prostate cancer metastasis

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caring wife
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 20
   Posted 10/11/2010 8:40 PM (GMT -6)   
Where besides bones does prostate cancer metastasize?   My father in law is now receiving Hospice care for his advanced prostate cancer which is in the pelvix, thoracic, lumbar spine as well as femurs.  It was in his lymph nodes when diagnosed 17 years agao.   He has done very well after having his testicles removed.  He has taken Casodex, Flutimide and Ketoconazole.  But his PSA was on the rise again.    The Hospice nurse told us that he may have brain metastisis.  I didn't know that was an area that prostate cancer invaded.  Is that true?   He is in his final days and that is OK.  He fought a good fight for 17 years which is amazing considering the lymph node involment when diagnosed. Thanks.  This site is very good at providing accurate information

Sleepless09
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 1267
   Posted 10/11/2010 9:01 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi caring wife, sorry to read about your father in law. Seventeen years! That does sound like a good fight. I don't have an answer for your question, but I did want to reply and tell you I've got you on my prayer list tonight.

Sheldon AKA Sleepless
Age 67 in Apil '09 at news of 4 of 12 cores positive T2B and Gleason 3 + 3 and 5% to 25% PSA 1.5
Re-read of slides in June said Gleason 3 + 4 same four cores 5% to 15%
June 29 daVinci prostatectomy, Dr. Eric Estey, at Royal Alexandra Hospital Edmonton one night stay
From "knock out" to wake up in recovery less than two hours.  Actual surgery 70 minutes
Flew home to Winnipeg on July 3 after 5 nights in Ramada Inn  ---  perfect recovery spot!
Catheter out July 9
Final pathology is 3 + 4 Gleason 7, clear margins, clear nodes, T2C, sugeron says report is "excellent"
 
Oct 1st 09 -- dry at night, during day some stress issues.
Oct 31st padless 24/7 
 
First post op PSA Sept 09  less than 0.02
PSA on Oct 23, 2009 less than 0.02
PSA on Jan 8, 2010  less than 0.02
PSA on April 9, 2010 less than 0.02 
PSA on July 9, 2010 (one year) less than 0.02
  

Piano
Veteran Member


Date Joined Apr 2008
Total Posts : 847
   Posted 10/11/2010 11:29 PM (GMT -6)   
Hi Caring Wife: Seventeen years is a good run -- I would be happy to eke out 17 years after diagnosis!

I didn't know the answer either, but googled around and found that PCa commonly spreads to bones, lungs, liver and other abdominal organs. It is rarer for it to spread to the brain, but it still can happen. One source I saw quoted about a 2% chance of metastatic PCa appearing there.
Pre-op:
Age 63 at diagnosis, now 65.
No symptoms; PSA 5.7; Gleason 4+5=9; cancer in 4 of 12 cores.
Operation:
Non-nerve-sparing open surgery on 7 March 2008.
Two nights in hospital; catheter out after 7 days.
Post-op:
Continent; no pads needed from the get-go.
Pathology showed organ confined and negative margins. Gleason downgraded to 4+4=8.
PSAs:
6-week : <0.05
7-month: <0.05
13-month: 0.07 (start of a trend?)
19-month: 0.09 (maybe)
25-month: 0.2 (yes, bummer)
27-month: 0.2 (not up; glad about that)
ED:
After a learning curve, Bimix injections (0.2ml) worked well. From 14 months, occasional nocturnal erections. At 18 months, "graduated" to just the pump.

English Alf
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 2215
   Posted 10/12/2010 12:36 AM (GMT -6)   
Hi
Sorry to hear about your father-in-law, but 17 years after Dx is not bad.

PCa typically spreads to pelvis, spine, hip bones, liver, lungs. It can I imagine spread to any where, but what I have heard of in relation to the brain is that it spreads to the skull and if it grows on the inside of the skull then it presses against the brain and damages the brain that way or by cutting off the blood supply to parts of the brain. What may thus be being noticed with your FiL are symptoms that are similar to what would happen if there was actually a tumour in the brain itself, the symptoms depend what part of the brain is affected, (similarly if it is in the bones of the spine it can press on the spinal cord and affect nerve transmission, but it has not actually spread to the spinal cord)

With my best wishes
Alf
Born Jun ‘60
Apr 09 PSA 8.6
DRE neg
Biop 2 of 12 pos
Gleason 3+3
29 Jul 09 DaVinci AVL-NKI Amsterdam
6 Aug 09 Cath out
PostOp Gleason 3+4 Bladder neck & Left SVI -T3b
No perin’l No vasc invasion Clear margins
Dry at night
21 Sep 09 No pads daytime
17 Nov 09 PSA 0.1
17 Mar 10 PSA 0.4 sent to RT
13 Apr 10 CT
28 Apr 10 start RT 66Gy
11 Jun 10 end RT
Tired
BMs weird
14 Sep 10 PSA <0.1
Erections OK

Postop
Regular Member


Date Joined Feb 2010
Total Posts : 385
   Posted 10/12/2010 12:46 AM (GMT -6)   
There is a rare form of prostate cancer, small cell carcinoma, that can spread directly into the brain:

http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1611899-overview

It behaves differently from other kinds of prostate cancer, and doesn't produce PSA, but sometimes can be mixed with more common forms of prostate cancer.

So, it could be that, or, like Alf said, it could be growing from the skull. Or the nurse could be mistaken.

BuiDoi
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2010
Total Posts : 234
   Posted 10/12/2010 12:52 AM (GMT -6)   
 
My thoughts and prayers are with you.. 
There is a natural hesitation to make comments on such matters because , well, "what the hell would I know?"
 
But - I have to say that I have heard just too much information from people who are surviving what doctors said was unsurvivable, and they are consuming OPC's.
 
It is such a shame that things so often progress to such an uncontrollable state, but were he just disgnosed with those mets, then I know what I would be doing.
There seems to be nothing to be lost and much to be gained..  Look at  Resveratrol, and OPC, and Anti-Oxidants etc. etc.   Do I believe -- YES !
I know people controlling and shrinking brain cancer, just via diet and OPC consumption.
YES - We (the bride and I and all my family) take OPC daily.
 
Had I been told that I needed Chemo after my RRP - I would have declined and just gone on large doses of OPC and Resveratrol, which is made from plant extracts..  "...and God gave man plants with which to heal himself..."
 
I feel concerned in expressing my opinion, but saying nothing is worse..
..
.
Nov 09 = First-PSA 5.3 @ 60yo - Asymptomatic - DRE-Non-Palpable
Jan-2010 = TRUS Bx DX - AdenoCar T1c - GS(3+3)=6 , 5 & 45% max., L-MidZone
May25-2010 = RRP- Nrv-Spare
Post Op. GS(3+4)=7, 1.1cm3, Pos Margins, EPE (focal) Lateral Left
Margin-Involvement (extensive) Posterior , Grade3 x 8mm
+8week PSA<0.01, ED-85%, Incont-30%
+16W PSA<0.01, ED -85%, Cont -5%
+17W First 'DRY' day. ED -90%

Post Edited (BuiDoi) : 10/12/2010 1:51:42 PM (GMT-6)


zufus
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2008
Total Posts : 3149
   Posted 10/12/2010 10:54 AM (GMT -6)   
Another man just passed recently whom dealt with his PCa for 17 yrs. and he was dealing with brain mets and even had radiation done in that area and did many protocols in his long fight. There is plenty of unanswered definitiveness in PCa issues, many variables and even PCa variant types, ploidy DNA types and ones one immune system. Anybody whom believes it is totally definable at this time is history will find the twilight zone makes more sense. (LOL)
Dx-2002 total urinary blockage, bPsa 46.6 12/12 biopsies all loaded 75-95% vol.; Gleasons scores 7,8,9's (2-sets), gland size 35, ct and bone scans look clear- ADT3 5 months prior to radiations neutron/photon 2-machines, cont'd. ADT3, quit after 2 yrs. switched to DES 1-mg, off 1+ yr., controlled well, resumed, used intermittently, resumed useage

60Michael
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jan 2009
Total Posts : 2222
   Posted 10/12/2010 12:47 PM (GMT -6)   
Caring Wife,
That is a great fight of 17 years and he must be ready for peace. I am glad Hospice is involved as that is a person friendly way to leave this earth. I did have a friend that had PCa which did spread to his brain in the last stages of his life. Blessings to you and your family.
Michael

caring wife
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2008
Total Posts : 20
   Posted 10/12/2010 9:06 PM (GMT -6)   
Thanks for all of your imformative replies.  Yes, 17 years is a long time following his diagnosis of lymph node involvement and he is very lucky to have lived this long...thanks to care received at the Universtity of Iowa Hospital and Clinics.   We will never know whether it had spread to his brain, but it sounds like it is possible and he has some symptoms.       Hospice care has been a blessing to us.  I highly recommend it.  My husband's cancer was diagnosed prior to lymph node involvement.  We are hoping for years and years of zero PSA's.  We have passed the two year mark of zero's.  

Sleepless09
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 1267
   Posted 10/12/2010 9:24 PM (GMT -6)   
Congratulations on the two years of zeros, caring wife. That's the way you get to 60 plus years of straight zeros, one year at a time, and your husband is off to a perfect start.

And, thanks for the further information on your father in law.

My best to all of you.

Sheldon AKA Sleepless
Age 67 in Apil '09 at news of 4 of 12 cores positive T2B and Gleason 3 + 3 and 5% to 25% PSA 1.5
Re-read of slides in June said Gleason 3 + 4 same four cores 5% to 15%
June 29 daVinci prostatectomy, Dr. Eric Estey, at Royal Alexandra Hospital Edmonton one night stay
From "knock out" to wake up in recovery less than two hours.  Actual surgery 70 minutes
Flew home to Winnipeg on July 3 after 5 nights in Ramada Inn  ---  perfect recovery spot!
Catheter out July 9
Final pathology is 3 + 4 Gleason 7, clear margins, clear nodes, T2C, sugeron says report is "excellent"
 
Oct 1st 09 -- dry at night, during day some stress issues.
Oct 31st padless 24/7 
 
First post op PSA Sept 09  less than 0.02
PSA on Oct 23, 2009 less than 0.02
PSA on Jan 8, 2010  less than 0.02
PSA on April 9, 2010 less than 0.02 
PSA on July 9, 2010 (one year) less than 0.02
  

havit2
New Member


Date Joined Oct 2010
Total Posts : 11
   Posted 10/13/2010 1:10 PM (GMT -6)   
I am also very sorry to hear the news of your father in law, but I thank you very much for the post. Seventeen years is a beacon and an inspiration for those of us with advanced PCa. I will keep him in my prayers as well

dacama
New Member


Date Joined Oct 2010
Total Posts : 11
   Posted 10/15/2010 8:40 PM (GMT -6)   
As a new member I am sorry to hear the news. He put up a good fight.

May the peace of G-d which passes all understanding be with your family at this time.
54
Late 07 PSA UP/Early 08 First Biopsy - Neg
Late 08 PSA Higher/Early 09 Second Biopsy - Neg
Early 10 PSA UP/Early 10 Third Biopsy - Positive
26 Cores...4 positive
8/23/10 RP Gleason 6+ 5% of Prostate Cancerous Wide Margins
Nodes negative/Vesicles negative
Tumor contained in capsule
NO post surgery PSA test as of yet.
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