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Jazzman1
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2010
Total Posts : 1160
   Posted 10/1/2010 12:03 PM (GMT -6)   
I'm going to see the man next week to schedule surgery, which probably won't happen for another six to eight weeks. Should I be doing Kegels now?
 
If so, is there a definitive source of information about exactly how to do them? I've read a few different accounts, and they all differ somewhat.
 
I'll stand on my head and whistle yankee doodle for the next two months if it'll help me avoid incontinence. Thanks.
 
 
Age 55

PSA:
8/09 2.69
7/10 4.00
8/10 4.11

Biopsy 8/10
Three of 14 cores positive: 10%, 60% & 80%
Stage T1C
Gleason 6

142
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 6946
   Posted 10/1/2010 12:27 PM (GMT -6)   
Getting started on the Kegels now is a real good idea. The only time you do not want to be doing them is while the catheter is in - doesn't help to be working against a piece of plastic.
 
Once started, you will be doing them for the long term - backing off lets the muscles get out of tone, and you might leak again.
 
Every description I see is different, and each person will tell you to do different numbers per day, but the general principle is the same. Check with your Uro's office and see if they have a specific site or booklet.
 
As a start, look at this page on USToo:
 
 
If you have not looked at that site before, you should also check for a local chapter, and consider going to meetings as available. It helps to meet others in different stages of the PCa journey.
 
You have seen mention of Yananow.net - that is also a good starting point for "experience" questions.

142
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 6946
   Posted 10/1/2010 12:38 PM (GMT -6)   
Not sure about other's experiences, but I remember the craze was to do Kegels to "improve" relations with the girlfriends in college, with the girls leading the charge.
 
Just didn't know I'd be needing them again to get back where I once was - oh, well. sad

88CC
New Member


Date Joined Sep 2010
Total Posts : 11
   Posted 10/1/2010 12:44 PM (GMT -6)   
I'm thinking about surgery in the same time frame as you are. I've meet with 5 doctors (two of them surgeons) and they all say start doing Kegels. But the doctor I met with yesterday surprised me by saying the best method is to just stop several times when urinating. Stopping and starting a few times when you already have trouble peeing is hard, but like you said, I'll do anything to improve my chances of not leaking.

Good luck!
Age 55; living in Seattle area
PSA = 5.1 on July 19, 2010; no long term history
Bx on Aug 25, 2010; ultrasound showed 88cc volume (due to BPH)
Dx on Aug 31, 2010; 6 out of 20 cores positive
PNI in 2 cores
G = 6 (3+3); Clinical stage = T2a
No treatment yet; still researching options.

Jazzman1
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2010
Total Posts : 1160
   Posted 10/1/2010 1:15 PM (GMT -6)   
Thanks for the input; the information out there is a little confusing.
 
Walsh recommends in his book that you do it only when urinating, and that overdoing it can be worse than not doing it at all. That kind of got me wondering about making sure I do it right.
 
I'll check out the UStoo website; I've been there before, but they don't have a local chapter in Cleveland. For sure I won't be doing kegels when the catheter is in. My only plans for that time are to watch CNN to see if somebody just came up with a pill that cures prostate cancer. I just know it's gonna happen right after my surgery, and I'm gonna so want my money back...
 
If I had known this was a way to get college girls, I would have started months ago. Thanks for the tip. I'll get busy.   tongue
Age 55

PSA:
8/09 2.69
7/10 4.00
8/10 4.11

Biopsy 8/10
Three of 14 cores positive: 10%, 60% & 80%
Stage T1C
Gleason 6

dogbot
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 147
   Posted 10/1/2010 1:43 PM (GMT -6)   
I started well before my op, and this was the advice of the doctors. But, I was told never to stop and start urine flow. Perhaps this is due to the different methods used in England.
 
All the best.

Herophilus
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 662
   Posted 10/1/2010 2:16 PM (GMT -6)   
Prior to surgery I was running up to 24 miles a week. Post surgery I have some reoccurring problems with my left foot from an injury which has restricted my ability to run but I substituted up to 100 miles a week on the bike (to and from work all summer and extra mileage on the weekends). I have now joined a 24 hr gym for the winter. I comment on the above because I believe that the running is what made my recovery a non-event. I’d like to see one of the unofficial polls that people do here as to how running prior to surgery relates to urinary incontinence/continence. My guess would be that very few individuals that were active runners for a period of one year prior to surgery had major issues with post op continence problems. Just curious. I believe that running/jogging for an extended period of time is the best pelvic floor muscular conditioning thing you can do. However I understand some patients can’t do that for a number of reasons so the “kegels” would be an important physical therapy in that post operative group. I have had several people tell me that doing the kegels have made a major impact in recovery.
Best of luck

Hero

142
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 6946
   Posted 10/1/2010 2:17 PM (GMT -6)   
When you do a Kegel, you are stopping the urine flow by clamping down on the urethra. That is why some tell you to start trying them while urinating. It helps you "find" the muscle to tense. If anything else tenses (thighs, gut) at the same time, you may not be focusing on the right one.
 
Once you've got that sorted out, you can do them any time. It is just a way to "find" the right combination.
 
I've also been told that it is not good to do them while urinating normally as a rule, since you in a way confuse the processes. Wait till everything is drained, then do them.

Mavica
Regular Member


Date Joined Jun 2008
Total Posts : 407
   Posted 10/1/2010 2:36 PM (GMT -6)   
My Urologist gave me, pre-op, several guides to the proper way to Kegel. I don't think they helped me much and now that I'm two-years post-op and still using one to two light pads a day ... my Urologist/Surgon tells me there's no way to tell if doing the Kegels really help, but he feels there's no harm in trying.

Fairwind
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2010
Total Posts : 3741
   Posted 10/1/2010 10:03 PM (GMT -6)   
Stop your urine stream without tightening anything else up and that's it. Then you can do them anytime. Five seconds on, five seconds off, repeat 10 times. Do that 8-10times a day...

Some physical therapists have a bio-feedback toy they like to play with. They shave your bung-hole, stick on 3 or 4 little EKG pads, and you do the Kegels while you watch the result on a lap-top screen...The therapist, a female, said "I paid $3500 for this program..." My reply was: "Sorry dear, but I'm not going to help you pay for it..."

English Alf
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 2215
   Posted 10/2/2010 1:50 AM (GMT -6)   
This is what I found, but it doesn't mean I've been sticking to the method. I just squeeze that "stop the flow" muscle at irregular intervals during the day.

Up to ten times a day…

Sitting on a chair with your legs apart lean forward, resting your elbows on your knees, and make a conscious effort to relax your abdominal muscles and buttocks. Although sitting like this is probably the best way in which to do these exercises, they can be done whilst standing or lying down, with the knees slightly apart.

Contract the muscles around the urethra (imagine stopping the stream of urine whilst urinating). Keep the muscles contracted for the count of five (one-and two-and three-and four-and five) and then relax the muscles. After the count of five, repeat this cycle of contraction and relaxation five times.

Next contract these muscles quickly and strongly, then relax immediately. Repeat these quick contractions and relaxation five times in rapid succession.

Now do five slow and five rapid contractions with the muscles around the anal canal (imagine you are stopping yourself passing wind) instead of those around the urethra.

Next, stand with your legs slightly apart and contract both sets of muscles at the same time – it should feel as if you are pulling up the entire pelvic floor. Contract and relax these muscles five times, trying to contract them more strongly each time.


Alf
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