Struggling to increase coinfection herb dosage

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Szabo246
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Date Joined Sep 2017
Total Posts : 483
   Posted 4/4/2018 1:45 PM (GMT -6)   
I’m currently taking crypto sida houttuynia for coinfections and am on 20 drops twice a day, I’ve had new symptoms since starting treatment for these and my doc believes is herxing.

New symptoms include night sweats, intermittent twitching in calf, low grade fever.

I’ve been on 20 drops twice a day for a while and everytime I try to increase I just feel awful.

I’m worried as this isn’t even half the reccomended dose.

Any advice?

Girlie
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Date Joined May 2014
Total Posts : 32507
   Posted 4/4/2018 2:13 PM (GMT -6)   
20 drops of each?


If you’re herxing then no reason to worry about increasing. Herxing = killing bacteria.

There isn’t a specific dose - that everyone needs to get to.

If you stop having effects - then you can raise it again.
Moderator, Lyme Forum
Symp started April/2013; Buhner's Lyme May 15-July24/14; Igenex pos. July 3/14
Doxy: July 4-Aug.24/14;Zithro July26-Aug24/14; Amox + Proben. Aug. 29/14;
added biaxin Sept. 26/14
Disc. amox,added Ceftin Nov. 20th.;
Disc. biaxin added Buhner bart herbs Dec/14;Jan/15 pulsing Tinda (w/ Ceftin);
Abx/herb break Apr-July/15; July-mino; Aug. added Rif;
Nov./15 mino - to biaxi

WalkingbyFaith
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Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 1662
   Posted 4/4/2018 2:41 PM (GMT -6)   
Agree with Girlie. Buhner has said that some people are very sensitive and never get above a few (like 5) drops and still recover. Twenty drops twice a day is a lot and you are herxing. You may want to try taking 10-12 drops 3x day and see if that works better.

I started IHA Formula in Sep, sida in Oct, and bidens in Nov or Dec. I'm at 4 drops sida, 5 drops Bidens, and 6 drops IHA and feel like I'm herxing 90% of the time. I'm beyond ready to get over the herxing. The constant inflammation is killing me.

1000Daisies
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 2421
   Posted 4/4/2018 2:44 PM (GMT -6)   
Wow - 20 drops twice a day? We can rarely ever get that high on our herbals. And Kid#1 is doing well (for over a year now) and I'm not fully sure he ever made it that high (it was either 15 or 20 drops for his dosage).

I wouldn't worry about getting to max dosage personally. I've seen improvements on low dosages (for us), so I had to let it go that we weren't ever likely to get as high as what's can be suggested!
Kid#1: Extremely sick for several years, very difficult to treat, but doing great now!
Kid#2: Still sick now despite being treated for years but doing better (not well yet).
Kid#3: Generally good but relapsing off/on.
Me: Adv Labs positive 2016 (suspected I passed to my kids)-not as sick as others, mostly battling fatigue and yeast issues (heart/kidney issues resolved)
Treating with herbals now.

1000Daisies
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Date Joined Apr 2016
Total Posts : 2421
   Posted 4/4/2018 2:53 PM (GMT -6)   
WalkingbyFaith said...
Agree with Girlie. Buhner has said that some people are very sensitive and never get above a few (like 5) drops and still recover. Twenty drops twice a day is a lot and you are herxing. You may want to try taking 10-12 drops 3x day and see if that works better.

I started IHA Formula in Sep, sida in Oct, and bidens in Nov or Dec. I'm at 4 drops sida, 5 drops Bidens, and 6 drops IHA and feel like I'm herxing 90% of the time. I'm beyond ready to get over the herxing. The constant inflammation is killing me.


WBF, I feel that some of these herbals are causing inflammation for me. For me, I felt it was making me worse - not better. I struggle with it personally. I'm back on them again - as slow as ever - after a break. On my break, many things improved again (including my arm pain, as well as my foot pain!). I'm thinking of switching to Byron White formulas after these current bottles are done to see if I have better reaction to those. I've been thinking about doing this for a long time now (I keep talking about it doing it - just need to do it now! LOL). Keep us posted on how you are doing!!

Szabo246
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2017
Total Posts : 483
   Posted 4/4/2018 3:40 PM (GMT -6)   
Thanks for the reassurance all.

Girlie- yes 20 drops of each.

Maybe taking them more frequent but lower dose may help, it’s so hard trying to fit it all in though, even twice a day and fitting in probiotics/ binder is difficult!

insomniaaa
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2017
Total Posts : 147
   Posted 4/4/2018 3:47 PM (GMT -6)   
Girlie said...
Herxing = killing bacteria.


How do you know that the bacteria are actually dying in the process?

Not all bacteria are the same and many gram-negative bacteria can emit endotoxins.
Does this mean that they are actually dying in the endotoxin emission process? Not necessarily if you ask me.
I'm sure they can regurgitate these nasty endotoxins while continuing to live their lifecycle happily ever after.

Why do I get the same intense herx a day later if they are supposedly dying? They can't possibly reproduce in 24h can they? Everyone says that lyme is a slowly replicating organism. I'm assuming that other coinfections that cause chronic illness also reproduce rather slowly.

Post Edited (insomniaaa) : 4/4/2018 4:08:37 PM (GMT-6)


WalkingbyFaith
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Date Joined Aug 2017
Total Posts : 1662
   Posted 4/4/2018 3:48 PM (GMT -6)   
1000Daisies said...
WalkingbyFaith said...
Agree with Girlie. Buhner has said that some people are very sensitive and never get above a few (like 5) drops and still recover. Twenty drops twice a day is a lot and you are herxing. You may want to try taking 10-12 drops 3x day and see if that works better.

I started IHA Formula in Sep, sida in Oct, and bidens in Nov or Dec. I'm at 4 drops sida, 5 drops Bidens, and 6 drops IHA and feel like I'm herxing 90% of the time. I'm beyond ready to get over the herxing. The constant inflammation is killing me.


WBF, I feel that some of these herbals are causing inflammation for me. For me, I felt it was making me worse - not better. I struggle with it personally. I'm back on them again - as slow as ever - after a break. On my break, many things improved again (including my arm pain, as well as my foot pain!). I'm thinking of switching to Byron White formulas after these current bottles are done to see if I have better reaction to those. I've been thinking about doing this for a long time now (I keep talking about it doing it - just need to do it now! LOL). Keep us posted on how you are doing!!


If you try Byron White formulas, please do let us know how it goes. I'm way too scared for that. As bad as I feel on tiny doses of Buhner's herbs, I've always assumed Byron White would send me to another universe!!

My initial plan was to do the Buhner protocols until a couple months after symptoms were gone (about a year to 18 months) and then take a challenge test with the Byron White formulas just to make sure the infections were really gone.

How optimistic and naive I was. After 10 months of treatment, I feel like my body is sicker and weaker and have a hard time imagining ever not having any symptoms left.

insomniaaa
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2017
Total Posts : 147
   Posted 4/4/2018 4:00 PM (GMT -6)   
WalkingbyFaith have you tried the RIfampin yet and did it help with the bartonella symptoms at all?

I just read in another thread that you took the Minocycline for a few days and as a result you suffered a herx from hell for 2 months. Sorry to hear that. I hope you feel better now.

Post Edited (insomniaaa) : 4/4/2018 4:39:21 PM (GMT-6)

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