Heart deaths, suicides linked to prostate cancer diagnosis.

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Worried Guy
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Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 3732
   Posted 2/5/2010 1:42 PM (GMT -6)   
From CNN Health.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/02/02/suicide.heart.deaths/index.html?section=cnn_latest

"Historically, men who get a diagnosis of prostate cancer have been nearly twice as likely to kill themselves and more likely to die of heart-related causes soon after their diagnosis compared with men in the general population, a study has found."..............

....'In the study, researchers at Harvard Medical School analyzed a national database of cancer statistics in which nearly 350,000 men diagnosed with prostate cancer between 1979 and 2004 were followed for a year after receiving their diagnosis."

Well, that's one way to treat it...
Jeff

Fortunately the suicide rate was still very low: 1 on 2300.
I'll bet HW can cut that rate in half. ;-)
DX Age 56. First routine PSA test on April 8, 09: 17.8. Start 2 weeks of Cipro to rule out protatitis. May '09 PSA: 22.6, 3 weeks later: PSA: 23.2.
Biopsy 6/10/09: 7/12 scores positive, 20%-70%, Gleason 6=3+3. Bone and C/T scans neg.
RP DaVinci -7/21/2009 @ Univ of Roch Medical Center
Left nerve gone, right partial spared.
Catheter removed - 7/31/2009 Pathology report received:
Gleason 3+4=7, Tumor size: 2.5 x 1.8 cm, location: both lobes and apex.
Extraprostatic extension present; Perineural invasion: present, extensive.
No Malignancy in Seminal Vesicle, vasa deferentia, lymph nodes 0/13
Prostate mass 56 grams. Pathologic Stage: pT3aN0MX
Post Surgery Status:
Potency - 12/11 5 months, Still no activity, zip. Using pump daily since 11/11. No effect with 20 mg of Cialis or 100 mg of Viagra. Shots, See Uro 1/22/10 Trimix unsuccessful.
Incontinence - 8/20 4 full pads per day
.. 9/7 3-4 full pads per day (Try cutting down on fluids. Bad idea. I know.)
11/14 4 months: Still 3 pads per day. 420ml/day, 91 um leak.
12/11 5 months: Still 3 pads per day. 400-450ml/day
1/11/10 6 months: Still 3 pads but leak is now 320 ml (5 day avg.)
Post Surgery PSA - 9/3 6 weeks - 0.05; 10/13 3 months - 0.04, 1/14 6 months - 0.05.


Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25380
   Posted 2/5/2010 1:52 PM (GMT -6)   
Think you would find similar suicide curves with most other major cancer types, male or female. Definitely one way of not worrying about it spreading, or dealing with life changing side effects. More of the reason we need a good support network, both in real life, as in real persons, and online, like HW here and some of the other good patient to patient care sites out there. I worry about those that don't have a wife or significant other, or other close friends or family to help deal with their PC and other ailments. I am thankful for those in my life and here, of course. It's a big reason why I haven't gone out of my mind yet with all these complications and setbacks.

David in SC
Age: 57, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 7/08 12.3, 9/08 14.5, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 - 7/7 Positive, 40-90% Cancer, Gleason 4+3
Open RP: 11/08, Rht nerves saved, 4 days in hospt, on catheters for 63 days, 5th one out 1/09
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos margin
Incontinence:  1 Month     ED:  Non issue at any point post surgery
Post Surgery  PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12
Latest: 7/9 met 2 rad. oncl, 7/9 cath #6 - blockage, 8/9 2nd corr surgery, 8/9 cath #7 out 38 days, 9/9 - met 3rd rad. oncl., mapped  9/9, 10/1 - 3rd corr. surgery - SP cath/hard dialation, 10/5 - 11/27 IMRT SRT 39 sess/72 gys ,cath #8 33 days, Cath #9 35 days, 12/7 - Cath #10 43 days, 1/10 - Corrective Surgery #4, and Caths #11 and #12 in at the same time


60Michael
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 2222
   Posted 2/5/2010 3:02 PM (GMT -6)   
Well said David. With a support system you might think about it but you are less likely to act on it. But research and statistics have proven over the years that men are more successful at suicide than are women. Some things in life you just dont want to be the best at.
Michael
Dx with PCA 12/08 2 out of 12 cores positive 4.5 psa
59 yo when diagnosed
Robotic surgery 5/09 Atlanta, Ga
Catheter out after 10 days
Gleason upgraded to 3+5, volume less than 10%
Margin slightly involved
2 pads per day, 1 depends but getting better,
8/5 1 depend at night only, now none
 started ED tx 7/17, slow go
Post op dx of neuropathy
3 months psa.01, 6 month psa.4, 6 1/2 month psa.5
Starting IMRT on 1/18/10
Great family and friends
Michael


Worried Guy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 3732
   Posted 2/5/2010 3:20 PM (GMT -6)   
Michael,
I worked on an ambulance (First Medic) for 7 years. 2000+ hrs active. In general, men did it, without telling anyone. Women OD'ed on Tylenol 3, called their friends and said goodbye. They were saved.
Successful or not, either way, it leaves unimaginable heartaches for the family. (And maybe sleepless nights and a nightmare or two for the fire and ambulance crews called in to help.)

Gosh, I actually wrote a post without kidding around...
Jeff

Post Edited (Worried Guy) : 2/5/2010 5:39:12 PM (GMT-7)


tatt2man
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 2842
   Posted 2/5/2010 4:06 PM (GMT -6)   
Jeff - a similar posting was in a magazine in the doctor's waiting room - dealing with prostate cancer - was not a cheery thought to see in print ( before my first visit with the Uro) -
-I only cried, maybe for 5 minutes and then moved on to get things planned/ concluded before the surgery and composed the " I am sorry to tell you this, but I have ... letter. I did a mass mailing to my close friends and family - that got it out of the way, so I could deal with the matters at hand.

I am sorry I only discovered HW after the surgery. It did feel very lonely waiting for the date to arrive, even though I knew thousands of men are affected by this each year.
I felt more stressed out before the diagnosis because I was not sure what was going on in my body.

-and for those lurkers, and others reading this topic - every day of your life you have to choose something - whether it be what you are having for dinner, or coping with your mother-in-law's visit, or coping with and surviving prostate cancer. Some may not want to choose the latter. It may seem too big or scary for them to cope with.

My word of advice is a little phrase I wrote when I was 15 years old after a suicide attempt. At that time, my life was a mess, family fighting, being beat up at school for looking/acting like a homo ( not the 2% milk) and not thinking anything was worth the bother....

"suicide is like a severed hand touching an unopened gift"

Whenever I am down in the dumps and wonder if all this is worth it, I remember my little phrase and count all the things that happened after that eventful day - and usually some memory or thought brings me around and I do ( to coin a popular phrase) count my blessings.

Wishing you peace and contentment, good guidance and love and support on this journey.
hugs
BRONSON
.................
Age: 54 - gay - with spouse, Steve - 59
PSA: 04/2007- 1.68 - 08/2009 - 3.46 - 10/2009 - 3.86
Confirmation of Prostate Cancer: October 16, 2009 - 6 of 12 cancerous samples , Gleason 7 (4+3)
Doctor: Dr. Mohamed Elharram -Urologist / Surgeon - Peterborough Regional Health Centre
Radical Prostatectomy Operation: November 18, 2009 , home - November 21, 2009
Post Surgery Biopsy: pT3a- gleason 7 - extraprostatic extension - perineural invasion - prostate weight - 34.1gm -
ED Prescription: Jan 8/2010 - started daily 5mg cialis
location: Peteborough, Ontario, Canada
............

Post Edited (tatt2man) : 2/5/2010 3:09:26 PM (GMT-7)


Worried Guy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 3732
   Posted 2/5/2010 4:31 PM (GMT -6)   
Oh Bronson,
I'll take and return the hug! You were one bright, perceptive kid.

I suppose people make the choice they think is best for them. Maybe there is embarrassment for something they did or didn't do, or they do not want to become a burden on the family, or they just think it is not worth the effort.
Men seem to make the choice and act with no chance for an out. Women generally leave an out.
Typically it would happen on Sunday nights or the night before a holiday. I worked the 11 PM to 6 AM shift Sunday and Wednesday evenings. After a busy night on another planet, I would go in to the office at 8:00 AM and pretend like nothing happened. I would not tell a soul. Privacy reasons. A different world.

I figure as long as I have life insurance I can never do it. I want my family to collect every penny when I go.
To any newbies or lurkers, this post sounds a little morose but actually I am a pretty upbeat guy.
Stay well
Jeff

soulmate 101
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 57
   Posted 2/5/2010 4:55 PM (GMT -6)   
Bronson you are a poet. Well said. I'll remember that line now, too.

soulmate
Husband, age 57, diagnosed in December 09, after PSA velocity increase from 2.71 to 4.34 over one year prompted a prostate biopsy.
Gleason 4+3 = 7 stage T2c, laparoscopic nerve sparing Da Vinci robotic radical prostatectomy 1/13/10, clear surgical margins no lymph node or seminal vesicle involvement.
Let the healing begin...


goodlife
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2009
Total Posts : 2691
   Posted 2/5/2010 5:02 PM (GMT -6)   
Jeff,

If its only the insurance, after 2 years, it's covered.

Don't know if you saw my post about the dog losing his hed over a piece of tail, but I see it too regularly on this forum, how life is not worth it without sex, wet sex, spontaneous sex.

What are we thinking ?
Goodlife
 
Age 58, PSA 4.47 Biopsy - 2/12 cores , Gleason 4 + 5 = 9
Da Vinci, Cleveland Clinic  4/14/09   Nerves spared, but carved up a little.
0/23 lymph nodes involved  pT3a NO MX
Catheter and 2 stints in ureters for 2 weeks .
Neg Margins, bladder neck negative
Living the Good Life, cancer free  6 week PSA  <.03
3 month PSA <.01 (different lab)
5 month PSA <.03 (undetectable)
6 Month PSA <.01
1 pad a day, no progress on ED.  Trimix injection
No pads, 1/1/10,  9 month PSA < .01


Worried Guy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 3732
   Posted 2/5/2010 6:12 PM (GMT -6)   
Hey Dick,
Thanks for the tip! I thought if I blew my brains out the insurance company would not pay. That is a relief. ;-)

A guy much smarter than me once said "There is nothing so overrated as sex, and nothing so underrated as a good sh__." So true. Of course I'm 57. If you had told me that 25 years ago, I might have argued.

Jeff
I'm thankful to be on the top side of the snow- and want to keep it that way as long as possible.
DX Age 56. First routine PSA test on April 8, 09: 17.8. Start 2 weeks of Cipro to rule out protatitis. May '09 PSA: 22.6, 3 weeks later: PSA: 23.2.
Biopsy 6/10/09: 7/12 scores positive, 20%-70%, Gleason 6=3+3. Bone and C/T scans neg.
RP DaVinci -7/21/2009 @ Univ of Roch Medical Center
Left nerve gone, right partial spared.
Catheter removed - 7/31/2009 Pathology report received:
Gleason 3+4=7, Tumor size: 2.5 x 1.8 cm, location: both lobes and apex.
Extraprostatic extension present; Perineural invasion: present, extensive.
No Malignancy in Seminal Vesicle, vasa deferentia, lymph nodes 0/13
Prostate mass 56 grams. Pathologic Stage: pT3aN0MX
Post Surgery Status:
Potency - 12/11 5 months, Still no activity, zip. Using pump daily since 11/11. No effect with 20 mg of Cialis or 100 mg of Viagra. Shots, See Uro 1/22/10 Trimix unsuccessful.
Incontinence - 8/20 4 full pads per day
.. 9/7 3-4 full pads per day (Try cutting down on fluids. Bad idea. I know.)
11/14 4 months: Still 3 pads per day. 420ml/day, 91 um leak.
12/11 5 months: Still 3 pads per day. 400-450ml/day
1/11/10 6 months: Still 3 pads but leak is now 320 ml (5 day avg.)
Post Surgery PSA - 9/3 6 weeks - 0.05; 10/13 3 months - 0.04, 1/14 6 months - 0.05.


Ralph Alfalfa
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2008
Total Posts : 469
   Posted 2/5/2010 8:29 PM (GMT -6)   
Just remember fellas, suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem.  Things can be worked through, and time will pass.  This may seem selfish, but I'd hate to think what I'd miss by making an early exit.  You only have one trip on this mortal coil, so enjoy it.  Full of cliches tonight, aren't I?
 
Hang in there,
Bob
 
 AGE:58
 Dx: October,27(the day after my birthday)
 Psa 14.5
 Gleason:(4+3) 7 T1c
 Bone scan:Negative
 Cat scan: Negative
 Biopsy: 4 of 12 positive, left side, pre-cancerous on the right.
 Confined to prostate.
 DaVinci Jan. 19th, No lymph node involvement, all margins clear.
 8 week PSa <0.01
 Gleason downgraded to (3+4)7
 6 month Psa , 0.1 
 9 month Psa,  0.2  Doubled! Criminy!
 Started RT 10/28...one year since diagnosis.


English Alf
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 2215
   Posted 2/6/2010 11:00 AM (GMT 0)   
Don't want to add too much to a negative topic, but...


Only men can get PCa so the only people that get this cancer that can ever want to commit suicide are men and men are on the whole more likely to succeed at suicide due to the (violent) methods they choose: guns, hanging, jumping in front of trains or off bridge etc whereas women tend to go for things like pills plus alcohol. (I worked for a railway company for a while and in all my time all the suicides were male)

Acquaintances, school friends, friends of friends, friends of relatives and distant relatives of mine have killed themselves or attempted to do. The men chose hanging shotgun or a train and all succeeded, the women all took overdoses and only one succeeded. (And none of them had cancer)

Suicide has never been an option for me with PCa or at any other time either. And nor have I felt so stressed that I thought my heart would pack in. However...

If in say twenty years time I am being "eaten alive" because the cancer has come back in a big way and spread to places that are making my life unbearably uncomfortable and painful then that may present me with a dilemma.

Meanwhile I am enjoying Saturday. Enjoying it a lot in fact and planning to enjoy watching the International Rugby matches on TV later too.

Life - terrific
don't want to miss tomorrow in case something even more terrific happens.

Alfred

rob2
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 1131
   Posted 2/6/2010 6:25 AM (GMT -6)   
My doctor called me and told me when I was diagnosed with cancer. When I went in for my face to face meeting with him he indicated he calls all patients whether positive or negative. He said he did that because of the impact of the news. He knew one story where a nurse called someone to give the news and the man killed himself soon after. I agree with all the posts above. We all need an outlet to discuss our cancer and options for treatment. I always wanted to just take off running when I was diagnosed but reality set in. I had cancer and running would not help me at all..
 
Age 49
occupation accountant
PSA increased from 2.6 to 3.5 in one year
biopsy march 2008 - cancer present gleason 7
Robotic Surgery May 9, 2008 - houston, tx
Pathology report -gleason 8, clear margins
20 month  PSA <.04 (low as the machine will go)
continent at 10 weeks (no pads!)
ED is still an issue but getting better


60Michael
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 2222
   Posted 2/6/2010 7:55 AM (GMT -6)   
Alfred is right as I think men chose a more vilent method of suicide than do women. But I am sure that other variables are at play, including a lack of support system and our tendency to keep things bottled up. Yes, life is too good to leave early and suicide seems to be somewhat selfish. I always ask people who are thinking about suicide, "who would miss you the most." Hopefully that helps them consider the impact suicide would have on others and helps them get out of being self absorbed.
Michael
Dx with PCA 12/08 2 out of 12 cores positive 4.5 psa
59 yo when diagnosed
Robotic surgery 5/09 Atlanta, Ga
Catheter out after 10 days
Gleason upgraded to 3+5, volume less than 10%
Margin slightly involved
2 pads per day, 1 depends but getting better,
8/5 1 depend at night only, now none
 started ED tx 7/17, slow go
Post op dx of neuropathy
3 months psa.01, 6 month psa.4, 6 1/2 month psa.5
Starting IMRT on 1/18/10
Great family and friends
Michael


English Alf
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 2215
   Posted 2/6/2010 2:41 PM (GMT -6)   
Yeah the support system is a big part of it. (so thanks HW guys and gals)

As for who does and doesn't get support or does and doesn't want support...
They've just published some stats here in Holland that there is an increased likelihood of a man dying of things like a heart attack in the period immediately after his partner dies, whereas there is a decreased likelihood of a woman dying after her husband dies.
suggesting the widowers withdraw into themselves, worry and don't let anyone know how they feel but everyone rallies round to help and support a grieving widow. (My uncle died of a heartattack a few hours after his wife died)

And with regard to doctors giving results/news on the phone I was told at the outset that appointments would always be made for all test results to be given face to face and that nothing would be revealed on the phone.

ie
On the day I left hospital they gave me the date for the appointment to get the post op pathology.
On the day I got the post-op pathology they gave me the dates for the appointment for the 6 and 9 month PSA test results.
(And at 10 weeks they phoned me up to check I was okay and to ask if I wanted to come in to see anyone.)

I wasn't sure about telling people at the start, but a neighbour bumped into me after my biopsy and before the result and in a very happy way asked "How are you?"and I simply couldn't lie to her. She gave me so much positive help that I don't hesitate too much about telling people these days.



Alfred
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