)   
Great, many thanks! I am taking good notes here.

What about extra magnesium, I read about taking a really big doze in the evening would be very useful. did you experience anything of the like...?

Georgia Hunter
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   Posted 2/8/2018 5:45 AM (GMT -6)   
Antonio, unless you get away from that house and the mold, you won't be able to determine what is causing the issue. I'm a firm believer that environment dictates health in adults more than genetics. If your environment isn't good, then you won't be good/healthy.

And for others in this thread, just because eating something makes you feel better doesn't mean it's the best thing for you long term. Not eating something may benefit you because when you eat it, it increases oxidative stress. The ultimate goal is to determine why it increases oxidative stress and correct that issue. For many of us, the cause is pathogens that have reduced or depleted specific nutrients that allow for more efficient cellular processing. Borrelia is just one of many pathogens that may be causing us issues. Metal accumulation can be an issue as well. But with any or all of the issues we face, there is one constant. That constant is that our GI bacterial ratios are skewed. Correcting these ratios is necessary to improve health. Unless the pathogens are reduced or the GI environment is improved, correcting the bacterial ratios can increase oxidative stress (which is the cause of almost all our issues.) So what we need to do can hurt us. If I had the answers, I'd give them to you. It's taken all these years just for me to find the right questions.

k07
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Date Joined Sep 2015
Total Posts : 2502
   Posted 2/8/2018 8:05 AM (GMT -6)   
I'm sure you've already looked at parasites? Also, are you drinking filtered water?

Have you tried Modified Citrus Pectin as a binder? It seems easiest on the gut and has good impact on metals (lead, cadmium, arsenic that I know of) and has recently been touted as being able to regulate immune system (something to do with galectin-3).

I feel for you since you've tried so much. It does seem like some factor caused a sudden switch.

WalkingbyFaith
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Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 1682
   Posted 2/8/2018 9:40 AM (GMT -6)   
Georgia Hunter said...
Antonio, unless you get away from that house and the mold, you won't be able to determine what is causing the issue. I'm a firm believer that environment dictates health in adults more than genetics. If your environment isn't good, then you won't be good/healthy.

And for others in this thread, just because eating something makes you feel better doesn't mean it's the best thing for you long term. Not eating something may benefit you because when you eat it, it increases oxidative stress. The ultimate goal is to determine why it increases oxidative stress and correct that issue. For many of us, the cause is pathogens that have reduced or depleted specific nutrients that allow for more efficient cellular processing. Borrelia is just one of many pathogens that may be causing us issues. Metal accumulation can be an issue as well. But with any or all of the issues we face, there is one constant. That constant is that our GI bacterial ratios are skewed. Correcting these ratios is necessary to improve health. Unless the pathogens are reduced or the GI environment is improved, correcting the bacterial ratios can increase oxidative stress (which is the cause of almost all our issues.) So what we need to do can hurt us. If I had the answers, I'd give them to you. It's taken all these years just for me to find the right questions.


Georgia Hunter,

All great comments and advice, as usual. Thanks!

It's so easy for us to get bogged down with all the issues we have and forget that all the issues are caused by something else, and we need to be reminded to focus on the root cause(s). Glad you made the point that Borrelia isn't the only pathogen we need to address. I'm getting deeper and deeper into herbal treatments that target many types of pathogens. I feel like that's my best shot, even if it takes a long time.
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