How does bio-feedback work?

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DanmanBob
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2008
Total Posts : 467
   Posted 6/7/2008 9:33 AM (GMT -6)   
Have seen many references to men undergoing bio-feedback.
 
What is the purpose and how does this work?
Danman Bob, Born 1951
Nerve-sparing, open prostate surgery November 13, 2007
Gleason score 9, PSA 14; Biopsy result - 9 of 12 sticks showed cancer
Post-op pathology stated that cancer was confined to the prostate
Unrelated surgery January 2008 delayed incontinence recovery, which is now showing good signs of improvement (fraction of a pad a day as of late April 2008)
100 MG Viagra 3 times a week beginning December 2007
Osbon Erec-Aid Esteem manual pump for therapy beginning mid-February 2008
30 MG papaverine/1 MG phentolamine bimix injections beginning late April 2008
Five week post-op PSA 0.2, five month post-op PSA 0.1, next test August 2008


rob2
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 1131
   Posted 6/7/2008 9:48 AM (GMT -6)   

about two weeks before surgery, my doctor referred me to a clinic to teach me kegel exercises.  they put a rod in my rear and shocked it a little to show the muscle i needed to train to regain continence after surgery.  the clinic said it would have been good if i had come several weeks earlier so i could have done a lot of kegels before surgery.  i didn't have time and was too stressed out to think about anything but surgery.  anyway, the clinic referred the kegels exercises i did as pre-op biofeedback.  they gave me an article on biofeedback that described the kegel exercises as biofeedback and how they helped you get back to continence after surgery. 


 
Age 48
occupation accountant
PSA increased from 2.6 to 3.5 in one year
biopsy march 2008 - cancer present gleason 7
decision - surgery (robotic)
surgery may 9, 2008 - houston, tx
pathology report -gleason 8
margins clear
waiting on first psa post surgery
continence ok during day - 1 pad
night time different story
kegel's twice a day 20 reps


Gordy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jun 2005
Total Posts : 528
   Posted 6/7/2008 3:47 PM (GMT -6)   
Danman-

Eeeeek!!! I had biofeedback many years ago to deal with migraines. All they did was put sensors on my hands and forehead as I recall and played very relaxing music. The sensors were hooked up to monitors and the idea was for me to become relaxed enough that the needles on the graphs on the monitors would drop as low as I could get them, indicating I wasn't stressed, but was calm and relaxed.

What Rob2 is talking about sounds like medieval torture.

-Les
1/2005 Dx PSA 26.5 Gleason 7 (4+3) @Age 61
1/2005 Start Casodex and Zoladex
PSA drops to <0.01
7/2005-8/2005 5 weeks of IMRT and then HDR brachy
1/2007 Rad Oncologist orders CT scan of pelvis
because of complaints of pain in both thighs
MRI confirms pain not caused by cancer BUT
1/2007 CT scan of pelvis picks up a nodule at bottom of left lung
5/2007 CT scan of lungs shows 1/2007 nodule has grown and
there are numerous nodules on both lungs.
6/2007 Thoracic surgeon removes wedge of left lung for biopsy
6/2007 Path report says 95% chance of metastatic PCa, but she's
never seen cells like this before.
8/2007 2nd opinion at M.D. Anderson in Houston.
They confirm: mutated PCa, very rare, but seen there 2 or
3 times. Recommendation: have CT scans every 6 weeks
and watch for change. At that point start chemo and will
survive for 22 - 24 months thereafter.
PSA still undetectable, but get Lupron shot to bring T down from 27
2/2008 Trip to Houston – PSA now 0.5 and nodules larger. Lupron shot.


anglophile
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 82
   Posted 6/7/2008 3:53 PM (GMT -6)   
My biofeedback was three sticky sensors (like the ones when they do an EKG) on my backside. On on each cheek and one in toward the anus. They did this to me with me only pulling my pants down to reveal my backside. After they got the sensors in place, I was allowed to pull my pants up (sensors coming out of the top back) and then sit down. They hook them up to a computer readout and ask you to do a kegel squeeze. The readout shows if you are doing it correct or just pinching your "cheeks."

Then you do a series of them, holding for seconds... Then they have you practice standing up without leaking (squeeze, exhale, bend and stand).

They were very, very beneficial to me, along with tips from the physical therapy tech. It was much less invasive and embarrassing than I had expected. Within two days I went from my usual 3 pads over 24 hours to 2 pads over 24 hours and was able to walk to the bathroom at night before urinating, without having to physically hold Mr. Happy when I couldn't control my muscles.
Age 59 - diagnosed in Jan. 08 after biopsy
da Vinci Robotic Prostatectomy 4/11/08 - both nerves spared
Catheter removed 4/25/08
Prostate Pathology:
Gleason Grade 6 (3+3)
Apex: neg
Base: positive (tumor present at right and left base)
Peripheral Margins: neg
No extra prostatic extension seen
Tumor corresponds to a AJCC/pTMN stage II
5 wks post-op Continence: 1 pad night, 2 during day
7 wks post-op Continence: 2 pads every 24 hours
First post-op PSA at 7 wks: 0.1


rob2
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 1131
   Posted 6/8/2008 6:19 AM (GMT -6)   
i forgot to mention they put sensors on my stomach as well. it all went to the computer monitor and i could see the movement of my stomach. when i did the kegels correctly, the stomach muscles didn't move. the problem i had is the nurse told me to act like i was trying to stop passing gas. i couldn't find the muscle. when my doctor took out my catheter and had me urinate. he had me stop in mid-stream. that's the muscle you want. i was able to do the kegels from then on. there are good instructions for the kegel's on the internet. you can google "kegel exercises for men".
 
Age 48
occupation accountant
PSA increased from 2.6 to 3.5 in one year
biopsy march 2008 - cancer present gleason 7
decision - surgery (robotic)
surgery may 9, 2008 - houston, tx
pathology report -gleason 8
margins clear
waiting on first psa post surgery
continence ok during day - 1 pad
night time different story
kegel's twice a day 20 reps


Quincy3
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 19
   Posted 6/8/2008 9:53 AM (GMT -6)   
How long must you do the Kegel exercises, six months post-op or more? I had open radical at Johns Hopkins in December. Great place. Great team. But, I still leak about one thin pad a day. I use a larger one for overnight. Gleason was a 6 (3+3) and PSA was 1.4. Caught very early, thankfully and two PSAs have been less than 0.1 since surgery. I often wonder what would have happened if I had waited instead of spending the past six months leakings. Initially I had a bladder neck constriction and because of that was dry. Now that it has resolved, it's a slow leak.

Piano
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 847
   Posted 6/8/2008 9:51 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi Quincy, and welcome to the forum. How long must you do the Kegel exercises? Forever :-)
 
Of course they help with incontinence, and apparently also with ED. I suggest while you have either of those problems, keep doing them.
Age 63. Other than cancer, in good health; BMI 20
Pre-op: No symptoms; PSA 5.7; Gleason 4+5=9; cancer in 4 of 12 cores
7 March 2008, RRP, non nerve sparing
Two nights in hospital; catheter and staples out after 7 days
Continent, no pads needed from the get-go
Post Op: Stage pT2 M- N-; clear margins and lymph nodes; Gleason 4+4=8; prostate weight: 37gm
6-week PSA: 0 


Quincy3
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 19
   Posted 6/11/2008 5:14 PM (GMT -6)   
Great. Just great. Of course, it could be worse.

kw
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 883
   Posted 6/11/2008 9:51 PM (GMT -6)   

   My therapist had me put one stickey sensor pad under the scrotum area.  Then she put one on my lower abs.  She would lead me though exercises and read the monitor to make sure I was using the pelvic floor muscles.  I went to several sessions but it never made any difference in my leaking.  I would give it a try so you know your using the right muscles.

    Good Luck, KW


    43 at Dx and Surgery
    PSA 5.7, Biopsy 3 of 12 positive (up to 75%) all on left side of prostate, Gleason 7
    RRP on Oct. 17, 2006 - Nerves on right side saved. All Lab's clear. 
    Cathiter in for 28 days due to complications in healing. Removed Nov. 9, 2006
    First Post op PSA on Dec. 11, 2006  Undetectable 0.00.
    ED workable and usable with Viagra.
    Feb. 20th, 2007 - Feb. 4th, 2008  Cystoscope, Two Collagen injections,Second Opinion Consultation for Incontinance at OU Medical Center, Bio-Feedback training, Chiropractic, Accupuncture  to try to resolve ongoing incontinance (4-6 pads a day)  All PSA's 0.00.
    Feb. 22nd, 2008 - Surgery to install the AMS AdVance Male Sling.
    March 27th, 2008 - Sling not working, Little or no improvement.
    April 18, 2008 - Collagen injection.  Back to using 4-6 full pads a day within a week.
    May 14, 2008 - Another collagen injection to try to Band-Aid the leaking for our June cruise.  Will start making conusultation appiontments for AUS after we return.
 
     

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