Walking and incontinence

New Topic Post Reply Printable Version
[ << Previous Thread | Next Thread >> ]

CharlieTuneA
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 37
   Posted 10/15/2009 2:33 PM (GMT -6)   
Hello all,
 
I've recently read quite a few posts on this forum that talk about walking being helpful in regaining continence. I've been an avid walker for a long time, and now that I have had my second catheter removed, I'm getting back to walking on a regular basis, about 1 1/2 miles a day. However, I fail to see how walking actually helps with urinary control. Maybe I need to give myself more time, or walk shorter distances more often.
 
Does anyone know what the thinking is behind the idea of walking to improve continence?
 
Thanks!
 
-Charlie
Age at diagnosis 59, PSA 1.4
Biopsy 12/08 12 cores, 6 positive
Gleason 3+3=6
CAT scan negative.

DaVinci surgery 6/16/09
After 10 days, cystogram revealed fistula
Catheter Removed 7/17/09
Fistula still evident week of 8/24
PSA 0.03
Catheter Reinserted 8/28/09
2nd catheter removed 9/28/09

Continence is a future goal.


Sleepless09
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 1267
   Posted 10/15/2009 3:00 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi Charlie -- I can't tell you why folks here think it's a good idea, but I do think that excercise, and walking is a good one, just keeps all body functions from kidney to heart corking along efficiently, and that's a good thing. On the control side, I found when walking I was at my worst. One step, squirt, two steps squirt, three steps ... well, you get the picture. When I was walking I wasn't doing anything else except being upset by the squirts and so as I ambeled along I was working on one step, kegel, two steps kegel --- and after I'd done a mile things seemed to be working automatically. Of course, it may just be the tank was dry, but I'd say the walking was useful as it put me under some stress and it was expected stress, and repeated stress, and I was able to work on it way better than just sitting in a chair.

Good luck,

Sheldon AKA Sleepless
Age 67 in Apil '09 at news of 4 of 12 cores positive T2B and Gleason 3 + 3 and 5% to 25% PSA 1.5
Re-read of slides in June said Gleason 3 + 4 same four cores 5% to 15%
June 29 daVinci prostatectomy, Dr. Eric Estey, at Royal Alexandra Hospital Edmonton one night stay
Flew home to Winnipeg on July 3 after 5 nights in Ramada Inn  ---  perfect recovery spot!
Catheter out July 9, so far, so good
Final pathology is 3 + 4 Gleason 7, clear margins, clear nodes, T2C, sugeron says report is "excellent"
First post op PSA Sept 09  0.02
Oct 1st 09 -- dry at night, during day some stress issues, but better every week.    


James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4462
   Posted 10/15/2009 3:53 PM (GMT -6)   
Walking is recommended just after surgery to get the body active again, to stimulate the urinary and bowel functions, to eliminate the drugs and such from the body, leftovers from the surgery, etc. Walking after catheter removal- for me- helped build up endurance, provided toning to the legs, groin and the pelvic floor. Walking combined with kegals makes your body and, more importantly your brain, retrain itself to accept , adapt and use the new circumstances of your body. I don't know when walking isn't good for the body, even arthritics benefit from it. In summary, it specifically tones up the thighs and by extension the lower torso and the pelvic floor.
James C. Age 62
Co-Moderator- Prostate Cancer Forum
4/07 PSA 7.6, referred to Urologist, recheck 6.7
7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% involved, left lobe, GS 3/3=6
9/07 Nerve sparing open RRP 110gms.- Path Report: GS 3+3=6 Stg. pT2c, 110gms, margins clear
24 mts: PSA's: .04 each test since surgery, Bimix .3ml PRN or Trimix .15ml PRN


Mavica
Regular Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 407
   Posted 10/15/2009 5:47 PM (GMT -6)   
I don't know (or I'm forgetting) the specific research or reasoning behind the recommendation of my surgeon that I walk a lot post-op, and afterwards, but I've always been a "walker" and I can say that I leak less when I'm walking than when I sit.  That's my "research," 13-months after surgery.

Age:  60 (58 at diagnosis - June, 2008)

April '08 PSA 4.8 ("free PSA" 7.9), up from 3.5 year prior

June '08 had biopsy, 2 days later told results positive but in less than 1% of sample

Gleason's 3+3=6

Developed sepsis 2 days post-biopsy, seriously ill in hospital for 3 days

Dr. recommended robotic removal using da Vinci

Surgery 9/10/08

Northwestern Memorial Hospital, Chicago, IL

Dr. Robert Nadler, Urologist/Surgeon

Post-op Gleason's:  3+3, Tertiary 4

Margins:  Free

Bladder & Urethral:  Free

Seminal vesicles:  Not involved

Lymphatic/Vascular Invasion:  Not involved

Tumor:  T2c; Location:  Bilateral; Volume:  20%

Catheter:  Removed 12-days after surgery

Incontinent:  Yes (1/2 light pads per day)

Combination of Cialis and MUSE (alprostadil) three times weekly started 9-27-08

Returned to work 9-29-08 (18-19 days post-op)

PSA test result, post-op, 10/08: 0.0; 12/08: 0.0; 4/09: 0.0; 9/09: 0.0

 


Doc
New Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 18
   Posted 10/15/2009 6:01 PM (GMT -6)   
My catheter came out about 2-1/2 wks ago, and unlike Mavica, about the only time I DON'T leak is when I am sitting or lying down. I find that I can build up a good volume of urine while sitting, and then can walk around a bit without leaking too badly as long as my bladder is full. As soon as I void, though, the same walking around or the usual up-and-down office activities just lead to continuous dribble. Not sure why walking would have this effect, and not sure if Sheldon's approach is right for me or not, as I think that part of my recovery has to be to stretch out the bladder and I can only do that now after sitting for awhile. Who knows? I'd be very interested in what others have to say on this subject.

Doc
PCa Dx 07/09: 3+3 in 2 cores
Age at Dx 54
daVinci RRP 09/17/09
Final path 3+3, <5%, margins neg, pT2a.
 


T40
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 103
   Posted 10/15/2009 8:04 PM (GMT -6)   
When I first started walking I had the tendency to attempt to hold my kegel nonstop the entire time.  Did it stop me from leaking?  Nope.  Did it strengthen the area?  Absolutely.  I got on the elliptical for 30 minutes this morning and didn't use a pad.  Didn't drip at all.  Later in the day I might have after being stuck in meetings all day.  But so slight it wasn't an issue.  Walk, walk some more, then keep walking.  It will make a difference in my opinion.
Age 40
Pre-op PSA was 5.8 from wellness test on May 19, 09
Follow up test from uro was 4.6 with a 9.3% free psa
Gleason 3+3 in one core, 3+4 in second core of 12 samples taken
Uro recommended Robotic for someone of my age. My research confirms.
Surgery performed August 19th, 09.
One side nerves spared. Nerve graft on other side.
Six weeks incontinence almost over. ED a work in progress but seeing some response.
Post op October 2nd, 2009 All margins were negative. PSA results in a few days.


James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4462
   Posted 10/15/2009 8:30 PM (GMT -6)   
You know, one of our members here had a really good trick for curing his incontinence. He walked around the house naked and holding a dixie cup to catch the urine. Especially upstairs and back down. He claimed this allowed him to concentrate and also forced him to visually recognize what he was doing. I swear he claimed it worked for him... You can look it up! smilewinkgrin
James C. Age 62
Co-Moderator- Prostate Cancer Forum
4/07 PSA 7.6, referred to Urologist, recheck 6.7
7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% involved, left lobe, GS 3/3=6
9/07 Nerve sparing open RRP 110gms.- Path Report: GS 3+3=6 Stg. pT2c, 110gms, margins clear
24 mts: PSA's: .04 each test since surgery, Bimix .3ml PRN or Trimix .15ml PRN


MrGimpy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 504
   Posted 10/15/2009 8:48 PM (GMT -6)   
Walking serves several purposes ( aside from cardio benefits) It increases blood flow , especially to the groin area which helps in healing

I was told that the walking along with Keigels would be teh best way to a speedy dryness state and they were correct
Stats:
Age: 52
PSA (2008)=1.9
Biopsy on Jan 09, 2009
One (1) out of twelve (12) cores was positive, plus external nodule found
Gleason Score = 3+3
Surgery (Da Vinci, robotic prostatectomy): 4/7/09
Removed Catheter: 04/19/09
100% bladder control - Pad free 7/09
PSA 7/09 undetectable, under .0


CharlieTuneA
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 37
   Posted 10/16/2009 6:42 AM (GMT -6)   
Thank you all for your replies. As I said, I've always been a walker, and will continue to do so. I just wanted to know what some of the theory was behind the idea of walking helping the continence process.

I'll now probably try to multitask and consciously combine walking and Kegeling at the same time.

Dribblingly,

Charlie
Age at diagnosis 59, PSA 1.4
Biopsy 12/08 12 cores, 6 positive
Gleason 3+3=6
CAT scan negative.

DaVinci surgery 6/16/09
After 10 days, cystogram revealed fistula
Catheter Removed 7/17/09
Fistula still evident week of 8/24
PSA 0.03
Catheter Reinserted 8/28/09
2nd catheter removed 9/28/09

Continence is a future goal.


MrGimpy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 504
   Posted 10/16/2009 7:27 AM (GMT -6)   
Charlie,

Over doing your Keigel exercises can have a negative effect. More is not always better, follow your Dr's instructions on frequency
Stats:
Age: 52
PSA (2008)=1.9
Biopsy on Jan 09, 2009
One (1) out of twelve (12) cores was positive, plus external nodule found
Gleason Score = 3+3
Surgery (Da Vinci, robotic prostatectomy): 4/7/09
Removed Catheter: 04/19/09
100% bladder control - Pad free 7/09
PSA 7/09 undetectable, under .0


CharlieTuneA
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 37
   Posted 10/16/2009 7:32 AM (GMT -6)   
Thanks, MrGimpy.

I'm getting mixed messages from my uro and his associates. When I asked the doc about Kegels, he said for me the things was to focus on the healing right now and not to get too concerned about Kegels. However, his PA, a very nice fellow but maybe a tad misinformed, recommends the 5-5-5 plan. That is, to do five sets of five Kegels each, five times a day. That's overkill, IMO.

Your advice makes more sense.

-Charlie
Age at diagnosis 59, PSA 1.4
Biopsy 12/08 12 cores, 6 positive
Gleason 3+3=6
CAT scan negative.

DaVinci surgery 6/16/09
After 10 days, cystogram revealed fistula
Catheter Removed 7/17/09
Fistula still evident week of 8/24
PSA 0.03
Catheter Reinserted 8/28/09
2nd catheter removed 9/28/09

Continence is a future goal.


geezer99
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2009
Total Posts : 990
   Posted 10/16/2009 10:32 AM (GMT -6)   
My uro believes in moderate kegels pre-op but thinks that post-op walking is best. He said that if walking did not do the trick, then he would have me in for a training program where they attach electrodes and monitor your contractions to be sure they are doing them right (I didn't need this)

Others have suggested, and I agree that it is easier to completely empty your bladder if you urinate sitting down. For me, starting empty makes holding it easier especially when I am tired
Age at diagnosis 66, PSA 5.5
Biopsy 12/08 12 cores, 8 positive
Gleason 3+4=7
CAT scan, Bone scan 1/09 both negative.

Robotic surgery 03/03/09 Catheter Out 03/08/09
Pathology: Lymph nodes & Seminal vesicles negative
Margins positive, Capsular penetration extensive Gleason 4+3=7
6 weeks: 1 pad/day, 1 pad/night -- mostly dry at night.
10 weeks: no pad at night -- slight leakage day/1 pad.
3 mo. PSA 0.0 - now light pads


jacketch
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2009
Total Posts : 179
   Posted 10/16/2009 10:55 AM (GMT -6)   
James C. said...
Walking is recommended just after surgery to get the body active again, to stimulate the urinary and bowel functions, to eliminate the drugs and such from the body, leftovers from the surgery, etc. Walking after catheter removal- for me- helped build up endurance, provided toning to the legs, groin and the pelvic floor. Walking combined with kegals makes your body and, more importantly your brain, retrain itself to accept , adapt and use the new circumstances of your body. I don't know when walking isn't good for the body, even arthritics benefit from it. In summary, it specifically tones up the thighs and by extension the lower torso and the pelvic floor.

My doc also said it helpes the body to adjust to the rearrangement in parts especially those who had a very large prostate.
 
p.s. I remember the dixie cup guy. He swore by it.
62yo
V10.46 Dx Feb-09
RRP 5-5-09
No adverse SE
PSA 6-19-09 -0-
PSA 9-21-09 -0-
 
Thriving, not just surviving!
 


hb2006
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2008
Total Posts : 299
   Posted 10/16/2009 10:59 AM (GMT -6)   
The thing that I would add, is to avoid coffee, soda, beer, etc for an hour or so before walking. I was always doing moderate kegels while walking and was dry in 6 weeks after surgery.

I also found that the walking would tend me to make me remember the stress points, such as stepping off a curb and so my body would be ready and not leak at that point. I was walking 3+ miles a day at six weeks but I heal very fast.
Age 60, PSA 2007 4.1, PSA 2008 10.0
Diagnosed April 2008, Biopsy: 6 of 12 cores positive, Gleason 4 + 5 = 9
CT and Bone Scan negative, Open surgery at Shawnee Mission Medical Center May 21, 2008
Right side nerves spared, Radical prostatectomy and lymph node dissection
Cather removed on June 3rd, totally dry on July 9th, pT2c, lymph nodes negative
PSA Sept 28, 2008 0.00, PSA Jan 22, 2009 0.00, PSA June 29, 2009 0.00
ED Status- Currently using Trimix, Levitra daily for increased blood flow.
Noctural Erections have completely returned on a nightly basis, same hardness as before.


CharlieTuneA
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 37
   Posted 10/16/2009 11:37 AM (GMT -6)   
Thanks everyone! I might try a modified Dixie Cup method, that is, commando but with my bathrobe on, strictly for a little modesty. Either way, my wife will certainly get a laugh, and she could use one.

-Charlie
Age at diagnosis 59, PSA 1.4
Biopsy 12/08 12 cores, 6 positive
Gleason 3+3=6
CAT scan negative.

DaVinci surgery 6/16/09
After 10 days, cystogram revealed fistula
Catheter Removed 7/17/09
Fistula still evident week of 8/24
PSA 0.03
Catheter Reinserted 8/28/09
2nd catheter removed 9/28/09

Continence is a future goal.


Jstars
Regular Member


Date Joined Oct 2005
Total Posts : 489
   Posted 10/16/2009 3:11 PM (GMT -6)   
Hey I *AM* that dixie cup guy! Actually one of his descendants. But I picked up the idea and 'ran' with it. I used a plastic cup (smooth edge at top) and recycled the old rubber leg bag strap to mostly hold it in place against my left leg and willy just flopped over into the cup. Not perfect but fine if you are on treadmill or jogging in place or walking about the house. (Can even do under a bathrobe if you have kids still about). (Maybe put a tissue in to prevent slosh).

I was doing 10,000+ steps a day for years before surgery and really never stopped doing them after surgery (although a lot less in the days just after -- taking it easy -- but still some).

I also just do jogging in place if not on a treadmill or something -- that might be even better than plain walking (after some recovery time -- don't push it too much) since you get jounced about more causing pelvic muscles to activate on each 'jog'.

One thing about the CUP method was you are not getting all soaked with the pads. Another is you get to see how much you are leaking and when. And another is it is fun to collect your urine in bottles all around the house -- no need to head for the john -- ever, except to empty your containers when they get full. My wife loved that part -- not!

One final thing about the CUP method is you save tons of pads -- and I think it makes you feel better when you are not wasting pads left and right. I know I felt that way.

With fond memories of My Cup ...
Age 58, 195lbs, 6'4", 57 at DX, PSA Aug2008 7 4 ... June2007 4.7 (BPH + LUTS)
Biopsy Nov2008 1 of 12 cores 5%, Gleason 3+3 - Sona showed size 140+ cc (110 grams post op).
02/03/09 open RRP surgery , Nerve sparing both sides, 1 day in hospital, Day 4 first BM,
Pathology Report: All margins clear - No Invasive spread - no change in Gleason score.
02/18/09 Cath out, passed a 1cm oblong STONE within hours.
03/06/09 Started Levitra@20mg / Viagra@100mg / (04/01) Cialis@20mg -- no real effect (thru 10/2009).
04/01/09, 07/07/09, 10/01/09 PSA <0.1 - Stone Was Oxalate stone -- X-ray no stones.
08/09 - started MUSE@1000mcg ... using pump&plump first 10 minutes - good effect.
09/09 500mcg also works .. needing 2 advil 30 min before to suppress the Alpro ache tho.

New Topic Post Reply Printable Version
Forum Information
Currently it is Thursday, June 21, 2018 1:03 AM (GMT -6)
There are a total of 2,973,988 posts in 326,198 threads.
View Active Threads


Who's Online
This forum has 161200 registered members. Please welcome our newest member, tremblayarlena.
286 Guest(s), 2 Registered Member(s) are currently online.  Details
Girlie, Saipan Paradise