Bartonella rash appeared years after starting to feel sick?

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jq
New Member


Date Joined Jul 2017
Total Posts : 15
   Posted 2/28/2018 10:04 AM (GMT -6)   
Hey all,

I’ve been feeling super sick now for about 2 years, and just generally unwell for a few years before that. about a year ago I was tested for Lyme and co infections and my WB had 41, 58, and 83/93, but all co infection tests were negative. Suddenly just like 2 weeks ago I developed what appears to be a Bartonella rash on my inner thigh. I’m 5’10” and 140lbs and have been for like 10 years so I know it’s not stretch marks, also it’s only on one leg which further rules out stretch marks.

Is this a usual thing to happen? Just randomly getting a Bartonella rash years after initial infection? I’m also 30 years old now, so could it just be that my immune system is starting to get worse with age? Another weird thing that happened is usually since I’ve been sick my heart rate is like 110-125 resting, recently it’s been 70-90 which is good but much lower than normal.

With my WB results being what they were I was given 3 months of doxy and saw no improvement at all. I wasn’t really a fan of the 2 LLMDS I saw, so I’m not sure what to do at this point. I’m also not sure if lyme is actually an issue for me. I was bit by a dog right before all this started happening, but I also live in NJ and used to go hiking weekly.

Here’s a pic of the rash: /imgur.com/a/B5wLm

Any thoughts and advice?

Post Edited (jq) : 2/28/2018 8:08:18 AM (GMT-7)


Notime4lyme
Regular Member


Date Joined Dec 2017
Total Posts : 383
   Posted 2/28/2018 12:11 PM (GMT -6)   
It sounds like you still probably have lyme. Tests for co-infections are really inaccurate, I think. I have bartonella but I never tested positive. Maybe you could go to a naturopath instead? Also, just doxy is not going to do much . Usually you have to take to or three antibiotics for several months to actually be able to see improvement.

I had no bartonella rash until maybe 6 or 8 years after I think I was infected. I'm not sure what the rash appearing all of a sudden means.

jq
New Member


Date Joined Jul 2017
Total Posts : 15
   Posted 2/28/2018 12:14 PM (GMT -6)   
Interesting. It’s been about 6 or 7 years since I first started feeling mildly crappy. Just these past 2 years is when it’s gotten so bad that I can’t even function. I wonder if this is a common thing for the rash to be delayed like this.

WalkingbyFaith
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 1996
   Posted 2/28/2018 12:44 PM (GMT -6)   
In my case, I had reddish purple streaks that appeared in the horizontal creases of my abdomen at some point in childhood. I developed unexplained stretch marks on my thighs when I was 10 or 11 years old. I didn't start having bizarre, unexplained symptoms until age 39 although I did have plenty of mild to moderate signs of bartonella and maybe babesia all my life until that point. It just wasn't obvious that something was terribly wrong.

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 33842
   Posted 2/28/2018 1:42 PM (GMT -6)   
jq said...
Interesting. It’s been about 6 or 7 years since I first started feeling mildly crappy. Just these past 2 years is when it’s gotten so bad that I can’t even function. I wonder if this is a common thing for the rash to be delayed like this.


Did you stop treatment at the 3 month mark? Or did the Dr. advise you to?

You were undertreated...and I suggest you go to a LLMD to start treatment again.

You can treat bartonella and cover lyme with it too.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

jq
New Member


Date Joined Jul 2017
Total Posts : 15
   Posted 2/28/2018 2:10 PM (GMT -6)   
Girlie said...
jq said...
Interesting. It’s been about 6 or 7 years since I first started feeling mildly crappy. Just these past 2 years is when it’s gotten so bad that I can’t even function. I wonder if this is a common thing for the rash to be delayed like this.


Did you stop treatment at the 3 month mark? Or did the Dr. advise you to?

You were undertreated...and I suggest you go to a LLMD to start treatment again.

You can treat bartonella and cover lyme with it too.


To be completely honest I stopped going to him in disbelief of the idea of lyme/co's due to the fact that I saw no improvement at all. Since I had all negative testing and other doctors laughed when I mentioned lyme I figured I'm an idiot to keep possibly damaging myself by taking months of antibiotics.

acarined
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2015
Total Posts : 230
   Posted 2/28/2018 2:44 PM (GMT -6)   
You can take herbs instead, they might work well enough to convince you to take pharmaceuticals. My bart rashes appear as small areas of petechia, or burst capillaries, they were frequent and then disappeared for almost 20 years until I started treatment. Dogs carry bart, as do many mammals and anthropods, the strict association with cats is mistaken.

Notime4lyme
Regular Member


Date Joined Dec 2017
Total Posts : 383
   Posted 2/28/2018 3:22 PM (GMT -6)   
I'm not sure if antibiotics actually work for bartonella. I tried rifampin and azithromycin and it didn't really help. I'm not saying antibiotics aren't a good idea- they just didn't seem to actually get rid of the bartonella.

I have a lot of the burst capillaries too. I heard that you can get the bart rashes to go away- I just don't know how.

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 33842
   Posted 2/28/2018 3:24 PM (GMT -6)   
Notime4Lyme - Antibiotics DO work for Bartonella.

Dr. M (bart guru) - many of his patients have healed on his protocol.

I'm emailing with someone who sees him and he is getting better...but it can be a long process.

And many other LLMD's are healing people who have bartonella confection.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

Rikky1
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jun 2015
Total Posts : 2922
   Posted 2/28/2018 3:59 PM (GMT -6)   
i have burst capillaries on the bridge of my face that appeared shortly after infection. all my issues are ANS and my LLMD believes its primarily (if not exclusively) from Bart.

i never tested positive for bart after many tests. most people don't so forget that angle.

bart like babesia is a major b*tch to get rid of. usually rifampin or levaquin after a few weeks at most will bring out new/worse symptoms.

the rifamycin class of drugs are also biofilm busters and hits persisters as well so a pretty powerful abx that should be used more than just trying to hit gram negative pathogens.

so if i were you i'd find a competent LLMD that knows what they're doing and start over. you're probably looking at a long haul but the question is do you want to stay (or get worse) than where you are today or start treating again?

jq
New Member


Date Joined Jul 2017
Total Posts : 15
   Posted 2/28/2018 4:01 PM (GMT -6)   
My biggest concern about LLMD's is that the 2 I went to were both previous presidents of ILADS, and the one said I didn't have lyme because of my test results I mentioned in the original post, and the other just didn't listen to me at all and just wanted to throw meds at me. Money isn't an issue for me, I just need someone that is good but also can have a conversation.

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 33842
   Posted 2/28/2018 7:42 PM (GMT -6)   
jq said...
Girlie said...
jq said...
Interesting. It’s been about 6 or 7 years since I first started feeling mildly crappy. Just these past 2 years is when it’s gotten so bad that I can’t even function. I wonder if this is a common thing for the rash to be delayed like this.


Did you stop treatment at the 3 month mark? Or did the Dr. advise you to?

You were undertreated...and I suggest you go to a LLMD to start treatment again.

You can treat bartonella and cover lyme with it too.


To be completely honest I stopped going to him in disbelief of the idea of lyme/co's due to the fact that I saw no improvement at all. Since I had all negative testing and other doctors laughed when I mentioned lyme I figured I'm an idiot to keep possibly damaging myself by taking months of antibiotics.


It can take longer than 3 months to see improvement...but sometimes it requires a change in antibiotics.
Were you doing at least two together?

Maybe try a LLMD that one of the forum members goes to.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 33842
   Posted 2/28/2018 7:44 PM (GMT -6)   
jq said...
My biggest concern about LLMD's is that the 2 I went to were both previous presidents of ILADS, and the one said I didn't have lyme because of my test results I mentioned in the original post, and the other just didn't listen to me at all and just wanted to throw meds at me. Money isn't an issue for me, I just need someone that is good but also can have a conversation.


That's unfortunate that a past president of ILADS was basing diagnosis and treatment on a test result.
What about your symptoms? Did he say anything about that?

And the other one..well all I can say is we have bad Doctoring in every area of medicine...including Lyme Docs. Not knowing the specifics...I can't comment on whether your Dr. belongs in that group.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

jq
New Member


Date Joined Jul 2017
Total Posts : 15
   Posted 2/28/2018 9:25 PM (GMT -6)   
Girlie said...
jq said...
My biggest concern about LLMD's is that the 2 I went to were both previous presidents of ILADS, and the one said I didn't have lyme because of my test results I mentioned in the original post, and the other just didn't listen to me at all and just wanted to throw meds at me. Money isn't an issue for me, I just need someone that is good but also can have a conversation.


That's unfortunate that a past president of ILADS was basing diagnosis and treatment on a test result.
What about your symptoms? Did he say anything about that?

And the other one..well all I can say is we have bad Doctoring in every area of medicine...including Lyme Docs. Not knowing the specifics...I can't comment on whether your Dr. belongs in that group.


Basically just called me when the results came in and said everything was negative and quickly rushed off the call :/ I feel like I'm just gonna be this way forever.

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 33842
   Posted 2/28/2018 9:59 PM (GMT -6)   
jq said...
Girlie said...
jq said...
My biggest concern about LLMD's is that the 2 I went to were both previous presidents of ILADS, and the one said I didn't have lyme because of my test results I mentioned in the original post, and the other just didn't listen to me at all and just wanted to throw meds at me. Money isn't an issue for me, I just need someone that is good but also can have a conversation.


That's unfortunate that a past president of ILADS was basing diagnosis and treatment on a test result.
What about your symptoms? Did he say anything about that?

And the other one..well all I can say is we have bad Doctoring in every area of medicine...including Lyme Docs. Not knowing the specifics...I can't comment on whether your Dr. belongs in that group.


Basically just called me when the results came in and said everything was negative and quickly rushed off the call :/ I feel like I'm just gonna be this way forever.


You can get another LLMD - just start a new thread to look for one. Go to one that others' have found helpful.

Or if you prefer to go the herbal route....we can help with that.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi
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