Fluid input and output

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English Alf
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 2211
   Posted 10/25/2009 3:13 AM (GMT -6)   

Hello all,

 

I thought a new post was the best way for me to bring up this topic as I have yet to find my way around to know if anything like it has already been covered.

 

Do you know what your fluid input and output is? Because when it comes to my bladder and incontinence I found that the amount I was drinking and when, as well as how much I was urinating and when proved to be very relevant.

 

I guess, like everyone, I was told that it was important to make sure I drank plenty after the operation. It was recommended to drink between 1.5 and 2 litres a day. (I hope everyone can cope with me talking in litres and ml)

So I drank plenty until about six days after the operation when I had to empty my catheter bag at night and noticed that it was nearly full. There was about 750ml in it at 3am despite it having been emptied at 11pm. The first thing that suggested was that my situation pre-op of having to get up in the night to urinate was because my kidneys must produce a lot of urine when I was asleep. The next thing I did was to work out how much I was drinking and it proved to over 3 litres per day, so I thought it might help to drink less and I am sure it did.

 

I was dry at night since the catheter came out, though for the first weeks I wore a pad at night just in case, but one of the most helpful changes was to stop drinking anything after 8pm. I still get woken sometime around 3 or 4 with a full bladder, but that’s just like the old situation and I am thus used to going to the bathroom and getting back to sleep again afterwards.

In the day time I also limit my drinking to regular times and can now be fairly certain that there are clear windows when I know that it has been a while since I have urinated and even longer since I have drunk anything and that I am thus empty so it will be okay to be out of the house for a while. And then when I get back I have something to drink.

 

I have also cut out caffeine, so that’s meant only decaffeinated coffee, no tea and no cola drinks. I didn’t drink much alcohol anyway, and only drank at meal times, but now I drink even less. I drink 3.5% beer instead of 5% and maybe only one bottle a week (330ml/half a pint). I also use very small wine glasses and thus while I drink wine two or three times a week it is not more than 300ml in total. And I eat more fruit to take in liquid in a slower form.

 

about 10 weeks after the operation I was very thorough and measured everything I drank and everything I produced and noted the time as well. I am going to list the details below in case anyone else finds them interesting or helpful.

 

05.15                       300ml urine     

08.30                       150ml urine

08.30                       500ml drink = Juice, milk & Coffee (Breakfast)

09.15                       10ml urine

10.00                       25ml urine

10.30                       250ml drink = Coffee

11.45                       225ml urine     

11.55                       10ml urine

12.30                       50ml urine        

12.30                       250ml drink = Juice at Lunch

14.00                       175ml urine     

16.00                       325ml urine     

16.01                       5ml urine (only occasion I nearly had a leak)

16.05                       250ml drink = Coffee

17.45                       350ml drink = water & small glass of wine with meal

18.30                       100ml urine     

19.00                       250ml drink = Coffee

20.00                       160ml urine     

20.00                       250ml drink = Coffee

21.45                       275ml urine     

22.00                       5ml urine while washing

24.00                       200ml urine     

If I have done the mathematics correctly that was a Total input of 2100ml and Total output of 2015ml

 

I am convinced it is easier to manage my new situation by being careful about what I drink and when. Has anyone else noticed anything similar or been being more careful and regular in this regard?

 

Alfred


Age:     49        5ft 9in. 178lbs

Married 25 years, and I cannot thank my wife enough for her help, support and understanding!!

Family history of Prostate Cancer: None

PSA April 2009: 8.6 (The first time my PSA was measured.)

DRE: negative

Biopsy April 2009: Tumour found in 2 out of 12 cores. Gleason 3+3.

RALP (nerve-sparing) at AVL-NKI Hospital Amsterdam on 29th July 2009

In hospital for ONE night

Partial erections on 1st and 2nd Aug 2009 with catheter still in.

Catheter out on 6th Aug 2009. Dry at night, but wearing pads 24/7

Post-op pathology: Gleason 3+4. Seminal Vesicles invaded, but otherwise negative margins,

Erection 100% & orgasm without help from anything on 15th Aug 2009  

Stopped wearing pads on 21st Sept 2009

Pre-op style intercourse possible on 24th Oct 2009      

No use of tablets, injections, pumps etc. at any time.

 


dogbot
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 147
   Posted 10/25/2009 7:25 AM (GMT -6)   
Hi, looking at the amounts of urine passed I noticed that some were very small, I presume these were leaks and not actually visits to the bathroom. I have measured my amounts of urine passed but not the amounts taken in. The amounts passed vary between 100 ml to about 400 ml and at the upper limit I am bursting to go for a pee. I do not usually drink after about 8 to 9pm. My specialist nurse said that these were good averages for a normal bladder. I do still need to go during the night but it is getting later and later as time goes by, now at approx 6 to 6.30 am. I did not ever go to the bathroom in the  night prior to surgery. All the best from England.

Diagnosed February 2009. Gleason 6, Psa 7.2, 12 core biopsy, and then Mri scan, which showed organ specific.
DaVinci at Addenbrookes, Cambridge, England 18th May 2009.  Nerves removed one side.
Catheter in for 8 days, no pain, no post op problems apart from an infection, cleared with antibiotics.
Some aching around the penis, which still occurs.
6 week psa 0.1, post op pathology all good, confirming pre op tests. Ed a problem, no treatment as yet.
Light ladies pad during the day, just to control a slight dampness and a Tena for  men pad at night for occassional leakage.
Awaiting 3 month consultation at the moment.
Sept 09 - still awaiting consultation. 99% dry during the day, tena pad at night just in case.
Sept 18th 09. PSA less than 0.1
Sept 29th follow up consultation at Addenbrookes. All ok at the moment
Virtually dry at the moment.


English Alf
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 2211
   Posted 10/25/2009 7:33 AM (GMT -6)   
All were indeed visits to the bathroom. I did the measuring after I'd stopped wearing pads, but the small amounts were more like part two of a larger pee. (I am now learning to hang around for a minute or so after I think I've finished to deal with this)
I also find that my bladder is very bad at telling me how full it is. I tend to get the same sensation that I need a pee regardless of how full it actually proves to be when I empty it.
 
Alfred  

Age:     49        5ft 9in. 178lbs

Married 25 years, and I cannot thank my wife enough for her help, support and understanding!!

Family history of Prostate Cancer: None

PSA April 2009: 8.6 (The first time my PSA was measured.)

DRE: negative

Biopsy April 2009: Tumour found in 2 out of 12 cores. Gleason 3+3.

RALP (nerve-sparing) at AVL-NKI Hospital Amsterdam on 29th July 2009

In hospital for ONE night

Partial erections on 1st and 2nd Aug 2009 with catheter still in.

Catheter out on 6th Aug 2009. Dry at night, but wearing pads 24/7

Post-op pathology: Gleason 3+4. Seminal Vesicles invaded, but otherwise negative margins,

Erection 100% & orgasm without help from anything on 15th Aug 2009  

Stopped wearing pads on 21st Sept 2009

Pre-op style intercourse possible on 24th Oct 2009      

No use of tablets, injections, pumps etc. at any time.

 


Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25364
   Posted 10/25/2009 8:23 AM (GMT -6)   
Alfred,

Your "new" bladder will lie to you, until it gets use to things again. I went through that for weeks, couldn't tell by feeling alone, if I had a full bladder, partial bladder, or no need to go at all. Since I didn't want to wet my pants, I would go to the loo much more often, so that I wouldnt have to take a chance. That should straighten out over time. Another factor, your bladder is now positioned differently somewhat after surgery, and the angle of the bladder neck is different, and you have one less set of muscles to control the flow, so it does take time for both you and your body to re-adjust to your new plumbing arrangements.

David in SC
Age: 57, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 7/08 12.3, 9/08 14.5, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 - 7/7 Positive, 40-90% Cancer, Gleason 4+3
Open RP: 11/08, Rht nerves saved, 4 days in hospt, on catheters for 63 days, 5th one out 1/09
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos margin
Post Surgery  PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Latest: 7/9 met 2 rad. oncl, 7/9 cath #6 - blockage, 8/9 2nd corr surgery, 8/9 cath #7 out  38 days, 9/9 - met 3rd rad. oncl., mapped  9/9, 10/1 - 3rd corr. surgery - SP cath/hard dialation, 10/5 - began IMRT SRT - 39 sessions/72 gys.


geezer99
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2009
Total Posts : 990
   Posted 10/25/2009 9:01 AM (GMT -6)   
This is a very good lesson in being proactive in your recovery. Record keeping is definitely a good idea for those who are fighting incontinence. Let me add just one more point -- it is easier to completely empty your bladder if you pee sitting down. I find this especially important at bedtime.
Age at diagnosis 66, PSA 5.5
Biopsy 12/08 12 cores, 8 positive
Gleason 3+4=7
CAT scan, Bone scan 1/09 both negative.

Robotic surgery 03/03/09 Catheter Out 03/08/09
Pathology: Lymph nodes & Seminal vesicles negative
Margins positive, Capsular penetration extensive Gleason 4+3=7
6 weeks: 1 pad/day, 1 pad/night -- mostly dry at night.
10 weeks: no pad at night -- slight leakage day/1 pad.
3 mo. PSA 0.0 - now light pads
6 mo. PSA 0.00 -- 1 light pad/day

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