Short stay in the zero club

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Veteran Member

Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 1011
   Posted 3/30/2010 7:54 PM (GMT -6)   
One year PSA is in. I managed to go from .07 to .28 in less than 3 months. Very disappointing. Well it's time to move on to phase II. Will talk to my surgeon tomorrow hopefully, and then make some appointments with medical oncologists. I got a lot of good information from this site, and feel more prepared for the next steps. Thanks all. Any additional words of wisdom would be appreciated.
Dx with PC Dec 2008, PSA 3.4, Biopsy: T1c, Geason 7

Robotic Surgery March 2009 Hartford Hospital
Pathology Report: T2c, Geason 8, organ confined, negitive margins, lymph nodes negitive
nerves spared, no negitive side effects of surgery

One night in hospital, back to work in 3 weeks

psa Junl 09 <.01
psa Oct 09 <.01
psa Jan 10 .07 re-test one week later .05

Elite Member

Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25355
   Posted 3/30/2010 7:58 PM (GMT -6)   
BB, sorry to hear this news. Yes, good time to speak to a medical and radiation oncologist. There has been a bunch of us in the past 3-4 months that have needed salvage radiation. so there is plenty of varying experience in dealing with it. If you are at .28, good time to plan to deal with it before it climbs much higher. Good luck and please stay connected to us.

David in SC
Age: 57, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 7/08 12.3, 9/08 14.5, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 - 7/7 Positive, 40-90% Cancer, Gleason 4+3
Open RP: 11/08, Rht nerves saved, 4 days in hospt, on catheters for 63 days, 5th one out 1/09
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos margin
Incontinence:  1 Month     ED:  Non issue at any point post surgery, no problem post SRT
Post Surgery  PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12
Latest: 7/9 met 2 rad. oncl, 7/9 cath #6 - blockage, 8/9 2nd corr surgery, 8/9 cath #7 out 38 days, 9/9 - met 3rd rad. oncl., mapped  9/9, 10/1 - 3rd corr. surgery - SP cath/hard dialation, 10/5 - 11/27 IMRT SRT 39 sess/72 gys ,cath #8 33 days, Cath #9 35 days, 12/7 - Cath #10 43 days, 1/19 - Corr Surgery #4,  Caths #11 and #12  same time, 2/8-Cath #11 out - 21 days, 3/2- Cath #12 out - 41 days, 3/2- Corr Surgery #5, 3/6 Cath #13 out - 4 days, Cath #14 out - 27 days, Cath #15 - 3/29

Veteran Member

Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 2832
   Posted 3/30/2010 8:00 PM (GMT -6)   
BB - sorry to hear the change in stats - but you seem to have a good foothold on what is needed next - and what to ask the docs
- wishing you all the best and a return to the zero club.
Age: 54 - gay - with common-law spouse of 13 years, Steve - 59
PSA: 04/2007- 1.68 - 08/2009 - 3.46 - 10/2009 - 3.86
Confirmation of Prostate Cancer: October 16, 2009 - 6 of 12 cancerous samples , Gleason 7 (4+3)
Doctor: Dr. Mohamed Elharram -Urologist / Surgeon - Peterborough Regional Health Centre
Radical Prostatectomy Operation: November 18, 2009 , home - November 21, 2009
Post Surgery Biopsy: pT3a- gleason 7 - extraprostatic extension - perineural invasion - prostate weight - 34.1gm -
ED Prescription: Jan 8/2010 - started daily 5mg cialis - girth back to normal -but not much length - will go for trimix in April when I see doc
Incontinence: Feb 2010- 3-5 pads/1-2 clothes changes/day- March 3, 2010 - week 14 after surgery -finally seeing improvement - March 29- incontinence better - 1-2 pads a day - one pad at night
location: Peteborough, Ontario, Canada
Post Surgery-PSA: to be announced - April 8, 2010

Regular Member

Date Joined Dec 2009
Total Posts : 214
   Posted 3/30/2010 10:00 PM (GMT -6)   


Sorry to hear your bad news.  You are heading down the right path now.

Waiting for you to return to the zero club!!

Please let us know how you progress.


Age:  63 
Biopsy: May 09 showed 2 of 12 cores positive for prostate cancer -- 1 at 5% and 1 at 25%.  Cancer indicated as non aggressive.  Gleason Score: 3+3.
RRP on Oct 23/09 in London, Ontario.  Excellent surgeon. 
7 Weeks Post Op -  The fears I had about bad things about the operation and recovery did not materialise except of course ED!!.  Otherwise, everything went very smoothly.  Incontinence not a problem.  Wear a pad when out just in case. Pain was never a problem.
Pathology:  Unremarkable 
First followup PSA and Visit: Feb 11/10 - 0.0.
Next PSA May
Next doctor's visit in 6 months      

Veteran Member

Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 1015
   Posted 3/30/2010 10:16 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi BB,

I am hopeful that the nerve sparing procedure left behind the suspect tissue and that any remaining PCa is highly localized for a successful treatment.

'Wishing you the very best in your plans for getting back on track!

Surgery: Da Vinci; July 31, 2007; 54 on surgery day;
Pathology: PSA: 4.3; Gleason: 3+3=6; T2a; Confined to Prostate;
Post RP PSAs: 09/07 <0.04; 12/07 <0.04; 03/08 <0.04;
06/08 <0.04; 12/08 <0.04; 06/09 =0.06; 09/09 <0.04;
Latest PSA 12/09 =0.05

Veteran Member

Date Joined Oct 2006
Total Posts : 1210
   Posted 3/30/2010 11:08 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi BB,
Sorry to read about the increased PSA. I was in a similar situation about 18 month ago and had the SRT. For me it was not such a big deal. Had some anal discomfort and a bit of rectal bleeding, but all petty much cleared up 6 month after completion of the SRT. If I was you, I wouldn't wait much longer. I understand that SRT is most effective when started soon after a recurrence is confirmed. Hope all goes well with you.
All the best.

Born Sept 1936
PSA 7.9
-ve DRE
Gleason's Score 3+4=7, 2 of 8 positive
Open RP 28 Nov 06 (nerve sparing), Post op staging T3a
Gleasons still 3+4=7
Seminal vesicles and lymph nodes clear
Catheter out 15 Dec 06, Dry since 11 Feb 07
All PSA tests in 2007 (4) <.04
PSA tests in 2008: Mar.=.04; Jun.=.05; Sept.=.08; 3 days before Rad Start=0.1
Salvage RT completed (33 sessions - 66 Grays) on the 19th Dec., 08.
PSA in Jan., 09=0.05; July 09=<0.04; JAN 10=<0.04

Regular Member

Date Joined Mar 2007
Total Posts : 426
   Posted 3/30/2010 11:44 PM (GMT -6)   
Sorry to hear about your increase in PSA and moving out of the zero club...    Same thing happened to me and I finished my SRT about 2 1/2 weeks ago.   I had 32 treatments at 2 gys each for a total of 64 gys.
I had little side effects and treatments were a snap for me.   I am just waiting for another month or two to take a PSA and see where I am at.
As David mentioned,  there have been a bunch of us going thru SRT after a rise in PSA...   Feel free to ask any questioned you want.
Praying that we all get back into the "zero" club!
After 3-4 years of annual PSA 4-6, biopsy recommended
3/13/2007 - 12 point biopsy - Left 0/6  Right 1/6 Gleason 3+3 T1c
4/24/2007 - DaVinci performed at Virginia Mason hospital in Seattle
5/2/2007 - Catheter Out! Final pathology of Gleason 6  T2c Nx Mx, approx 20% of prostate involved, positive margin, but only at 2 focal points.  
6/28/2007 9 weeks incontinance... Overnite, went from 4-6 soaked pads a day from prev 8 weeks to 2 barely wet pads a day.
7/12/2007 11 weeks post-op  Minimal leakage...  one small pad a day
7/18/2007 First Post-Op PSA...  0.01 !!! 
9/10/2007 Pad free and ED at 75% with 100mg Viagra generic
6/26/2008 2nd Post-OP PSA at 14 months...  0.02 
12/2/2008 3rd Post-OP PSA at 20 months...   0.03
10/30/2009 4th Post-OP PSA at 31 months...   0.13 (moved and diff lab)
11/3/2009 Retest at my original lab...  0.11  (followup with Doc sched 11/10)
11/10/2009 Discussion indicated biochemical reccurrence and need for salvage radiation treatment. 
1/21/2010 Another PSA test at 34 months...  0.14
1/26/2010 IMRT Salvage Radiation Treatment started
                  32 sessions for 64 gys total.
3/12/2010 Finished 32 sessions...  No side effects to date except a little
tiredness.  Slight changes in bowel movements the last week...   Would feel like I did not empty completely and get a little blood once in a while.  Also maybe aggrivated by a little constipation caused by cholesterol medicine simvastatin that I started in November and when I do not drink enough water. No change in frequency for bowel or unination though which was a blessing thru the whole process.

English Alf
Veteran Member

Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 2209
   Posted 3/31/2010 3:43 AM (GMT -6)   
Sorry you've left the club (I never even made it, I'm due RT any day now)

I was wondering how old you are as your age isn't in your profile. You don't have to reveal, but There have been a lot of posts lately about BCR and RT and choices etc and I think a person's age is a factor in how you reach a decision about what to do when PSA starts to rise after surgery.
Being only 48 at dx and 49 at BCR means I am now looking for treatments that may help give me more years and have to accept that the side-effects are the price to pay.


Veteran Member

Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 1011
   Posted 3/31/2010 6:26 AM (GMT -6)   
Thanks for kind words and support. I will seek several, perhaps 3 opinions on futher treatment. However, I was thinking because of my high gleason and quick recurrence chances that cancer is still local are slim. I will post my progress. Probably will have questions along the way. BTW Alf, I am 57. In what way should my age affect my future treatment.
Dx with PC Dec 2008, PSA 3.4, Biopsy: T1c, Geason 7

Robotic Surgery March 2009 Hartford Hospital
Pathology Report: T2c, Geason 8, organ confined, negitive margins, lymph nodes negitive
nerves spared, no negitive side effects of surgery

One night in hospital, back to work in 3 weeks

psa Junl 09 <.01
psa Oct 09 <.01
psa Jan 10 .07 re-test one week later .05

James C.
Veteran Member

Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4462
   Posted 3/31/2010 6:41 AM (GMT -6)   
Really sorry to hear your news. Hopefully this is just a small scrap left over and the next treatment will wipe it out.
James C. Age 63
Gonna Make Myself A Better Man
4/07: PSA 7.6, Recheck after 4 weeks Cipro-6.7
7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% invloved, left lobe, GS3+3=6
9/07: Nerve Sparing open RRP, 110gms, Path Report- Stg. pT2c, 10 gms., margins clear
32 Months: PSA's .04 each test since surgery, ED continues: Bimix- .3ml PRN, Trimix- .15ml PRN

Cajun Jeff
Veteran Member

Date Joined Mar 2009
Total Posts : 4069
   Posted 3/31/2010 6:48 AM (GMT -6)   
darn: I hate seeing news like this. There have been a bunch in the last 3 or so month in your situation. Let us know what your consults revel. Hope that this is just a bump in the road.

Good luck with step II.

Cajun Jeff
9/08 PSA 5.4 referred to Urologist
9/08 Biopsy: GS 3+4=7 1 positive core in 12 1 pre cancer core
10/08 Nerve-Sparing open radical
Surgery Path Report Downgrade 3+3=6 GS Stage pT2c margins clear

3 month: PSA <0.1
6 month: PSA <0.1
10 month:PSA <0.1
1 year: PSA <0.1
16 month:PSA <0.1

ED - Started Cialis at 3 months, tried all 3, 6 months added pump, 9 months Tried MUSE (YUCK) Bad experience.
1 year mark Found new Urologist visit was at 14th month post surgery
Started Injections, Caverject! (Success)
17 month: ED making improvements : Oral Meds gets me 85%

Veteran Member

Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 2210
   Posted 3/31/2010 7:42 AM (GMT -6)   
I was in the same boat and as someone said there have been a number of us recently that had SRT. Sounds like it was caught early so now is a good time to get the rest of it. good luck and keep us posted.
Dx with PCA 12/08 2 out of 12 cores positive 4.5 psa
59 yo when diagnosed, 61 yo 2010
Robotic surgery 5/09 Atlanta, Ga
Catheter out after 10 days
Gleason upgraded to 3+5, volume less than 10%
2 pads per day, 1 depends but getting better,
 started ED tx 7/17, slow go
Post op dx of neuropathy
T2C left lateral and left posterior margins involved
3 months psa.01, 6 month psa.4, 6 1/2 month psa.5
Starting IMRT on 1/18/10, Completed 39 tx at 72 gys on 3/12/10
Great family and friends

Regular Member

Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 364
   Posted 3/31/2010 8:39 AM (GMT -6)   
BB:  As suggested earlier it is a good idea to start SRT ASAP before your PSA goes above .50, the cure rate has been documented to be much better at that PSA or lower.  It takes a while to get set up for SRT so here is a suggestion:  Go ahead and get a lupron shot, that will stop the cancer in its tracks for the time being and allow you time to preopare for SRT.  My guess is your Doc. will reccommend that since your dealing with a Gleason 8.  I had the almost exact same stats as you, I received a lupron shot when my PSA reached .28 and then waited for 2 months to begin SRT, the theroy being the lupron would weaken the cancer over that period of time and make the SRT that much more productive.  I'll continue on the HT for possibly 2 years. 
Good luck and move at a good pace if possible.
 54 y.o.
 Diagnosed 4/10/08
 DRE Normal
 Biopsy- 12 cores, 4 positive highest 4+4=8
 Bone scan, CT scan and Chest X-ray clear 4/16/08
 Urologist suggested surgery 4/16/08
 MRI on 4/24/08 clear no suggestion of lymph node   involvement.
 4/24/08 -Started on Lupron and Casodex preparing for HDRT and IMRT in late July.  This treatment will not preclude me from surgery if I change my mind.
Decide to have DaVinci surgery after another consult with surgeon.
6/19/08- DaVinci surgery at University of Washington.
6/25/08- Path report, clear margins, no noted extension
9/12/08- PSA <0.02 
12/05/08-PSA <0.02 Six months after surgery 
3/02/09-PSA <0.02 Nine months after surgery
5/02/09-PSA .10
8/17/09-PSA .21 Begin HT and set up for SRT to begin in 2 months.

English Alf
Veteran Member

Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 2209
   Posted 3/31/2010 9:14 AM (GMT -6)   
(read with caution)
The age issue for me is about the big issue I am in fact slightly reluctant to mention
ie When might I die?
It's an issue I think about occasionally. I choose to think about it deliberately almost to make sure I have had a good think and then I can forget about it for a while so as not to brood about it.

I can't not choose a treatment without investigating it a bit (lot) to find out if it's going to make me live longer as it's a lot to go throguh if it's going to make no difference or just a small diference.
If it's going to make a big diference then that's fine.

And in the way that an old man with PCa may choose to opt for AS an older man with a BCR may choose to do no more. as the differnece it will make in terms of the number of years may be irrelevant.

But me aged 49 and you aged 57 sound like men who should obviuosly chose to do something that will give us more years.

Age at Dx 48 No Family history of Prostate Cancer
Married 25 years, and I cannot thank my wife enough for her support.
April 2009: PSA 8.6 DRE: negative. Tumour in 2 out of 12 cores. Gleason 3+3.
RALP (nerve-sparing) at AVL-NKI Hospital Amsterdam on 29th July 2009. Stay 1 night.
Partial erections on while catheter still in. Catheter out on 6th Aug 2009.
Dry at night after catheter came out
Post-op Gleason 3+4. Tumour mainly in left near neck of bladder.
Left Seminal Vesicle invaded, (=T3b!)
no perineraul invasion, no vascular invasion. clear margins,
Erection 100% on 15th Aug 2009, but lots of leaking
Stopped wearing pads on 21st Sept 2009
Pre-op style intercourse on 24th Oct 2009 !! No use of tablets, jabs, VED etc.
Nov 17th 2009 PSA = 0.1
Mar 17th 2010 PSA = 0.4!!! referred to radiation therapist

Regular Member

Date Joined Nov 2009
Total Posts : 485
   Posted 3/31/2010 12:10 PM (GMT -6)   
BB,  I'm sorry to hear the bad news.  Please keep us posted.  I can add a little insight to Alfred's comment about age.   My wife and I are both in our 70's and most of our health care decisions are based on quality of life issues more so than length of life.  With my shorter life expectancy, my issues may well be different than yours and Alf's.  And then, they might not.

Diagnosed 2/2008 at age 71, Gleason score 5+3=8, stage T1c, PSA 9.1. 
Robotic surgery 5/2008, nerves spared, All margins, SV and lymph nodes negative. 
Staged pT2c, Gleason score 5+3=8.  PSA <0.1 at 20 months, Jan. 4, 2010.

Veteran Member

Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 1011
   Posted 3/31/2010 4:56 PM (GMT -6)   
Thanks everyone. Your comments are helpful. Did contact my surgeon today. He wants to get one more PSA, ultra-sensitive this time. At least we will do it right away. I will let you know how I make out.
Dx with PC Dec 2008, PSA 3.4, Biopsy: T1c, Geason 7

Robotic Surgery March 2009 Hartford Hospital
Pathology Report: T2c, Geason 8, organ confined, negitive margins, lymph nodes negitive
nerves spared, no negitive side effects of surgery

One night in hospital, back to work in 3 weeks

psa Junl 09 <.01
psa Oct 09 <.01
psa Jan 10 .07 re-test one week later .05

gold horse
Regular Member

Date Joined Nov 2009
Total Posts : 360
   Posted 3/31/2010 6:04 PM (GMT -6)   
BB it is always a bad news when one of our brother leave the zero club;just keep the faith.
PSA 6/05=0.04,0.04,0.04,6/06,0.04,0.04,0.04,6/07,0.04,0.04,0.04,6/08,0.04,0.04,1/09

Ralph Alfalfa
Regular Member

Date Joined Nov 2008
Total Posts : 469
   Posted 3/31/2010 7:08 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi, BB. I was in the same boat last fall. Had a Psa doubling time of 3 months. Started RT in late October and finished 12/22. Psa results 3 months post RT came back at 0.1, so it was cut in half. Doc told me it could rise some, or it could go down further,(fine by me). Had no major side-effects other than some bowel irritation, and would get dog-tired in the late afternoon, but a nap helps that. Just fortunate that I got to do the 39 treatments during the bad weather so I'd be pretty much be good to go by Spring. Will have follow up Psa in June and go from there. Played 18 holes of golf today with the sons and son-in-law and came in second, losing by 8 to my oldest son who can hit it a ton. Fatigue is pretty much history and the bowel situation cleared itself up by the end of RT. All in all, not a bad experience, but I think the worst part of it was having to make the drive back and forth everyday. But time passes quickly, and it's over before you know it. Good luck to you if this is the route you take. There are few mulligans with this disease. Do well.

 Dx: October,27(the day after my birthday)
 Psa 14.5
 Gleason:(4+3) 7 T1c
 Bone scan:Negative
 Cat scan: Negative
 Biopsy: 4 of 12 positive, left side, pre-cancerous on the right.
 Confined to prostate.
 DaVinci Jan. 19th, No lymph node involvement, all margins clear.
 8 week PSa <0.01
 Gleason downgraded to (3+4)7
 6 month Psa , 0.1 
 9 month Psa,  0.2  Doubled! Criminy!
 Started RT 10/ year since diagnosis.  RT over 12/22.
 3 month post RT Psa 0.1.

Regular Member

Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 91
   Posted 3/31/2010 7:13 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi BB - sorry to hear about your PSA reading. Here's to hoping it's a fluke and that the re-test will put you back in the zero club!
Dx: in 6/2005 at age 49
PSA tests 3/2005: 3.8 ng/ml, 4/2005: 4.1 ng/ml, Stage: T1c
TRUS biopsy: 2 out of 10 cores positive, Gleason 6 (3+3), bone scan: neg.
daVinci Robotic Prostatectomy 8/2/2005
Post-surgical Path report: upgraded to Gleason 7 (3+4), pT2c, NX, MX.
neg. surgical margins, neg. seminal vesicles, neg. vasa deferentia
Perineural invasion: present
prostate capsule: tumor focally invaded into, but not beyond prostatic capsule.
Post-surgery PSA tests, all <0.1 ng/ml for about 4 yrs.
Then on 7/23/2009: 0.1, 10/16/2009: 0.2, retested 10/23/2009: 0.1, 1/22/2010: 0.2.
Switched to more sensitive test on 2/5/2010: 0.14 ng/ml.

Regular Member

Date Joined Mar 2009
Total Posts : 260
   Posted 4/1/2010 9:03 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi BB,
Sorry to hear the bad news. Here's hoping you'll beat this thing and return to the Zero club very soon.

Age 70, First ever PSA 7.8 taken June 2008, Biopsy July 2008, 10 of 12 cores positive, Gleason 3+3=6
da Vinci surgery December 10, 2008, catheter removed December 29 2008
St. Lukes Hospital, Bethlehem, Pa.
Dr. Frank Tamarkin
Prostate weight 73.0 grams, Gleason 3+3=6, stage pT3a
Tumor locations: right anterior apex, right posterior apex to mid
left anterior mid to base, left posterior apex to mid
extensive perineural invasion in right anterior apex, right and left posterior apex to mid
seminal vesicles negative
Five PSA tests undetectable, latest Feb 5 (Whew!)

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