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James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4463
   Posted 1/1/2011 11:30 AM (GMT -6)   
sv posted for the first time in another thread. Welcome to HW, thank you for sharing your story with us. I hope you will stay with us and continue to share your journey.

He said:

Last September I too was a Gleason 9 and after careful research determined that getting that beast out of my body asap was critical. A recent convert of integrated medicine, we immediately took out of our diet all sugar, dairy products, red meat and switched to a completely organic diet of fresh fruits and vegetables with delicious meals of wild caught cold water fish, chicken and eggs. We also loaded up on cooked tomatoes for licapene and a variety of other antioxidants like green tea and blue berries. What actually worked? We don't know but we do know that we ate like my life depended on it. And so it did.

Added to that was a rock solid belief that when disaster strikes us, we are given the tools to prevail...the choice is ours--to stand and fight or lay down and die. Which will you choose?

Next was finding the best surgeon in our area because a DaVinci robot meant nothing to us in the hands of someone without at least a few thousand surgeries under his belt. We chose Dr. Mark Kawachi at City of Hope near Los Angeles. During the five weeks between diagnosis and surgery, via meditation and super positive attitudes, we convinced our bodies, souls and minds that the beast was in fact, in remission.

The morning of surgery, as I shook hands with Kawachi while nurses were busy plugging needles and tubes into my nether regions, I looked him in the eye and said that as far as we were concerned my cancer was in remission and that I was only going along with this to humor him. The staff was further surprised when I added that my post surgical biopsy would reveal a lowered Gleason score.

Eight days later when they removed my catheter, not only was I water tight but three nights later we had sex with a 3/4 erection compliments of vitamin V. Best of all...post biopsy Gleason went down, not to an 8 but a 7! All margins and lymph nodes were clear and completely organ confined. First lab test was with Bostwick and the second was City of Hope so an error was nearly impossible.

Your bone scan showing suspicious blobs? Forget about them until something is conclusive and then, even if there is a problem, your fight is far from over. It is just beginning. But I say to you my brother in our battle with this hideous monster, THINK POSITIVE AND DON'T YOU EVER DARE GIVE UP!
James C. Age 63
Gonna Make Myself A Better Man tinyurl.com/28e8qcg
4/07: PSA 7.6, 7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% involved, left lobe, GS6
9/07: Nerve Sparing open RRP, Path: pT2c, 110 gms., all clear except:
Probable microscopic involvement of the left apical margin -GS6
3 Years: PSA's .04 each test until 04/10-.06, 09/10-.09- Uh-Oh, next in Jan & Feb.
ED-total-Bimix 30cc

142
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 7082
   Posted 1/1/2011 7:53 PM (GMT -6)   
sv,
 
Welcome to HW. It sounds like you've had a good go of it so far, and I hope the new year brings you a string of zeros.
DaVinci 10/2009
My IGRT journey (2010) -
www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=35&m=1756808

Cajun Jeff
Veteran Member


Date Joined Mar 2009
Total Posts : 4119
   Posted 1/2/2011 9:58 AM (GMT -6)   
This is an interesting report. Sounds like your doing some things very right. Do keep us posted. Happy New Year!

Cajun jeff
9/08 PSA 5.4 referred to Urologist
9/08 Biopsy: GS 3+4=7 1 positive core in 12 1% cancer core
10/08 Nerve-Sparing open radicalSurgery Path Report Downgrade 3+3=6 GS Stage pT2c margins clea
r3 month: PSA <0.1
19th month: PSA <0.1
2 year PSA <0.1
Only issue at this time is ED but getting better

Casey59
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 3172
   Posted 1/2/2011 3:47 PM (GMT -6)   

 

SV, I offer a tip-of-the-hat to you as a HW (HealingWell) cultural expression on behalf of many others here in salutation, recognition and respect.  You, sir, are what one would call an “empowered patient, and you have had some outstanding results which appear to be commensurate with your commitment (which simply confirms the trends in medical studies showing a direct correlation between the degree of lifestyle change and change in measureable PC behavior).

You are joining a growing number of men here at HW embracing and following the practice of integrative medicine/integrative oncology, and a strong (growing) list of men who have embraced changes in their lives and lifestyles to improve their likely outcomes in fighting PC. 

 

I really like your attitude where you wrote:

sv said...
...a rock solid belief that when disaster strikes us, we are given the tools to prevail...the choice is ours
 The way I’ve recently said the same thing here at HW is this: 
Casey59 said...
It seems to me that no one in the world would be more motivated to seek out an anti-cancer regimen that a cancer survivor who wants to be sure he remains a survivor.
 
 
I also really like your recognition that the precise scientific measurement of what worked more and what worked less doesn’t really matter¾the simple correlation is more important at this point for you than waiting for the cause-and-effect proof.  You wrote:
sv said...
What actually worked? We don't know but we do know that we ate like my life depended on it. And so it did.

 

Further to that point, it would, in fact, be essentially impossible to isolate and determine the effect of a single food in a complex diet…and as a result there is very little effort expended in this area of prostate cancer research.  Rather, PC studies have focused on the “big three” changes which have been documented in some patients to stop or even reverse PC progression:  (i) diet (both what you do put in your mouth, and what you do not put in your mouth), (ii) stress reduction, and (iii) exercise.  You addressed (i) diet and (ii) stress reduction in your post.  SV, if you get an opportunity to return and post again on HW, please also let us know what you’ve done in the area of (iii) exercise, rounding-out the “big three”, to also help your cause.

Congratulations, welcome, and very best wishes…

 
 
edit:  fix typo

Post Edited (Casey59) : 1/2/2011 1:52:32 PM (GMT-7)


Casey59
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 3172
   Posted 1/3/2011 4:28 PM (GMT -6)   

I’m not sure we’ll hear back from SV—I hope we will—but in my last post I acknowledged his efforts in both diet and stress reduction, two of the “big three” which have been shown in a recent medical study at UCSF (Dr Peter Carroll, PC surgeon and head of urology dept; this study previously discussed in depth here) to reduce PSA (as a marker for PC) in men already diagnosed with prostate cancer (other studies have focused on prevention; this study was unique in that it focused on progression).  I also asked for SV’s comment on how he was addressing exercise (the 3rd component of the “big three” from the UCSF study).

Even moderate amounts of exercise—taking regular walks, for example—reduces overall mortality rates in men with PC; however, the more vigorous the exercise, the greater the benefit.  (By the way, these are not my words; read this:  LINK)

SV appears to be an excellent example of what we would call “thrivership” (as opposed to “survivorship”)…read this:

What is thrivership? The Merriam-Webster dictionary defines thriver as one who progresses toward a goal despite circumstances, and flourishes.  The diagnosis of prostate cancer can lead you in one of two directions. Some will react to this diagnosis with a sense of resignation and fatalism.  This view can lead to helplessness — waiting for the other shoe of cancer recurrence or progression to drop.  On the other hand, thrivership puts you in the driver’s seat — making you as vital to your care and treatment as any doctor or nurse. You may have had prostate cancer, but now you are in charge of your life, adopting new healthy habits and enjoying each day to its fullest.  As a prostate cancer thriver, you can use the latest knowledge about nutrition and exercise to improve your overall health and quality of life.  Your diagnosis of prostate cancer can be the beginning of a healthier lifestyle. 

 

No, I didn’t invent the word “thrivership.”  The term, and the quote above, comes from a document (free online) published by the Prostate Cancer Foundation (PCF) titled “Nutrition, Exercise and Prostate Cancer.”  This is a document that I would recommend for all PC patients (attention moderators:  excellent site sticky opportunity).  Here’s the LINK to the PCF document, which I invite all to read.  It even includes a section on making, and sticking to, a commitment to bring aboutchange in lifestyle…which many men find hard to do, despite the documented evidence that the “big three” can bring real, documented benefits (re-read the UCSF study) in men with PC. 

If you didn't set a New Year's resolution yet...here's your chance to set one (exercise) that might make a significant difference in your life!


James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4463
   Posted 1/3/2011 4:58 PM (GMT -6)   
devil But he, and others, have the right to sing it, as loudly and off-key as others may hear it to be.... tongue

Different strokes and all that. cool
James C. Age 63
Gonna Make Myself A Better Man tinyurl.com/28e8qcg
4/07: PSA 7.6, 7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% involved, left lobe, GS6
9/07: Nerve Sparing open RRP, Path: pT2c, 110 gms., all clear except:
Probable microscopic involvement of the left apical margin -GS6
3 Years: PSA's .04 each test until 04/10-.06, 09/10-.09- Uh-Oh, next in Jan & Feb.
ED-total-Bimix 30cc

Casey59
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 3172
   Posted 1/3/2011 5:00 PM (GMT -6)   
James...huh?

James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4463
   Posted 1/3/2011 5:13 PM (GMT -6)   
Huh, what? My comment to DAvid was just saying everyone has a right to express their opinions here, no matter how much others may disagree or think they are expressed too often.... smilewinkgrin
James C. Age 63
Gonna Make Myself A Better Man tinyurl.com/28e8qcg
4/07: PSA 7.6, 7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% involved, left lobe, GS6
9/07: Nerve Sparing open RRP, Path: pT2c, 110 gms., all clear except:
Probable microscopic involvement of the left apical margin -GS6
3 Years: PSA's .04 each test until 04/10-.06, 09/10-.09- Uh-Oh, next in Jan & Feb.
ED-total-Bimix 30cc

John T
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2008
Total Posts : 4268
   Posted 1/3/2011 5:30 PM (GMT -6)   
David,
I think your personal issues with Casey are affecting your responses to his posts. He has laid out some evidence that many of the top specialists in PC also agree with. It's your choice to ignore them, but other patients may be interested in persuing them.
JT
65 years old, rising psa for 10 years from 4 to 40; 12 biopsies and MRIS all negative. Oct 2009 DXed with G6 <5%. Color Doppler biopsy found 2.5 cm G4+3. Combidex clear. Seeds and IMRT, no side affects and psa .1 at 1.5 years.

Casey59
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2009
Total Posts : 3172
   Posted 1/3/2011 5:40 PM (GMT -6)   
Ahhh...I see what happened now, James. Several months ago I used the site's "Ignore" feature (for reasons we don't need to re-hash here), and so a certain member's posts are invisible to me. I can tell from your reply (and John's) what has transpired...

Let's move on from that part of the discussion.

(But for anyone interested, the "Ignore" feature is the "thumbs down" icon in the upper right-hand corner of each post.)

Tony Crispino
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 8128
   Posted 1/3/2011 6:07 PM (GMT -6)   
David,
Do you have anything to say to our new member? Your posts in this thread have been addressed in a negative manner to Casey and are not on topic to the subject matter posted. If you do not have anything to offer for a new member as the goodwill of this post intends, then please do not use this thread for a personal vendetta.

Casey's post in not a bad post by any means. It is posted with a welcome to a new member and some insights that Casey has shared that I do not disagree with.

Please be supportive, and please try to be courteous when a new member is being welcomed.

Tony
Disease:
Advanced Prostate Cancer at age 44 (I am 48 now)
pT3b,N0,Mx (original PSA was 19.8) EPE, PM, SVI. Gleason 4+3=7

Treatments:
RALP ~ 2/17/2007 at the City of Hope near Los Angeles.
Adjuvant Radiation Therapy ~ IMRT Completed 8/07
Adjuvant Hormone Therapy ~ 28 months on Casodex and Lupron.

Status:
"I beat up this disease and took its lunch money! I am in remission."
I am currently not being treated, but I do have regular oncology visits.
I am the president of an UsTOO chapter in Las Vegas

Blog : www.caringbridge.org/visit/tonycrispino

James C.
Veteran Member


Date Joined Aug 2007
Total Posts : 4463
   Posted 1/3/2011 6:09 PM (GMT -6)   
David, 2 different animals, I think. The one you refer to was a very specific, detailed subject that was being repeatedly posted and creating division without contributing much after the initital couple of rounds This time, its' much more general and contains subjects that I think most of can agree is parts of a logical health improvement plan. I can't find anything wrong with anyone recommending changing diets, doing stress reduction and improving exercise to improve health and even strengthen the body's resistance to disease. But, discussing this just opens the door to further dissention, so I'm gonna keep my yap shut now.... turn
James C. Age 63
Gonna Make Myself A Better Man tinyurl.com/28e8qcg
4/07: PSA 7.6, 7/07 Biopsy: 3 of 16 PCa, 5% involved, left lobe, GS6
9/07: Nerve Sparing open RRP, Path: pT2c, 110 gms., all clear except:
Probable microscopic involvement of the left apical margin -GS6
3 Years: PSA's .04 each test until 04/10-.06, 09/10-.09- Uh-Oh, next in Jan & Feb.
ED-total-Bimix 30cc

stevmac1
Regular Member


Date Joined May 2010
Total Posts : 129
   Posted 1/3/2011 7:00 PM (GMT -6)   
sv said "THINK POSITIVE AND DON'T YOU EVER DARE GIVE UP!"
Awesome advice, buddy. I love it.
steve
50 Yrs. old. DX Feb, 2010 w/6.6 PSA.
Biopsy 04-24-10, Gleason 3+3=6
4 of 5 cores left side inv. 4 of 6 rt side
RRP 06-07-10....
16 days post-op, catheter out.
Gleason upgraded to 3+4
Totally continent @ 8 weeks post-op. (!!!)
1st post-op PSA @ 12 weeks - <0.05
2nd " " " @ 6 months - <0.05

Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25393
   Posted 1/3/2011 9:04 PM (GMT -6)   
Tony, you absolutely have to be kidding?

"Please be supportive, and please try to be courteous when a new member is being welcomed."

I have been supportive to almost, if not, everyone here for over 2 years and almost 9,000 posts. And I am usually among the first in greeting any new brother here. I have been supportive when I couldn't hardly sit up straight, or be in so much pain I was almost white with hurting. And because I disagree, now I am the bad guy?

Very disapointed, but you are the moderator, and thats that.

David in SC
 
P.S.  Tony, you are saying that you agree with Casey that stress reduction, diet, and exercise can reduce or reverse PC progression?  That is what he plainly stated above.  I think all these things are good and can help with all cancer patients, but I don't believe for a minute that it reduces or can reverse progression.
 
But since disputing this post, I removed my "offensive" posts from this thread, so as not to encourage any other takers.

Post Edited (Purgatory) : 1/3/2011 7:20:59 PM (GMT-7)


Tudpock18
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Sep 2008
Total Posts : 4274
   Posted 1/3/2011 9:14 PM (GMT -6)   
Tony...that was cold, dude...stone cold.  To imply that David of all people is not courteous and supportive to new members is way off base, IMHO.  Personally I think you crossed over the moderator line on that one.
 
And, sv, welcome.  Glad you have such a positive attitude and I hope your recovery goes well.
 
Tudpock (Jim)
Age 62 (64 now), G 3 + 4 = 7, T1C, PSA 4.2, 2/16 cancerous, 27cc. Brachytherapy 12/9/08. 73 Iodine-125 seeds. Procedure went great, catheter out before I went home, only minor discomfort. Everything continues to function normally as of 12/8/10. PSA: 6 mo 1.4, 1 yr. 1.0, 2 yr. .8. My docs are "delighted"! My journey:
http://www.healingwell.com/community/default.aspx?f=35&m=1305643&g=1305643#m1305643

Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25393
   Posted 1/3/2011 9:19 PM (GMT -6)   
And before I forget, SV, you are most welcomed here at HW Prostate Cancer. You have had an amazing PC journey so far, with such a good attitude to boot. And no doubt, sounds like you have and/or are doing all you can from your side in helping yourself work through all the issues. My hat is off to you.

Please keep us posted. I wish you only the best as you continue forward.

David in SC
Age: 58, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 7 of 7 Positive, 40-90%, Gleason 4+3
open RP: 11/08, on catheters for 101 days
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos marg
Incont & ED: None
Post Surgery PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12, 4/8 .04, 8/6 .06 11/10 Not taking it
Latest: 6 Corr Surgeries to Bladder Neck, SP Catheter since 10/1/9, SRT 39 Sess/72 gy ended 11/09, 21 Catheters, Ileal Conduit Surgery 9/23/10

Tony Crispino
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 8128
   Posted 1/3/2011 11:00 PM (GMT -6)   
David,
Thank you for taking down the posts. I apologize if you don't think they were inappropriately placed. And I certainly don't mean to indicate you are not supportive here, it just seemed to me that you were just a bit more focused on controversy with Casey than you were supporting sv in the posts you removed. But I forgive and forget. Your last post is what this thread was about.

On your question:
"Tony, you are saying that you agree with Casey that stress reduction, diet, and exercise can reduce or reverse PC progression? That is what he plainly stated above. I think all these things are good and can help with all cancer patients, but I don't believe for a minute that it reduces or can reverse progression."

Yes. You and I will have to disagree on this one. I believe that positive lifestyle changes can be a very productive weapon against prostate cancer, or any cancer for that matter, and I have seen examples. And if not life saving there is a quality of life improvement as well because diet, exercise, and other complimentary therapies promote a healthier person. I truly believe that the best way to approach treating prostate cancer is by treating the mind, body, and spirit. It's not just about treating tumors.

Peace,

Tony

Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25393
   Posted 1/3/2011 11:23 PM (GMT -6)   
Tony, I will only agree that diet, stress reduction, and exercise promote a healthier person and lifestyle, who could disagree with that? I have constantly promoted the healthy heart diet in my posts. I still do not believe, or will not believe, there is positive proof, that any of the 3 threes mentioned will reduce or reverse prostate cancer, or any other cancers natural progression. And that's not just my idle opinion, its the opinion of every doctor I have had associated with all my bouts of cancers thus far.

I took down the posts, not because I thought I said anything wrong or untrue, and none of them were "flames", I did so for the good of HW and its normal harmony.

I don't hold grudges, so live and let live.

David in SC
Age: 58, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 7 of 7 Positive, 40-90%, Gleason 4+3
open RP: 11/08, on catheters for 101 days
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos marg
Incont & ED: None
Post Surgery PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12, 4/8 .04, 8/6 .06 11/10 Not taking it
Latest: 6 Corr Surgeries to Bladder Neck, SP Catheter since 10/1/9, SRT 39 Sess/72 gy ended 11/09, 21 Catheters, Ileal Conduit Surgery 9/23/10

Tony Crispino
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 8128
   Posted 1/4/2011 12:45 AM (GMT -6)   
David,
There is compelling evidence that being healthy and by improving ones immune system you can indeed reduce tumor sizes and even prolong life. In some cases, even induce a remission and extend it. This is the very basis for immunotherapy research.

I am open to anything that could do the same for me, too.

SV:
I was treated at the City of Hope, too. They have a terrific prostate cancer program. Tim Wilson was my surgeon and four years later he has agreed to come out to Las Vegas and will be doing a guest speaking spot for our UsTOO prostate cancer support group. I believe they have a very caring staff. They have a nutritionist on staff and I also believe that they have an oncology team that specializes in an integrative approach. I think it's a good idea to look into it. Here is a link to the Society of Integrative Oncology (SIO) that shows some of the very best at it:

www.integrativeonc.org/index.php/Integrative-Oncology-Practices/

Peace, and good healing!

Tony

clocknut
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2010
Total Posts : 2680
   Posted 1/4/2011 10:44 AM (GMT -6)   

Congratulations sv on your downgrade to Gleason 7, and welcome to HW.

My reaction is much like David's, though, when I read comments such as, "During the five weeks between diagnosis and surgery, via meditation and super positive attitudes, we convinced our bodies, souls and minds that the beast was in fact, in remission."

I challenge anyone to show me scientific proof that a positive mental attitude or meditation has any effect in reducing tumor size, lowering Gleason number, or improving cancer survivability.  Obviously I'm happy about sv's outcomes, but we do a disservice to the many brave men and women who have fought cancer with their whole spirit, with wonderful positive attitudes, with courage beyond imagination, with stringent changes to lifestyle and diet, and yet the cancer has claimed their lives.  It's as if we're saying that they just didn't fight hard enough. 

I think we all should strive to have a positive attitude, since it's so obviously preferable to walking around in a state of depression, but we're deceiving ourselves and misleading readers of this forum if we pretend that meditation and a positive attitude can arrest cancer.  It's also odd that we let this new age equivalent of "spiritualism" slide, when we would all be in a major snit if sv had claimed that prayer and daily devotions to St. Luke, patron of physicians, had reduced his cancer.

However, while I'm skeptical of the value of meditation and positive attitude, I applaud sv's whole body approach through nutrition and selection of a highly competent surgeon.

 

 

.


Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25393
   Posted 1/4/2011 12:24 PM (GMT -6)   
very well written post, clock. i applaud you.
Age: 58, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 7 of 7 Positive, 40-90%, Gleason 4+3
open RP: 11/08, on catheters for 101 days
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos marg
Incont & ED: None
Post Surgery PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12, 4/8 .04, 8/6 .06 11/10 Not taking it
Latest: 6 Corr Surgeries to Bladder Neck, SP Catheter since 10/1/9, SRT 39 Sess/72 gy ended 11/09, 21 Catheters, Ileal Conduit Surgery 9/23/10

John T
Veteran Member


Date Joined Nov 2008
Total Posts : 4268
   Posted 1/4/2011 12:44 PM (GMT -6)   
Clock,
Almost every Oncologist treating advanced PC, Liebowitz, Strum, Scholz and Myers all have a diet and excercise program that goes along with their therapies. Scholz told me that he did not believe that diet affected PC progression, but after treating so many patients on "wierd" diets, especially with low glocouse numbers, have their PC stop or go into remission he just could not ignore what he was seeing. He now fullly embraces the diet aspect. When I learned that I would have to wait at least 4 months for treatment I asked what I could do. He said very bluntly" go on a vegeterian diet". I, a total meat a potatoes guy, just laughed. He said he was not kidding and recommended a couple of books to read. After reading them I was at least convinced to give it a try. My psa had been rising consistantly for 10 years, checking it every 2 months, and never once dropped. It was 40 when I was Dxed. I went on a strict diet and it dropped four months in a row to 30. I know this is not evidence, but coupled with my research I became convinced that there was a connection. As Casey mentioned Dr Carrol, a surgeon at UCSF, has been doing some work on diet with the UCSF AS program and has found a major reduction in progression between those on a strict diet and excercise and mediation program compared to a control group. So far after three years no one on the diet program has had any sort of progression. The control group has the normal progression rate of 30%.
JT
JohnT
65 years old, rising psa for 10 years from 4 to 40; 12 biopsies and MRIS all negative. Oct 2009 DXed with G6 <5%. Color Doppler biopsy found 2.5 cm G4+3. Combidex clear. Seeds and IMRT, no side affects and psa .1 at 1.5 years.

clocknut
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2010
Total Posts : 2680
   Posted 1/4/2011 1:14 PM (GMT -6)   
James,
I'm very open minded about the effects of diet.  I wish I could motivate myself to be more careful in that area.  There seems to be plenty of evidence, anecdotal and otherwise, that show that certain kinds of diets can have an effect on cancer:  either promoting cancer growth or hindering it.   And I really applaud both you and sv for your multi-pronged attack on the cancer:  mind and body.
 
The part that makes me nervous is where he says that during that 5-month period between diagnosis and treatment he attacked the cancer with meditation and positive thinking and convinced himself that the beast was in remission. 
 
I'm glad things worked out so well for him, but do you know of any studies that demonstrate a link purely between "positive thinking," "meditation," and cancer reduction?  And what about all those courageous warriors who have lost their battles with cancer?  Were they lacking in positive attitude?  Did they not meditate sufficiently?  A positive attitude never hurts, but I'll bet the secret to your success and sv's is in the dietary aspect rather than the meditative aspect.
 
 
'
 

Tony Crispino
Veteran Member


Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 8128
   Posted 1/4/2011 1:55 PM (GMT -6)   
clock,
The use of complimentary therapies is not just to address the tumor. I have always been very positive about where I was heading in early 2007 with a disease that appeared to have the odds stacked against me. And they still may be. However, my positive attitude has allowed me to motivate myself in many ways that I otherwise would not have. My QoL is up and my lifestyle changes made easier by acceptance were effective in helping me through surgery, radiation, and almost three years on HT. I probably could be in the same boat physically without the changes, but I personally doubt my quality of life would be the same.

Things are all relative from patient to patient. For those that absolutely won't believe that things like meditation, or hypnosis, or addressing spirituality won't help them, then I say then don't do it. But there are other things that can help, but each patient has to "tailor" their own protocols to do what does work for them. This is where an integrative oncology approach can help. These folks are trained to help you find what you can believe in.

And for those who do believe that what they are doing is working, I say good for them. And keep doing it.

From a study stand point, complimentary therapies have been shown to work well in a number of ways. I think that John T has a perfect example with Mark Scholz personal experience as an oncologist. First not thinking it would not help to becoming an advocate for integrative approaches. My oncologist is also a top dog in the business and he too is very much a believer that there is more to oncology than just the tumor. And the link I posted above shows that the very top centers have adapted integrative approaches into their programs.

I think SV's story is wonderful. And I think for anyone else closing the door to diet, exercise, or other methods of addressing ways to improve ones chances against disease may be missing a crucial opportunity. I certainly have change my views on it over the four years I have been dealing with advanced prostate cancer.

Tony

clocknut
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2010
Total Posts : 2680
   Posted 1/4/2011 2:16 PM (GMT -6)   
Tony,
Reading your post, I don't find a thing I disagree with. I know I prayed like crazy after being diagnosed. I called on every saint and the spirit of every deceased relative to help me though this.......to at least give me the strength to deal with what I knew I would have to go through (though a miraculous cure would have been preferable). I meditated. I pictured the cancer tumor as the enemy, and I imagined my body attacking it and destroying it like PacMan devoured the little electronic images on the game board.

Whether the benefits of meditation are scientifically demonstrable, or whether it just helps a person cope and continue with a "normal" life, then it ain't all bad.

I certainly didn't mean to be critical in any way of sv's approach. His is an amazing story of courage. I just always get nervous when anything is said that might give the impression that those loved ones (e.g., my father) who have lost the battle have lost it because they failed to have sufficient "positive attitude" or perhaps didn't pray or meditate sufficiently. We all do what we can, and I think we should all do as much as we can in our struggle against the disease.
Age 65
Dx in June 2010.
PSA gradually rising for 3 years to 6.2
Biopsy confirmed cancer in 6 of 12 cores, all on left side
Gleason 7 (3 + 4)
Bone scan, CT scan, rib x-rays all negative.
DaVinci surgery late August at Advocate Condell, Libertyville IL
Negative margins; negative seminal vesicles
5 brothers, ages 52-67 ; I'm the only one with PCa
Continence OK after 7 weeks. ED continues.
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