Cats and bartonella

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OriolCarol
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Date Joined Dec 2017
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   Posted 2/20/2018 5:07 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi guys.

I have a 2 year old cat at home and I think he may be infected with bartonella (and me too). It has torn my skin many times (now not anymore, since my first symptoms). The problem is that if he is infected, the bacteria can persist in the environment? We have hairs all over the house ....

OriolCarol
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Date Joined Dec 2017
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   Posted 2/20/2018 5:11 PM (GMT -6)   
Can this be causing a recurrent infection?

Girlie
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   Posted 2/20/2018 5:31 PM (GMT -6)   
I don't think it is a problem - in the house . If your cat bites you ...or maybe even a scratch...it can re-infect you.

i may have been reinfected in 2016 after a nasty cat bite...cat had undiagnosed heart disease,and died so maybe had bartonella.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

goshawk
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Date Joined Sep 2016
Total Posts : 2101
   Posted 2/20/2018 5:47 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi you can have your cat tested for Bartonella.

I think it is only transmitted to humans from a cat bite or scratch.

I don't think the hair from the cat is a problem.

Take care, Jo

k07
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Date Joined Sep 2015
Total Posts : 2498
   Posted 2/20/2018 6:00 PM (GMT -6)   
Our new cat has bart. I had her tested bc she has respiratory issues. It makes me nervous but from what I read it could be as high as half of all cats carry it.

Girlie
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Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32507
   Posted 2/20/2018 6:14 PM (GMT -6)   
k07 said...
Our new cat has bart. I had her tested bc she has respiratory issues. It makes me nervous but from what I read it could be as high as half of all cats carry it.


have you asked the Vet if your cat can be treated?
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

WalkingbyFaith
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Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 1662
   Posted 2/20/2018 6:17 PM (GMT -6)   
I was about to post a question on this the other day. I've had bartonella symptoms since childhood and had no pets then. I had 2 cats in adulthood. One died and the other is 17 years old now. The one still living does scratch me a lot if I don't dodge her fast enough. How do I get her tested? How accurate is the testing for cats? It's not very reliable for us.

I also wondered about the litter box. I change her litter box. I know I should wear gloves and a mask, but I never do. If she does have bartonella, can I get reinfected by changing the litter box?

Girlie
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Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32507
   Posted 2/20/2018 6:38 PM (GMT -6)   
WalkingbyFaith said...
I was about to post a question on this the other day. I've had bartonella symptoms since childhood and had no pets then. I had 2 cats in adulthood. One died and the other is 17 years old now. The one still living does scratch me a lot if I don't dodge her fast enough. How do I get her tested? How accurate is the testing for cats? It's not very reliable for us.

I also wondered about the litter box. I change her litter box. I know I should wear gloves and a mask, but I never do. If she does have bartonella, can I get reinfected by changing the litter box?


I don't think you can get reinfected by changing the litter box. It's not air-borne (as far as I know )

But, you can get toxoplasmosis (sp?) I think. I don't know for if it's air-borne, but I remember when I was pregnant putting on gloves when I went out to weed the flower beds.

When I changed the litter boxes (when my husband was out of town) I would do it outside...and I would hold my breath and dump it into the bag....then quickly walk away and breathe again. Then I'd disinfect the litter box before refilling it.
This was before I had lyme.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

k07
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Date Joined Sep 2015
Total Posts : 2498
   Posted 2/20/2018 7:16 PM (GMT -6)   
I’ve had toxo (was tested when pregnant and showed past infection). My childhood revolved around trying to tame wild cats.

My kittens bart test came back very high. For some reason it seems that the animal testing is more accurate. Especially if they have symptoms. I treated her with abx for awhile but she still has some symptoms which could be chlamydia. I’m giving her lysine and may take her to holistic vet.

WalkingbyFaith
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Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 1662
   Posted 2/20/2018 7:49 PM (GMT -6)   
We don't have any holistic vets here. I wish we did. I would take her to one.

I know my cat has issues that are likely from the mold exposure. She lost a ton of weight just like my parents and I did. I can't believe she's still here after all she's been through the last year and half, especially at 17 years old. I tried talking to vets about the mold issues. One of them treated me horribly. I think the vets here are even worse than the people doctors.

k07
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Date Joined Sep 2015
Total Posts : 2498
   Posted 2/20/2018 8:14 PM (GMT -6)   
Ugh. That happened to my cat (lost weight) and he was hyperthyroid. Eventually high bp and kidneys failed. He almost made it to 18.

He could have had mold exposure too.

The Dude Abides
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Date Joined May 2017
Total Posts : 1101
   Posted 2/20/2018 8:38 PM (GMT -6)   
Here's something I originally posted in this thread, regarding Dr. Klinghardt's view on cats:

"Cats are forbidden.  They carry toxoplasmosis, viruses, Bartonella, XMRV‐like viruses, etc."

Source: bit.ly/2o64h7l, Page 11

"XMRV – Judy Mikovits – murine/mouse gets to people through cats.  Former cat owners have higher prostate cancer.  86% of CFS have XMRV virus."

Source: Ibid., Page 12

"Cats are not safe for us.  Dogs of Lyme disease owners have average lifespan of 8 years vs. 12‐14.  If there is a plague on the world right now, it is cats.  Dogs carry Bartonella but attract bugs to them rather than to their owners.  They have parasites.  Dog owners need to be de‐wormed twice a year."

Source: Ibid., Page 12

I had an orange/white tabby for 11 years and was rarely separated. When I traveled for work, she flew with me. She slept in the bed and under the cover next to me. (In fact, she would often hog the bed!) I've long wondered if I might have picked-up something from her, given the years of scooping the litter box, her walking on the counters/table (despite my trying to dissuade her with a spray bottle of water), and her licking my face.

Girlie
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Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32507
   Posted 2/20/2018 9:37 PM (GMT -6)   
Dude - the spray bottles have never worked in our home either.

Our current cat is too fat to jump on to the kitchen counters.
But she has other bad habits - like scratching our recliners - I’m now glad we didn’t buy the expensive leather ones.

Face licking - oh yah - but never on the mouth- lol

Dude - do you not have a cat now for health reasons?
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

The Dude Abides
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Date Joined May 2017
Total Posts : 1101
   Posted 2/20/2018 10:13 PM (GMT -6)   
Girlie said...
Dude - the spray bottles have never worked in our home either.

Our current cat is too fat to jump on to the kitchen counters.
But she has other bad habits - like scratching our recliners - I’m now glad we didn’t buy the expensive leather ones.

Face licking - oh yah - but never on the mouth- lol

Dude - do you not have a cat now for health reasons?


Regarding the spray bottle, it worked, initially. But, over time, I would walk toward her with it and she would just crouch-down, close her eyes, and wait for the blast of water. But, she would no longer get off the counter.

Unfortunately, she was put to sleep on May 25, 2007, due to Intestinal Lymphoma.

I still blame myself for her illness, due to the food I fed her. (Iams dry cat food, rather than wet/raw food.) She'd had intestinal problems for years, but I "managed" it by giving her the steroids that a Veterinarian in Dallas had prescribed. If I could do it over again, knowing what I know now, I would have her on a completely different diet. I still have a lot of guilt over the matter and haven't been able to even consider another pet.

At the time she passed, we were living in Seattle and the Veterinary Clinic there had done nothing useful nor found anything helpful, in all the visits leading-up to my cat's passing. In fact, they weren't even the ones that discovered the Lymphoma. That was done by an Emergency Veterinary Clinic - the place where she was also put to sleep, and, subsequently, cremated.

Some weeks after she was gone, I got a reminder card in the mail from the "regular" Veterinary Clinic to bring my cat for a checkup. I completely lost my mind, called the Clinic, and told them if I ever received ANY form of communication from them again, they could expect a visit from me and I would clear-out the @#$%* building. Luckily, for all of us, I never heard from them again.

She had been with me through a divorce, a job layoff, selling my house, moving to new cities and states, ongoing bouts of fear and anxiety, a hurricane, etc. I cried daily for two weeks, after she passed. It completely shattered me. Almost 11 years later, my heart still aches. I've still never even opened the sealed box that contains the urn with her ashes.

No doubt, I could use some psychotherapy. shakehead

OriolCarol
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Date Joined Dec 2017
Total Posts : 544
   Posted 2/21/2018 2:40 AM (GMT -6)   
I'm worried. There is a doctor named Schaller who says that bartonella can infect the eyes, saliva etc ... then I understand that if I eat a hair of my cat (surely I have swallowed many unintentionally) I will be re-infected with bartonella reincidentally ... I do not know if these claims of that schaller have fundament scientist but I am paranoid now with my cat and I dodge all the hairs that I find around the house

NicHostetler
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Date Joined Mar 2017
Total Posts : 617
   Posted 2/21/2018 8:46 AM (GMT -6)   
I personally think it is comical that Klinghardt says that cats are plague on the world. HA!!

That is just absolutely ridiculous. For one person that gets bartonella from a cat there are thousands, HUNDREDS of thousands that get healing from cats. Cats reduce anxiety and depression among many many other things. I am young (just out of college) and live alone in a pretty big city quite a ways away from family. I have a cat that I am so attached to. He's my best friend and I love him to death. He has been by my side through my whole journey with Lyme and I rely on him for emotional healing.

I do, however, (and I know this is extremely contradictory to what I just said) think that I may have gotten bartonella from him. When he was a kitten I adopted him and he liked to play a lot (as all pets do) and scratched me a few times. It is really hard to remember for me if I was sick before I got him or after because it all happened around the same time..

I actually just called my vet two weeks ago to see if I could get him tested for bartonella and they said I could but it was like $125 and there was nothing they can do for bart unless the cat is showing symptoms. I guess the meds are like three antibiotics (similar to what we would take for bart) for a few weeks and typically does not get rid of the infection and can make the cat more sick. I am thinking of just getting the claw covers for him to prevent any possible reinfection if he does have it.

k07
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Date Joined Sep 2015
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   Posted 2/21/2018 9:30 AM (GMT -6)   
NicHostetler said...
I personally think it is comical that Klinghardt says that cats are plague on the world. HA!!

That is just absolutely ridiculous. For one person that gets bartonella from a cat there are thousands, HUNDREDS of thousands that get healing from cats. Cats reduce anxiety and depression among many many other things. I am young (just out of college) and live alone in a pretty big city quite a ways away from family. I have a cat that I am so attached to. He's my best friend and I love him to death. He has been by my side through my whole journey with Lyme and I rely on him for emotional healing.

I do, however, (and I know this is extremely contradictory to what I just said) think that I may have gotten bartonella from him. When he was a kitten I adopted him and he liked to play a lot (as all pets do) and scratched me a few times. It is really hard to remember for me if I was sick before I got him or after because it all happened around the same time..

I actually just called my vet two weeks ago to see if I could get him tested for bartonella and they said I could but it was like $125 and there was nothing they can do for bart unless the cat is showing symptoms. I guess the meds are like three antibiotics (similar to what we would take for bart) for a few weeks and typically does not get rid of the infection and can make the cat more sick. I am thinking of just getting the claw covers for him to prevent any possible reinfection if he does have it.


I totally agree with you! I typically like Klinghardt but this is one piece that I do NOT agree with him. Most people can be exposed to bartonella and not get sick. It is like any other thing that our immune system can keep in check. I'm pretty sure I was exposed as a child.

Dogs (not cats) are known to carry MARCoNS in their noses, which can depress the immune system. So all animals carry risk. But they are well worth it for me.

I keep my kittens nails trimmed. I think we're forgetting that even if you get scratched/bit if you thoroughly clean it you will hopefully be ok. Also, people can end up getting bartonella not directly from the cat but fleas (cdc says this is not proven but...). So making sure that the cat does not have fleas is important.

Post Edited (k07) : 2/21/2018 8:35:27 AM (GMT-7)


Girlie
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   Posted 2/21/2018 12:28 PM (GMT -6)   
k07 said...



I totally agree with you! I typically like Klinghardt but this is one piece that I do NOT agree with him. Most people can be exposed to bartonella and not get sick. It is like any other thing that our immune system can keep in check. I'm pretty sure I was exposed as a child.

Dogs (not cats) are known to carry MARCoNS in their noses, which can depress the immune system. So all animals carry risk. But they are well worth it for me.

I keep my kittens nails trimmed. I think we're forgetting that even if you get scratched/bit if you thoroughly clean it you will hopefully be ok. Also, people can end up getting bartonella not directly from the cat but fleas (cdc says this is not proven but...). So making sure that the cat does not have fleas is important.


I have also read that Bartonella is usually 'self-limiting' - meaning we are exposed but our immune systems deal with it.

Our cat(s) have been indoor cats only for the past 20 years. So no fleas...they're clean...etc.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

The Dude Abides
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Date Joined May 2017
Total Posts : 1101
   Posted 2/21/2018 12:56 PM (GMT -6)   
I may get one of these as a pet, so I don't have to worry about fur, fleas, ticks, etc.

/youtu.be/tf7IEVTDjng

NicHostetler
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Date Joined Mar 2017
Total Posts : 617
   Posted 2/21/2018 1:15 PM (GMT -6)   
The Dude Abides said...
I may get one of these as a pet, so I don't have to worry about fur, fleas, ticks, etc.

/youtu.be/tf7IEVTDjng


Those look very good for cuddling! tongue

Not sure if you have seen the show Black Mirror on netflix but this type of robot is in one of the episodes so that freaks me out lol. The show is kind of a Twilight Zone type show.

The Dude Abides
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Date Joined May 2017
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   Posted 2/21/2018 1:48 PM (GMT -6)   
NicHostetler said...
The Dude Abides said...
I may get one of these as a pet, so I don't have to worry about fur, fleas, ticks, etc.

/youtu.be/tf7IEVTDjng


Those look very good for cuddling! tongue

Not sure if you have seen the show Black Mirror on netflix but this type of robot is in one of the episodes so that freaks me out lol. The show is kind of a Twilight Zone type show.


Definitely good for cuddling! Rather than a heartbeat, the 60 Hz hum can lull one to sleep.

I have a Netflix subscription, but haven't seen "Black Mirror." I like the old "Twilight Zone" episodes, so I'll look into the new show. Thanks!

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32507
   Posted 2/21/2018 3:59 PM (GMT -6)   
The Dude Abides said...
I may get one of these as a pet, so I don't have to worry about fur, fleas, ticks, etc.

/youtu.be/tf7IEVTDjng



LOL - Dude - you are cracking me up on a daily basis now...please stick around here!
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

The Dude Abides
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Date Joined May 2017
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   Posted 2/21/2018 4:28 PM (GMT -6)   
Thank you, Girlie. You're always very kind. I appreciate you very much.

OriolCarol
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Date Joined Dec 2017
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   Posted 2/22/2018 3:20 AM (GMT -6)   
Then there is no danger of constant infection if I touch the cat's hairs? (in the hypothetical case of having bartonella), or if accidentally, I eat some hairs hahaha. My parents wanted to give the cat into adoption, because they think bartonella is flying by air, hooked on the sheets, sofas, table etc ...

NicHostetler
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Date Joined Mar 2017
Total Posts : 617
   Posted 2/22/2018 7:09 AM (GMT -6)   
In my opinion there is no way bartonella could survive on cats hair for very long, but I am not a doctor.

The only thing I have ever seen is through a bite or a scratch.
Very sick starting around 07/2016
Started treatment 03/2017
Bixain & Cefdinir - 3 months - plateaued
Then Biaxin & Minocycline - 3 months - did not improve
Tinidazole - 500MG 2x a day - 2 weeks
Now taking:
Mepron 5mL 2x a day
Zithromax
Nystatin
Cats Claw - 30 drops 2x a day
Gou Teng - 30 drops 2x a day
CSA - 40 drops 2x a day
Japanese Knotweed - 40 drops 2x a day
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