Flagyl Toxicity

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Hoagie
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   Posted 3/18/2018 9:11 PM (GMT -6)   
/metrogirlblog.wordpress.com/treatment/

I believe this to be a very important article for everyone here to read because you are either taking, took it, or may possibly be prescribed it.

I have been getting worse since my treatment began last year. I noticed I would be worse off after each cycle. I took a two month abx break over Christmas and actually started to stablize and even feel better.

Went back on abx and was doinv ok again until the Flagyl. I suppose it's ok for most people. But, I have read a lot of horror stories surrounding this drug. I am done with it.

Post Edited (Hoagie) : 3/20/2018 9:01:06 AM (GMT-6)


astroman
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   Posted 3/18/2018 10:01 PM (GMT -6)   
/metrogirlblog.wordpress.com/treatment/

Must be why Flag is know to be hard on the body and seems like your herxing bad, when in fact some might be suffering toxic side effects from Thiamine (B1) deficiency. LLMDs dont know this connection.

So it makes sense to get your thiamine (B1) level tested prior to taking Flagle and probably during its use (if you still dare to use it).. You also need magnesium for this to work. All lymies should take magnesium anyway.

I had Thiamine (B1) tested (coincidence and was good) with a bunch of other vits and minerals. I still had some bad herxing on flagle, with candida at the same time.

Post Edited (astroman) : 3/18/2018 9:11:30 PM (GMT-6)


Girlie
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   Posted 3/19/2018 1:00 AM (GMT -6)   
Hoagie - were you on Flagyl daily for several weeks/months?


I only take it two days every 3 or 4 weeks. (Part of Dr. J protocol)



"Must be why Flag is know to be hard on the body..." I never heard this before.

The only thing I heard is it has the black box warning label due to mice/rats getting bladder cancer from it.


I wonder if that's why Dr. J's initial lab tests calls for B1 testing.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

Hoagie
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   Posted 3/19/2018 6:54 AM (GMT -6)   
I'm only on it 2x per cycle as well. Thank God that was the case. It was a few days after each cycle that I would notice a worsening of symptoms and worse anxiety and insomnia. I was getting a lot better in the anxiety/insomnia dept. after being off for 2 months. But i have been knocked back now. I plan on doing some heavy detox and hopefully it won't be too long and I start feeling better again.

1000Daisies
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   Posted 3/19/2018 10:44 AM (GMT -6)   
I have loads of regret and worry about two of my children taking flagyl for long terms (not quite pulsed like what is commonly done nowadays). They never adversely reacted to it (to what I could tell). They even took it daily for stretches! YIKES! sad

I do believe we (generally speaking) overlook the side effects of some of these treatments (specifically abx but other treatments too!). Often times, we contribute a symptom to a herx, but I think it's overlooked sometimes on what these medications themselves can cause.

I try not to worry about my kid's prior treatments and the damage they may have caused. It just makes me super sad.
Kid#1: Extremely sick for several years, very difficult to treat, but doing great now!
Kid#2: Still sick now despite being treated for years but doing better (not well yet).
Kid#3: Generally good but relapsing off/on.
Me: Adv Labs positive 2016 (suspected I passed to my kids)-not as sick as others, mostly battling fatigue and yeast issues (heart/kidney issues resolved)
Treating with herbals now.

astroman
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Date Joined Mar 2014
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   Posted 3/19/2018 11:01 AM (GMT -6)   
"we contribute a symptom to a herx, but I think it's overlooked sometimes on what these medications themselves can cause." - yes, this

Even herbs, at some doses are almost poison.

I took Flagyl every day for months.

this is part of the reason conventional medicine dose not like long term ABX for lyme.
Had initial lyme symptoms late 80's, then again and with bullseye early 90's. Ended ABX for Lyme in 2015. Rebuilding / fine tuning / fixing muscles since then; member "10 Percenters Lyme Club". What an adventure this has been. Hashimotos adds to the enjoyment.

Hoagie
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   Posted 3/19/2018 1:08 PM (GMT -6)   
I've picked up The Wahl's Protocol book again. opened to the mitochondrial section. At this point, I feel like God is pointing me to a natural route. Everything I have read and what I have experience relates abx to dysfuction and death of the body's vital functions. I understand abx is a route countless others have used to achieve healing. But, my body is rejecting it.

I have a phone call scheduled with my LLMD to go over some disability paperwork. I am going to tell him I'm ceasing abx and would like to go an herbal/holistic route. Plus I'll be doing 40 hyperbaric dives starting next month. I believe that these steps along with getting my mold issue under control, and proper diet, I can heal. I'll probably need some additional mold testing done on myself and a proper detox protocol for the exposure I've received.

Hoagie
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Date Joined Jul 2017
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   Posted 3/19/2018 1:15 PM (GMT -6)   
1000Daisies said...
I have loads of regret and worry about two of my children taking flagyl for long terms (not quite pulsed like what is commonly done nowadays). They never adversely reacted to it (to what I could tell). They even took it daily for stretches! YIKES! sad

I do believe we (generally speaking) overlook the side effects of some of these treatments (specifically abx but other treatments too!). Often times, we contribute a symptom to a herx, but I think it's overlooked sometimes on what these medications themselves can cause.

I try not to worry about my kid's prior treatments and the damage they may have caused. It just makes me super sad.


I'm sure your children are fine. The majority of Flagyl users are probably ok with it. But for some it's hell. And yoi most likely would have known early on if your kids were having bad reactions to it. For me, I would worsen a couple days after. And from the accounts I read, the others that were affected couldn't take it more than 5 days straight without significant issues.

Georgia Hunter
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   Posted 3/20/2018 5:03 AM (GMT -6)   
Flagyl kills things that other antibiotics don't kill. Combine this with a niacin deficiency and there is potential trouble. People who respond poorly to it most likely have issues with both parasites and niacin deficiencies.

k07
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Date Joined Sep 2015
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   Posted 3/20/2018 6:17 AM (GMT -6)   
Hoagie said...
I've picked up The Wahl's Protocol book again. opened to the mitochondrial section. At this point, I feel like God is pointing me to a natural route. Everything I have read and what I have experience relates abx to dysfuction and death of the body's vital functions. I understand abx is a route countless others have used to achieve healing. But, my body is rejecting it.

I have a phone call scheduled with my LLMD to go over some disability paperwork. I am going to tell him I'm ceasing abx and would like to go an herbal/holistic route. Plus I'll be doing 40 hyperbaric dives starting next month. I believe that these steps along with getting my mold issue under control, and proper diet, I can heal. I'll probably need some additional mold testing done on myself and a proper detox protocol for the exposure I've received.


I’m not sure if you’ll find this relevant or not, but Shoemaker has this new genetic testing (progenedx) he can do that shows if genes are being affected (for lack of better term). He found that abx altered like 600 or so genes. After VIP therapy that number went down to double digits. So yes, I agree 100% with Daisies that we often excuse side effect as a herx.

I would recommend an LLMD that has some knowledge of Shoemaker.

Post Edited (k07) : 3/20/2018 12:45:17 PM (GMT-6)


Hoagie
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   Posted 3/20/2018 10:00 AM (GMT -6)   
Georgia Hunter said...
Flagyl kills things that other antibiotics don't kill. Combine this with a niacin deficiency and there is potential trouble. People who respond poorly to it most likely have issues with both parasites and niacin deficiencies.
You should be an LLMD, GH.

I just got off the phone with my LLMD, and this is exactly what he said. He mentioned that it might be hitting something we are unaware of. It really messes me up bad though. Too bad for me to handle. He mentioned going off abx right now is a bad idea because I most likely released stuff that needs to be hit with the other abx. He said to continue with the protocol minus the flagyl for now. We will add in GSE next round, Then graduate on to tinidazole and see how that is tolerated, then maybe switch to a low dose flagyl again. At this point, I am scared to death of Flagyl. It is doing something. I just want to make sure it's doing the right thing.

Whenever I take it my neurological symptoms go haywire; anxiety/panic, can barely walk, weird cns feeling all over my body that is super uncomfortable. I can see having a seizure if it gets much stronger.

I am about to hit a storm I feel.

astroman
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Date Joined Mar 2014
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   Posted 3/20/2018 11:20 AM (GMT -6)   
Georgia Hunter said...
Flagyl kills things that other antibiotics don't kill. Combine this with a niacin deficiency and there is potential trouble. People who respond poorly to it most likely have issues with both parasites and niacin deficiencies.


Per above - Niacin deficiencies (B3) issues with Flagyl.

The article link was mentioning Thiamine (B1) deficiency issues with Flagyl.

So it can be both?

Post Edited (astroman) : 3/20/2018 10:23:12 AM (GMT-6)


Georgia Hunter
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Date Joined May 2012
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   Posted 3/20/2018 4:30 PM (GMT -6)   
astroman said...
Georgia Hunter said...
Flagyl kills things that other antibiotics don't kill. Combine this with a niacin deficiency and there is potential trouble. People who respond poorly to it most likely have issues with both parasites and niacin deficiencies.


Per above - Niacin deficiencies (B3) issues with Flagyl.

The article link was mentioning Thiamine (B1) deficiency issues with Flagyl.

So it can be both?


No, you are right Astro. I had B3 on the brain from my long post this morning. B1 is the issue.
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