ED drug choices

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laxacharlie
New Member


Date Joined Apr 2010
Total Posts : 16
   Posted 5/4/2010 10:25 AM (GMT -6)   
Now that RARP surgery is done (3/12) one of my next steps is to address ED issues. My uro prescribes Cialis and has suggested using the pump for a time. My question: I was in Argentina with a friend last winter. He regularily buys and uses a generic of Viagra. It is very inexpensive (a fraction of the cost of Cialis or Viagra) and readily available over the counter in Argentina. I am curious if anyone has used generics for Cialis, Viagra of any other drug while going through ED therapy after prostatectomy? Thanks!

Burlcodad
Regular Member


Date Joined Nov 2009
Total Posts : 254
   Posted 5/4/2010 10:47 AM (GMT -6)   
im using generic viagra ("manly')from alldaychemist.com   they have specials where pre shipping cost is about 58 cents per pill
 
many guys here use that site
Diagnosed 9/09 at age 54  
PSA 6/09 1.3 
Stage 2b (biopsy done because of firmness felt on right side) 3 positive cores out of 12 (all less than 25%) Gleason 6
 
Surgery  1/13/10 at UP- Penn Presbyterian - Dr David Lee. Home 1/14/10 Nerves spared on both sides -Catheter removed 1/19/10  Path report scheduled for 2/11/10
 
Post OP Pathology Report Gleason score was upgraded to 7 (3+4)
no capsular involvement, seminal vesicles clear, lymph nodes clear, negative margins, gland involvement 2-10%
 
Since report was good and recovery going well next appt is now  the first psa test appt scheduled for 4/22
 
POST OP PSA   4/10 <0.1,
 
Incontinence - Initial 6 pads a day, 3 Weeks - 3 pads a day relatively dry at night , 3 Months mostly dry 0-1 pad per day
 
ED - yes but seeing some improvements - levitra 10 mg 2x week 3 months  100 mg almost daily
 
 
 


Gleason7
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2010
Total Posts : 111
   Posted 5/4/2010 10:49 AM (GMT -6)   
www.northdrugmart.com
Equivalent of Viagra called SILAGRA. I have over a years supply PLUS @ .25 MG/ DAY for $238.00. Been using it for a couple of months now and the effects are identical. The lab is in India and it's shipped here from Germany. I would bet they offer a substitute for Cialis as well.

Arnie
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 372
   Posted 5/4/2010 12:06 PM (GMT -6)   
Hey Lax..........ditto here on "Manly" from Alldaychemist
Easy ordering online via credit card, and shipment and,  at least on the east coast, was only 9  days from order to doorstep (Two separate orders)...........so check it out and order the appropraite quantity for your needs. Many guys have used/ordered it w/o problwms...........and, it works for me!
 
Arnie in DE
Age 56 (biopsy & surgery)
PSA at Diagnosis-3.9
Biposy 8/19/08--4 of 12 cores positive; 5% involvement, Gleason 6 (3+3)
 
Surgery 1/26/09-DaVinci Robotic Prostatectomy at Presbyterian Medical Center/HUP-Phila, PA
Dr. David Lee
 
Pathology Report- Adenocarcinoma, no capsular involvement, seminal vesicles clear, lymph nodes clear, negative margins, Gleason 7 (3+4), Stage T2C, NO MX, Prostate 61.8 grams, gland involvement 2-10%
 
Catheter removed after 8 days, totally dry at 3 months. ED issues continue, Viagra (via ADC) nightly (100mgs), VED use in earnest at 6 months. "Ball Park Frank" plumping at this point......ED at 10 months continues to improve, albeit slowly. Continued daily use of 100mg Viagra (ADC). Discontinued pump use; manual stimulation to varying states of erections; achieved penetratable erection on a couple of occasions----At 13 months, nocturnal erections are frequent. Still taking 100mg of ADC Viagra nightly. Libido still in the dumper, but working on it with doctors.
3 month PSA--<0.1
6 month PSA--<0.1
10 month PSA--<0.1
13 monthPSA--<0.1


TheOldFart
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2010
Total Posts : 34
   Posted 5/4/2010 4:52 PM (GMT -6)   
I don't have PC, but I have used Viagra, as well as Silagra, Caverta and Manly from ADC. I bought 1 order of Manly and 2 orders of Silagra. The Manly is relatively weak - less than 1/2 the strength of Viagra, while the Silagra works exactly the same as Viagra. 1/4 of a Silagra or Viagra is stronger than 1/2 of a Manly. Caverta takes longer to take effect, but lasts about 12 hours. It must be slow release. My favorites are Viagra and Silagra.

compiler
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2009
Total Posts : 7203
   Posted 5/4/2010 5:50 PM (GMT -6)   

I started with generic Viagra from all-day-chemists. I had some problems (that were probably not due to the viagra, but not sure) so I switched to generic levitra from the same place.

No problems. Not sure that it is doing anything. I take 1/2 pill (10 mg) for blood flow/healing.

 

Mel


63 years old . PSA-- 3/08--2.90; 8/09--4.01; 11/09--4.19 (Free PSA 24%),  after 45 days on cipro! DREs have always been normal. PCA-3 was about 75 (way above the 35 threshold). That led to:

Biopsy on 11/30/09. 5 out of 12 cores positive. Gleason 4+3. 2 cores were 3+3 (one 5% and the other 30%) on one side. On  other side:2 cores are 4+3 (5%)--1 core 3+4 (30%) no peri-neural invasion. prostate is 45 grams. Stage: T1C.  

Surgery with Dr. Menon at Ford Hospital, 1/26/10. He says all looked good. Spared nerves. Unfortunately: Pathology Report: G 4+3 (65%-35%). Cancer in 15% of gland. Lymph Nodes: Clear.  Perineural Invasion: yes. Seminal Vessical Involvement: No.  Extraprostatic Extension: yes.  Positive Margin: Yes-- focal-- 1 spot .5mm. Final Weight is 52.7 gms.  (Second opinion from Jon Epstein at Hopkins confirmed these results)

 Incontinence: joined that club-- definite leaks—1 pad/day. Night is dry, was  using 1 pad at night for security, but pretty much dispensed with that most nights. Update: no pads at night. No pads while at home, but still very uncomfortable. Use 1 pad for out-of-house activities. Suddenly got MUCH better on 3/10/10, almost overnight. Still some urgency but no pads about 90% of the time.  As of 3/12/10--completely continent! Uh...OH. As of about 3/16/10 problems with constant urgency although no pads needed--feels like an infection but none showing in urine.

First post-op PSA on 3/10/10--DRUM ROLL: 0.01 Next PSA in mid-June.


Postop
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2010
Total Posts : 385
   Posted 5/4/2010 6:53 PM (GMT -6)   
I use Silagra (a Viagra generic) from India, purchased on line from Jandrugs. For the first 6 months tried brand name Cialis 20 mg, then the generic version, taladafil. Neither worked as well for me. With Silagra 100 mg, things work as well as before surgery. Have to take it on an empty stomach, lasts about 12 to 18 hours, but peak effect is at about 1-2 hours.

MrGimpy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 504
   Posted 5/5/2010 4:02 AM (GMT -6)   
I also had mixed results with Manly. I can feel the difference with real Viagra or generic Silagra. With either Viagra or Silagra I can feel the stuff nose side effect soon after taking as well as more of a usaable erection

As most things in life the cheaper brand gets you cheaper results, buy 100 get 100 free means you still get 100 dosages you just have to take 200 mg to get the effects of 100mg of the ones costing more
Stats:
Age: 52, PSA (2008)=1.9
Biopsy on 01/09/09, Gleason Score = 3+3
One (1) out of twelve (12) cores was positive, plus external nodule found
Surgery (Da Vinci, robotic prostatectomy): 4/7/09
Post Op Path 3+3
Removed Catheter: 04/19/09
100% bladder control - Pad free 7/09
PSA 7/09 undetectable, <0.01 - 3 months post-op
PSA 1/10 undetectable, <0.01 - 9 months post-op
Trimix provides 100% erectile function


In This Together Wife
Regular Member


Date Joined Dec 2009
Total Posts : 135
   Posted 5/5/2010 7:38 AM (GMT -6)   
I thought the Sildenafil was the generic for the Viagra.  Is this the "manly"? and Silagra the generic for Viagra?  Also, I see at alldaychemist the generic Cialis taladafil is not for the US--is that true at the other pharmacys?  We are still trying to see what's best for us.
Thanks!!
CareBear
(Bear's stats) Age 49
 8-4-09    Family Practioner for back pain  PSA 4.9
8-20-09  Consult with urologist                PSA 4.89
9-2-09    Biopsy          3 cores positive 7% 3+3 (6) gleason
11-13-09 DaVinci
11-23-09 Cath removed  Path report cancer contained neg. margins
 2-22-10  PSA 0.01 !!!


TheOldFart
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2010
Total Posts : 34
   Posted 5/5/2010 8:14 AM (GMT -6)   
Manly, Silagra, Caverta and others are made in India and are generic forms of Viagra. They are not really legal in the US because they violate the US patent that Phizer holds for Viagra. They are legal to be produced in India because of India's different patent laws. For me, Silagra is the only one of the 3 that is identical to Viagra in how it works for me. Manly is weak and Caverta seems to be slow release. However, my new Medicare drug plan makes Viagra less expensive than Silagra, so I doubt I will order it again unless the plan changes.

The generic form of Cialis cannot be exported to the US because the patent for Cialis is stronger than the patent for Viagra and Levitra. It is legal to ship generic Viagra and Levitra from India to the US, but it is not for generic Cialis. It is not legal on this end to buy them, but customs turns their heads to the fact most of the time. Since they are not controlled substances like narcotic drugs, I don't think that customs wants to be bothered.

engineer55
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2009
Total Posts : 121
   Posted 5/5/2010 10:17 AM (GMT -6)   
I like generic levitra, viagra also works but seem to get more side effects, cialis did not do much and is too expensive
Dx'ed 5/08 one core 2%  out of 12  3+3 gleason
DREs all negative
PSA was in the 3-4 range then jumped to 7
I have the enlarged prostate, on the order of 100cc.  After taking Avodart for 3 months  my
PSA was cut in half.
I did Active S for a year but concluded that I didn't want a life
of biopsies and Uro meetings.
DaVinci on 6/24/09  UCI Med Center  Dr Ahlering, long surgery based on size and location
Final was 5% one side all clear, but had a huge 90 grm prostate
Now we work on pee control, ok at night but sitting is a big problem.


keepingon
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2008
Total Posts : 30
   Posted 5/5/2010 11:38 AM (GMT -6)   
They gave me a generic for Viagra, It did not work. Neither does Viagra. I'am T4n1
Found out Jan. 07
g\8
psa 116
The doc said chemo or radiation was not an option.
Started Lupron to shrink it before surgery, did not work.
Radical prostentechomy Sept. 5.
Couldn't get it all, it was outside the sack and into lower lymph nodes.
Cathader removed about 3 months.
Incontinont for about 3 months
Peranial rectal absesses w/ drains for about 4 months <MRSA>
Continued Lupron until Oct. 08 <psa.04 to .06>.
Started losing weight. <194 to 170>
Now trying Zoladex, next shot in Dec. 18, then we will see what the PSA is, before deciding on future treatments.
Now in the T4 N1 stage.
Side effects:
Lupron=memory, tired all the time, joints and muscle aches, hot flashes.
Zoladex=memory, tired after doing something, left back rib cage is tender when inhaling, all joints and muscles below the waist ache, the worst is the left hip.
Went to the doc's today 12-18-08, stopped Zoladex today waitin on blood work to come back.
Blood work came back .07. now back on Zoladex for three months then we will see what happens.
PSA came back .08, back on the Zoladex, see what happens in three more months.
Zoladex quit working., Now back on Lupron.
Had a  tumer removed from back hip, the hips feel good now.
Psa still rising.3-2-10
Still on Lupron.
The last doctors visit, he said He was suprised to see how well I'am doin. He also told me he had second  thoughts of doin the surgery, because he thought I was too far gone, But I will show em.


laxacharlie
New Member


Date Joined Apr 2010
Total Posts : 16
   Posted 5/5/2010 1:39 PM (GMT -6)   
CareBear-
Great PSA score! I will get my initial reading on June7. I believe that Sildenafil is the generic for the Viagra. One can purchase a product called "Magnus" in Argentina and label indicates it is Sildenafil. I have a close friend who uses it often with great results. I am not convinced that the adage "you get what you pay for" applies to generics. A Viagra pill which is Sildenafil should not be any more effective than a "Magnus" pill which is Sildenafil. The difference is the patent protection, which leads to increased cost. These pills are very inexpensive in Argentina. I suppose each of us must try different drugs to find out which is most effective.

TheOldFart
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2010
Total Posts : 34
   Posted 5/5/2010 2:20 PM (GMT -6)   
If it is sildenafil citrate and the correct strength then it should be the same as brand name Viagra. However, there is nothing that guarantees that any uncontrolled generic is the proper formula or the proper strength. If there is no government agency or other controlling organization controlling the manufacture of the drug, then there is no guarantee that if is what it says it is. One example is Manly. Manly at the advertised strength does not work the same as the more expensive Viagra generics. Manly costs about 1/4 of what Silagra or Caverta cost, but is less than 1/2 the strength of Silagra or Caverta. Even though Caverta seems to be the correct strength, it takes longer to work and the effects last longer than Viagra or Silagra for me. So in the instance of these generics, my opinion is that you get what you pay for. Silagra and Caverta are produced by known drug companies that are approved sources of various generic drugs. If the company that produces Magnus is a legitimate generic drug company then it is more likely that it is the proper drug and the proper strength. However, Manly is produced by a real generic drug company and is obviously not the proper strength, although it works the same as Viagra for me if I take 2 to 4 times the advertised dose that I normally need for Viagra. You do get what you pay for sometimes.

Casey59
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 3172
   Posted 5/5/2010 5:41 PM (GMT -6)   
TheOldFart said...
... my opinion is that you get what you pay for...
Definitely not my opinion.  I cannot tell the difference between Cialis and the generic version I use, Ceebis.  I don't recall the price difference...I think it's greater than 10X.

TheOldFart
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2010
Total Posts : 34
   Posted 5/5/2010 6:20 PM (GMT -6)   
Wow Casey59, you are an expert at taking something out of context. You must be a politician. :) My entire statement was "So in the instance of these generics, my opinion is that you get what you pay for.' If you read what I said, I was comparing the 50 cent and weak Manly to the 2 dollar Silagra and Caverta. I was not comparing Silagra to Viagra or your generic Cialis to the brand Cialis. I still stand by my statement and it is completely true from my experience with those generics. I also cannot tell the difference between the 2 dollar Silagra and the 16 dollar Viagra, which I also stated if you would read it.

Drums
Regular Member


Date Joined Mar 2010
Total Posts : 134
   Posted 5/5/2010 10:17 PM (GMT -6)   
Be careful about buying drugs over the internet. Most have been found to be fake and manufactured under poorly controlled circumstances or purposely have the wrong ingredients. That's why there's a real issue regarding drug reimportation. Many internet purchased drugs have been found to have too much, too little, or no active ingredient. They've also been found to have dangerous ingredients. The cynics will of course say it's a drug industry conspiracy. But I'd say, just be careful and do your research. For instance, Google "fake internet drugs" and see what you get. There've been several analyses of internet drugs.
 
The FDA posted some helpful hints on choosing a site that might be trustworthy, as well as signs of one that's not. If there's been good experience by some of our members, then it might be a good idea to stick with those sites.
 
 
Bill
Age 52, father died of PCa, PSA: 10/16/09 - 2.8; 1/11/10 - 3.8
Biopsy 11/25/09, 11 core samples - HG PIN on right side
Biopsy 2/17/10, 11 core samples - left side, adenocarcinoma, Gleason 6, one core at 5%
Notified of dx on 3/12/10 (27th wedding anniversary)
MRI 3/17/10 and bone scan, 3/23/10, indicate: gland volume is 27mL, PCa is confined to prostate, seminal vesicles and vas deferens are unremarkable.


MrGimpy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 504
   Posted 5/6/2010 4:42 AM (GMT -6)   
Hi Drums,

Great post, I myself will only buy Generics that I know have the Mfr name listed

One that I have found to work the best is SILAGRA which is manufactured by Cipla a very large drug company in India. They have been approved by the FDA.

Some of the other Generic Viagras had no Mfr name at all on the packaging, perhaps thats why they were ineffective. If a company stood behind what they made you would think they would list who they were on the packaging

www.cipla.com/globalpresence/globalpresence.htm
Stats:
Age: 52, PSA (2008)=1.9
Biopsy on 01/09/09, Gleason Score = 3+3
One (1) out of twelve (12) cores was positive, plus external nodule found
Surgery (Da Vinci, robotic prostatectomy): 4/7/09
Post Op Path 3+3
Removed Catheter: 04/19/09
100% bladder control - Pad free 7/09
PSA 7/09 undetectable, <0.01 - 3 months post-op
PSA 1/10 undetectable, <0.01 - 9 months post-op
Trimix provides 100% erectile function


Paul1959
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2007
Total Posts : 598
   Posted 5/6/2010 4:50 AM (GMT -6)   
If you really want to stick to the real, name brand drugs, there is a site www.edguider.com which is where they have approved online pharmacies. You may be able to get drugs cheaper there than off the shelf at your local pharmacy.
Paul
www.franktalk.org ED website for PCa guys

46 at Diagnosis.
Father died of Pca 4/07 at 86.
10/07 PSA 5.06 (Biopsy 11/07 1 of 12 with 8% involvment) (1mm)
Da Vinci surgery Jan 5, '08 at Mt. Sinai Hosp. NYC www.roboticoncology.com
Saved both nerve bundles.
Path Report: Stage T2cNxMx
-Gleason (3+3)6
Pad free on March 14 - (10 weeks.) Never a problem since.
ED - at one year, ED is fine with viagra.
Two year PSA - undetectable!


In This Together Wife
Regular Member


Date Joined Dec 2009
Total Posts : 135
   Posted 5/6/2010 6:16 AM (GMT -6)   
Great info here, thanks--got some researching to do
CareBear
(Bear's stats) Age 49
 8-4-09    Family Practioner for back pain  PSA 4.9
8-20-09  Consult with urologist                PSA 4.89
9-2-09    Biopsy          3 cores positive 7% 3+3 (6) gleason
11-13-09 DaVinci
11-23-09 Cath removed  Path report cancer contained neg. margins
 2-22-10  PSA 0.01 !!!


James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4462
   Posted 5/6/2010 8:12 AM (GMT -6)   
OldFart, how do you determine that Manly is 1/2 or less the strength of the others, etc.? That it is obviously not the proper strength? What testing data or source do you use to arrive at this statement? I ,for one, have been using the Manly for 3 years, mixed with Viagra as a control and have never found that there is any 'noticable' difference in strength. So I wonder by what criteria or data source you make the statement that it and others are diluted or false drugs? Manly is manufactured by Cooper Pharma, LTD, a large and established, well recognized drug manufacturer in India, and is certified to the same worldwide drug manufacturing standards as Silgara and others that you do acknowledge as legit. Google Cooper Pharma Ltd. and read about them and their approved manufacturing methods, including meeting G.M.P rules for W.H.O certification and ISO 9001:2000 Certification. They aren't fly by the night fakes by any means.
James C. Age 63
Gonna Make Myself A Better Man www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6cX61oNsRQ&feature=channel
4/07: PSA 7.6, Recheck after 4 weeks Cipro-6.7
7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% invloved, left lobe, GS3+3=6
9/07: Nerve Sparing open RRP, 110gms, Path Report- Stg. pT2c, 10 gms., margins clear
32 Months: PSA's .04 each test since surgery, ED continues: Bimix- .3ml PRN, Trimix- .15ml PRN

Post Edited (James C.) : 5/6/2010 8:16:21 AM (GMT-6)


MrGimpy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 504
   Posted 5/6/2010 1:52 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi JAmes,

Looking at the Cooper Pharma, LTD website under their manufactured products, they do not have a category for Erectile Dysfunction, nor do they list a product called Manly or any of the 3 generic ED equivalents.

Perhaps it is someone else who makes Manly ?
Stats:
Age: 52, PSA (2008)=1.9
Biopsy on 01/09/09, Gleason Score = 3+3
One (1) out of twelve (12) cores was positive, plus external nodule found
Surgery (Da Vinci, robotic prostatectomy): 4/7/09
Post Op Path 3+3
Removed Catheter: 04/19/09
100% bladder control - Pad free 7/09
PSA 7/09 undetectable, <0.01 - 3 months post-op
PSA 1/10 undetectable, <0.01 - 9 months post-op
Trimix provides 100% erectile function


James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4462
   Posted 5/6/2010 3:02 PM (GMT -6)   
Hmm, my blister pack of 20 Manly pills, containing 100 mg of sildenafil citrate, has printed on it: manufactured in India by Cooper Pharma, Delhi, India. manufactured July, 2007, expires Sept., 2012. Why it isn't listed on their website I can't answer.. smilewinkgrin
James C. Age 63
Gonna Make Myself A Better Man www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6cX61oNsRQ&feature=channel
4/07: PSA 7.6, Recheck after 4 weeks Cipro-6.7
7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% invloved, left lobe, GS3+3=6
9/07: Nerve Sparing open RRP, 110gms, Path Report- Stg. pT2c, 10 gms., margins clear
32 Months: PSA's .04 each test since surgery, ED continues: Bimix- .3ml PRN, Trimix- .15ml PRN


Casey59
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 3172
   Posted 5/6/2010 3:13 PM (GMT -6)   

Ceebis (Cialis substitute) is also from Cooper.  Good stuff!!

 

 

 

.

Post Edited (Casey59) : 5/6/2010 8:56:15 PM (GMT-6)


MrGimpy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 504
   Posted 5/6/2010 3:23 PM (GMT -6)   
Maybe they are out of that business, most of the products they now produce seem based on acetaminophen , Aspirin , Ibuprofen or Paraceaemol ( which is acetaminophen) , cough syrups and multi-vitamins

In short it looks like they produce primarily OTC drugs now.

Maybe they contracted with ADC to product their ED products and private labeled them as Manly. If that is the case then no-one else would sell Manly. Its unlikely that a drug company makes a product name and only sells it through one website

I would wonder why a drug company makes a product based on Sildenafil citrate but chooses not to list it as one of their products.
Stats:
Age: 52, PSA (2008)=1.9
Biopsy on 01/09/09, Gleason Score = 3+3
One (1) out of twelve (12) cores was positive, plus external nodule found
Surgery (Da Vinci, robotic prostatectomy): 4/7/09
Post Op Path 3+3
Removed Catheter: 04/19/09
100% bladder control - Pad free 7/09
PSA 7/09 undetectable, <0.01 - 3 months post-op
PSA 1/10 undetectable, <0.01 - 9 months post-op
Trimix provides 100% erectile function

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