Road to Continence Pattern

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Dandapani
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 62
   Posted 2/23/2009 7:38 PM (GMT -6)   
Since we have a couple of other IC threads on the first page, I thought I would add my own... :)

On this Wednesday, I will be 10 weeks out from surgery (details below). From early on after the catheter was pulled, I had night time continence, with a dry Depends underpants in the AM. Then a few weeks later, I could go longer on the AM Depends Male Guard, but still requiring a change in the PM, and another pad when I get home before I go to bed, changing into (usually) the same underpant garment as the night before (ya, I'm a cheap ******).

I moderate my daily water with 8 ounces in the AM with my meds, 8 ounces with lunch, then the remainder with dinner and early evening while at home, plus a cup of coffee after dinner.

When I get up, I use a new Guard pad at 5:45 AM, and can generally run until 2PM before it is saturated. I can usually tell when I have to go and head most accidents off at the pass. I usually have a stream while urinating.

After the 2PM pad, everything seems to fall apart and I have more accidents, and I need to change it at 5-6PM when I get home from work. The PM is spent with less of a stream and some dribbling. By evening, when I'm home and have the rest of my daily ration of water, all bets are off. I can urinate and then few minutes later have a pretty serious accident. Control seems to go out the window.

No water after 7PM, and I go to bed by 9:30PM. In the beginning I had more urgency to urinate in the middle of the night, but now it is perhaps once or twice (even the dogs have to go out around 2AM).

Then the cycle repeats itself.

I understand that the nighttime and AM pattern of recovering continence is typical. And the time will extend farther into the PM and evening. I see small progress toward this.

Can anyone describe the physiology of this process?

Some more data. Moving around, squatting, generally being active, causes the most "accidents". So weekend putzing around causes me the most distress (I was and am an active person). However, my day job is usually sitting working at a terminal or attending a meeting. If I drink too much water too early, then the entire day is shot with saturated pads.

Is there anything in addition I can do to help the process along? Kegels aren't cutting it, if you get my drift.
Dan

PC diagnosis @ 53 YO
PSA: 3.4 - 3.7 for preceeding 10 years, new GP advised Urologist visit

09/18/09 12 plug biopsy
09/29/09 PC diagnosis, 1 of 12 plugs, 5% cancer, Gleason 3+3 (6), left side plug w/cancer
12/17/09 da Vinci robotic radical prostatectomy, lab confirmed biopsy, 5%, PIN rest of prostrate, negative margins
12/29/09 catheter removed

current status: 3-4 pads/diapers a day, dry overnight, however; total ED


Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25371
   Posted 2/23/2009 7:45 PM (GMT -6)   
Dan, for me, the Kegals neither helped or hurt, I am neutral on them. You may want to look at your stats, all the dates you have used are still in the future...lol.......just a typo I think.

David in SC
Age 56, 56 at DX, PSA 7/7 5.8, 7/8 12.3
3rd Biopsy 9/8 Positive 7 of 7 cores pos, 40-90%, Gleason 7
Open RP surgery 11/14/8, Right nerves saved, 4 days hospital, staples out 11/24/8, 5th cath out on 1/19/9
Post-surgery Pathlogy Report:Gleason 3+4=7, pT2c, 42 grm, tumor 20%, Contained in capsular, clear margins, clear lymph nodes 
First PSA Post Surgery   2/9 .05
 
 


Dandapani
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 62
   Posted 2/23/2009 7:57 PM (GMT -6)   
Purgatory said...
Dan, for me, the Kegals neither helped or hurt, I am neutral on them. You may want to look at your stats, all the dates you have used are still in the future...lol.......just a typo I think.

David in SC


David, thanks. blush I fixed my profile. :)
Dan

PC diagnosis @ 53 YO
PSA: 3.4 - 3.7 for preceeding 10 years, new GP advised Urologist visit

09/18/08 12 plug biopsy
09/29/08 PC diagnosis, 1 of 12 plugs, 5% cancer, Gleason 3+3 (6), left side plug w/cancer
12/17/08 da Vinci robotic radical prostatectomy, lab confirmed biopsy, 5%, PIN rest of prostrate, negative margins
12/29/08 catheter removed

current status: 3-4 pads/diapers a day, dry overnight, however; total ED


Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25371
   Posted 2/23/2009 8:18 PM (GMT -6)   
There you go Dan, I think I did the same thing here originally too. Glad to have you here with us.
Age 56, 56 at DX, PSA 7/7 5.8, 7/8 12.3
3rd Biopsy 9/8 Positive 7 of 7 cores pos, 40-90%, Gleason 7
Open RP surgery 11/14/8, Right nerves saved, 4 days hospital, staples out 11/24/8, 5th cath out on 1/19/9
Post-surgery Pathlogy Report:Gleason 3+4=7, pT2c, 42 grm, tumor 20%, Contained in capsular, clear margins, clear lymph nodes 
First PSA Post Surgery   2/9 .05
 
 


kw
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2006
Total Posts : 883
   Posted 2/23/2009 9:34 PM (GMT -6)   
It may just take a bit more time for you body to readjust to how things are now.
Keep working at it and try not to stress over it. You may look at cutting out all caffeene until things improve.
Good Luck,
KW
    43 at Dx and Surgery (RRP)
    PSA 5.7, Biopsy 3 of 12 positive (up to 75%) all on left side of prostate, Gleason 7
    RRP on Oct. 17, 2006 - Nerves on right side saved. All Lab's clear. 
    Cathiter in for 28 days due to complications in healing. Removed Nov. 9, 2006
    First Post op PSA on Dec. 11, 2006  Undetectable 0.00.
    ED workable and usable with Viagra.
    Feb. 20th, 2007 - Feb. 4th, 2008  Cystoscope, Two Collagen injections,Second Opinion Consultation for Incontinance at OU Medical Center, Bio-Feedback training, Chiropractic, Accupuncture  to try to resolve ongoing incontinance (4-6 pads a day)  All PSA's 0.00.
    Feb. 22nd, 2008 - Surgery to install the AMS AdVance Male Sling.
    March 27th, 2008 - Sling not working, Little or no improvement.
    April 18, 2008 - Collagen injection.  Back to using 4-6 full pads a day within a week.
    May 14, 2008 - Another collagen injection to try to Band-Aid the leaking for our June cruise.  Will start making conusultation appiontments for AUS after we return.
    July 14th, 2008 - AUS consultation with Dr. Morey at UT Southwestern (Dallas).
    July 30, PSA 0.00.
    Aug. 22nd, 2008 - AUS Surgery by Dr. Morey
    Oct. 6th, 2008 - AUS Activation by Dr. Morey.  Working Great, only light drips and dribbles.
    Jan, 31st, 2009 - PSA 0.00  Next test in July, 2009  


Dandapani
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 62
   Posted 2/24/2009 4:54 AM (GMT -6)   
kw said...
It may just take a bit more time for you body to readjust to how things are now.
Keep working at it and try not to stress over it. You may look at cutting out all caffeene until things improve.
Good Luck,
KW


Thanks, KW. Coffee/caffeine doesn't seem to make much of a difference either way.

Three main factors:

1) Time of day, PM through early evening is the worse.
2) Volume of fluids consumed at one time.
3) Activity level.
Dan

PC diagnosis @ 53 YO
PSA: 3.4 - 3.7 for preceeding 10 years, new GP advised Urologist visit

09/18/08 12 plug biopsy
09/29/08 PC diagnosis, 1 of 12 plugs, 5% cancer, Gleason 3+3 (6), left side plug w/cancer
12/17/08 da Vinci robotic radical prostatectomy, lab confirmed biopsy, 5%, PIN rest of prostrate, negative margins
12/29/08 catheter removed

current status: 3-4 pads/diapers a day, dry overnight, however; total ED


kcragman
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 240
   Posted 2/24/2009 6:23 AM (GMT -6)   
Dandapani -

You are barely two months into what my doctors tell me is a one year healing process. Incontinence and ED are different for all guys. Some come back amazingly fast, some take much longer, and a few never make it back. What you are going thru is completely normal. It sounds to me like you are ahead of the curve. For me, tiredness was a big issue. After I achieved a little bit of control, I could be totally dry from the time I went to bed to late afternoon the next day. But at around 5-6 PM I would start to break down and start leaking regardless of what I did. Activity is a big issue. I coach rec league soccer and I still soak a pad during the course of a 90 minute practice. But I am getting better and better each season.

I'm about 40 weeks out from surgery (yikes - I'm actually losing count) and I still wear one pad a day. You will probably do much better than me. Most guys hit a sudden and dramatic improvement point between 10 and 20 weeks. Sometimes they improve all the way to dry almost over night - or within a few days or a couple of weeks. I went from 5-7 heavy pads a day to 2-3 light pads a day around the 15-16 week mark, and my first 6 weeks don't count because I had such butt pain I could not do anything.

So I would say you are right on track as far as IC goes. For ED, doctors prescribe many different paths. Just do what your doctor recommends, pick up some tips off of this board, and see what happens.

I wish you the best,
kcragman
Age: 53; 52 at DX
March 2006: PSA 2.5
Dec 2007: PSA taken for insurance application. I did not see the results until late
Jan '08 - after I was rejected. Their lab said PSA 4.5.
Feb 2008: PSA 3.7.
March 2008: Biopsy. Gleason 7 (4+3) 12 cores taken. 5 on the left side were
cancerous and the 6th was suspect.
May 5, 2008: Da Vinci robotic laparoscopy at GW Hospital, Washington DC.

Post op: Gleason 9 (4+5). 15% of prostate involved. Stage: pT3a. Negative margins. Lymph node and nerve samples taken, and appeared to be cancer free.

July 2008: PSA at 7 weeks was undetectable.
August 2008: PSA at 14 weeks (3 months) was undetectable.
Nov 2008: PSA at 6 months was undetectable.
Feb 2009: PSA at 9 months was undetectable.


LV-TX
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2008
Total Posts : 966
   Posted 2/24/2009 11:57 AM (GMT -6)   
Dandapani -

Can only add my experience. Up until about the 3-4 month mark...it was like two steps forward and one step back. Meaning one day I would be good all the way up to dinner time, and the very next day leaked badly. Then almost overnight all the problems disappeared or should I say reduced significantly (I still wear one pad for those stress situations during the day only).

My uro said that the muscles used when doing the kegals take time to build up. You use these muscles during the day to stop urine flow unconsciously and they just get worn out by the end of the day. Over a period of time, just like using any muscle it will improve the endurance to the point that you will have nearly complete control. I would say for most men, the time frame is give or take 3-4 months. But as others said...it is different for each of us.

Good luck
You are beating back cancer, so hold your head up with dignity
 
Les
 
Age 58 at Diagnosis
Oct 2006 - PSA 2.6 - DRE Normal
May 2008 - PSA 4.6 - DRE Normal / TRUS normal-Gland 38 cc
July 2008 - Biopsy 4 of 12 Positive 5 - 30% Involved Bilateral (Perineural Invasion present at base) - Gleason (3+3) 6  Stage T1C
August 23 - Bone Scan - Hips, Spine and ribs marked uptake - X-Ray showed clear -Hooray
Sept 9 2nd DRE - questionable - TRUS...shadow in base - Gland now 41 cc
Robotic Surgery Sept 18, 2008
Pathology October 1, 2008 - Gleason 7 (4+3) Staged pT2c NO MX - Gland 50 cc
Seminal Vesicles and Lymph Nodes clear
Positive Margins Right Posterior Lobe
4 tumors in prostate - largest being 6 cm 
PSA 5 week Oct 2008 <.05
       3 month Jan 2009 .06


Ed C. (Old67)
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 2458
   Posted 2/24/2009 12:03 PM (GMT -6)   
Dan,
I had my catheter removed a week ago (2/17). I have had night time continence from the first night. I started out using 2-3 pads per day. After the first 3 days I dropped down to 2 pads. I usually seem to leek the most when I'm doing my 3 miles walk in the morning. After my walk I only use 1 pad that lasts till night time. I never seem to really saturate the pad too much so I'm hoping to be dry in the next couple of weeks.
Age: 67
Retired in 2001 and living in Austin TX.
PSA 3.5 free PSA 11%
Dx 12/30/08
2 cores out of 12 were positive Gleason (4+4) and (4+5)
Negative CT scan and bone scan done on 1/16
Robotic surgery performed on Feb 9th
Surgeon: Dr. Randy Fagin, Austin TX.
Post op Pathology report:
Prostate weighed 57 grams
size:5.2 x 5.0 x 4.9 cm
10-20% involved
Bilateral
Gleason 4+4
both nerve bundles removed,
pT3a Nx Mx
Negative margins
Lymph nodes: not dissected
seminal vesicles clean


Jstars
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2005
Total Posts : 489
   Posted 2/24/2009 12:50 PM (GMT -6)   
I know i am still a rookie-newbie on the IC path, but would like to put in a vote for The CUP. I read somewhere on here about a (half joking perhaps) idea to just hang a pail under your penis while incontinent (obviously only good when you are lounging in your bathrobe while still at home).

But as humorous as it might seem I have been sold on the benefits of this method for the following reasons:

1: You can really monitor what is going on -- when you drip, when you do not and when you REALLY drip
and how much you drip (not getting anal about actually measuring it but you get a good idea).
2: You use ZERO pads during these times --surely a plus for all us cheapskates - and also saving landfill space by the TON!!.
3: As someone pointed out - you are dangling in a nice airy environment - not all humid and uriney and airless -- gotta be a plus there.
4: Along with #1 you also can really see when you just leaked -- with a pad I can sort of sense I just did but am never sure.
5: This is similar (when u think about it a bit) to the method we used to use with our Toddlers when they were resisting our cajolings to become potty trained -- you take away their nice warm feelings of a wet diaper for an uncomfortable running down the legs feeling (ok we avoid that last part with the cup).
6: Did I mention saving pads ??? ;-)

7: And this is a really good one -- when you have your partner using fingers trying to send some of the old feelings back to Mr Sleepy AND you still drip a little during this (as you inevitably will) you can just keep Mr. H heeled over into the cup while any of this important rehabbing is going on and the dribs go in the cup and do not interfere with any ministrations that she might be doing (and no doubt your partner and you are more relaxed about not having to sop up any drips. ). (I guess you can do this with a pad under just as well but remember #2 and #6!!!

8: Along the same line as #7, it allows you to check in on things as often as you like -- especially when you are looking for signs of life after taking some performance enhancing drugs etc.

As for cup attachments -- I just recycled the old LEG BAG rubberband (latex or something?) around my left leg, slip a 10 oz clear plastic disposable cup along inner thigh and slip penis head over into the cup. Scrotum etc is OUTSIDE cup unless you really want it all jammed in there. ( Disposable cups come in all different thicknesses -- use one that won't crush easily AND that has a comfortable curved top edge).

You only have to remember to shift the cup angle just before sit down so's it does not spill (also just have a small plastic bottle around for Dumping.

Obviously this only works for a tablespoon or two before you dump -- otherwise you slosh --unless you stick a tissue in to absorb for a while).

Can even be used under baggy sweats or boxers around the house.

Give it a try -- turns Incontinence into a Spectator Sport of sorts for you and partner!

(I am sure this idea might wear thin over weeks and months as pad use decreases anyways -- but for now in the early hi-flo days I like it a lot).

jim
Age 58, 192lbs, 6'4", 57 at DX, PSA Aug2008 7 4 ... June2007 4.7 (BPH + LUTS)
Biopsy Nov2008 1 of 12 cores 5%, Gleason 3+3 - Sona showed 140+ ml (110 grams) prostate size.
Prostate way too big for any Rad or Seed treatment or even trying to shrink.
open RP surgery 02/03/9, Nerve sparing both sides, 1 day in hospital,
Post-surgery Pathlogy Report - All margins clear - No Invasive spread - no change in Gleason score.
Cath out on 2/18/9, passed a STONE within hours. To be analyzed by doc.

Post Edited (JimbStars) : 2/24/2009 11:56:46 AM (GMT-7)


klondiker
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2009
Total Posts : 43
   Posted 2/24/2009 1:07 PM (GMT -6)   
Jimbstars - I mentioned the CUP to my urologist and got the most unusual look as a response. He mumbled something which I could not hear. I guess that based on his response the CUP method will not receive an AMA endorsement soon. Good post as it made me laugh.
Age - 55
2004 PSA 2.7
2008 PSA 5.8
Sept 2008 PSA 5.66
Oct 2008 PSA 6.67
Biopsy on 11/25/2008 cancer found in 10% of one core , gleason 3+3=6
open RRP done on 1/14/2008. Pathology showed 20% of prostate cancerous, gleason 3+3=6, contained in capsule
First post op PSA 2/10/09 - 0.07
As of 2/11/09 down to one or two pads per day


James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4462
   Posted 2/24/2009 1:49 PM (GMT -6)   
Jim, you are taking the condom catheter to a whole new level. tongue I've never heard of anyone strapping the cup down, most just carry it around..

www.urodry.com/mgmt/alphadry.html?gclid=CNXrtcL29ZgCFQNbxwodlCbFOg
James C. Age 62
Co-Moderator- Prostate Cancer Forum
4/07 PSA 7.6, referred to Urologist, recheck 6.7
7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% involved, left lobe, GS 3/3=6
9/07 Nerve sparing open RRP- Path Report: GS 3+3=6 Stg. pT2c, 110gms, margins clear
16 mts: ED- 50 mg Viagra 3X week, pump daily,Trimix .35ml 2X week continues
PSA's: .04 each 3 months


Jstars
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2005
Total Posts : 489
   Posted 2/24/2009 2:36 PM (GMT -6)   
James C ...

Yeah I had thought about a condom - was even looking them over at CVS (ribbed or non) -- that would be equally funny looking .. not as "Airy" tho ...
Get this - they even now make a condom with a built in vibrating ring -- runs for 20 minutes on a watch style battery! LOL!

Klondiker,

Thanks for sharing what your uro thought of The Cup -- I will bring it up with mine too -- will like to see his expression too.

jim
Age 58, 192lbs, 6'4", 57 at DX, PSA Aug2008 7 4 ... June2007 4.7 (BPH + LUTS)
Biopsy Nov2008 1 of 12 cores 5%, Gleason 3+3 - Sona showed 140+ ml (110 grams) prostate size.
Prostate way too big for any Rad or Seed treatment or even trying to shrink.
open RP surgery 02/03/9, Nerve sparing both sides, 1 day in hospital,
Post-surgery Pathlogy Report - All margins clear - No Invasive spread - no change in Gleason score.
Cath out on 2/18/9, passed a STONE within hours. To be analyzed by doc.


Dandapani
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 62
   Posted 2/24/2009 7:24 PM (GMT -6)   
kcragman said...
Dandapani -

You are barely two months into what my doctors tell me is a one year healing process.


KC, my Urologist told me before my surgery that by 3 months, the level of continence achieved by then, is what will likely be the long term outcome. I think from the feedback here, that he is a bit of an underachiever. Some gentlemen here seem to be healing over a much longer period, but healing nonetheless.

My first visit with him is early April for my first PSA reading. At the pace I'm currently going (I like the previous poster two forward, one back!) I don't think I'll be very far along by then (4+ more weeks), but I'm encouraged by the non-linear improvements that some seem to achieve (over night improvements).

I wondered what was happening in the PM when everything kind of falls apart. One poster above talked about muscle fatigue. That makes sense.

When lying down and resting at night, there is little urine pressure on the bladder neck. But I can tell immediately when I stand up after lying down, if the weight of the urine is about to exceed my bladder neck/muscle capacity to hold urine before I can make it to the toilet. (I kind of do the pee-pee dance you see little boys do, sort of holding their own with their hand while trying to make it to the toilet. LOL!) But resting at night, everything has a chance to restore its ability to hold the weight.

I have made improvements. I can drive to work (55 minutes) in the AM, walk up 6 flights of stairs, and make it to my desk without having to go urinate for at least 30 minutes. At 5 weeks out from surgery, that was not possible. I leaked walking in, leaked walking up the stairs, and barely made it to the toilet.

Thanks for the input, everyone.
Dan

PC diagnosis @ 53 YO
PSA: 3.4 - 3.7 for preceeding 10 years, new GP advised Urologist visit

09/18/08 12 plug biopsy
09/29/08 PC diagnosis, 1 of 12 plugs, 5% cancer, Gleason 3+3 (6), left side plug w/cancer
12/17/08 da Vinci robotic radical prostatectomy, lab confirmed biopsy, 5%, PIN rest of prostrate, negative margins
12/29/08 catheter removed

current status: 3-4 pads/diapers a day, dry overnight, however; total ED


Dandapani
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 62
   Posted 2/24/2009 7:26 PM (GMT -6)   
JimbStars said...
I know i am still a rookie-newbie on the IC path, but would like to put in a vote for The CUP.


Jim, the "CUP" method sounds like it would be most appropriate for a kilt-wearing Scottsman. What DO they have on under their kilts? LOL!
Dan

PC diagnosis @ 53 YO
PSA: 3.4 - 3.7 for preceeding 10 years, new GP advised Urologist visit

09/18/08 12 plug biopsy
09/29/08 PC diagnosis, 1 of 12 plugs, 5% cancer, Gleason 3+3 (6), left side plug w/cancer
12/17/08 da Vinci robotic radical prostatectomy, lab confirmed biopsy, 5%, PIN rest of prostrate, negative margins
12/29/08 catheter removed

current status: 3-4 pads/diapers a day, dry overnight, however; total ED


Dandapani
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 62
   Posted 2/24/2009 7:29 PM (GMT -6)   
LV-TX said...

My uro said that the muscles used when doing the kegals take time to build up. You use these muscles during the day to stop urine flow unconsciously and they just get worn out by the end of the day. Over a period of time, just like using any muscle it will improve the endurance to the point that you will have nearly complete control. I would say for most men, the time frame is give or take 3-4 months. But as others said...it is different for each of us.


LV, interesting. Up to a few weeks ago, I would get a sharp "electrical" pain/jolt inside my abdomen down low, and sure enough, I'd get a small leak/squirt. It was totally unconscious. That now has stopped. Wonder if this was part of the healing process, nerve wise. Nerve fatigue would trigger a small moment of loss of control.
Dan

PC diagnosis @ 53 YO
PSA: 3.4 - 3.7 for preceeding 10 years, new GP advised Urologist visit

09/18/08 12 plug biopsy
09/29/08 PC diagnosis, 1 of 12 plugs, 5% cancer, Gleason 3+3 (6), left side plug w/cancer
12/17/08 da Vinci robotic radical prostatectomy, lab confirmed biopsy, 5%, PIN rest of prostrate, negative margins
12/29/08 catheter removed

current status: 3-4 pads/diapers a day, dry overnight, however; total ED


kcragman
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 240
   Posted 2/24/2009 8:02 PM (GMT -6)   
Dandapani -

I have not heard the 3 month thing anywhere, and it does not say that in the Walsh book, so I would question its validity.

It sounds like you are going down about the same path I did - only you are going faster. The evening thing has got to be muscle fatigue. I also find that alcohol (especially wine) does not help me, especially in the evenings. But if I want a glass (or two) of wine - I WILL have it. (I'm still wearing a pad, after all.)

My doctor was telling me that if you sleep on your back - as I have been forced to, and I assume most everybody else also - your bladder will comfortably hold a quantity of urine up to the level of of the urethra (or bladder neck). At that point you start to feel pressure. The time it takes to fill your bladder, the amount of pressure and the amount of (unconscious?) control you have determines how much sleep you get. Of course, when you stand up, you now have ALL the pressure bearing down on your urethra so you have to go to the bathroom.

And yes, good days and bad days are extremely frustrating. I was in an IC trial, and I had to take my pads in to be weighed - they were tracking the loss of urine in grams from the pads used in the previous 24 hours. I was doing OK - probably 5 medium to heavy pads a day, but then the day before my 3 month weigh in I had possibly the worst day of my IC career. When they weighed my pads, I was off the charts. That was about 14 weeks. Like I said, during the 15-16 week period, I suddenly went from 5, sometimes 7 pads a day down to 2 or 3 light pads, and a few weeks later down to one pad. I just can't get over that last hump, but then, I have to admit - I'm not working very hard at it these days.

Good luck!
kcragman
Age: 53; 52 at DX
March 2006: PSA 2.5
Dec 2007: PSA taken for insurance application. I did not see the results until late
Jan '08 - after I was rejected. Their lab said PSA 4.5.
Feb 2008: PSA 3.7.
March 2008: Biopsy. Gleason 7 (4+3) 12 cores taken. 5 on the left side were
cancerous and the 6th was suspect.
May 5, 2008: Da Vinci robotic laparoscopy at GW Hospital, Washington DC.

Post op: Gleason 9 (4+5). 15% of prostate involved. Stage: pT3a. Negative margins. Lymph node and nerve samples taken, and appeared to be cancer free.

July 2008: PSA at 7 weeks was undetectable.
August 2008: PSA at 14 weeks (3 months) was undetectable.
Nov 2008: PSA at 6 months was undetectable.
Feb 2009: PSA at 9 months was undetectable.


Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25371
   Posted 2/24/2009 8:17 PM (GMT -6)   
That is still a lot of progress you have made there kragman, big improvement from your wettest times
Age 56, 56 at DX, PSA 7/7 5.8, 7/8 12.3
3rd Biopsy 9/8 Positive 7 of 7 cores pos, 40-90%, Gleason 7
Open RP surgery 11/14/8, Right nerves saved, 4 days hospital, staples out 11/24/8, 5th cath out on 1/19/9
Post-surgery Pathlogy Report:Gleason 3+4=7, pT2c, 42 grm, tumor 20%, Contained in capsular, clear margins, clear lymph nodes 
First PSA Post Surgery   2/9 .05
 
 


kcragman
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 240
   Posted 2/25/2009 8:03 PM (GMT -6)   
FYI - I went back and looked at my posts concerning the IC trial in the August 2008 time frame.

Purgatory - Thanks for your comment. Yes, I have gone from losing 615 grams in one day (my worst measured day ever) to losing 5-10 grams a day.

Dandapani - The doctors also told me during the trial (which included 95 patients at that time) that they were seeing the most dramatic improvements between the 3 and 6 month marks. So I think your doctor's comments were somewhat off base.

Just my 2 cents,
kcragman
Age: 53; 52 at DX
March 2006: PSA 2.5
Dec 2007: PSA taken for insurance application. I did not see the results until late
Jan '08 - after I was rejected. Their lab said PSA 4.5.
Feb 2008: PSA 3.7.
March 2008: Biopsy. Gleason 7 (4+3) 12 cores taken. 5 on the left side were
cancerous and the 6th was suspect.
May 5, 2008: Da Vinci robotic laparoscopy at GW Hospital, Washington DC.

Post op: Gleason 9 (4+5). 15% of prostate involved. Stage: pT3a. Negative margins. Lymph node and nerve samples taken, and appeared to be cancer free.

July 2008: PSA at 7 weeks was undetectable.
August 2008: PSA at 14 weeks (3 months) was undetectable.
Nov 2008: PSA at 6 months was undetectable.
Feb 2009: PSA at 9 months was undetectable.

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