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New Member

Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 5
   Posted 6/13/2009 7:20 PM (GMT -6)   
Dxd in 2002 (age 62) with PSA of 42.7 and Gleason of 7 (4+3). Started Lupron/Casodex 11/02 and radiation in 2/03 got PSA down to less than .01 quickly so was able to stop my Hormone treatment after two years. PSA started to slowly rise about 2006 and when reached the 7-8 mark started back on Lupron/Casodex and got it back down to 1.7 in early 2008 so stopped treatment. In two months PSA started rising rapidly so in June 2008 started back on Lupron/Casodex but couldn't stop the rise. Stopped Casodex around Sept 2008 but PSA continued to rise and last count in April was 20.7. Any one have tis type of situation and if so how did you treat it? All Bone  and CT Scans show no signs of cancer.

Regular Member

Date Joined Sep 2006
Total Posts : 187
   Posted 6/13/2009 10:06 PM (GMT -6)   
Haven't been in your shoes, but keep up the fight! I know a guy who stopped responding to HT and his PSA stated to rise---he got on a clincial trial for MDV-3100, and his PSA dropped back down. Its not approved yet, but maybe try to find an open trial?

Good luck!
Age 49 - pre-surgery PSA 39 (at age 45)
Open Radical Prostatectomy 6/9/2006
Pathological Stage T3a, Positive Surgical Margin
Gleason 3+4
PSA rose to .24 in November of 2006
6 month hormone therapy initiated December 1. 2006
36 sessions of IMRT Ended Feb 1, 2007
PSA as of May 25, 2007 undetectable
PSA as of November 29, 2007 undetectable
PSA as of May 14, 2008 undetectable
PSA as of November 25, 2008 undetectable
PSA as of May 22, 2009 undetectable

Veteran Member

Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 3149
   Posted 6/14/2009 5:47 AM (GMT -6)   

You could try the second  line hormone therapies:  estradiol patches, DES, emcyt  (they can work against hrpca and cause direct apoptosis of PCa cells...probably won't get them all but is useful) or ketoconazole is another drug that works (how long on anything is the biggest question) and there are others. Estradiol patches have little or no side effects and DES in much safer that the alot of the b.s. that is thrown out there about using such.(just use 1 mg or even less-could be cut it in half and use coumadin in conjunction). The old days decades ago the well meaning medical idiots used 5-mg and no blood thinner or aspirin and a few patients got blood clots, this is what everyone remembers. They don't mention their successes using this and very good control for thousands of patients, while using this for decades before the expensive newer (better?) drugs came out.

I have used DES for 2 yrs., sometimes on/off, sometimes maybe randomly, it outperformed the ADT3, it canceled those ADT side effects and the only issue I ever felt was some breat tenderness. It cost almost nothing (no patents, no drug is man made compounded drug). If you were paranoid about using this, then use the estradiol patch it also works similarly (same family of drugs), people say they have no side effects, except maybe the breast tenderness. Dr. Premoli in Argentina uses the patches on his patients, they don't have mega bucks and insurance companies to send the thousands of dollars to.

Dr. Fred Lee the pioneer doc of cryo-freezing PCa methodology is also a PCa survivor his choice of drug is emcyt (same family of drugs), so yeah he would be an idiot too if you believe the b.s. hype on using these types of drugs. (this does have side effects and is probably not used that much). You would have to find the right doc in order to get a written Rx for these drugs or even the ketoconazole. If you are seeing a uro-doc, you are beyond what he can help you with.

Chemo in my opinion is a possible later consideration and would drag your body down, myself I would wish to avoid forever. I feel so much better not using ADT(3) drugs that most people would not believe it, got rid of the weight gain, no sweats, no hot flashes, and that bunch of lousy effects. (have much better strenght and energy now too. Plus got a chance to flip the bird to the nice drug companies whom cashed in tremendously for my first 2 yrs. on ADT3=$26,000+.  Yeah I'm an idiot for using it ... (cost=$130 per year). Yes there may be some patients whom should not use some of these drugs, if they have high end blood clotting factors kind of built -in to their own chemistry, but this can be tested for too.

Anyway food for thought, controlling PCa is probably better than letting run rampant on its own. Contact a leading PCa advocacy organization for patient whom are at risk is another option.

Dx-2002 (probably shouldn't be around this long with my original stats and total urinary blockage likely caused by PCa in 2002, way high stats found all 12/12-cores 75-95% cancerous, gleasons 7,8,9's,  bpsa  46.6)  (current psa  .78 resumed DES again recently and got 3rd response in so using it)




Post Edited (zufus) : 6/14/2009 4:56:49 AM (GMT-6)

Tony Crispino
Veteran Member

Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 8128
   Posted 6/15/2009 12:57 AM (GMT -6)   
Welcome to HealingWell. In my going on three years here, I have seen some cases like yours. Bob (Zufus) is one of them. Others have made a decision to take early chemotherapy as opposed to delayed. And still others decided on secondary hormonal treatment options like Ketoconazole or like Bob says estrogenic drugs like DES. At this point if your CT's are negative, what other scans are you planning? MRI?

You may also ask for a CTC (circulating tumor cell). This test may help you decide which is a good move now. With Provenge around the corner, as well as more genetic approaches, just trying to stablize the PSA is a sound approach.

Do you have an idea what you may try?

Anyway, welcome again. This is a great site with great membership interaction. Peace to you.


 Age 46 (44 when Dx)
Pre-op PSA was 19.8 : Surgery at The City of Hope on February 16, 2007
Geason 4+3=7, Stage pT3b, N0, Mx
Positive Margins (PM), Extra Prostatic Extension (EPE) : Bilateral Seminal vesicle invasion (SVI)
HT began in May, '07 with Lupron and Casodex 50mg (2 Year ADT)
IMRT radiation for 38 Treatments ending August 3, '07
Current PSA (May 11, 2009): <0.1
My Journal is at Tony's Blog  

John T
Veteran Member

Date Joined Nov 2008
Total Posts : 4249
   Posted 6/15/2009 12:34 PM (GMT -6)   

The Prostate Cancer Research Institute has free videos on their web site by Drs Sholtz and Lam on androgen independent PC. Videos are very informative and Sholtz and Lam are experts in treating this type of PC.


64 years old.

PSA rising for 10 years to 40, free psa 10-15. Had 5 urologists, 12 biopsies and MRIS all neg. Doctors DX BPH and continue to get biopsies yearly. Positive Biopsy in 10-08, 2 cores of 25, G6 less than 5%. Scheduled Surgery as recommended.

2nd Opinion from Dr Sholtz, an Oncologist said DX wrong, path shows indolant cancer, but psa history indicates large cancer or metastasis. Futher tests and Color Doppler confirmed large transition zone tumor that 13 biopsies and MRIS missed. G 4+3 approx 2.5cm diameter.

Combidex MRI in Holland eliminated lymphnode mets. Casodex and Proscar reduced psa to 0.6 and prostate from 60mm to 32mm. Changed diet, no meat and dairy.

Seed implants on 5-19-09, 3 hours door to door, no pain, minor side affects are frequency and burining urination. Daily activities resumed day after implants.

Scheduled for 5 weeks IMRT in July


Elite Member

Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25382
   Posted 6/15/2009 8:31 PM (GMT -6)   

I can't directly answer your questions, but I wish you all the best in your particular situation. There must be an answer out there, or a combination of things that can improve your numbers. Please keep us posted.

David in SC
Age 56, 56 at DX, PSA 7/7 5.8, 7/8 12.3,9/8 14.5
3rd Biopsy Sept 08: Positive 7 of 7 cores, 40-90%, Gleason 7, 4+3
Open RP surgery 11/14/8, Right nerves spared, 4 days hospital, staples out 11/24/8, 5th cath out on 1/19/9
Post-surgery Pathlogy Report:Gleason 3+4=7, pT2c, 42 grm, tumor 20%, Contained in capsular, clear margins, clear lymph nodes 
First PSA Post Surgery   2/9 .05, 5/9 .10 doubled in 3 months, new test in six weeks, then possibly off for salvage radiation

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