does this surgery help anyone
2
have you heard of this - 50.0%
2
good procedure - 50.0%

 
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sargeandham
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 14
   Posted 6/7/2008 10:41 AM (GMT -6)   
:-)  have been thru prostrate surgery,all psa tests,after one year reading is 0.1,  however I have had to go thru 4 to 6 pads daily for over a year.  This tuesday june 3rd  I had the advanced male sling installed in Columbia  SC.  This is Satruday and I have had no wet pads since. Its complicated but well worth having done.  I wanted to comment on this as I know a lot of men have this problem but wont discuss it.  The sling is installed between the scrotum and anus..  They cut two areas beside the crotch to install curved needles.  With the needles they pull the sling up over the uretha.  This replaces the muscles you lost during surgery of the prostate.  this is kinda a short version of the process as I unbderstand it.  Hope this helps someone that suffering the mental anguish of incontience.     sargeandham
   PS  I had the robitic surgery in Detroit at Henry Ford in May of 07

Valentine08
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2008
Total Posts : 30
   Posted 6/7/2008 2:37 PM (GMT -6)   
sarge... Please keep us posted on your experience and progress as this is, as you noted, a topic of concern. I guess I'm making uneven slow progress, but I often feel that my incontinence recovery is not going to happen anytime soon. I know, I'm not quite to 4 months yet. HW has been a real benefit to us.
Age 59
PSA ; PSA 9/07=3.4; '06=3.2 DRE Negative; '05=2.4; '04=1.7
Biopsy 11/07 =  Stage T1c, 12 cores, 2 positive
Gleason score= 3+3=6
DaVinci Robotic RP surgery: 2/14/08
Path report: Gleason= 3+4=7; Stage T2c


sargeandham
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 14
   Posted 6/7/2008 7:50 PM (GMT -6)   
valentine 08:
 
thanks for the reply.  It usually takes up to 6-8 months for most men to overcome incont.  Some never do.  There are several type of slings.  Mine was one of the new ones called Advanced male sling.  This is not screwed to pelvic.  There are comments that theirs didnt work.  If I stay at 95% I will be very happy.  I would go   out to eat, to bathroom, eat, to bathroom.  leave go to mall to bath room, walk around half hour or so.  Go to bathroom change pads,  this went on all the time.  So I hope that this surgery success continues.  I will keep in touch.   sarge/ham

kw
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 883
   Posted 6/10/2008 10:55 PM (GMT -6)   
I had the AdVance sling also. But mine did not make any long term change to my leaking. But I still wanted to try it before the AUS!

KW
    43 at Dx and Surgery
    PSA 5.7, Biopsy 3 of 12 positive (up to 75%) all on left side of prostate, Gleason 7
    RRP on Oct. 17, 2006 - Nerves on right side saved. All Lab's clear. 
    Cathiter in for 28 days due to complications in healing. Removed Nov. 9, 2006
    First Post op PSA on Dec. 11, 2006  Undetectable 0.00.
    ED workable and usable with Viagra.
    Feb. 20th, 2007 - Feb. 4th, 2008  Cystoscope, Two Collagen injections,Second Opinion Consultation for Incontinance at OU Medical Center, Bio-Feedback training, Chiropractic, Accupuncture  to try to resolve ongoing incontinance (4-6 pads a day)  All PSA's 0.00.
    Feb. 22nd, 2008 - Surgery to install the AMS AdVance Male Sling.
    March 27th, 2008 - Sling not working, Little or no improvement.
    April 18, 2008 - Collagen injection.  Back to using 4-6 full pads a day within a week.
    May 14, 2008 - Another collagen injection to try to Band-Aid the leaking for our June cruise.  Will start making conusultation appiontments for AUS after we return.
 
     


egor
Regular Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 46
   Posted 7/12/2008 2:19 PM (GMT -6)   
Sarge,
It's been almost 6 weeks since you had the Advance Male Sling installed. How experienced with the procedure was your surgeon?
Are you still dry?
I've heard that you should take it easy for 4 wks after the procedure. Did you do that?
Have you done any heavy exercise with the sling installed?
I had DaVinci in Aug of 2006. PSA was only 1.9, but the Uro felt something. Cancer only showed up in one core and biopsy Gleason was 3 + 3 = 6.
After surgery, no positive margins, nerves spared, gleason was 3 + 4 =7.All PSA tests since were 0.02.ED no problem.
But, incontinence never disappeared. Did bio feedback for Kegels,had 2 collagen injections and took Imiprimine for a while. Still doing 2 - 4 pads a day, about 120 grams (4 ounces).
Next step is Advance Male Sling.
So, are you still happy with the Sling?
Ed

SkyDaver
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2008
Total Posts : 72
   Posted 7/12/2008 9:46 PM (GMT -6)   
(Just joined tonight ... I'll get the profile filled out soon)

At the AMS Medical Systems website, there is a good PDF file that is the transcript of a urological roundtable about the AdVance Male Sling

http://www.amsadvance.com/news.htm, the second article

http://www.amsadvance.com/AdVance_UT_Whitepaper_4_08.pdf should get you right there.

I've got an appointment in August with Dr. Webster at Duke for evaluation for the AdVance sling. I'm down to 100 ml /day or so, and think (reading that article) that I'll be a good candidate.

egor
Regular Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 46
   Posted 7/13/2008 11:50 AM (GMT -6)   
SkyDaver,
Thanks for the web sites on the Advance Male Sling (AMS). I have seen then they are excellent, but perhaps somewhat biased.
Unfortunately, I've only been able to find a couple of other references to the AMS, so have to depend largely on word of mouth and forums like this one. (which is why I'm interested in Sarge's progress).
So far, it seems that the procedure is successful for men moderately incontinent (200 ml) and who don't overdo exercise for the first 4-6 weeks after the procedure.
My next Uro visit is next month in Rochester, NY when I'll probably try the AMS.
My Uro says he's done about 12 per month this year, and except for the first two men, the rest seem to be happy with the result.
Ed

James C.
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   Posted 7/13/2008 11:52 AM (GMT -6)   
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mrbolt
New Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 1
   Posted 7/13/2008 12:00 PM (GMT -6)   
sargeandham said...
:-)  have been thru prostrate surgery,all psa tests,after one year reading is 0.1,  however I have had to go thru 4 to 6 pads daily for over a year.  This tuesday june 3rd  I had the advanced male sling installed in Columbia  SC.  This is Satruday and I have had no wet pads since. Its complicated but well worth having done.  I wanted to comment on this as I know a lot of men have this problem but wont discuss it.  The sling is installed between the scrotum and anus..  They cut two areas beside the crotch to install curved needles.  With the needles they pull the sling up over the uretha.  This replaces the muscles you lost during surgery of the prostate.  this is kinda a short version of the process as I unbderstand it.  Hope this helps someone that suffering the mental anguish of incontience.     sargeandham
   PS  I had the robitic surgery in Detroit at Henry Ford in May of 07
Very curious what was name of your surgeon at Henry Ford ? Thank You.
 

sargeandham
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 14
   Posted 7/13/2008 9:42 PM (GMT -6)   
mr.bolt...I had my surgery done by Dr mennon  he has done over 3000 this was at Henery Ford Vittuti Institute.

age 65  pre-op PSA was 10.2
bio 2005 was neg psa 4.2 ., 10-06 was 4.5  neg.bio
01-08  4.7 could not determine, dr. requested send to J.Hopkins, one from Oct 07 came back pos. gleason 3+3  2 of 10 positive.
robot assisted henry ford hosp 5/07 psa every 3 mons  0.1 since great...,
incontience 4 to 5 pads daily for year terrible...
6/03/08 advanced male sling installed.its been a week no leakage  one time at night //great..//dr. excellant he  never gave up. sling done Colo. SC


sargeandham
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 14
   Posted 7/13/2008 9:52 PM (GMT -6)   
Egor.  My dr. had only done two of the slings, but about 300 slings for women,..It has been 6 weeks and everything is great.  I did nothing  lifted less than 10 to 15 lbs.  My only issue and it is so minor.  I when urninating, cant always tell when finished.  also I had an appointment with Dr. Webster at Duke University Hospital.  But the 300 slings my dr. had done changed my mind.  It is a painfull after surgery, have to use donut for about 8 to 10  days,   hope this helps 

age 65  pre-op PSA was 10.2
bio 2005 was neg psa 4.2 ., 10-06 was 4.5  neg.bio
01-08  4.7 could not determine, dr. requested send to J.Hopkins, one from Oct 07 came back pos. gleason 3+3  2 of 10 positive.
robot assisted henry ford hosp 5/07 psa every 3 mons  0.1 since great...,
incontience 4 to 5 pads daily for year terrible...
6/03/08 advanced male sling installed.its been a week no leakage  one time at night //great..//dr. excellant he  never gave up. sling done Colo. SC


egor
Regular Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 46
   Posted 7/14/2008 8:40 AM (GMT -6)   

Thanks Sarge,

That sounds great!

Are you still wearing any pads as a precaution?

 Did you need to take prescription pain killers early on?

Ed


kw
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 883
   Posted 7/14/2008 10:32 PM (GMT -6)   
As I said, my AdVance sling did not work. But I also leaked at a 6-8 FULL pads a day. I have no Idea how many ml it would be. Not to scare you but to me the sling was more painful than my RRP. You will want some good pain killers for a while. If you doctor says your a good candidate for the sling it would be worth a try before going the AUS route I think.

Good Luck,
KW
    43 at Dx and Surgery
    PSA 5.7, Biopsy 3 of 12 positive (up to 75%) all on left side of prostate, Gleason 7
    RRP on Oct. 17, 2006 - Nerves on right side saved. All Lab's clear. 
    Cathiter in for 28 days due to complications in healing. Removed Nov. 9, 2006
    First Post op PSA on Dec. 11, 2006  Undetectable 0.00.
    ED workable and usable with Viagra.
    Feb. 20th, 2007 - Feb. 4th, 2008  Cystoscope, Two Collagen injections,Second Opinion Consultation for Incontinance at OU Medical Center, Bio-Feedback training, Chiropractic, Accupuncture  to try to resolve ongoing incontinance (4-6 pads a day)  All PSA's 0.00.
    Feb. 22nd, 2008 - Surgery to install the AMS AdVance Male Sling.
    March 27th, 2008 - Sling not working, Little or no improvement.
    April 18, 2008 - Collagen injection.  Back to using 4-6 full pads a day within a week.
    May 14, 2008 - Another collagen injection to try to Band-Aid the leaking for our June cruise.  Will start making conusultation appiontments for AUS after we return.
    July 14th, 2008 - AUS consultation with Dr. Morey in Dallas TX.
 
     


sargeandham
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 14
   Posted 7/15/2008 2:08 PM (GMT -6)   
egor.   the pain i was talking about is where they cut.  I took pain pill as needed    my dr.did the look into bladder and determined  that I had enough muscle left.  H e does not guartanee it of course no one would
As for pads I wore one the first day.  then kept one m y pockert for a week,  o by the way the muscle he was checking was the one you use for keagles

age 65  pre-op PSA was 10.2
bio 2005 was neg psa 4.2 ., 10-06 was 4.5  neg.bio
01-08  4.7 could not determine, dr. requested send to J.Hopkins, one from Oct 07 came back pos. gleason 3+3  2 of 10 positive.
robot assisted henry ford hosp 5/07 psa every 3 mons  0.1 since great...,
incontience 4 to 5 pads daily for year terrible...
6/03/08 advanced male sling installed.its been a week no leakage  one time at night //great..//dr. excellant he  never gave up. sling done Colo. SC


divo
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2008
Total Posts : 637
   Posted 7/15/2008 8:07 PM (GMT -6)   
Sarge, I am glad that it worked for you. It did not work for my husband, Pete, and he is in line for an AUS in Sept. He is j ust working with the clamps now...I really think each person is very different. Not just the doctor , or the procedure, but each man's biology is so different...We can all share here, and be happy when someone has a good outcome! Di
Husband Pete
dx Jan 2001 age 67 gleason 4 + 3 PSA 16.5
seed implant and conformal radiation Lupron from Jan 2001 to Jan2002
2005 Dec PSA began to rise from .5 to 8 within 6 months
Salvage surgery at MSK 9/06
Fistula operation 2/07 MSK
Many cystoscopies and ER visits with strictures
catheter for one year....Catheter taken out Sept 07..
Total Incontinence since then....
PSA .52 3/07
In line for AUS possibly in Sept 08


sargeandham
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 14
   Posted 7/17/2008 4:36 AM (GMT -6)   
divo Sorry to hear about your husbands not working. I feel fortunate are they worried about the .57 reading.. In my life there is always something, the month after my davinici, i fell and broke my neck. wore brace trying for easyway out, but had surg in Nov.08 then this surg so I have had enough, just overcoming pneumonia, which threw me into afib so it goers on and on,but I have a wonderful wife and there is a GOD, but some days its hard to see the good side of things.
age 65  pre-op PSA was 10.2
bio 2005 was neg psa 4.2 ., 10-06 was 4.5  neg.bio
01-08  4.7 could not determine, dr. requested send to J.Hopkins, one from Oct 07 came back pos. gleason 3+3  2 of 10 positive.
robot assisted henry ford hosp 5/07 psa every 3 mons  0.1 since great...,
incontience 4 to 5 pads daily for year terrible...
6/03/08 advanced male sling installed.its been a week no leakage  one time at night //great..//dr. excellant he  never gave up. sling done Colo. SC


divo
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2008
Total Posts : 637
   Posted 7/17/2008 7:07 AM (GMT -6)   
Sarge, you surely have had a rough time....Pete fell a few days before his surgery. He got out of the car to talk to a friend, and he was so worried about the surgery, he wasnt thinking straight, and left the car in gear...It began to roll, and he ran after it and fell hard on his hip and shoulder...Tore his rotator cuff and injured his hip....( Luckily the car ran into a tree instead of another car)....He hasnt been able to fix those because of the other problems associated with the salvage surgery. He is on lots of pain medication along with the diapers....Really has been horrible for him. It seems that some days it is hard to see the good side, but we always have hope! Di
Husband Pete
dx Jan 2001 age 67 gleason 4 + 3 PSA 16.5
seed implant and conformal radiation Lupron from Jan 2001 to Jan2002
2005 Dec PSA began to rise from .5 to 8 within 6 months
Salvage surgery at MSK 9/06
Fistula operation 2/07 MSK
Many cystoscopies and ER visits with strictures
catheter for one year....Catheter taken out Sept 07..
Total Incontinence since then....
PSA .52 3/07
In line for AUS possibly in Sept 08


WVA Rafter
New Member


Date Joined Aug 2008
Total Posts : 5
   Posted 8/3/2008 7:24 AM (GMT -6)   
Sarge, glad your sling worked out for you.  Like KW, my hasn't...at least not yet.  I'm three weeks post-sling implant.  The soreness and purple swelling was scary!  It's true that everyone's physiology is different so things don't work the same for everyone.  There were some complications with my sling installation so I'm hoping I'll see some improvement when that heals up.
 
Rafter
49 at Dx with no family history of PC
PSA 4.5, Biopsy 5 of 12 positive, Gleason 7
Robotic RP on Jan 17, 2007 
Pathology report showed tumor 20% of prostate but within margins
All PSA's 0.00 since surgery
Leaking 1+ pad per day since six months post surgery
July 11, 2008 - Surgery to install the AMS AdVance Male Sling.  Only minor dribbles for the first week.
July 19, 2008 - Sling not working, back to 1 soaked pad per day.  Suspect internal bleeding and large hematoma at site interfering with sling installation or performance.  Watching and waiting.
 


sargeandham
New Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 14
   Posted 8/3/2008 1:01 PM (GMT -6)   
WVARafter, sorry to hear yours did not work Its been two mos. now and mine is still fine. once in a while if I hold things too long I will get a dribble. The soreness and bruising were terrible took 3 weeks or so to get swelling and bruising to take its. normal course. What are they going to do about the internal problems you have whis you good luck... sarge
age 65  pre-op PSA was 10.2
bio 2005 was neg psa 4.2 ., 10-06 was 4.5  neg.bio
01-08  4.7 could not determine, dr. requested send to J.Hopkins, one from Oct 07 came back pos. gleason 3+3  2 of 10 positive.
robot assisted henry ford hosp 5/07 psa every 3 mons  0.1 since great...,
incontience 4 to 5 pads daily for year terrible...
6/03/08 advanced male sling installed.its been a week no leakage  one time at night //great..//dr. excellant he  never gave up. sling done Colo. SC


SkyDaver
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2008
Total Posts : 72
   Posted 8/20/2008 10:04 PM (GMT -6)   
Well, I'm overdue for my report :-)

Went to Duke late July, where the PA in the Urology dept. did a urodynamics study, and Dr. Webster did a cystoscopy (I was a bit worried about those prior to the visit, but they are NOT tough to handle at all)

Clinical indications (which I guess are the response in the two tests) were good, and we are proceeding with the AdVance Male Sling (gotta spell it right, or AMS will probably come after me!) on Monday, Aug 25.

I'm getting nervous about it; I'm annoyed with the leakage, and don't want to think about how I'll feel if this doesn't work. Yeah, things look favorable now, but my DaVinci procedure and nerve sparing were textbook, too, and I'm still incontinent & impotent nearly 11 months later.

As far as my incontinence levels, it's important to know that I'm a computer geek. I saw Dr. Webster back in January about the incontinence, but I just wasn't ready to go through the testing or surgery. I started weighing the pads (pad count is a poor measure, IMO) and plotting the net weight each day, including a local weighted statistical smoothing calculation of the data. I have had definite improvement since February, but still have some really bad (for me) days, at nearly 200 ml (which is just under 7 ounces) I don't wear a pad at night, and am almost perfectly dry then. Mornings aren't bad, esp. on work days, but the late afternoon, esp. if I'm on my feet, is when I start leaking, with very little control.

I'll try to return with an update next week.
51 yrs old at diagnosis & surgery
Biopsy 6/20/2007, 2 of 10 cores positive, 9%, Gleason 3+3, PSA 2.5, up from 2.0 previous year.
DaVinci robotic at Duke Univ. Medical Center 10/3/2007 both nerves spared
post surgical PSA tests all < 0.1


egor
Regular Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 46
   Posted 8/20/2008 10:35 PM (GMT -6)   

I'm having my AMSling done on Sept 5. I'll start a new thread afterwards and let you know how I make out.

Don't forget the webcast, Thursday at 3:00 EST of the AMS procedure.

(See my previous post)

Ed


Ed from Rochester, NY 66 years old
PSA 6/06 1.9
4/06 Biopsy 1 core cancerous Gleason 3 + 3 = 6
8/06 Da Vinci Dr. Joseph, Strong Memorial, Rochester, NY
Gleason 3 + 4 = 7, negative margins
3 month PSA .01
6 month PSA .01
9 month PSA .02
1 yr PSA .01
1 1/2 yr PSA .02
1st collagen 12/07
2nd collagen 3/08
Imiprimine 7/08
still leaking about 120 ml/day 2 - 4 pads


WVA Rafter
New Member


Date Joined Aug 2008
Total Posts : 5
   Posted 8/21/2008 9:29 PM (GMT -6)   

SkyDaver and Egor -Best of luck to you on your sling procedures!  I'm sure it will go smoothly for you.  As both I and sargeandham mentioned, be prepared for some swollen black and blue private parts.  My doc didn't warn me about that, or I least it didn't register, so I kinda freaked out.  It goes away though and worth the potential for improvement.  Keep us posted!

Just to update you on my own situation...I'm six weeks post sling implant now.  The first 9 days were great...only a minor drip.  But, apparently I had some post-surgery internal bleeding that formed a large hemotoma in the vicinity of the incision and I think that caused the sling to move, loosen or something.  Anyway, the hemotoma is virtually gone now but I'm leaking at my pre-sling rate.  I had a follow up with the surgeon yesterday and he wants me to wait at least 3 months before I have the procedure again to replace the sling if I decide to do it.

Given my experience, I'm thinking of going to a different surgeon for sling attempt #2.  I called AMS today and they gave me a recommendation for a different urologist so I'll book a consultation with him.


49 at Dx with no family history of PC
PSA 4.5, Biopsy 5 of 12 positive, Gleason 7
Robotic RP on Jan 17, 2007 
Pathology report showed tumor 20% of prostate but within margins
All PSA's 0.00 since surgery
Leaking 1+ pad per day since six months post surgery
July 11, 2008 - Surgery to install the AMS AdVance Male Sling.  Only minor dribbles for the first week.
July 19, 2008 - Sling not working, back to 1 soaked pad per day.  Suspect internal bleeding and large hematoma at site interfering with sling installation or performance.  Watching and waiting.
 

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