The book: CANCER-Step Outside the Box.

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JB71
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2009
Total Posts : 206
   Posted 4/25/2010 12:59 PM (GMT -6)   
A friend of a friend passed this book for me to read. Cancer-Step Outside the Box is in it's forth Edition, written by a Ty Bollinger.
 
He quotes hundreds of 'doctors/scientists' from dozens of books and appears to be not very happy with the pharmaceutical companies.
 
I'm in the mids of chapter 4 and starting to have serious doubts about starting my radiation in two weeks.
 
If I'm reading it right, the radiation is going to kill me later, if not sooner.
 
Have any of my 'bros' here, read this book and what are your thoughts?
 
Jerry.
.
Age, only 71.
July 2009, PSA 9.1, free ratio 0.16
September GLEASON 4+4=8, T2A
Prostate 44cc.
Calcium: 2.46  (range: 2.20 - 2.65 mmol/L)
25 Hydroxy Vitamin D: 102 (range: sufficiency:
76 - 250 nmol/L)
Bone Scan: Negative
CT Scan scheduled for Dec. 1st. Negative.
Started Casodex 50mg. on Nov. 6, first pill of 30.
Got Lupron 22.5mg ( 90 day ) on  November 19.
No real side effects as of Dec. 15 except dry skin and hair but getting quite 'porky' in the belt area even though now I go to the gym, three times a week. Also I dont have a need to shave anymore so now I can save my 'shaving' allowance and direct it to my stash of Depends !
 
Christmas Day got my first hot flashes. Thanks Santa!
 
Open surgery done on Jan. 20th. by Dr. J. Chin at London's University Hospital.
 
Cath removel scheduled for Feb. 8th. Yes, I know,
that will be 19 days. Dr. is out of country until then.
====================================
Pathology Report:
 
Gleason Score: cannot be determined due to hormone therapy effects. ???????
Extraprostatic Extension:
present, left radial, multifocal
present, left basal, multifocal
Resection Margins:
Apical: involved by invasive carcinoma, multifocal
Bladder Neck: involved by invasive carcinoma, unifocal on left side.Other: non-tumoural prostatic present at resection margin.
Perineural Invasion: present.
Seminal Vesicle Invasion: absent
Lymphovascular Invasion: absent
Lymph Node Status: no malignancy in regional lymph nodes
Additional path. findings:
high grade prostatic intraepithelial neoplasia
 
Pathology Stage: yp T3a NO MX
==================================
Radialogist appointment was on Friday Feb. 26 with Dr. Glenn Bauman in London.
Got another Lupron 90 day shot today and he wants to start IMRT soon. CT Scan plus measure scheduled in about 3 weeks. ( march 15)
 
First PSA test since surgery on March 18th.
with the results of <0.03 !!!
 
Started a Facebook page for bikers with prostate issues at:
 
IMRT to start on May 10.
 
.


Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25380
   Posted 4/25/2010 2:42 PM (GMT -6)   
Jerry, what did chapter 4 say about radiation?
Age: 57, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 7/08 12.3, 9/08 14.5, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 - 7/7 Positive, 40-90% Cancer, Gleason 4+3
Open RP: 11/08, Rht nerves saved, 4 days in hospt, on catheters for 63 days, 5th one out 1/09
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos margin
Incontinence:  1 Month     ED:  Non issue at any point post surgery, no problem post SRT
Post Surgery  PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12, 4/8 .04, next one:  July
Latest: 7/9 met 2 rad. oncl, 7/9 cath #6 - blockage, 8/9 2nd corr surgery, 8/9 cath #7 out 38 days, 9/9 - met 3rd rad. oncl., mapped  9/9, 10/1 - 3rd corr. surgery - SP cath/hard dialation, 10/5 - 11/27 IMRT SRT 39 sess/72 gys ,cath #8 33 days, Cath #9 35 days, 12/7 - Cath #10 43 days, 1/19 - Corr Surgery #4,  Caths #11 and #12  same time, 2/8-Cath #11 out - 21 days, 3/2- Cath #12 out - 41 days, 3/2- Corr Surgery #5, 3/6 Cath #13 out - 4 days, Cath #14- 27 days, Cath #15 - 26 days, Cath #16 - 4/23 put in


James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4462
   Posted 4/25/2010 2:47 PM (GMT -6)   
Well, without seeing the book, I say that any book that makes one doubt their planned treatment plan is most likely a scare mongering one, and is selling it's own agenda, which most likely is gonna be a herbal or homeopathic one. I wouldn't reconsider my plans after reading 4 chapters in a book, especially one that is written by a layman, who quotes and seems to have an ax to grind with the established medical procedures and suppliers. Just my opinion, not having read the book, but reading between the lines to what you have written... Sounds like someone who is selling something outside the conventional medical practices arena.
James C. Age 63
Gonna Make Myself A Better Man www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6cX61oNsRQ&feature=channel
4/07: PSA 7.6, Recheck after 4 weeks Cipro-6.7
7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% invloved, left lobe, GS3+3=6
9/07: Nerve Sparing open RRP, 110gms, Path Report- Stg. pT2c, 10 gms., margins clear
32 Months: PSA's .04 each test since surgery, ED continues: Bimix- .3ml PRN, Trimix- .15ml PRN


Sunbird
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 140
   Posted 4/25/2010 3:05 PM (GMT -6)   
I read a statistic that said external radiation for prostate cancer will result in a secondary cancer occurence of 1 in 70 men due to radiation exposure of this treatment sometime within the following 10 years...........
1996, Age 48, Stage III Colon Ca, Colon Resection followed by 18 chemo treatments.
 
2000, Colon Ca Metastasis to upper left lung lobe.  Lung lobe surgically removed.  24 chemo treatments scheduled.  Took 1, declined the rest.
 
9/08 PSA is 2.8, 12/08 PSA is 4.56??  Chalk it up to prostatitis due to urinary retention after Nissen Fundo Surgery.  VA docs prescribe 30 days of Septra.  Prostate feels normal.  PSA hovers around 4.1.  VA docs want prostate biopsy but can't seem to get me into the schedule.  Continue through Spring and Fall of 2009 thinking I have prostatitis.  Bacteria cultures are always neg.  PSA drops to 3.1 10/09.
 
12/09 Prostate Biopsy performed
3 of 10 cores positive, 5%, 25%, & 35%, 3 + 3= Gleason Six with perineural invasion.
 
Doc wants CT Scan due to prior Colon Ca. Findings: "The seminal vesicles are irregular & there is nodularity in the periprostatic fat such that local extension cannot be excluded.  Shotty lymph nodes in both groin measuring 2.3 cm."
 
Doc wants Endo-rectal MRI (OUCH!) Findings: Mild central zone BPH, no discrete focus of carcinoma is identified, no evidience of invasion into the periprostatic fat or seminal vesicles.  Normal size iliac chain lymph nodes.
 
2/08/10 Open RP surgery.  Findings: Gleason Six upgraded to Seven.  3 + 4, Stage pT2c, Bilateral w/perineural invasion, No pos lymph nodes,  margins uninvolved, no extraprostatic extension, no seminal vesicle extension,  39 grams, blood loss 1200 ml (didn't want a transfusion & didn't get one) nerve bundles spared bilaterally.  current age-61


Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25380
   Posted 4/25/2010 3:37 PM (GMT -6)   
So then, my PC dx came 9 years after a bout of heavy radiation treatments for a different type of cancer, can I assume there is a connection based on that statement?
Age: 57, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 7/08 12.3, 9/08 14.5, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 - 7/7 Positive, 40-90% Cancer, Gleason 4+3
Open RP: 11/08, Rht nerves saved, 4 days in hospt, on catheters for 63 days, 5th one out 1/09
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos margin
Incontinence:  1 Month     ED:  Non issue at any point post surgery, no problem post SRT
Post Surgery  PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12, 4/8 .04, next one:  July
Latest: 7/9 met 2 rad. oncl, 7/9 cath #6 - blockage, 8/9 2nd corr surgery, 8/9 cath #7 out 38 days, 9/9 - met 3rd rad. oncl., mapped  9/9, 10/1 - 3rd corr. surgery - SP cath/hard dialation, 10/5 - 11/27 IMRT SRT 39 sess/72 gys ,cath #8 33 days, Cath #9 35 days, 12/7 - Cath #10 43 days, 1/19 - Corr Surgery #4,  Caths #11 and #12  same time, 2/8-Cath #11 out - 21 days, 3/2- Cath #12 out - 41 days, 3/2- Corr Surgery #5, 3/6 Cath #13 out - 4 days, Cath #14- 27 days, Cath #15 - 26 days, Cath #16 - 4/23 put in


Sunbird
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 140
   Posted 4/25/2010 3:47 PM (GMT -6)   
Hard to say. They were referring to bladder and rectal cancers due to the close proximity of the area targeted to these organs.
1996, Age 48, Stage III Colon Ca, Colon Resection followed by 18 chemo treatments.
 
2000, Colon Ca Metastasis to upper left lung lobe.  Lung lobe surgically removed.  24 chemo treatments scheduled.  Took 1, declined the rest.
 
9/08 PSA is 2.8, 12/08 PSA is 4.56??  Chalk it up to prostatitis due to urinary retention after Nissen Fundo Surgery.  VA docs prescribe 30 days of Septra.  Prostate feels normal.  PSA hovers around 4.1.  VA docs want prostate biopsy but can't seem to get me into the schedule.  Continue through Spring and Fall of 2009 thinking I have prostatitis.  Bacteria cultures are always neg.  PSA drops to 3.1 10/09.
 
12/09 Prostate Biopsy performed
3 of 10 cores positive, 5%, 25%, & 35%, 3 + 3= Gleason Six with perineural invasion.
 
Doc wants CT Scan due to prior Colon Ca. Findings: "The seminal vesicles are irregular & there is nodularity in the periprostatic fat such that local extension cannot be excluded.  Shotty lymph nodes in both groin measuring 2.3 cm."
 
Doc wants Endo-rectal MRI (OUCH!) Findings: Mild central zone BPH, no discrete focus of carcinoma is identified, no evidience of invasion into the periprostatic fat or seminal vesicles.  Normal size iliac chain lymph nodes.
 
2/08/10 Open RP surgery.  Findings: Gleason Six upgraded to Seven.  3 + 4, Stage pT2c, Bilateral w/perineural invasion, No pos lymph nodes,  margins uninvolved, no extraprostatic extension, no seminal vesicle extension,  39 grams, blood loss 1200 ml (didn't want a transfusion & didn't get one) nerve bundles spared bilaterally.  current age-61


Tudpock18
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Sep 2008
Total Posts : 4156
   Posted 4/25/2010 4:10 PM (GMT -6)   

Sunbird...how about posting a link to this "statistic"?  "I read a statistic..." is not particularly credible unless the reader gets a chance to vet the source.

Tudpock


Age 62, Gleason 3 + 4 = 7, T1C, PSA 4.2, 2 of 16 cores cancerous, 27cc
Brachytherapy December 9, 2008.  73 Iodine-125 seeds.  Procedure went great, catheter out before I went home, only minor discomfort.  Regular activities resumed, everything continues to function normally as of 4/10/10.  6 month PSA 1.4 and now 1 year PSA at 1.0.  My docs are "delighted"!

60Michael
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 2222
   Posted 4/25/2010 5:05 PM (GMT -6)   
My oncologist told me the cancer would likely kill me long before the radiation would kill me. But it would be nice to read some well documented research on the subject.
Michael
Dx with PCA 12/08 2 out of 12 cores positive 4.5 psa
59 yo when diagnosed, 61 yo 2010
Robotic surgery 5/09 Atlanta, Ga
Catheter out after 10 days
Gleason upgraded to 3+5, volume less than 10%
2 pads per day, 1 depends but getting better,
 started ED tx 7/17, slow go
Post op dx of neuropathy
T2C left lateral and left posterior margins involved
3 months psa.01, 6 month psa.4, 6 1/2 month psa.5
Starting IMRT on 1/18/10, Completed 39 tx at 72 gys on 3/12/10
Great family and friends
Michael


Sunbird
Regular Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 140
   Posted 4/25/2010 5:17 PM (GMT -6)   
google...linkinghub.elsevier secondary cancer after radiotherapy for prostate cancer....but I was in error....it states "surviving MORE than ten years will develop secondary cancer........
1996, Age 48, Stage III Colon Ca, Colon Resection followed by 18 chemo treatments.
 
2000, Colon Ca Metastasis to upper left lung lobe.  Lung lobe surgically removed.  24 chemo treatments scheduled.  Took 1, declined the rest.
 
9/08 PSA is 2.8, 12/08 PSA is 4.56??  Chalk it up to prostatitis due to urinary retention after Nissen Fundo Surgery.  VA docs prescribe 30 days of Septra.  Prostate feels normal.  PSA hovers around 4.1.  VA docs want prostate biopsy but can't seem to get me into the schedule.  Continue through Spring and Fall of 2009 thinking I have prostatitis.  Bacteria cultures are always neg.  PSA drops to 3.1 10/09.
 
12/09 Prostate Biopsy performed
3 of 10 cores positive, 5%, 25%, & 35%, 3 + 3= Gleason Six with perineural invasion.
 
Doc wants CT Scan due to prior Colon Ca. Findings: "The seminal vesicles are irregular & there is nodularity in the periprostatic fat such that local extension cannot be excluded.  Shotty lymph nodes in both groin measuring 2.3 cm."
 
Doc wants Endo-rectal MRI (OUCH!) Findings: Mild central zone BPH, no discrete focus of carcinoma is identified, no evidience of invasion into the periprostatic fat or seminal vesicles.  Normal size iliac chain lymph nodes.
 
2/08/10 Open RP surgery.  Findings: Gleason Six upgraded to Seven.  3 + 4, Stage pT2c, Bilateral w/perineural invasion, No pos lymph nodes,  margins uninvolved, no extraprostatic extension, no seminal vesicle extension,  39 grams, blood loss 1200 ml (didn't want a transfusion & didn't get one) nerve bundles spared bilaterally.  current age-61


JB71
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2009
Total Posts : 206
   Posted 4/25/2010 5:39 PM (GMT -6)   
No, No. This book is not selling anything for their own advantage. There are NO links to anything from which it can make a PROFIT, unlike the PHARMO Companies that are listed and why are there no law suits from those companies, including the cancer centres that are being accused of putting out phony information ?

Are these pharmo company's ONLY in business to make money for their investors or are they really trying to help you and me ?

I'm starting to have some serious doubts !!!
.

Post Edited (JB71) : 4/25/2010 5:42:13 PM (GMT-6)


Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25380
   Posted 4/25/2010 6:25 PM (GMT -6)   
So, Jerry, share some of what you are reading that is spooking you so bad on your radiation?
Age: 57, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 7/08 12.3, 9/08 14.5, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 - 7/7 Positive, 40-90% Cancer, Gleason 4+3
Open RP: 11/08, Rht nerves saved, 4 days in hospt, on catheters for 63 days, 5th one out 1/09
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos margin
Incontinence:  1 Month     ED:  Non issue at any point post surgery, no problem post SRT
Post Surgery  PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12, 4/8 .04, next one:  July
Latest: 7/9 met 2 rad. oncl, 7/9 cath #6 - blockage, 8/9 2nd corr surgery, 8/9 cath #7 out 38 days, 9/9 - met 3rd rad. oncl., mapped  9/9, 10/1 - 3rd corr. surgery - SP cath/hard dialation, 10/5 - 11/27 IMRT SRT 39 sess/72 gys ,cath #8 33 days, Cath #9 35 days, 12/7 - Cath #10 43 days, 1/19 - Corr Surgery #4,  Caths #11 and #12  same time, 2/8-Cath #11 out - 21 days, 3/2- Cath #12 out - 41 days, 3/2- Corr Surgery #5, 3/6 Cath #13 out - 4 days, Cath #14- 27 days, Cath #15 - 26 days, Cath #16 - 4/23 put in


JB71
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2009
Total Posts : 206
   Posted 4/25/2010 7:30 PM (GMT -6)   
Purgatory:

First, thanks for the response but allow me to get back to my first post on this topic, which is asking for input from posters on our forum who have read or at least, in part, the above tittled book.

As I have mentioned, I'm reading chapter 4 out of a 430 page book. To tell you the truth, I dont know if I can finished it. SO MANY CONTROVERSARIES !!

But said that, why not take some time out and Google the book's description ?

Many doctors are mentioned and I have Googled their names and, sure enough, the bio's seem to be accurate.

When in this book, the Memorial Sloan-Kettering Center is accused of providing phony results from a breast cancer study, it gets buried. No one was cured but the results were posted as: YES, Successfull. And there are so many more, just like this one.

There are just so many references in this book that, as I mentioned earlier, makes me question the wishdom of going on to radiation.

I'm NOT selling this book but if you like, go to:
www.CancerTruth.net

I have learned and continue to learn from all your contributions.

Jerry in Canada.
.

Post Edited (JB71) : 4/26/2010 6:50:41 AM (GMT-6)


142
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 6949
   Posted 4/25/2010 7:50 PM (GMT -6)   
I had a look at that site, and I must say Too Much Hype.

I have a friend who is a licensed homeopathic doctor in Europe - even he was not against my plans for treatment. At least he knows the scope of what he can do.

Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25380
   Posted 4/25/2010 7:55 PM (GMT -6)   
Jerry, I don't think anyone is going to ban you from this site, you are obviously upset at something you read, I was only asking you because I care that you are so upset. That's why I asking if there was anything in particular that you read that upset you so much. There is always a cancer risk, however remote, from radiation. That even includes X-Rays like chest X-rays, etc. When I had my neck/throat radiation 10 years back, they told me that each zap was equal to 40 Chest X-rays at that time, multiply that times the 35 plus that I had, and that was a lot of radiation. Now, I have added 72 gys from the prostate cancer salvage radiation.

What ever fears or new information you have gleaned from this book, I think you should share with your radiation oncologist first most, and see how much of that can be abated right from the start.

I am not telling you should or shouldn't procede, that is your choice alone. Trust me, with all the issues I have with radiation, and post radiation even 5 months later, I have had my share of second doubts. I told my uro a month ago, that I wished to God that I had never had the salvage radiation, because it has really done a number on my insides.

Perhaps other who have read the book, can share their opinion with you on what they read and thought of it. I was just trying to help you, sorry if it upset you more, wasn't my intentions.

David in SC

________________________________________________

P.S>  I brought it up on Amazon and from the guy's own web site, I read all 17 pages that were available for free to read and the forward and table of contents.  What I saw, was a combiniation of conspiracy theories  (something I have a strong dislike for), home cures, the same tired dietary and supplement issues that get battled back and forth by experts from both sides without any positive conclusions, and then when they were advocating "silver", that was the first sign of kookiness to the mix.  It reminds me of all the people that got excited about the book "The DaVinci Code", and how clever author Brown knitted all these seemingly historic facts to prove one of the greatest conspiracy theories of all time, trouble was, they didn't all knit together in history the way he said, and more importantly, and many readers failed to grasp, it was a work of fiction, not even remotely true.

The author of your book seems to have a definite wire up his bum about the regular medical industry in general, he fails to acknowledge how many lives are saved every year through surgery, radiation treatments, chemo, and even HT.  We all know its not a perfect world of cure, but it works for many.

 


Age: 57, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 7/08 12.3, 9/08 14.5, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 - 7/7 Positive, 40-90% Cancer, Gleason 4+3
Open RP: 11/08, Rht nerves saved, 4 days in hospt, on catheters for 63 days, 5th one out 1/09
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos margin
Incontinence:  1 Month     ED:  Non issue at any point post surgery, no problem post SRT
Post Surgery  PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12, 4/8 .04, next one:  July
Latest: 7/9 met 2 rad. oncl, 7/9 cath #6 - blockage, 8/9 2nd corr surgery, 8/9 cath #7 out 38 days, 9/9 - met 3rd rad. oncl., mapped  9/9, 10/1 - 3rd corr. surgery - SP cath/hard dialation, 10/5 - 11/27 IMRT SRT 39 sess/72 gys ,cath #8 33 days, Cath #9 35 days, 12/7 - Cath #10 43 days, 1/19 - Corr Surgery #4,  Caths #11 and #12  same time, 2/8-Cath #11 out - 21 days, 3/2- Cath #12 out - 41 days, 3/2- Corr Surgery #5, 3/6 Cath #13 out - 4 days, Cath #14- 27 days, Cath #15 - 26 days, Cath #16 - 4/23 put in

Post Edited (Purgatory) : 4/25/2010 8:08:00 PM (GMT-6)


goodlife
Veteran Member


Date Joined May 2009
Total Posts : 2691
   Posted 4/25/2010 8:17 PM (GMT -6)   
Did you read the fine print at the bottom of the site, advising he is not a doctor, and that his $30 book should not be substituted for medical treatment ?

30,000 books at $30 plus S & H charges amounts to a pretty nice amount of pocket change.

On the other hand, none of us have been guaranteed cures. It is all a calculated risk for us. The surgery offers a 90 % statistical chance. The radiation offers a 25 to 30 % chance of cure after the surgery fails. There is a 1 1/2 % chance of radiation tumors.

Do doctors make mistakes ? Of course, that is why we repeatedly advise multiple opnions on this site. Is medical science perfect. Of course not. Is the natural remedy "science' perfect. Absolutely not. Which science spends billions and billions on research, testing, drug trials, etc.. not natural remedies.

We all have to do what we feel is best. For me, I had complete confidence in the US medical practices. If someone thinks that eating peach pits, or drinking some concoction, or putting a salve on a cancer is what they should do, then I say do it. It is just a matter of statistics. What are the odds that we are part of a big conspiracy ?

I am cancer free after a year. Sure wish I would have eaten peach pits instead.

Really Jerry, you need to think about what you are being told, and what you are saying. It really doesn't make sense.
Goodlife
 
Age 58, PSA 4.47 Biopsy - 2/12 cores , Gleason 4 + 5 = 9
Da Vinci, Cleveland Clinic  4/14/09   Nerves spared, but carved up a little.
0/23 lymph nodes involved  pT3a NO MX
Catheter and 2 stints in ureters for 2 weeks .
Neg Margins, bladder neck negative
Living the Good Life, cancer free  6 week PSA  <.03
3 month PSA <.01 (different lab)
5 month PSA <.03 (undetectable)
6 Month PSA <.01
1 pad a day, no progress on ED.  Trimix injection
No pads, 1/1/10,  9 month PSA < .01
1 year psa (364 days) .01


JB71
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2009
Total Posts : 206
   Posted 4/25/2010 8:21 PM (GMT -6)   
Thank You David.
I know I can sleep better tonight, knowing I have many friends on here who are concerned about my situation and are here to give support. There is just SO much info out there that in a 100 year life time we can not consume even parts of it, let alone the spam/carbage/crap that could be our final cure. open minds, at least in my case, are needed right now and that is why I'm going to read the rest of this book over the next couple of days.

What do I do with the info gathered from it? I dont know just yet but surely it can not be all bullcrap? Or is it all just: FREEDOME OF SPEECH ? ( A bunch of lies in cloak & dagger?)
.
.


skeener
Regular Member


Date Joined Dec 2009
Total Posts : 214
   Posted 4/25/2010 8:28 PM (GMT -6)   

Jerry

Just spent half an hour browsing your link and other links on the page.

 

I'm with David all the way on this site.

 

When I read testimonials that say "You saved my life" and "I am completely cancer free", I have to be wary.  Even our most sensitive PSA tests do not guarantee that we are cancer free.

 

The most important information on this website is the notice on the bottom which states:

 

I am not a doctor. The information contained on this website and in the book is for educational purposes only. It is not intended as a substitute for the diagnosis, treatment, or advice of a qualified licensed professional. The facts presented on this website and in the book are offered as information only, not medical advice, and in no way should anyone consider that I am practicing medicine.  A conscious effort has been made to only present information that is both accurate and truthful. However, I assume no responsibility for inaccuracies in my source materials, nor do I assume responsibility for how this material is used. Any statements regarding alternative treatments for cancer have not been evaluated by the FDA.

 

Jerry, please do not make any PCa treatment decisions based on this book.

 

Skeener

 


Age:  63 
Biopsy: May 09 showed 2 of 12 cores positive for prostate cancer -- 1 at 5% and 1 at 25%.  Cancer indicated as non aggressive.  Gleason Score: 3+3.
RRP on Oct 23/09 in London, Ontario.  Excellent surgeon. 
7 Weeks Post Op -  The fears I had about bad things about the operation and recovery did not materialise except of course ED!!.  Otherwise, everything went very smoothly.  Incontinence not a problem.  Wear a pad when out just in case. Pain was never a problem.
Pathology:  Unremarkable 
First followup PSA and Visit: Feb 11/10 - 0.0.
 
Next PSA May
Next doctor's visit in 6 months      


Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25380
   Posted 4/25/2010 8:56 PM (GMT -6)   
Jerry:

You are a very real friend to me, I know we have never met in person, and probably won't get the pleasure, and you have many other fine brothers and sisters here that are dear to you too. Not trying to get mushy on you. I care, we care, and I sensed a deep seriousness to you being so upset.

I am sure there are many "truths" in the book", and probably a lot of "half truths" or "truths" taken out of context. Even though finance/acccounting is my main profession ,spent a lot of time with business and contract law, so I am always looking at motivatin in how things are worded. Not so much a cynic, as a realist.

You have done well with your PC journey so far, you are much older than me and you have done great. I didnt want to do SRT either, you know that, but I also knew, that it was my last curative possibilty, and I knew the odds were lessened with my case, but at 57, I couldn't pass up on that curative hope. It looks like it working now, no guaranty it will stay that way for me, because of what they say about PSA velocity pre- and post-treatments, but I went for it knowing that it would screw me up in other ways, the current situation is proof of the pudding.

Talk any reservations or fears to your doctor(s) first, then to you family and closet friends, finish your book, but discount it from your final thoughts and decision process. Modern medical treatments and procedures is why you are in as good a shape as you are right now in my opinion, and I would weigh heavily upon that, my friend. Either way, you will always have my support and respect.

Bless you brother, let the voice of reason steer your course ahead.  Remember what is preached by most here:  knowledge abates fear, knowledge is power.

David in SC

And Goodlife and others, thanks for helping Jerry through this.


Age: 57, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 7/08 12.3, 9/08 14.5, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 - 7/7 Positive, 40-90% Cancer, Gleason 4+3
Open RP: 11/08, Rht nerves saved, 4 days in hospt, on catheters for 63 days, 5th one out 1/09
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos margin
Incontinence:  1 Month     ED:  Non issue at any point post surgery, no problem post SRT
Post Surgery  PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12, 4/8 .04, next one:  July
Latest: 7/9 met 2 rad. oncl, 7/9 cath #6 - blockage, 8/9 2nd corr surgery, 8/9 cath #7 out 38 days, 9/9 - met 3rd rad. oncl., mapped  9/9, 10/1 - 3rd corr. surgery - SP cath/hard dialation, 10/5 - 11/27 IMRT SRT 39 sess/72 gys ,cath #8 33 days, Cath #9 35 days, 12/7 - Cath #10 43 days, 1/19 - Corr Surgery #4,  Caths #11 and #12  same time, 2/8-Cath #11 out - 21 days, 3/2- Cath #12 out - 41 days, 3/2- Corr Surgery #5, 3/6 Cath #13 out - 4 days, Cath #14- 27 days, Cath #15 - 26 days, Cath #16 - 4/23 put in

Post Edited (Purgatory) : 4/25/2010 9:00:42 PM (GMT-6)


JoeyG
Regular Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 162
   Posted 4/26/2010 6:59 AM (GMT -6)   
Statistics can be very very deceiving.  I bet those who get treatments, other than radiation also have a 1 in 70 cancer of getting a second cancer. That's less than a 1.5% chance and I think that percentage may apply to ANYONE who gets one cancer and lives long enough to possibly get another one. Its not impossible and, while it doesn't happen often, its certainly not rare.
Age -57; Diagnosed 10/05 PSA 13.4 GS 7 (4+3) Organ confined (T2B)
Cryoablation 4/06 Allegheny Hosp-Dr Ralph Miller (Cohen/Miller)
Post Cryo Nadir 8/06 0.2
Rising steadily to 0.7 4/09 :-(
Steady at 0.7 (7/09)
Doubled to 1.5 (2/10) YUCH!
Hoping to qualify for salvage cryo or radiation


John T
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2008
Total Posts : 4227
   Posted 4/26/2010 10:16 AM (GMT -6)   
Guys,
I've read thousands of posts by patients on PC sites that talk of all sorts of complications and side affects from treatments. Never once have I run into a post from someone who has had a secondary cancer from radiation treatments. Your chance of developing a reoccurrance or another unrelated type of cancer or a heart attack is far greater than any secondary cancer from treatments. Let's worry about the things that are most likely to occur and not worry about things that rarely happen. You are more likely to die on the operating table from surgical complications than from secondary cancers. Both conditions are so rare and are not even worth considering when making a decision.
JT

64 years old.

PSA rising for 10 years to 40, free psa 10-15. Had 5 urologists, 12 biopsies and MRIS all neg. Doctors DXed BPH and continue to get biopsies yearly. 13th biopsy positive in 10-08, 2 cores of 25, G6 less than 5%. Scheduled for surgery as recommended by Urological Oncologist.

2nd Opinion from Dr Sholtz, a Prostate Oncologist, said DX wrong, pathology shows indolant cancer, but psa history indicates large cancer or metastasis. Futher tests and Color Doppler confirmed large transition zone tumor that 13 biopsies and MRIS missed. G7, 4+3, approx 16mmX18mm.

Combidex MRI in Holland eliminated lymphnode mets. Casodex and Proscar reduced psa to 0.6 and prostate from 60mm to 32mm. Changed diet, no meat and dairy. All staging tests indicate that tumor is local and non agressive. (PAP, PCA3, MRIS, Color Doppler, Combidex, tumor reaction to diet and Casodex, and tumor location in transition zone). Surgery a poor option because tumor is located next to the urethea and positive margin is very likely; permanent incontenance is also high probability with surgery.

Seed implants on 5-19-09, 3 hours door to door, no pain, minor side affects are frequency and urgency; very controlable with Flowmax and lasted 4 weeks. Daily activities resumed day after implants with no restrictions. Gold markers implanted with seeds to guide IMRT.

25 treatments of IMRT 6 weeks after seed implants. No side affects at all.

PSA at end of treatment 0.02 mostly the result of Casodex. When I stop Casodex next week expect PSA to rise. Next PSA in November. Treatments and side affects have greatly exceeded my expectations. Glad to have this 11 year journey finally conclude.

JohnT


JB71
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2009
Total Posts : 206
   Posted 4/26/2010 6:01 PM (GMT -6)   
Well guys, I'm still reading but have to admit that some of the suggested treatments are rather wacky.

I was somewhat interested in learning more about the Vitamin B-17 but after spending a couple of hours on the Google thingy decided that it was a bunch of crap.

The downside is that I wont be going to Mexico now.(LOL)


Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25380
   Posted 4/26/2010 6:32 PM (GMT -6)   
Good deal, Jerry. Was kind of hoping if you continued reading, the quirky and weird side would stand out in your mind, and it looks like it did. People dealing with cancer can be easily exploited through fear, it can be very effective with some people.

That's a good reason why we look out for one another here.

David in SC
Age: 57, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 7/08 12.3, 9/08 14.5, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 - 7/7 Positive, 40-90% Cancer, Gleason 4+3
Open RP: 11/08, Rht nerves saved, 4 days in hospt, on catheters for 63 days, 5th one out 1/09
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos margin
Incontinence:  1 Month     ED:  Non issue at any point post surgery, no problem post SRT
Post Surgery  PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12, 4/8 .04, next one:  July
Latest: 7/9 met 2 rad. oncl, 7/9 cath #6 - blockage, 8/9 2nd corr surgery, 8/9 cath #7 out 38 days, 9/9 - met 3rd rad. oncl., mapped  9/9, 10/1 - 3rd corr. surgery - SP cath/hard dialation, 10/5 - 11/27 IMRT SRT 39 sess/72 gys ,cath #8 33 days, Cath #9 35 days, 12/7 - Cath #10 43 days, 1/19 - Corr Surgery #4,  Caths #11 and #12  same time, 2/8-Cath #11 out - 21 days, 3/2- Cath #12 out - 41 days, 3/2- Corr Surgery #5, 3/6 Cath #13 out - 4 days, Cath #14- 27 days, Cath #15 - 26 days, Cath #16 - 4/23 put in

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