Babesia depression - any better with herbs vs abx?

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BabsBunny
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2017
Total Posts : 565
   Posted 3/5/2018 11:55 AM (GMT -6)   
This seems to be a big topic lately, so I'm sorry if everyone is repeating themselves on various threads, but I'm not sure if this specific question has been answered.

I have Babesia and was treating for months (almost a year total now) with Mepron and now Malarone. As I was getting moodier and moodier, I switched because I know I'm sensitive to corn-derived ingredients, and Mepron contains one or more. So far I've only gotten up to 2 Malarone in the AM with 1 Biaxin (500 mg).

The depression, anxiety, and mood swings have gotten very severe. It's taking me back to the days of SNRI withdrawal that were a living hell and I swore I would never ever ever put myself through again. So probably a little bit of PTSD going on there too.


I've started pulsing the abx, but regardless of skipping 1 day, or two days, the psychiatric episodes continue - slightly less severe on the off days. In addition to my Wellbutrin (for 2 years now) I'm taking 5-htp, GABA, Tyrosine, B-vitamins, NAC (all in their proprietary blends for best absorption). I had to start taking .25 mg of Ativan for the anxiety attacks and at first it worked, but now it seems to put a loose bandaid on it at best. So I'm tempted to start taking that 2 x a day, fueling my fears that I'm becoming addicted again. I understand its a super crazy LOW dose, but I've had such a traumatic experience with antidepressants, that I don't want to take it AT ALL.

My doc wanted to put me on Lamictal. I've read the great responses, but I've also read the horror stories of the deadly rash and, actually more worrisome to me, the withdrawal affects when trying to quit. I know when I go back complaining of severe depression, he's going to just tell me to stop worrying and just take it. He works almost exclusively allopathically, and I"ve been trying to balance his Lyme tx with a naturopath for everything else. I'm being torn in two.

I still have some naturopathic remedies I can try - CBD oil, arsenica album (homeopathy), increased dose of everything, but its getting expensive and causing... MORE ANXIETY. can anyone vouch for these specifically as a remedy to depression/anxiety caused by Babs tx?

So obviously I want the Hand of God to write on the wall and tell me exactly what to do before I drive myself and my spouse crazy (we're getting bad. real bad.)

But I also want some input about how herbs may handle this differently. I know that Babesia causes depression. I know that Babesia die-off causes depression. I know that Babesia medication side-effects cause depression. So are herbs any better at killing it gently and reducing the depression caused by side effects, if not from die-off?

I can't go much slower than I already am, or I won't be treating at all. I can't detox much more than I already am - lemon water is forbidden on low-histamine diet, and I have so many meds there is literally no time to take a binder, unless I get up in the middle of the night. Insomnia has been severe, so now that I've finally gotten back to sleeping well, I refuse to interrupt healing sleep.

In other words, what is the lesser of 3 evils: don't treat and die of Babesia; treat with abx and suffer die-off with side effects; treat with herbals and suffer die-off and... what side effects?

smhair and mostly, I just need to know that I'm not alone. Too many "trust me, I'm a/I work with/I know a" doctors telling me its my own fault, my LLMD is a quack and I need to stop taking ALL my meds and reset. And with Lyme-brain that hurts and confuses me more than I care to let it.
Lyme, Babesia, Bartonella. Symptoms began 5/2016, didn't start treatment until 9/2016. Slow but steady recovery.

*twitch twitch*

Post Edited (BabsBunny) : 3/5/2018 9:58:48 AM (GMT-7)


acarined
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2015
Total Posts : 231
   Posted 3/5/2018 12:44 PM (GMT -6)   
What are your doses of B-vitamins? They can cause anxiety from stimulation.

WalkingbyFaith
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 2041
   Posted 3/5/2018 1:02 PM (GMT -6)   
"So obviously I want the Hand of God to write on the wall and tell me exactly what to do before I drive myself and my spouse crazy (we're getting bad. real bad.)"

I had to laugh!! I know exactly what you mean. I've only treated with herbs so I can't compare to Mepron or Malarone. Even with herbs, I can only take tiny doses and feel like I'm herxing most of the time anyway. With herbs, you can go as low and slow for as long as you need to without the adverse effects of abx. To me, that's one of the greatest advantages.

One thing that struck me when reading the first paragraph is that your increasing depression and anxiety may not be from babesia. It could be from bartonella instead. When you treat one for a while, the others seem to come out. Bartonella can cause significant psych symptoms. You could test it out with houttynia or Byron White's A-Bart. Personally, I'm terrified of Byron White formulas.

Can you take d-limonene? I'm about to try that. Take a look at the thread on this from Lapis about limonene and biofilm. Sounds like it can really help with detox.

Finally, YOU ARE NOT ALONE. I'm sorry for what you're going through. I go through stages every other week it seems like questioning everything and nearly driving myself crazy. No, indeed Babsbunny, you are not alone. Wish I could be of more help.

Post Edited (WalkingbyFaith) : 3/5/2018 11:08:50 AM (GMT-7)


BabsBunny
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2017
Total Posts : 565
   Posted 3/5/2018 1:23 PM (GMT -6)   
acarined said...
What are your doses of B-vitamins? They can cause anxiety from stimulation.


They are different for each b vitamin - 100 mcg to 20mg. I have been taking these for quite a while though, and they helped (especially in conjunction with Tyrosine). The anxiety and depression seems to be coming from treatment of Babs, and I'm doing a cortisol test today for increased PM symptoms and daytime fatigue. But yes, my ND is keeping a close watch on how we add anything with more B vitamins

WalkingbyFaith said...
One thing that struck me when reading the first paragraph is that your increasing depression and anxiety may not be from babesia. It could be from bartonella instead. When you treat one for a while, the others seem to come out. Bartonella can cause significant psych symptoms. You could test it out with houttynia or Byron White's A-Bart. Personally, I'm terrified of Byron White formulas.

Can you take d-limonene? I'm about to try that. Take a look at the thread on this from Lapis about limonene and biofilm. Sounds like it can really help with detox.


Yes, it could be Bart... it would explain why it gets worse the longer I treat Babs. I'm supposed to be adding abx but haven't been able to move past my little Babs treatment because of the anxiety. Maybe it might help to add ALL my abx combos before working up to full dose of Babs abx to help hit Bart on the way. (For now I've been trying to work up one at a time to full dose of each... maybe I should work up to a small dose of each)

I've heard of D-Limonene and its one of the things I've considered, but for now I don't want to add anything else unless my docs specifically recommend it based on my and their experiences. I'm on like... 25 different supplements and so tired of spending money on the failed ones :-(.

Just took the plunge for super expensive CBD oil. I'm quite desperate.

Thank you for all your encouragement.
Lyme, Babesia, Bartonella. Symptoms began 5/2016, didn't start treatment until 9/2016. Slow but steady recovery.

*twitch twitch*

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 33965
   Posted 3/6/2018 12:20 AM (GMT -6)   
Babs - Babesia is a bit-h .....

Treating Babesia with Mepron is wicked.


I am on my second go-round on Mepron (taking it with Bactrim and Ceftin)
In 2016 I took Bactrim for a week and it lit up my back pain - turning it into burning back pain.

So now I'm taking it again and anticipating the bad burning nerve pain will come back.

The Mepron has a half life of 2-3 days making it difficult to get a lot of relief if you take a couple days off, as it is building up in your blood stream.

The first go round the Mepron increased my had pressure immensely....and also the sweating coupled with some daily bouts of anxiety.
(Are we having fun yet?)

When I stopped the protocol, my head pressure greatly reduced as well as the sweating and anxiety.

I'm on week two of the protocol and so far and have not got the terrible head pressure - but have had some increase in sweating.
Its early in the game tho...so it's likely coming.
The burning nerve pain showed its nasty face today...so I guess I'm going to be dealing with that again..and of course the second guessing - the doubts...etc (you know what I mean)

I don't have any suggestions for you - other than backing off the treatment for a bit, and focussing on detoxing.
But, know that you're not alone...I'm suffering right along with you and hoping that we see that light at the end of the tunnel soon.


((Hugs))
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

Girlie
Forum Moderator


Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 33965
   Posted 3/6/2018 12:22 AM (GMT -6)   
Forgot to mention - I did the CBD oil and no relief whatsoever.

I think getting something with THC (marijuana ) would work better - if it's legal in your State.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi
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