Confused by food, Scared of food, and yet im hungry. haha

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OzCrohnie
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 61
   Posted 4/14/2010 10:30 AM (GMT -6)   
I never knew what I could eat and I still don't (it's been 2 months-ish). I know i've been eating particular types of food and I've been safe with them but I want to have variety. I want to be able to go out to a restaurant and confidently order a meal knowing that I'm not gunna end up in agony that night from eating somehting I shouldn't have.

I know that different people react differently, so what is edible for some wont be for others...

A booklet my STN gave me on eating with an ileostomy said...

* Because You now have a stoma you do not have to change your eating habits
* You may be able to eat foods you were having trouble with prior to surgery. Chew all food well.


I found those lines funny, as after them the next 2 pages consists of a list of foods that may cause gas, odour, blockages, and thicken output. All food that I should avoid (or try to eat if I need thickening). Whats even funnier is the fact that before surgery people told me I would be able to eat more types of food once I have the ileostomy, but I could eat just about anything before the surgery, and now I have this list! hahaha wow.


Anyway, I was hoping to confirm a few food things. First this is what I know is the case for me:

Foods That Give Me Gas
BBQ Meatlovers pizza (from Dominoes). Had it three times so far, bag blew up like a balloon each night. My booklet indicates the ham could cause it, but I can't confirm...

Foods That Thicken Output
Bananas
Potato (although I'm sure I still see bits of potato when I empty)
Pumpkin

Foods I've eaten that haven't given me a blockage since I left hospital (that aren't listed above)
Steak et al
Chicken
Carrots
Toast (white bread apparently thickens)
Smooth Peanut butter (apparently thickens)
Pasta (apparently thickens)
Chocolate (Very watery output around Easter, connection??)
Biscuits
Hot chips
Donuts
Custard
Yoghurt
Muffins
Icecream
Maltesers
M&M's/Smarties


Other then the above mentioned food, I don't remember eating anything else. I think I'm too afraid to try anything else, I don't want a blockage.

I have carrots and beans in the freezer, I'm not going to touch them. I haven't had beans since before surgery. The outsides of beans are usually harder so maybe it'll cause a blockage?

Mum cooked me a meal a few weeks back which had zucchini in it. She went to the hard effort of cutting the outer skin off it as I was too paranoid to try it with the skin on. But then I saw seed things in the zucchini and couldn't bring myself to eat it. I felt so bad after all her effort. I've been told that seeds from say breads and buns can cause blockages, and I dont know about fruit and vegetables. I've only really started eating salad in recent years (used to be a fussy eater as a child, just started trying more foods about 5 years ago, now I'm even fussier then I was as a child). But now I'm not sure if I'm allowed to eat tomatoes? As they have seeds in them. Do you eat salad?

Sausages
I love sausages! Loved Sausages...

But this booklet says "Some sausage casings" in the "Foods that can cause a blockage" section.
My STN said it mainly applies to those sausages that have the skin falling off them. So I buy the skinnier ones (the ones I always liked anyway) which I've never seen the skin fall off. I was at my aunties for a BBQ and had sausages on my plate. I sat there for ages stairing at them, they had little flakes of skin falling off them. Now I have to boil the sausages, let them cool then peel the skin off before I get to BBQ them. All because it says "Some sausage casings".
At uni there are free BBQ's there hosted by different societies, You can easily get a free lunch 6 times a month, I doubt they boil there sausages before they BBQ them! haha

So what do you do with your sausages?


Bread

I was in hospital for a month, had white bread for breakfast (toast) every day and a few white bread sandwiches every second day or so.
I figured white bread was the safest option as it was easily digestible (and it says "White Bread" in the 'foods to help thicken your stomal output' section of my booklet they gave me). But then I had a dietician come around to see me the day before I went home (a month after i got my first stoma). He told me that I actually should be having Wholemeal bread OR White bread that is high in fibre. (even though the booklet says lots of fibre can cause a blockage) to avoid blockages. And yet, I didnt get a blockage in hospital.

I currently eat White bread that is high in fibre, I sometimes have 6 slices for breakfast a day. No blockage so far. Although I'm often still hungry, I'd love to have cereal like Nutri-grain (cereal in Au and NZ) or something, but I dont know if it will cause a blockage or something. :s


Biscuits

Someone once mentioned they thought biscuits help thicken up the output, does this sound right? Although, I could eat an entire packet of biscuits before bed and still have watery output by the time I get up in the morning. Its weird like that, its always watery in the morning then it slowly thickens up over the course of the day (hopefully). But then, if biscuits thicken the output and I ate a whole packet before bed, shouldn't that have been too thick?



I know there are a lot of questions here. I had a look for a comprehensive thread on foods but couldnt find one. If I overlooked it you can just paste the link. But I've read different pamphlets and different topics and it just seems like there are a lot of contradictions out there. As in some people eat carrots, others strictly avoid them, while others only eat them when they have been shaved.


I'm hungry right now, I have a packet of Pappadams in the kitchen I often heat up when I get home after a night out. But, I'm not sure if I can eat them, I'm not going to. I'd rather go to bed hungry. Actually, I think I might go have some toast!
Male, 22, diagnosed with Crohn's at 13.
Medication: Salofalk, Infliximab infusions, Humira injections.
On and off Prednisone for years.
I pop Loperamide (aka Gastro-Stop) like candy!
Have had one, two, three, four colonoscopies.
Getting a (permanent) bag in February!
Favourite Quote:  Unfortunately my quote (while perfectly acceptable in Australia) contains language that is considered unacceptable in some countries outside of Australia. I guess that's what happens when you comment on a forum used by many different cultures. So I've provided a link to the Wikipedia entry for the quote instead.


jtaylor
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2009
Total Posts : 39
   Posted 4/14/2010 12:13 PM (GMT -6)   
I'm nearing a year post surgery and I can eat absolutely anything without any worries. At the 2 month mark I was a lot more cautious than I am now, but I never encountered anything that gave me trouble. I always chew everything thoroughly and eat slowly to avoid excess gas. I still take it easy when I'm eating raw veggies or salads or anything else that is extremely high in fiber. Just take new foods slowly at first, try a little bit and chew it well. If everything comes out OK try eating more next time. After awhile your confidence in what you can safely eat will build back up and you won't think about it so much.

I'm with you on the watery output in the morning. No matter what I eat in the evening things just thin out overnight and in the morning I'm emptying very liquidy stool from my pouch, and then the first empty of the day (around noon) is still pretty runny.

Allison77
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2005
Total Posts : 421
   Posted 4/14/2010 12:18 PM (GMT -6)   
Whoa cowboy! Having a stoma shouldn't make you MORE nervous about what your eating!! Your putting WAY to much emphasis on having a blockage. Some people NEVER have a blockage and eat everything.
You have asked "what is safe to eat?" yet post "I know that different people react differently, so what is edible for some wont be for others..." You answered your own question right there. Everyone reacts differently to different foods. I personally can eat ANYTHING anytime of the day or night. I suppose it's different as I have a colostomy vs you with an ileo, though there are some things that I just can't swallow because I know i'll be seeing it in the portable poo pouch later. The only thing I think about when eating is "chew chew chew" I no longer stuff things into my gullet all willy nilly without thouroughly chewing.
IMHO you need to try everything and see what works for you. Don't be afraid of everything, after what you have been through, you can GET through anything.
*hugs*

-Allie
RX Crohn's 1999, over 30 surgeries, 3 strokes, permanent colostomy and rectum removal.
 
"The most unfortunate thing that happens to a person who fears failure is that he limits himself by becoming afraid to try anything new."


Equestrian Mom
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2008
Total Posts : 3115
   Posted 4/14/2010 12:47 PM (GMT -6)   
Oz~Allie is SO RIGHT...you should also keep a journal, if you are worried, for the next couple of months to track what individual foods do when you eat them.

We are all different and my story is that I eat EVERYTHING and ANYTHING :-) just like Allie and I don't stop myself at night, either, if I am hungry I eat.

I do only eat unprocessed foods (no bread, prepared foods or frozen meals) so anything in its natural state is game...fruits/veggies/seeds/popcorn/skins...I use caution and don't pig out but what I do eat is SO SATISFYING :-) Crohnies usually suffer when it comes to food, so I am making up for it!!

Take your time, it is only two months out, and you will find that the door to all foods is open to you!
Crohn’s dx 1989
some terrible years before my
Proctocolectomy in 2008


suebear
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2006
Total Posts : 5698
   Posted 4/14/2010 1:01 PM (GMT -6)   
Absolutely! Blockages are usually more common in the first few months post surgery when there's still a lot of post surgery inflammation. But you should be able to have a much more varied diet. I no longer have an ostomy, I have a jpouch, but I eat everything; nuts, seeds, fruit skin, stringy vegetables, etc. There is not a food out there that I cannot eat. I've had a few partial obstructions over the years but nothing that couldn't be managed at home. You should experiment more, life is too short!

Sue
dx proctitis in 1987
dx UC in 1991, was stable until 1998

1998 started prednisone, asacol, pentasa, nortriptylene, ativan, 6MP, rowasa enemas and suppositories, hydrocortisone enemas, tried the SCD diet, being a vegetarian, omega 3s, flax, pranic healing, yoga, acupuncture, probiotics

2000 lost all my B-12 stores and became anemic

2001 opted for j-pouch surgery- now living life med-free


PoolTableGuy
New Member


Date Joined Apr 2010
Total Posts : 3
   Posted 4/14/2010 2:44 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi Gang. I'm new to this and all forums but have decided to participate. Hopefully, I can find info to help me and offer info to help others.
 
When I had the ileostomy pouch from Aug 2009 til Mar 2010, I eventually ate anything I wanted. My fear of blockages went away when the swelling from the surgery went away. My surgeon told me right from the beginning that I could eat whatever I wanted. I was very sick with UC and was unable to eat much for quite a long time. So, I really ate whatever I wanted and didn't care much about the ostomy output. I did have to set my alarm every two hours at night though. The output caused a couple of leaks during the night. Getting up ate 12, 2, and 4 am allowed me to empty the pouch before it became too full. Hope this helps.
 
Brief health history: 2005 diagnosed with type II diabetes. Initially treated with oral meds but started taking insulin in 2008. Oct 2007, had a heart attack caused from smoking. Had a stent put in and have had no heart problems since. (Quit smoking that day.)  January 2008 diagnosed with Crohn's disease. Treated unsuccessfully with various medications for approximately a year. After another doctor did another colonoscopy, re-diagnosed as UC. As bad as it was, I am told UC is 100 times better than Crohn's. Unable to get UC under control and kept feeling worse and worse (including up to 25 bathroom visits per day) until Aug 2009 when colon was removed and J-Pouch constructed. Initially that went well, but developed serious infection that I just about died from. Three operations within 2 weeks and in hospital for 24 days. Had ileostomy reversed on March 1, 2010. Supposed to be in hospital 3 - 5 days but as luck would have it, I stayed for 12. It seems my bowels took a long time to begin working. So, here it is a month later and I am joining this forum to learm from other people how to manage my new "self". Still in the bathroom every couple of hours. And as you can imagine, I am trying to learn a new diet and eating habits that will help my rear not be so irritated (that is an understatement) and not be too high in carbs. Maintaining weight okay... take a daily vitamin... drink lots of water.
 
Diabetically speaking, I am very successful at managing my glucose by counting carbs at each meal and adjusting insulin (humalog) accordingly. I use 1 unit of insulin for each 5 carbs. I check my glucose at every meal and have a target goal of 100. For every 20 points above 100, I add 1 unit of insulin as a correction doseto the calculated amount from carbs. These numbers were formulated with the guidance of a great nurse practitioner I see every three months and my daily logs of carbs for each meal and snack and the amount of humalog taken. I also take 30 units of lantus before bed each night.
 
 Struggling with my new plumbing (J-Pouch). Need to come up with a plan for testing new foods so I can get some relief from the bathroom. It seems eggs, toast with cheese, orange juice mixed with light cranberry juice is working for morning meal. I can sometimes get three hours between bathroom visits. Lunch has been turkey sandwich with light mayo, potatoe chips and usually shortbread cookies. This kind of meal offers a little shorter interval between bathroom visits but is tolerable. Late afternoon and evening is the worst!! Dinner has been producing the worst results unless I eat turkey or chicken, canned french cut string beans and mac & cheese. I think the key might be that I'm eating too much at dinner. Did I mention that I love to eat?
 
I know it has only been 6 weeks.
 
Should I be more patient?

suebear
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2006
Total Posts : 5698
   Posted 4/14/2010 3:12 PM (GMT -6)   
Six weeks!!!!

Yes, you need patience! Your adaption will go on for a year. Expect improvement in 6 weeks increments. So six weeks from today you should have a bit of improvement over where you are now.

Sue
dx proctitis in 1987
dx UC in 1991, was stable until 1998

1998 started prednisone, asacol, pentasa, nortriptylene, ativan, 6MP, rowasa enemas and suppositories, hydrocortisone enemas, tried the SCD diet, being a vegetarian, omega 3s, flax, pranic healing, yoga, acupuncture, probiotics

2000 lost all my B-12 stores and became anemic

2001 opted for j-pouch surgery- now living life med-free


PoolTableGuy
New Member


Date Joined Apr 2010
Total Posts : 3
   Posted 4/14/2010 6:08 PM (GMT -6)   
Thanks for the reply. I really have no idea what to expect from day-to-day. Have you ever heard anyone say that the J-Pouch functions differently at certain times of the day for no apparent reason?

suebear
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2006
Total Posts : 5698
   Posted 4/14/2010 6:55 PM (GMT -6)   
Anything is possible early in recovery. It will get much more predictable with time. Make friends with time!

Sue
dx proctitis in 1987
dx UC in 1991, was stable until 1998

1998 started prednisone, asacol, pentasa, nortriptylene, ativan, 6MP, rowasa enemas and suppositories, hydrocortisone enemas, tried the SCD diet, being a vegetarian, omega 3s, flax, pranic healing, yoga, acupuncture, probiotics

2000 lost all my B-12 stores and became anemic

2001 opted for j-pouch surgery- now living life med-free


summerstorm
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2006
Total Posts : 6571
   Posted 4/14/2010 9:50 PM (GMT -6)   
Oz-at two months past, you are still gonna have extra gas, it takes a while for that to go down.
As for your list, calm down! Those books that are supposed to be helpful sometimes make it worse!
I dont suggest people eat those things the first few weeks after surgery, it does take a while.

All those things you mentioned, i eat, except pumpkin which i think it gross and smushy and custard which again is gross, lol. And i dont know what a malteaser is.
I havent eaten any zucchini i dont think, but just because i havent, i have eaten squash casserole, and fried squash, skin and seeds, no problems, i just chewed well!
I eat sausage although i dont know about the kinds with skin, i dont think i have ever seen that. But i eat hotdogs and they have skin.
I had beans for lunch yesterday, and beans in my soup just now.
I eat carrots with no problems, but they come out whole and it looks gross, lol.
Popcorn comes out kind of funny too, but i eat it anyway, i ate two bags yesterday (im such a pig!)
I will say this about ham, i havent had a problem with it, but it STINKS coming out!!! I have no idea why, but other than blue food coloring,nothing smells worse coming out of me than ham!

This is random, but if I eat peaches and cream (or drink peach schnapps and baileys)no matter what else i have eaten, my output smells like peaches and cream!!! how awesome is that???

Anyway, long long story short, just chew it all well, and drink lots of water and you should be fine!
UC for 8 years, before finally kicking its butt and having a permanent ileostomy April 17 2007! 
-I have gone to find myself, if i get back before i return, keep me here-


OzCrohnie
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 61
   Posted 4/15/2010 12:09 AM (GMT -6)   
Thanks for the replies! So I guess I'll hopefully be more confident once the swelling goes down. My stomach looks funny at the moment, its swollen so it kinda sticks out when i stand up (I've been skinny like a rake my whole life, so its kinda odd looking at it). But under my belly button is the cut from my second surgery, and because its still healing and was really deep, it looks weird because it goes down... so It looks like i have two hills on my stomach and a valley under the belly button.

And basically try more foods. But I currently can't drive and am basically home alone for a few weeks, so I might keep the experimenting till later when I've got someone here that might be able to go to the chemist or get whatever it is i need when I have a blockage.

When someone would mention the skin on sausages I used to automatically think of these fat sausages I once saw which basically had the skin falling off them on my plate at some restaurant I was at. It wasn't until now that I've noticed the skin on the skinnier sausages. But when you think about the way they are made it makes sense that they all have skin. As its the skin that holds the meat together inside the sausage. Without the skin the meat would not stay in the shape it is in at the factory where they are made (I assume).

That is pretty awesome about making it smell like peaches and cream! Waaay better then the usual smell haha! Oh and Maltesers are a ball of malt (i assume) covered in chocolate. Apparently they are more popular in the UK, Portugal, Ireland, Canada, and Australia. But the U.S. has similar products like "Whoppers" apparently... Anywho:





Also, I started a list this morning of what I eat. Figured writing the number of times i empty etc will be good for when I see my doctor next week too.
Male, 22, diagnosed with Crohn's at 13.
Medication: Salofalk, Infliximab infusions, Humira injections.
On and off Prednisone for years.
I pop Loperamide (aka Gastro-Stop) like candy!
Have had one, two, three, four colonoscopies.
Getting a (permanent) bag in February!
Favourite Quote:  Unfortunately my quote (while perfectly acceptable in Australia) contains language that is considered unacceptable in some countries outside of Australia. I guess that's what happens when you comment on a forum used by many different cultures. So I've provided a link to the Wikipedia entry for the quote instead.


summerstorm
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2006
Total Posts : 6571
   Posted 4/15/2010 8:06 PM (GMT -6)   
oh yes whoppers are great! even though they make me feel so sick, i continue to eat them, lol. i like huge amounts at one time, possibly why they make me feel so sick, lol.
UC for 8 years, before finally kicking its butt and having a permanent ileostomy April 17 2007! 
-I have gone to find myself, if i get back before i return, keep me here-


flchurchlady
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2007
Total Posts : 2765
   Posted 4/16/2010 2:28 AM (GMT -6)   
Oz - thanks for the Malteser photo... didn't know what that was either till I saw the pic and thought, oh - it's a Whopper! Those are so good!

When it comes to food, I peel everything that is really chewy, like sausage and tomato skins. Chicken is a good meat, since it's soft. It took me a while to have the confidence to eat a salad again, because with Crohn's, they were off limits! nono But... not anymore! Cooked veggies are better than raw, though, since they soften up when cooked.

You're only 2 months post-op, and things will get SO much better with time. The output will also be less frequent and will thicken up. A few Hollister M9 drops in your pouch will completely remove the odor, so make sure to add a box of those to your next ostomy supply order!

Just relax, you're doing great! Eat what you want in moderation, take time to chew everything well, drink plenty of fluids, and you'll be fine.

:-) Cecilia
Dx'd Crohn's in '99 at age 28. Proctocolectomy and permanent ileostomy in '06.
Disease-free and medicine-free since surgery and very thankful to be healthy again.


cleo35
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2007
Total Posts : 430
   Posted 5/7/2010 4:06 PM (GMT -6)   
I pretty much eat whatever I want now - although I will never again have popcorn; squash and a couple of other vegetables. If you're really paranoid about a food blockage keep a 32 oz bottle of Grape Juice on hand at all times. If you start feeling bloated and have a sensation of "nothing's moving" start drinking the Grape Juice - after about 3, 8 oz. glasses you'll get results. I've had to use it a couple of times in the last 4 years and it really works! Good luck!

mikeman
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 66
   Posted 5/8/2010 2:13 AM (GMT -6)   
absolutely no peanut butter, chocolate or pizza for me!
sadly, choco and pizza 2 favorite foods but i quickly realized my intestines dont allow it anymore.
consequences will be hellish gas pain with blockage potential...my pouch blows up like a football and the next day or 3 is the hershey squirts all day long nono

and soda is pretty awful too..your pouch will sound like a coffee perculator

Post Edited (mikeman) : 5/8/2010 1:17:45 AM (GMT-6)


esoR
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2007
Total Posts : 4147
   Posted 5/8/2010 6:16 PM (GMT -6)   
WOW OZ,

You can eat a ton! I got 2 blockages on mashed potato. Agonizing 10 hours of no output. Had to knee-chest position. Walk many laps around the deck and drink a gallon of hot tea. I was on a world cruise at the time way out in the middle of the ocean. Suddenly after 10 agonizing hours all the mashed potato came forth all of a sudden out of my stoma MUCH to my relief. THis happened twice.

Now my diet is: Orange juice, coffee, cream of rice for breakfast; yogurt for lunch with protein powder, and egg and a croissant with hot chocolate for dinner. I also am not very hungry ever so do not miss eating all I can't. You are much younger than I and male so it would make sense you would need much more food. But I would say you are doing great. I would not take on anything that you fear would give you a blockage, why get in trouble if you don't have to. My surgeon said no nuts, no seeds, no peels. Due to experience I added no mashed potato and no other heavy foods. Your thicken list is right on target. Your thinning the effluent list should include: grape juice, alcohol, orange juice, caffeine coffee, and chocolate.

Rosemary

summerstorm
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2006
Total Posts : 6571
   Posted 5/8/2010 6:25 PM (GMT -6)   
rosemary-were their skins in those potatoes?
Im surprised that would cause a blockage, unless they were very chunky, or dry.

Mike-have you tried taking some gas-x before you eat those foods? that may help
UC for 8 years, before finally kicking its butt and having a permanent ileostomy April 17 2007!
-I have gone to find myself, if i get back before i return, keep me here-
No matter what kind of day you are having, take five minutes to sing loudly and dance like a fool!


esoR
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2007
Total Posts : 4147
   Posted 5/8/2010 8:10 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi Summer,

No the potatoes I ate were mashed. My ileo doc said that I may have gotten a twist in the small intestine and with the motion of me constantly walking and the hot tea, the intestine untwisted. I asked will this happen again, he didn't say anything. He is retiring and I am going to ask the young associate I am transferring to. Makes me scared to eat much.

What part of the small intestine would twist? The part that came out through the skin to make the stoma?

Rosemary

P.S. Not meaning to highjack Oz's question, but I wondered what would cause an ileostomy twist?

Oz cleo is absolutely right about the grape juice. It works miracles. Seems to melt everything down and whale it out. Great feeling. Seems like if we could find a combination we'd be all set. Like a cheese sandwich and a glass of grape juice. The bread and cheese thicken and the grape juice thins and then we are in business:-) Today I had chicken noodle soup and a jar of baby food chicken. THen as a chaser I had a glass of hot cocoa. Seemed to work well and the cocoa chased out the more solid stuff. It's really all an experiment and this is if things stay good with the ileo.

summerstorm
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2006
Total Posts : 6571
   Posted 5/8/2010 9:55 PM (GMT -6)   
cocoa as a chaser, lol thats cute!

I think the whole thing can just kind of kink up
UC for 8 years, before finally kicking its butt and having a permanent ileostomy April 17 2007!
-I have gone to find myself, if i get back before i return, keep me here-
No matter what kind of day you are having, take five minutes to sing loudly and dance like a fool!


OzCrohnie
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 61
   Posted 5/9/2010 7:10 AM (GMT -6)   
I had my second round of surgery because there was a kink/twist in my small intestine (just before the stoma). I had always assumed the surgery was not done right or something, but now that I think about it, the surgeon never said that (he seems really competent and is Awesomely nice) plus it was working great for a week before everything started to build up behind it.

Oh and after some experimentation, Apple Juice most definitely does thin the output. I kinda wish it didn't, I've had apple juice every day of my life for at least 13 years (I like my routines :p) . My name's OzCrohnie and it's been 23 days since my last drink (of apple juice :p ) haha laaame! :p But yer, I think I'll keep it on hand if I ever need to intentionally think my output, at least that way I can still enjoy it every now and then!
Male, 22, diagnosed with Crohn's at 13.
Permanent ileostomy in February 2010.

Medication: Salofalk, Infliximab infusions, Humira injections .
On and off Prednisone for years. Currently only at 5mg
Loperamide (aka Gastro-stop) when needed.


Favourite Quote: Unfortunately my quote (while perfectly acceptable in Australia) contains language that is considered unacceptable in some countries outside of Australia. I guess that's what happens when you comment on a forum used by many different cultures. So I've provided a link to the Wikipedia entry for the quote instead.


Tom1
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2007
Total Posts : 279
   Posted 5/9/2010 5:26 PM (GMT -6)   
Two 6 oz glasses of merlot every night.  Yes, I get up more than one time every night, but I view it as the price I have to pay for the pleasure derived.
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