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OregonPinot
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 27
   Posted 6/6/2009 8:55 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi,
 
As many of the threads indicate, Viagra is used for increasing blood flow to the penis as well as helping to facilitate an erection.
 
For people who had nerve-sparing surgery both facets are important, for those who did not the increase in blood flow would be the primary objective of its use.
 
The MD recommended dosages (if at all) vary as well as the timing.
 
The literature published by Phizer ( http://www.pfizer.com/files/products/uspi_viagra.pdf )explains in most detail than most may want to have but it does state "Sildenafil at recommended doses has no effect in the absence of sexual stimulation." (Page one of the document).
 
Does anyone know if this applies to both blood flow and erection? Many posters have cited taking Viagra at night to increase blood flow post surgery without intending an erection to occur?
 
Thanks
 
    
PSA:      9.95
Gleason: 7 (3/4)
CT:        No mets indicated beyond Prostate 


Steve n Dallas
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2008
Total Posts : 4823
   Posted 6/7/2009 5:19 AM (GMT -6)   
I was told to take it right before bedtime. The goal was to help stimulate/simulate errections that we get/used to get in our sleep.
Age 54   - 5'11"   205lbs
Overall Heath Condition - Good
PSA - July 2007 & Jan 2008 -> 1.3
Biopsy - 03/04/08 -> Gleason 6 
 
06/25/08 - Da Vinci robotic laparoscopy
Catheter in for five weeks.
Dry after 3 months.
 
10/03/08 - 1st Quarter PSA -> less then .01
01/16/09 - 2nd Quarter PSA -> less then .01
xx/xx/xx   - 3rd Quater skipped
05/14/09  - 4th Quarter PSA -> less then .01
Surgeon - Keith A. Waguespack, M.D.
 


James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4462
   Posted 6/7/2009 7:26 AM (GMT -6)   
ED drugs do both, erections and blood flow. Use of them for ED recovery is to keep fresh blood infused into the abdomen, penis and the help the nerves and tissue heal or regrow. The warning is correct, as far as it goes- they will not produce erections without stimulation of some kind. They aren't gonna give you one whether you want it or not, ie: spanish fly effect. It only helps if you are willing to get involved... tongue

Simple version: Erections are produced in the brain, by nerve impulses, with nitric oxide being released to trigger increased blood flow in the penis to create an erections. ED drugs facilitate this nitric oxide absorption, allowing greater amounts to do it's thing. One of the common blends of meds is the ED drugs taken with l Arginine- an over the counter that promotes nitric oxide release, hence enhancing the action of the pill. I have been taking 2000mg of it with my generic Viagra just for the effect it is supposed to give. Supposedly the routine use of ED drugs will help establish nocturnal erections, hence helping with recovery, infusion and regaining ability.
James C. Age 62
Co-Moderator- Prostate Cancer Forum
4/07 PSA 7.6, referred to Urologist, recheck 6.7
7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% involved, left lobe, GS 3/3=6
9/07 Nerve sparing open RRP- Path Report: GS 3+3=6 Stg. pT2c, 110gms, margins clear
21 mts: ED- 50 mg Viagra 3X week, pump daily,Trimix .35ml 2X week continues
PSA's: .04 each 3 months


OregonPinot
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 27
   Posted 6/7/2009 9:38 AM (GMT -6)   

Thanks!

James C wrote "...allowing greater amounts to do it's thing..." - James, I presume you are referring to the supply of blood to that area.  In other words taking Viagra increases the blood supply to the area but taking Viagra with sexual stimulation increases it even greater allowing for the potential of an erection.

 

 

 


PSA:      9.95
Gleason: 7 (3/4)
CT:        No mets indicated beyond Prostate 
RP via da Vinci: 12/15/2008
UCSF - Peter Carroll, MD
Cancer within margins (3/4/5 based on biopsy), nerve sparing
PSA +3mos <.001
 


aus
Regular Member


Date Joined Sep 2006
Total Posts : 211
   Posted 6/7/2009 6:28 PM (GMT -6)   
" The MD recommended dosages (if at all) vary as well as the timing."
 
Everyone is different. It is prudent to start with a small 25 size pill as some men have side issues like vision problems, especially if they take the large 100 size.
 
Larger pills like 100 size can be cut into smaller sizes: as well as being safer to try it can be more economical as well.

James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4462
   Posted 6/7/2009 7:04 PM (GMT -6)   
Oregon, I was referring to the drugs allowing greater amounts of nitric oxide being relesed into the blood stream. The way it was explained to me, if the nerves are intact and working, then the ED drug will act as a 'booster' for the nitric oxide that is released into the blood stream, as a part of the erection response and growth. More nitric oxide=more blood flow into the penis, hence supposedly more response to the erection.
Here's a clearer definition:

How does Viagra work?
An erection is the result of an increase in blood flow into certain internal areas of the penis. Viagra works by enhancing the effects of one of the chemicals (nitric oxide) the body normally releases into the penis during sexual arousal. This allows an increase of blood flow into the penis.
James C. Age 62
Co-Moderator- Prostate Cancer Forum
4/07 PSA 7.6, referred to Urologist, recheck 6.7
7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% involved, left lobe, GS 3/3=6
9/07 Nerve sparing open RRP- Path Report: GS 3+3=6 Stg. pT2c, 110gms, margins clear
21 mts: ED- 50 mg Viagra 3X week, pump daily,Trimix .35ml 2X week continues
PSA's: .04 each 3 months

Post Edited (James C.) : 6/7/2009 7:14:25 PM (GMT-6)


mikey1955
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 672
   Posted 6/8/2009 3:11 PM (GMT -6)   

 

Hi Oregon,

Saw my GP last week. Asked him about Cialis, Viagra, Levitra. He said he found good post surgery results with Levitra. He gave me a sample pack of 2-20 mg pills. I did a quick read online and found this was the max dose. I cut one in half...my results: Got about a 50% chubby, plugged sinuses, a 24 hr headache and a bit of a chemical hangover the next day. On the bright side, I got a 100% improvement in erection meaning it is working. I'm a bit shy to try 20 mg, but I guess the side effects may subside with use?

Mike
Lower left groin hernia: mesh and large scar: surgery early 2006
Nov/Dec 07 and March 08 and now Dec 08: Severe perineal pain (between scrotum and rectum). Septra/Bactrim for 8 months (Nov 07-Jun 08) for diagnosed prostatitis.
PSA start of 2008: 5.3..... PSA June of 2008: 7.3
14 DRE all benign or nothing felt
TRUS Biopsy Nov 08: Got copy of pathology (see below). Prostate about 40 cm sq.
General Health: pretty good, 5' 10", 180 lbs, slim.
Bone scan Dec 08: Negative
Barium enema X-ray (March 09 due to several days of blood in stool)
MRI with endorectal coil (April 09 as part of a study)
3D advanced TRUS (April 09 as part of a study)
CT (April 09 as part of a study)
Biopsy Pathology: 5 of 8 cores positive, adenocarinoma in both lobes. 30%-65%. One core perineural invasion. 2 cores "foamy" and suspicious. All +ve cores, 3+3 GS 6.
Open RP surgery: May 5/09 Surgeon spoke to my wife and was very positive. Said both nerve bundles spared and not damaged. Bilateral lymph node dissection performed. Discharged 48 hours after surgery. Staples out, catheter out and pathology sheduled for May 21.
Post Surgery Pathology: pT3a N0 MX, extraprostatic extension (EPE), stage III prostate cancer, lymph nodes clear, seminal vesicles clear, Gleason upraded to 3+4 GS 7. EPE within surgical margins. Other than prostate and EPE, all tissue removed negative for cancer involvement.
Physical State: Getting back to working out slowly. Urinary control pretty much from the time of catheter removal. Rectal pain, sometimes bad but, told is normal. Erectile function at best 25-30% of presurgery. Trying Levitra...first 10 mG dose gave me nasal congestion, 50% chubby and a 24 hour headache...may go away with more use or change of meds. Considering pump. Recovery from surgery going very well.
Mental State: Pre-surgery anxiety gone. Positive attitude. Some anxiety about seeing radiation oncologist and upcoming 3 month PSA. 


James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4462
   Posted 6/8/2009 4:25 PM (GMT -6)   
If you got 100% improvement with 1/2, imagine what you get with a full one... turn
James C. Age 62
Co-Moderator- Prostate Cancer Forum
4/07 PSA 7.6, referred to Urologist, recheck 6.7
7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% involved, left lobe, GS 3/3=6
9/07 Nerve sparing open RRP- Path Report: GS 3+3=6 Stg. pT2c, 110gms, margins clear
21 mts: ED- 50 mg Viagra 3X week, pump daily,Trimix .35ml 2X week continues
PSA's: .04 each 3 months


mikey1955
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 672
   Posted 6/8/2009 5:11 PM (GMT -6)   
A 48 hour headache....? tongue
Lower left groin hernia: mesh and large scar: surgery early 2006
Nov/Dec 07 and March 08 and now Dec 08: Severe perineal pain (between scrotum and rectum). Septra/Bactrim for 8 months (Nov 07-Jun 08) for diagnosed prostatitis.
PSA start of 2008: 5.3..... PSA June of 2008: 7.3
14 DRE all benign or nothing felt
TRUS Biopsy Nov 08: Got copy of pathology (see below). Prostate about 40 cm sq.
General Health: pretty good, 5' 10", 180 lbs, slim.
Bone scan Dec 08: Negative
Barium enema X-ray (March 09 due to several days of blood in stool)
MRI with endorectal coil (April 09 as part of a study)
3D advanced TRUS (April 09 as part of a study)
CT (April 09 as part of a study)
Biopsy Pathology: 5 of 8 cores positive, adenocarinoma in both lobes. 30%-65%. One core perineural invasion. 2 cores "foamy" and suspicious. All +ve cores, 3+3 GS 6.
Open RP surgery: May 5/09 Surgeon spoke to my wife and was very positive. Said both nerve bundles spared and not damaged. Bilateral lymph node dissection performed. Discharged 48 hours after surgery. Staples out, catheter out and pathology sheduled for May 21.
Post Surgery Pathology: pT3a N0 MX, extraprostatic extension (EPE), stage III prostate cancer, lymph nodes clear, seminal vesicles clear, Gleason upraded to 3+4 GS 7. EPE within surgical margins. Other than prostate and EPE, all tissue removed negative for cancer involvement.
Physical State: Getting back to working out slowly. Urinary control pretty much from the time of catheter removal. Rectal pain, sometimes bad but, told is normal. Erectile function at best 25-30% of presurgery. Trying Levitra...first 10 mG dose gave me nasal congestion, 50% chubby and a 24 hour headache...may go away with more use or change of meds. Considering pump. Recovery from surgery going very well.
Mental State: Pre-surgery anxiety gone. Positive attitude. Some anxiety about seeing radiation oncologist and upcoming 3 month PSA. 


hb2006
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2008
Total Posts : 299
   Posted 6/9/2009 8:27 AM (GMT -6)   
My sinuses run for awhile every time I take Levitra, but I also had the same thing happen with Viagra. I never get the headaches, although since my by-pass surgery I never get headaches at all.

You might try taking a Bendryl an hour after taking the Levitra. That would clear up your nasal congestion.
Age 60
PSA 2007 4.1
PSA 2008 10.0
Diagnosed April 2008
Biopsy: 6 of 12 cores positive
Gleason 4 + 5 = 9
CT and Bone Scan negative
Open surgery at Shawnee Mission Medical Center May 21, 2008
Right side nerves spared
Radical prostatectomy and lymph node dissection
Cather removed on June 3rd, totally dry on July 9th
pT2c
lymph nodes negative
PSA Sept 28, 2008 0.00
PSA Jan 22, 2009 0.00
ED Status- Currently using Trimix, Levitra daily for increased blood flow.
Noctural Erections have completely returned on a nightly basis, same hardness as before.


CPA
Veteran Member


Date Joined Feb 2008
Total Posts : 655
   Posted 6/9/2009 10:02 AM (GMT -6)   
Greetings everyone.  I have taken both Levitra and Cialis and both of their generic equivalents from ADC.  When I first started I found I got the face flushing and stuffy nose with any of the versions.  As time has gone by, I no longer get the face flushing but I do get something of a stuffy nose although not nearly as much as I did when I first started.  I used to always take the pill as I was going to bed at night and I didn't even know about the symptoms.  I have taken a pill during the day from time to time here lately and discovered the improvement in the side effects.  I am about 15 months out from surgery and about 11 months out from beginning the pill therapy and usually take a pill twice a week.  David 

Age 55
Diagnosed Dec 2007 during annual routine physical
PSA doubled from previous year from 1.5 to 3.2
12 biopsies - 2 positive with 2 marginal
Gleason 3 + 3 = 6
RRP 4 Feb 08
Both nerves spared
Good pathology - no margins - all encapsulated - Gleason 4 + 3 = 7
Catheter out Feb 13 - wore pad for couple of days - pad free Feb 16
PSA every 90 days - ZERO's everytime!
Great wife and family who take very good care of me

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