What Not To Drink

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Flytyer2
Regular Member


Date Joined Dec 2010
Total Posts : 33
   Posted 1/24/2011 7:40 AM (GMT -6)   
The catheter has been out 3 weeks now, and I'm generally pad free, but do have some leakage when I cough, sneeze, etc. What beverages or types of beverages should I avoid while trying to regain continence? Thanks in advance.
Age 61
PSA: 12/09 7.3 (Proscar) -- 7/10 9.06 (Proscar)
--------------------------------------------------
Biopsy 9/13/2010
Diagnosed 9/20/2010
One of 12 cores positive: <5%

RRP at Mayo Clinic, Rochester, MN 12/15/2010
Gleason 3 + 4 with tertiary grade 5
Tumor confined to the prostate
Surgical marginins negative

Catheter removed at Mayo 01/03/2011
Pad free with min leakage 01/18/2011

clocknut
Veteran Member


Date Joined Sep 2010
Total Posts : 2667
   Posted 1/24/2011 7:45 AM (GMT -6)   
Hi, Fllytyer, sounds like you're doing well.
 
I guess the most obvious drinks to avoid would be any that have a known diuretic effect, like coffee and tea.
 
I don't find a connection there in my personal experience.  I'm sitting here drinking my morning cup of Joe as I type, and I'm sure I'll have several more, but if a person is having problems with continence, coffee, tea, and caffeinated beverages would probably be good to avoid.
 

daveshan
Regular Member


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 363
   Posted 1/24/2011 7:56 AM (GMT -6)   
Coffee, carbonated beverages and alcohol are the things I've heard not to drink. I power down more coffee than I'm willing to share here in the mornings and drink Fresca like it's going out of style with no ill effects so it would appear that effects vary.

Haven't done alcohol for a very long time as the side effects for me is worse than a bit of leakage so I can't speak with any experience there.

Dave in Durango CO

Worried Guy
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Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 3732
   Posted 1/24/2011 8:02 AM (GMT -6)   
Of the 18 months I "enjoyed' incontinence, I heard it was best to avoid: fruit juices, coffee, carbonated beverages, known diuretics, green tea, etc. After I read all the info from many sources, I asked myself "what's left?". Milk and water.

Over a period of at least 8 months I actually did testing myself with a laboratory grade 2000 gm capacity Mettler recording all input and output. I have daily leak data for every day since my catheter came out 18 months ago.
I found that the most significant factor to leakage was fluid input. Period. I found no measurable effect due to the type of drink.
If I drank a 200 ml of water or 200 ml of juice or tea or mountain dew. I would leak the same amount.

Jeff (one week post catheter removal after sling surgery and only leaking 15 ml / day!)

Post Edited (Worried Guy) : 1/24/2011 7:10:39 AM (GMT-7)


Pocketman
Regular Member


Date Joined Aug 2010
Total Posts : 121
   Posted 1/24/2011 8:47 AM (GMT -6)   
Worried Guy said...
Of the 18 months I "enjoyed' incontinence, I heard it was best to avoid: fruit juices, coffee, carbonated beverages, known diuretics, green tea, etc. After I read all the info from many sources, I asked myself "what's left?". Milk and water.

Over a period of at least 8 months I actually did testing myself with a laboratory grade 2000 gm capacity Mettler recording all input and output. I have daily leak data for every day since my catheter came out 18 months ago.
I found that the most significant factor to leakage was fluid input. Period. I found no measurable effect due to the type of drink.
If I drank a 200 ml of water or 200 ml of juice or tea or mountain dew. I would leak the same amount.

Jeff (one week post catheter removal after sling surgery and only leaking 15 ml / day!)
My uro gave me a list of foods and drinks to avoid and then commented that to be totally compliant one would have to go on a bread and water diet.  I too have found that volume of intake has a greater effect than what I drink.  I think caffiene has some ill effects, so I've cut back on that.

142
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 6948
   Posted 1/24/2011 8:57 AM (GMT -6)   
Coffee, Orange Juice, and anything carbonated (Coke, beer, sparkling wines) are killers for me. I had to give up coffee completely, and a beer after 9pm means waking up wet. The News Year's libation was also a really bad idea.
 
All these for me are "immediate impact" - no question.

Purgatory
Elite Member


Date Joined Oct 2008
Total Posts : 25380
   Posted 1/24/2011 9:36 AM (GMT -6)   
I was told nothing with caffine, including normal type teas, no kind of fruit juices - as they can all irratate the bladder, and no alch. of any type, and nothing carbonated. Better off drinking straight water during that time, though products like Crystal Light can take the edge off.
Age: 58, 56 dx, PSA: 7/07 5.8, 10/08 16.3
3rd Biopsy: 9/08 7 of 7 Positive, 40-90%, Gleason 4+3
open RP: 11/08, on catheters for 101 days
Path Rpt: Gleason 3+4, pT2c, 42g, 20% cancer, 1 pos marg
Incont & ED: None
Post Surgery PSA: 2/09 .05,5/09 .1, 6/09 .11. 8/09 .16
Post SRT PSA: 1/10 .12, 4/8 .04, 8/6 .06 11/10 Not taking it
Latest: 6 Corr Surgeries to Bladder Neck, SP Catheter since 10/1/9, SRT 39 Sess/72 gy ended 11/09, 21 Catheters, Ileal Conduit Surgery 9/23/10

English Alf
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 2215
   Posted 1/24/2011 9:43 AM (GMT -6)   
Previous posts seem to have covered my own list of what to avoid.

As for waht you can drink I seem to remember that many months ago we had a discussion here about the merits of camomille tea (assorted spellings).

Also if you don't want to give up on fruit juices drink, then dilute it. Or if you don;t like watery juice then drink half the normal quantity of juice and then drink the same amount of water to dilute it in the stomach.

Also there are a few foods to avoid that can make the bladder over react. I can't remeber the list, maybe someone else can, but I also seem to recall it's as well to avoid spices as well.

To help get through the night without a flood (but with the odd trip to the bathroom) you may want to avoid drinking anything after about 8pm, or even earlier.

Do not however reduce you daily intake of liquids below what your body needs.

Alf
Born Jun ‘60
Apr 09 PSA 8.6
DRE neg
Biop 2 of 12 pos
Gleason 3+3
29 Jul 09 DaVinci AVL-NKI Amsterdam
6 Aug 09 Cath out
PostOp Gleason 3+4 Bladder neck & Left SVI -T3b
No perin’l No vasc invasion Clear margins
Dry at night
21 Sep 09 No pads daytime
17 Nov 09 PSA 0.1
17 Mar 10 PSA 0.4 sent to RT
13 Apr CT
66Gy 28 Apr to 11 Jun 10
Tired + weird BMs
14 Sep 10 PSA <0.1
12 Jan 11 PSA <0.1
Erection OK

Worried Guy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 3732
   Posted 1/24/2011 7:51 PM (GMT -6)   
I would love to see the studies that show this effect to be real. You guys have no idea how many glasses, mugs, cups of liquids and how many loaded pee pads I weighed daily on my Mettler balance - to 0.01 grams!

Maybe my bladder did not have a discriminating palate, but it made no difference what liquid I put in my mouth. I all dribbled out into my pad.
The only relationship I could prove was volume in = volume out.

I was even able to determine my kidney thruput function at 75 ml/ hour.
If I drank a 250 ml cup of coffee I would begin to dribble it out in 30 minutes and 3 hours later it would be done. Ready for the next pee pad experiment.

Jeff

142
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 6948
   Posted 1/24/2011 8:05 PM (GMT -6)   
Jeff,
 
Officially my study is not very scientific, but here it is:
 
If I drink a carbonated beverage (Coke, beer, or sparkling wine) after 9 pm, I will wake in a puddle the next morning. Period. It happens. Every time. Unless I am up really late, and then I will realize I sopped a pad without warning. Before 9pm, I'll be peeing until midnight - not much but painfully often.
 
Coffee hits me with the mini-spurts about two hours later, and they go on for a few hours. No coffee, it happens a lot less. Clear enough that I quit coffee. When you get to GFMPH weekend, I'll explain why that was a huge decision.
 
Orange juice - more than an ounce or two - two hours later I'll hurt so bad I have to sit to pee.
 
15 months from DaVinci, no change.
 
 

Sleepless09
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 1267
   Posted 1/24/2011 8:50 PM (GMT -6)   
I drank a ton of coffee, and endless diet coke. I avoided booze for no better reason than it seemed like a good idea.

I dryed up right on the schedule I'd been given.

One great bit of advice I was given was that I would regain control. That it might be six weeks early, or it might be six months late. If I decided to worry and fuss about it, it wouldn't make a smigin of difference to the date I was dry --- so I may as well go with the flow (sorry about that, but I couldn't resist.)

Sheldon AKA Sleepless

English Alf
Veteran Member


Date Joined Oct 2009
Total Posts : 2215
   Posted 1/25/2011 1:24 AM (GMT -6)   
I think the problem realtes to the chemistry, or more relevantly the acidity.
If you drink things that make your urine acidic this can irritate the baldder, particularly the scar tissue around the neck of the baldder that is trying ti stay shut.

On the other hand I recall that having acidic urine can help reduce bladder infections. (I think you'll find that a woman sufering from cystitis may be drinking the opposite stuff to a man trying to improve his continence after RRP.)

Caffeine is the problem with coffee and colas, I switched to decaff before I was diagnosed so I'm okay there I think, also I've been sleeping better without caffeine.

Alf

Worried Guy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 3732
   Posted 1/25/2011 6:16 AM (GMT -6)   
Hey 142,

That is great data and the start of a study. I see a Mettler balance in your future. ;-)
"If I drink a carbonated beverage (Coke, beer, or sparkling wine) after 9 pm, I will wake in a puddle the next morning. Period. It happens. Every time. Unless I am up really late, and then I will realize I sopped a pad without warning. Before 9pm, I'll be peeing until midnight - not much but painfully often."

What happens when you drink an equal volume of water after 9 pm? Remember you have to drink the same amount as you would Coke. One can is 355ml.
Let's say your bladder alarm is set at 300 ml and your kidneys process like mine at 75 ml /hr. You drink the 355ml can of Coke at 9:00. Somewhere around 1:00 your kidneys would be at the alarm level and out it comes.
You have to try the same volume but with different fluids. I did it at night and during the day. I experimented with NyQuil and without, antihistamines and without, Caffeine and no caffeine, etc... 18 months.

I should have applied for an NIH grant.

Jeff

Wasn't there a commercial that went "A mind is a terrible thing to waste."?

142
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 6948
   Posted 1/25/2011 8:32 AM (GMT -6)   
Jeff,
 
I have a set of pills that I take as I go to bed each night, so the volume question is established.
Pee, take pills with about 250 ml of tap water, off to bed. (I don't take the pills if I am out having that beer - ).
I'm up between 5:30 -6:15 daily, first pee is usually 300ml (measured).
During the day, output is 150-200ml at a desperation "full".
 
This has all been stable for the last 7 months.

Worried Guy
Veteran Member


Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 3732
   Posted 1/25/2011 2:21 PM (GMT -6)   
Hey 142,
Oh baby! Another data taker! You even know your desperation full point! I love it!
That's exactly what's needed.
With a few more measurements you can compute your kidney output, in ml/hour.

Are you plotting your data, too? My wife made me take it down off the refrigerator. Women!
Jeff

142
Forum Moderator


Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 6948
   Posted 1/25/2011 2:33 PM (GMT -6)   
Jeff,
 
No serious statistics for me, but I did spend too much time studying engineering before I went off to other disciplines, and too much with engineers as I demanded practical fixes so real fumble-fingered humans could use some of the first computers without having to take yoga training first.
 
No wife / better half here, so I decide what goes on the fridge door. But my media is an old fashioned notebook. Paper kind, that is. And yes, I use pencils.
 
David,
My phone doesn't even have texting or email turned on, much less one of those little green android guys buzzing around. Good luck with that!
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